Re: M-TH: East Timor and the Western Left

1999-10-05 Thread Michael Booth
>Excuse me? Where on earth does this bizarre statement come from? Roosevelt >WAS imperialist, born and bred. I can't believe you meant to write this on >our list. Just say it ain't so! What do you mean "our list". That is a - dare I say it, imperialist - comment if ever I heard one. It's my fuck

Re: M-TH: East Timor and the Western Left

1999-10-05 Thread Macdonald Stainsby
>All this talk about the UN being an imperialist organisation seems to >ignore much of the history of how the UN was set up - largely by the >winners of World War Two, who were determined, especially Roosevelt, to >make sure that imperialism, would vanish from the world. Excuse me? Where on ea

Re: M-TH: East Timor and the Western Left

1999-10-05 Thread Michael Booth
All this talk about the UN being an imperialist organisation seems to ignore much of the history of how the UN was set up - largely by the winners of World War Two, who were determined, especially Roosevelt, to make sure that imperialism, would vanish from the world. To this end the US interefered

Re: M-TH: East Timor and the Western Left

1999-10-05 Thread Bullimore / Kim Maree (COM)
Recently I was at a conference on Women and Education in Melbourne, which was addressed by a woman representative from Fretlin. The speaker told us how grateful the East Timorese people were for the support of the Australian public, that someone actually cared about what was happening to them. Sh

Re: SV: M-TH: East Timor and the Western Left

1999-10-05 Thread Chris Burford
At 21:34 05/10/99 +0200, Bob wrote: >Ah Rob, > >Seems I touched a "aussie" nerve. Bob, you think "making people uncomfortable" is a sign that you are effective polemically. But it is obvious that Rob does not contribute to these debates merely as a generic Autralian. >But the point is that the

Re: M-TH: Is NZ a bloated semi-colony?

1999-10-05 Thread Dave Bedggood
Gerry, As far as I know the Lenin criteria for imperialism/semi-colony/colony has not changed, much as the post-als would like us to believe the opposite. Surplus value pumped out of NZ by finance capital from the 1840's to the present confirms NZ as NOT imperialist, despite its relatively p

M-TH: China and Indonesia

1999-10-05 Thread George Pennefather
Russia and certainly China might have a vested interest in the disintegration of Indonesia. Certainly China might have an interest in somewhat assisting in Indonesian instability (and being seen to be assisting) as a means of increasing its leverage with regard to Washington concerning comme

SV: M-TH: East Timor and the Western Left

1999-10-05 Thread Bob Malecki
Ah Rob, Seems I touched a "aussie" nerve. But the point is that the East Timorese certainly will not get Independence which if you noticed we support now! Unfortunately it will take a proletarian revolution throughtout Indonesia led by a marxist revolutionary party in order to obtain this. As fa

SV: M-TH: Is NZ a bloated semi-colony?

1999-10-05 Thread Bob Malecki
There is agreement between us regarding whether Australia is an imperialist nation (it is), but why do you consider NZ to be a "bloated semi-colony"? It would seem to me that if we can characterize Australia as imperialist, then we should also characterize NZ as imperialist. Jerry Good questio

M-TH: East Timor and the Western Left

1999-10-05 Thread Rob Schaap
A pretty useless document, Bob. Yeah, Australia is a minor imperialist nation state. Yeah, we're a paternalistic bunch, with some racism in our soul. Yeah, we check with Uncle Sam first. Yeah, Aboriginal Australians have been hideously treated. And, no, the executive levels of our union movem

M-TH: Is NZ a bloated semi-colony?

1999-10-05 Thread Gerald Levy
Hi Dave (B). I must have missed this before: > In reality these are imperialist troops (or in NZ's case of a > bloated semi-colony) prepared to back up the Indonesian military if > it can't keep the lid on the upsurge of mass struggles. The cross > class backing they are generating at home now w

M-TH: East Timor Independence Now!

1999-10-05 Thread Bob Malecki
East Timor Independence Now! All Indonesian and All UN Imperialist Troops Out Now! SYDNEY, September 27-In the largest Australian military operation since the Vietnam War, thousands of troops with tanks, armoured personnel carriers and helicopters are now occupying tiny, impoverished East Timor.

Re: M-TH: Re: Hot Pursuit

1999-10-05 Thread Rob Schaap
G'day Dave, You write: >What do you mean "hang around"? The terms of the UN resolution >requires the disarming of Falintil! Well, 'peacekeepers' refute their brief in practice all the time (often with their political leaders' tacit approval). I'd have preferred a bit of honest lying, meself (i