Re: [MBZ] 1980 300SD Drive train vibration

[Max Dillon via Mercedes]

Yes, I was also forgetting that one.

Any rubber mounts / bushings / flex discs that are older than ten years are 
suspect according to the late Dr Marshall Booth.

Rubber mount for differential?

Maybe start with engine mounts and then replace every piece of rubber back to 
the differential mounts, if your budget allows.

Max Dillon
Charleston SC

Dec 11, 2019 6:39:07 PM Peter Frederick via Mercedes :

> Oh, I forgot -- a bad transmission mount is a very likely cause of vibration 
> under acceleration and not under coasting -- the torque pushes the 
> transmission up off the mount, and drag pushes it down.
> 
> Easy job.
> 
> Peter
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Re: [MBZ] 1980 300SD Drive train vibration

[Clay Monroe via Mercedes]

My indy was of the mind that it was a waste of his time and my cash to fix just 
one flex disk when I came in with vibrations.   His book time to do the front 
and rears along with the center bearing was close enough to just doing a single 
disk.  Just the cost of parts with the mark up.  I never pushed him not to do 
his best.  He fixed the SD, E300D and the 220D, as well as the R107 when things 
got harmonic.

clay 


1974 450sl -  Frosch - Two tone green
1986 SDL - Polei

retired models-
2002 s430 - Victor, a Stately & well tailored crap
1982 SD - Allen
1976 300D - Blei Vanst - it looks silvery
1972 220D - Gump - She was green, simple and ran
1995 E300D - Gave her life to save me against a Dame in a SUV
POS 1987 SDL - Beware Nigerian Scammers








> On Dec 11, 2019, at 3:31 PM, Peter Frederick via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> Center bearing support bushing is bad.  I'd replace the front flex disk if 
> the rear was bad too, they are under the same conditions and if one was iffy 
> the other is too.  Worth the time to replace the center carrier bearing too.
> 
> What happens is that under acceleration the bad bushing will allow the 
> driveshaft to go just very slightly off center and shake (as will a bad flex 
> disk).  Acceleration forces are much greater than deceleration drag so little 
> or nothing happens when you are coasting.
> 
> You will have to carefully mark the driveshaft before you take it apart, not 
> all of them were marked for proper alignment in 1980.
> 
> Peter 

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Re: [MBZ] 1980 300SD Drive train vibration

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

Being off one spline WILL cause vibration.


Randy Bennell via Mercedes 
December 11, 2019 at 5:09 PM

I have not done it but it should be fairly easy to replace the center 
support. The big thing is to be absolutely sure that you mark the 
parts so that they can be put back in the same relationship to each 
other. The drive shaft is balanced as a unit and if you are out by a 
spline or two, it will likely be a problem.


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Re: [MBZ] 1980 300SD Drive train vibration

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

+1


Jaime Kopchinski via Mercedes 
December 11, 2019 at 1:38 PM
I'd put my money on center support bearing and carrier.

Jaime



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Re: [MBZ] 1980 300SD Drive train vibration

[Peter Frederick via Mercedes]

Oh, I forgot -- a bad transmission mount is a very likely cause of vibration 
under acceleration and not under coasting -- the torque pushes the transmission 
up off the mount, and drag pushes it down.

Easy job.

Peter
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Re: [MBZ] 1980 300SD Drive train vibration

[Peter Frederick via Mercedes]

Center bearing support bushing is bad.  I'd replace the front flex disk if the 
rear was bad too, they are under the same conditions and if one was iffy the 
other is too.  Worth the time to replace the center carrier bearing too.

What happens is that under acceleration the bad bushing will allow the 
driveshaft to go just very slightly off center and shake (as will a bad flex 
disk).  Acceleration forces are much greater than deceleration drag so little 
or nothing happens when you are coasting.

You will have to carefully mark the driveshaft before you take it apart, not 
all of them were marked for proper alignment in 1980.

Peter
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Re: [MBZ] 1980 300SD Drive train vibration

[Randy Bennell via Mercedes]

On 11/12/2019 4:45 PM, ROGER HALE via Mercedes wrote:

Thanks to all for their input and suggestions.  More detail:  the rear axles 
and boots look ok, no slack there, the tranny was a used unit purchased in 
Arizona and installed 2 years ago (probably less than 1,000 miles since 
installed) and it's ok except the vac from the IP to the modulator can't be 
adjusted, yea, needed piece is NLA.
So, can the center support, flex, etc. be easily replaced?  My Indie started 
talking about pulling the drive shaft, cutting off the ujoints, rebalancing the 
drive shaft and the putting everything back...a rather large amount of money 
for a 1980 car considering I've already put around $4k into revitalizing this 
car.
Any additional thoughts anyone?  Just trying to get back to a smooth ride and 
still have money for diesel fuel :-))
Thanks,
Roger
Roger Hale
Dinnerware Classics, Inc.
Monroe, Ga.
770-267-0850
www.dinnerwareclassics.com
___
I have not done it but it should be fairly easy to replace the center 
support. The big thing is to be absolutely sure that you mark the parts 
so that they can be put back in the same relationship to each other. The 
drive shaft is balanced as a unit and if you are out by a spline or two, 
it will likely be a problem.


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Re: [MBZ] 1980 300SD Drive train vibration

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

Agreed. Especially since the vibration goes away on deceleration (no load).

-D

> On Dec 11, 2019, at 2:39 PM, Jaime Kopchinski via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> I'd put my money on center support bearing and carrier.
> 
> Jaime
> 
> 
>> On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 2:27 PM ROGER HALE via Mercedes <
>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Time to consult the brain trust.  I've been getting my 1980 300SD
>> revitalized and back into driving condition.  Almost everything is done,
>> except, it still has a vibration somewhere in the drive train when
>> accelerating.  It starts at around 40mph.  My Indie replaced the rear flex
>> disk which reduced the vibration some, but not all.  When you are coasting
>> or take your foot off the accelerator, the vibration stops.  This seems to
>> rule out wheel bearings and axles, etc.  So, could this be the center
>> support bearings or universal joints or what?
>> Any suggestions would be appreciated.
>> Best Wishes,
>> Roger
>> Roger Hale
>> Dinnerware Classics, Inc.
>> Monroe, Ga.
>> 770-267-0850
>> www.dinnerwareclassics.com
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>> 
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>> 
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> 
>> 
> 
> -- 
> Jaime Kopchinski
> http://www.jaimekop.com/
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
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> 
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[MBZ] 1980 300SD Drive train vibration

[ROGER HALE via Mercedes]

Thanks to all for their input and suggestions.  More detail:  the rear axles 
and boots look ok, no slack there, the tranny was a used unit purchased in 
Arizona and installed 2 years ago (probably less than 1,000 miles since 
installed) and it's ok except the vac from the IP to the modulator can't be 
adjusted, yea, needed piece is NLA. 
So, can the center support, flex, etc. be easily replaced?  My Indie started 
talking about pulling the drive shaft, cutting off the ujoints, rebalancing the 
drive shaft and the putting everything back...a rather large amount of money 
for a 1980 car considering I've already put around $4k into revitalizing this 
car.
Any additional thoughts anyone?  Just trying to get back to a smooth ride and 
still have money for diesel fuel :-))
Thanks,
Roger
Roger Hale
Dinnerware Classics, Inc.
Monroe, Ga.
770-267-0850
www.dinnerwareclassics.com
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Re: [MBZ] 1980 300SD Drive train vibration

[Jaime Kopchinski via Mercedes]

Yes, this is true... its likely the center support, not the bearing
itself.  Its a good idea to replace the flex disc as well.  Both can look
fine visually and cause issues with vibration.

Jaime


On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 2:40 PM Jim Cathey via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Once you've experienced it, driveline vibration is much higher pitched
> than wheel-related noise.  (Due to the gear ratio in the differential.)
> Seems
> to me that it would be unlikely to be the center bearing, but it could be
> the
> front flex disc or the center support bushing.  Or, the U-joint.  Of
> course,
> one replaces the bearing too once you have it all apart.  It could be
> possible
> that the slip joint is loose.
>
> -- Jim
>
>
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>

-- 
Jaime Kopchinski
http://www.jaimekop.com/
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Re: [MBZ] 1980 300SD Drive train vibration

[Randy Bennell via Mercedes]

On 11/12/2019 1:26 PM, ROGER HALE via Mercedes wrote:

Time to consult the brain trust.  I've been getting my 1980 300SD revitalized 
and back into driving condition.  Almost everything is done, except, it still 
has a vibration somewhere in the drive train when accelerating.  It starts at 
around 40mph.  My Indie replaced the rear flex disk which reduced the vibration 
some, but not all.  When you are coasting or take your foot off the 
accelerator, the vibration stops.  This seems to rule out wheel bearings and 
axles, etc.  So, could this be the center support bearings or universal joints 
or what?
Any suggestions would be appreciated.
Best Wishes,
Roger
Roger Hale
Dinnerware Classics, Inc.
Monroe, Ga.
770-267-0850
www.dinnerwareclassics.com
___
How is the transmission, otherwise? I chased a problem like this on a 
1986 Chevy Suburban. We did all sorts of things but finally had to 
rebuild the transmission in order to rid the vehicle of the vibration.


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Re: [MBZ] 1980 300SD Drive train vibration

[Max Dillon via Mercedes]

That's a good start point, and usually the solution. Start with simple / cheap 
known wear items.

Are the boots on the half axles still intact? If they've failed, time to 
replace those.

The U-joints can get stiff / notchy with time, and I understand a good mechanic 
can feel the movement when they are off the car, and ID a bad u-joint.

Max Dillon
Charleston SC

Dec 11, 2019 2:39:11 PM Jaime Kopchinski via Mercedes :

> I'd put my money on center support bearing and carrier.
> 
> Jaime
> 
> 
> On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 2:27 PM ROGER HALE via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
> 
> > Time to consult the brain trust. I've been getting my 1980 300SD
> > revitalized and back into driving condition. Almost everything is done,
> > except, it still has a vibration somewhere in the drive train when
> > accelerating. It starts at around 40mph. My Indie replaced the rear flex
> > disk which reduced the vibration some, but not all. When you are coasting
> > or take your foot off the accelerator, the vibration stops. This seems to
> > rule out wheel bearings and axles, etc. So, could this be the center
> > support bearings or universal joints or what?
> > Any suggestions would be appreciated.
> > Best Wishes,
> > Roger
> > Roger Hale
> > Dinnerware Classics, Inc.
> > Monroe, Ga.
> > 770-267-0850
> > www.dinnerwareclassics.com
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
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> > 
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Jaime Kopchinski
> http://www.jaimekop.com/
> ___
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> 
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> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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Re: [MBZ] 1980 300SD Drive train vibration

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

Once you've experienced it, driveline vibration is much higher pitched
than wheel-related noise.  (Due to the gear ratio in the differential.)  Seems
to me that it would be unlikely to be the center bearing, but it could be the
front flex disc or the center support bushing.  Or, the U-joint.  Of course,
one replaces the bearing too once you have it all apart.  It could be possible
that the slip joint is loose.

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] 1980 300SD Drive train vibration

[Jaime Kopchinski via Mercedes]

I'd put my money on center support bearing and carrier.

Jaime


On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 2:27 PM ROGER HALE via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Time to consult the brain trust.  I've been getting my 1980 300SD
> revitalized and back into driving condition.  Almost everything is done,
> except, it still has a vibration somewhere in the drive train when
> accelerating.  It starts at around 40mph.  My Indie replaced the rear flex
> disk which reduced the vibration some, but not all.  When you are coasting
> or take your foot off the accelerator, the vibration stops.  This seems to
> rule out wheel bearings and axles, etc.  So, could this be the center
> support bearings or universal joints or what?
> Any suggestions would be appreciated.
> Best Wishes,
> Roger
> Roger Hale
> Dinnerware Classics, Inc.
> Monroe, Ga.
> 770-267-0850
> www.dinnerwareclassics.com
> ___
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>
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>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>

-- 
Jaime Kopchinski
http://www.jaimekop.com/
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[MBZ] 1980 300SD Drive train vibration

[ROGER HALE via Mercedes]

Time to consult the brain trust.  I've been getting my 1980 300SD revitalized 
and back into driving condition.  Almost everything is done, except, it still 
has a vibration somewhere in the drive train when accelerating.  It starts at 
around 40mph.  My Indie replaced the rear flex disk which reduced the vibration 
some, but not all.  When you are coasting or take your foot off the 
accelerator, the vibration stops.  This seems to rule out wheel bearings and 
axles, etc.  So, could this be the center support bearings or universal joints 
or what?
Any suggestions would be appreciated.
Best Wishes,
Roger
Roger Hale
Dinnerware Classics, Inc.
Monroe, Ga.
770-267-0850
www.dinnerwareclassics.com
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