Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
So the Falcon is a much better use of space on the inside which makes sense. I've never really taken a good Look at one to see how much room was inside compared to most modern cars. My parents had a '60 Falcon, but that was before my time. Kevin in Hillsboro, OR 1983 300SD 266Kmi, Ursula ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Get it up to 1000 mph, take you foot of the gas and the mass will let it coast across a few states. Mind you, on your way up to 60 mph, it probably getting more like, 40 gallons to the mile. hee hee. Ed 300E On 25/01/2008, LarryT [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There was a commercial on the radio for CSX pushing RRs for travel and movement of materials - they said a train gets 423 miles per gallon - which seems impossible - but I know little about them except they use diesel engines to power electric motors. Any idea how they came up with that number? Thx - Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs . - Original Message - From: Allan Streib [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 9:50 AM Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel OK Don [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Stuff isn't shipped with gasoline - it's shipped with Diesel, and Diesel is WAY too high now --- How much of the cost of goods is the fuel burned to ship it? I have no idea, but I guess it can't be a lot because prices have not gone up noticeably during the time that diesel fuel doubled in price. Allan -- 1983 300D 1966 230 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Thx Allan - great way to explain it -- Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs . - Original Message - From: Mitch Haley [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 2:19 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel Allan Streib wrote: That figure is ton-miles, i.e. they say they can move 1 ton of freight 423 miles on a gallon of fuel. Now that makes sense. And I'm sure it beats any other non-waterborne transportation. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
I'm with you. First thing we need to do to lower gas prices at the pump is to increase the gas tax $1/gal. Leave diesel tax where it is, poor bastard truckers are already paying more than they can afford... Put that increased money into a renewables fund that'll also pay off for improving insulation in houses. Give deep tax incentives for people putting solar hotwater on their houses. Give big money to colleges researching renewables and electric cars. Within 2 years I suspect the pump price would be back to or below what it is now even with the added tax. -Curt Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2008 16:31:33 -0500 From: Jeff Zedic [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 My point about the fuel prices is that it seems the only way to get North Americans to conserve fuel is to raise the price. With it being so cheap, it just gets pissed away. People want the easy way out and that means cheap fuel no matter what they have to do to ensure it. (read into that one what you will) Small cars in North America, when made by certain companies, were shitbox deathtraps. It's like they were made badly on purpose. Jeff Zedic - Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
LarryT wrote: they said a train gets 423 miles per gallon - which seems impossible Indeed. Figure out the coefficient of rolling resistance, multiply by the weight, and you get a drag number which makes that very impossible. Can't even be 423 loaded boxcar-miles per gallon. OTOH, Amtrak is surely above 423 passenger-miles per gallon, at least in potential if you could hook up 100 passenger cars and fill them with people all wanting to go in the same direction. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Kaleb wrote: There was supposed to be one built back in the 70's not 8 miles from my house. They protested and got it shut down so now the site is empty. Hear talk of building something there, maybe nuke, maybe coal. In kansas we are dealing with this issue on a statewide basis. The state denied a permit to build a coal plant in Western Kansas and the legislature is going to be revisiting that right now. I represent a County in a lawsuit that is pending. A company got permission from a County to build a biodiesel plant. The company began construction and a group of citizens has sued the County to stop construction. Should be very interesting. It would be nice to have more biodiesel sources. Donald H. Snook ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
There was a commercial on the radio for CSX pushing RRs for travel and movement of materials - they said a train gets 423 miles per gallon - which seems impossible - but I know little about them except they use diesel engines to power electric motors. Any idea how they came up with that number? Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) My guess is a train gets the _equivalent_ of 423 MPG. In otherwords, if you were to use a 1/2ton pickup (or maybe a 40 ton big truck, or possibly a BMW M5) it would have to get 423 MPG to move the same quantity of good for the same quantity of fuel that the train uses. A marketing way of saying fuel used per ton of transport capacity - or something like that. A train can move a _lot_ of weight for the diesel it burns. However, ship and barges make train look thirsty. --Philip ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Its usually per weighted mile. RRs are more efficient for large amounts of freight in the same way a bus is more efficient for larger numbers of people. -Curt Date: Fri, 25 Jan 2008 11:55:10 -0500 From: LarryT [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original There was a commercial on the radio for CSX pushing RRs for travel and movement of materials - they said a train gets 423 miles per gallon - which seems impossible - but I know little about them except they use diesel engines to power electric motors. Any idea how they came up with that number? Thx - Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs - Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
you wrote it took them about 8 years of hassle with the Enviros and gvmint to get approval And $10's of millions of $$'s if not more! Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs . - Original Message - From: Russ Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 8:31 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel More like 20 years Dan, Marathon Refinery in St.James La. was the last one completed. They are now going thru a 10 Billion Over hall that will increase their Production tow fold. A friend of mine is the Chief Production Chemist there. BTW it took them about 8 years of hassle with the Enviros and gvmint to get approval. Russ W. LWB250 wrote: If I remember correctly the comment that I've heard in the news numerous times, there hasn't been a new refinery built in the U.S. for over 10 years. Sorta like Nuke plants... Dan --- Donald Snook [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rich Thomas wrote: Oh, and the environmentalists who block new drilling and refineries. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Larry T. Wrote: While economizing to make oil last longer there is no escaping the need for new reserves of oil to keep our economy chugging along. Saving money with wind, solar, etc generators is fine but it;s a dropin the bucket when you look at the needs of this country on an overall basis. I'd like to see driling off our coasts, drilling in Anwar, building *lots* of nuclear power stations, oil refineries and as we go along, develop hybrids - but limit the gov't role and encourage the public to design things that are workable but need development. . . One thing I;ve always wondered about Algore - why was he so quiet about GW when he was VP for 8 years? In what was possibly the 2nd best pulpit in the world to tell people stuff, yet he failed to say anything that I recall. Now, it's making him millions ... Larry, I could not have said it better. You were reading my mind. Donald H. Snook ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
OK - sounds reasonable. Next time I see that commercial I'll pay closer attention. Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs . - Original Message - From: Mitch Haley [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 12:38 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel LarryT wrote: they said a train gets 423 miles per gallon - which seems impossible Indeed. Figure out the coefficient of rolling resistance, multiply by the weight, and you get a drag number which makes that very impossible. Can't even be 423 loaded boxcar-miles per gallon. OTOH, Amtrak is surely above 423 passenger-miles per gallon, at least in potential if you could hook up 100 passenger cars and fill them with people all wanting to go in the same direction. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Ok Don wrote: Stuff isn't shipped with gasoline - it's shipped with Diesel, and Diesel is WAY too high now I agree with that. But, I don't think that changes the analysis. The way I understand refining, a refiner can hydrocrack the oil and produce more gasoline now OR the refiner can produce diesel (but less of it). So, it actually uses more crude to produce diesel. My point was that if the price of gas OR diesel continues to climb it will be bad for the economy. Gas is more profitable and if a refiner can decide to produce less diesel (because it is costly in terms of refining costs and costly in terms of using up more of the supply of crude) then, he will produce more gasoline which will further increase the cost of diesel and will further increase the cost of all goods shipped. Donald H. Snook ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
OK Don [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Stuff isn't shipped with gasoline - it's shipped with Diesel, and Diesel is WAY too high now --- How much of the cost of goods is the fuel burned to ship it? I have no idea, but I guess it can't be a lot because prices have not gone up noticeably during the time that diesel fuel doubled in price. Allan -- 1983 300D 1966 230 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
There was a commercial on the radio for CSX pushing RRs for travel and movement of materials - they said a train gets 423 miles per gallon - which seems impossible - but I know little about them except they use diesel engines to power electric motors. Any idea how they came up with that number? Thx - Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs . - Original Message - From: Allan Streib [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 9:50 AM Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel OK Don [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Stuff isn't shipped with gasoline - it's shipped with Diesel, and Diesel is WAY too high now --- How much of the cost of goods is the fuel burned to ship it? I have no idea, but I guess it can't be a lot because prices have not gone up noticeably during the time that diesel fuel doubled in price. Allan -- 1983 300D 1966 230 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
That figure is ton-miles, i.e. they say they can move 1 ton of freight 423 miles on a gallon of fuel. Allan Mitch Haley [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: LarryT wrote: they said a train gets 423 miles per gallon - which seems impossible Indeed. Figure out the coefficient of rolling resistance, multiply by the weight, and you get a drag number which makes that very impossible. Can't even be 423 loaded boxcar-miles per gallon. OTOH, Amtrak is surely above 423 passenger-miles per gallon, at least in potential if you could hook up 100 passenger cars and fill them with people all wanting to go in the same direction. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- 1983 300D 1966 230 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Allan Streib wrote: That figure is ton-miles, i.e. they say they can move 1 ton of freight 423 miles on a gallon of fuel. Now that makes sense. And I'm sure it beats any other non-waterborne transportation. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
I've been really freaked out by the cars here ever since I got back to NA.bland bland bland styling.even the same models seem to have subtle variations that make them look different. Before you get too excited to and jealous of the Europeans and their cars, just remember how much they pay for fuel in most of Europe. It 3-4 times what we pay here in the States. Donald H. Snook ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Donald, I know!! I live there!! Actually, it's not THAT bad. First you need to keep in mind that US fuel is too cheap. ( in several ways). The price of petrol before the latest rise, was, in real dollar terms the cheapest it had ever been. Also, the US fuel isn't the cleanest...ever notice that sulphur stink when someone floors it to pass you? The price of petrol in the UK right now is about $7.80 per gallon. It was cheaper in France and Italy when I was there. In France, it was $7.33 per US gallon. BUT, most cars get SIGNIFICANTLY better fuel economy. We're talking about numbers the US auto companies only dream about!! A 2 litre engine is a big engine over there and believe me, it's got ballsnot like the wheezy shite here. If you see a 5 litre, it's someone with loads of cash and small of brain. Hey...wait a minute.aren't Ford and GM US?? Why can they do one thing on one continent and and a completely idiotic thing on another? Hmm..and yet they say it'll take ten to fifteen years to come up with the technology to achieve the desired resultsbut they already have this capability...what gives?? (who, me cynical?? NAH) Jeff Zedic ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Yes the US must immediately raise fuel prices by $5/gallon. I am sure the various governments involved would use the money efficiently, as they do now, and to make life better for everyone. I trust the governments! I believe in higher taxes! I know life will be better if only the US becomes more like Europe! Excellent information! --R (Texas, It's Bigger than France) Jeff Zedic wrote: Donald, I know!! I live there!! Actually, it's not THAT bad. First you need to keep in mind that US fuel is too cheap. ( in several ways). The price of petrol before the latest rise, was, in real dollar terms the cheapest it had ever been. Also, the US fuel isn't the cleanest...ever notice that sulphur stink when someone floors it to pass you? The price of petrol in the UK right now is about $7.80 per gallon. It was cheaper in France and Italy when I was there. In France, it was $7.33 per US gallon. BUT, most cars get SIGNIFICANTLY better fuel economy. We're talking about numbers the US auto companies only dream about!! A 2 litre engine is a big engine over there and believe me, it's got ballsnot like the wheezy shite here. If you see a 5 litre, it's someone with loads of cash and small of brain. Hey...wait a minute.aren't Ford and GM US?? Why can they do one thing on one continent and and a completely idiotic thing on another? Hmm..and yet they say it'll take ten to fifteen years to come up with the technology to achieve the desired resultsbut they already have this capability...what gives?? (who, me cynical?? NAH) Jeff Zedic ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Rich Thomas wrote: Yes the US must immediately raise fuel prices by $5/gallon. I am sure the various governments involved would use the money efficiently, as they do now, and to make life better for everyone. I trust the governments! I believe in higher taxes! I know life will be better if only the US becomes more like Europe! He never said anything about raising the price of fuel over here Just that it wasn't as bad as you would think since the increase in fuel mileage correlates to the increase in fuel cost. John ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Yah, right... Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rich Thomas Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 9:18 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel Yes the US must immediately raise fuel prices by $5/gallon. I am sure the various governments involved would use the money efficiently, as they do now, and to make life better for everyone. I trust the governments! I believe in higher taxes! I know life will be better if only the US becomes more like Europe! Excellent information! --R (Texas, It's Bigger than France) Jeff Zedic wrote: Donald, I know!! I live there!! Actually, it's not THAT bad. First you need to keep in mind that US fuel is too cheap. ( in several ways). The price of petrol before the latest rise, was, in real dollar terms the cheapest it had ever been. Also, the US fuel isn't the cleanest...ever notice that sulphur stink when someone floors it to pass you? The price of petrol in the UK right now is about $7.80 per gallon. It was cheaper in France and Italy when I was there. In France, it was $7.33 per US gallon. BUT, most cars get SIGNIFICANTLY better fuel economy. We're talking about numbers the US auto companies only dream about!! A 2 litre engine is a big engine over there and believe me, it's got ballsnot like the wheezy shite here. If you see a 5 litre, it's someone with loads of cash and small of brain. Hey...wait a minute.aren't Ford and GM US?? Why can they do one thing on one continent and and a completely idiotic thing on another? Hmm..and yet they say it'll take ten to fifteen years to come up with the technology to achieve the desired resultsbut they already have this capability...what gives?? (who, me cynical?? NAH) Jeff Zedic ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.9/1239 - Release Date: 1/23/2008 10:24 AM ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Yeah, have to agree. When last in Italy, I had a 2 litre gas car. 3 ppl and all our bags in the. At that time, gas was a little better than double what it was here. I filled it up when I started, and it took premium. Cost about $100. During my stay, I added aother $20, and that got me almost 1000 kms. I couldnt' believe it. And that 1000 kms was all fast driving in the Alps, and I don't think the car ever did under 180 kph on the Autostrada. Roads were fantastic and the drivers even better, so I wasn't shy using the loud pedal. I think the thought of having to pump premium fuel into a small car here would kill most ppl. Its' that mind set; if it's small, it's an economy car, and cheap to run and premium fuel don't go together. In the past, Ford has brought a few models over, but they have all failed in the market. Ed 300E On 24/01/2008, Jeff Zedic [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Donald, I know!! I live there!! Actually, it's not THAT bad. First you need to keep in mind that US fuel is too cheap. ( in several ways). The price of petrol before the latest rise, was, in real dollar terms the cheapest it had ever been. Also, the US fuel isn't the cleanest...ever notice that sulphur stink when someone floors it to pass you? The price of petrol in the UK right now is about $7.80 per gallon. It was cheaper in France and Italy when I was there. In France, it was $7.33 per US gallon. BUT, most cars get SIGNIFICANTLY better fuel economy. We're talking about numbers the US auto companies only dream about!! A 2 litre engine is a big engine over there and believe me, it's got ballsnot like the wheezy shite here. If you see a 5 litre, it's someone with loads of cash and small of brain. Hey...wait a minute.aren't Ford and GM US?? Why can they do one thing on one continent and and a completely idiotic thing on another? Hmm..and yet they say it'll take ten to fifteen years to come up with the technology to achieve the desired resultsbut they already have this capability...what gives?? (who, me cynical?? NAH) Jeff Zedic ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
I know, I agree, these are my beliefs, just thought I would share. I am so disappointed that none of our presidential candidates are promoting this obvious and beneficial plan. --R John Robbins wrote: Rich Thomas wrote: Yes the US must immediately raise fuel prices by $5/gallon. I am sure the various governments involved would use the money efficiently, as they do now, and to make life better for everyone. I trust the governments! I believe in higher taxes! I know life will be better if only the US becomes more like Europe! He never said anything about raising the price of fuel over here Just that it wasn't as bad as you would think since the increase in fuel mileage correlates to the increase in fuel cost. John ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
In the past, Ford has brought a few models over, but they have all failed in the market. Isn't the Ford Focus one such model? They must have modified/cheapened it for the North American market since it had so many problems in the beginning. Kevin in Hillsboro, OR 1983 300SD 266Kmi, Ursula ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Kevin Kraly wrote: In the past, Ford has brought a few models over, but they have all failed in the market. Wasn't the 1976-83 Ford Fiasco the first world car? Seems like it had an emblem on the back with a dozen countries' flags on it. http://www.carbodydesign.com/archive/2006/02/10-ford-fiesta-history/ford-fiesta-history.php I think the 1981 Ford Escargot/Mercury Jinx was Ford's first world car to be made in the USA. They sold millions of them over here, but they got a bad reputation due to two design features in the original 1.6L engine. It was in interference design, pistons hit valves if the timing belt broke. It was a stupid design, the water pump was driven by the timing belt. Water pump seizes, time for a top end rebuild. Or maybe that's a feature to keep you from overheating the engine when the water pump dies. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
I think there are all different levels of spec for the car. They have some really hot versions over in the UK, and other countries. Selling such a car here for $45,000 might be hard, but it's pretty much a little rally car, and I think pretty good value for what it is. To a degree, I think many still like to buy there cars here by the pound. http://www.conceptcarz.com/vehicle/z14509/Ford_Focus%20ST500/default.aspx Ed 300E On 24/01/2008, Kevin Kraly [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In the past, Ford has brought a few models over, but they have all failed in the market. Isn't the Ford Focus one such model? They must have modified/cheapened it for the North American market since it had so many problems in the beginning. Kevin in Hillsboro, OR 1983 300SD 266Kmi, Ursula ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Yup, we had one when they were new. lol. My dad was in the car business, so we tried all the new stuff at the time. Back then, if you mentioned timing belts, most would look at you kind of funny. Push rod ruled the day. Our other car was a Lincoln Mk. V at the time, with a 460. As for the design of the timing belt, hmmm, sounds familiar. Lot like a Porsche 928. Hey, wait a sec, that's the reason I rebuild the last 928 engine. Water pump ran off the back of the belt, water pump went a little wonky, caused the belt to jump a few teeth and 8 bent valves later. hee hee. was a 32 valve engine, so could have been worse. It could have been my car, instead of a friends. ;-) Ed 300E Wasn't the 1976-83 Ford Fiasco the first world car? Seems like it had an emblem on the back with a dozen countries' flags on it. http://www.carbodydesign.com/archive/2006/02/10-ford-fiesta-history/ford-fiesta-history.php I think the 1981 Ford Escargot/Mercury Jinx was Ford's first world car to be made in the USA. They sold millions of them over here, but they got a bad reputation due to two design features in the original 1.6L engine. It was in interference design, pistons hit valves if the timing belt broke. It was a stupid design, the water pump was driven by the timing belt. Water pump seizes, time for a top end rebuild. Or maybe that's a feature to keep you from overheating the engine when the water pump dies. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
John R. wrote: He never said anything about raising the price of fuel over here Just that it wasn't as bad as you would think since the increase in fuel mileage correlates to the increase in fuel cost. Well, let's all pray that gas does not get that expensive. I am sure that because of higher fuel efficiency, the cost per mile is not as high as we might expect. However, the problem with increasing gas prices is that we cannot replace ALL American cars to make the cost per mile reasonable. Higher gas prices in the US mean higher prices FOR everything in the US. Because the US is such a big country and shipping costs for everyday goods are very susceptible to increases in price, an increase in gas prices means, food will be more expensive as well as the cost of EVERY single product that is shipped. I understand the desire to decrease consumption of gas/oil, but I wish that fuel prices would go down. The economy would be a lot more stable if we had $1.50 gas (and $1.45 diesel) again. Donald H. Snook ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Isn't the Ford Focus one such model? They must have modified/cheapened it for the North American market since it had so many problems in the beginning. I don't know about any problems with the Focus and I have heard that the EURO models are faster and sportier, but I rented one of them when I was out of town for work. I HATED IT. It is too small. It was cramped and noisy. This was less than a year ago. Now, I am probably the wrong person to ask. I am 6'3 and 270 and I like BIG CARS. Maybe that makes me one of those ugly Americans who just wants to drive with a lot of metal around me, but I am okay with that. That is why I loved my 126. It was a BIG car. I could hold 5 people very comfortably with my seat ALL the way back. I also hated the Nissan Murano and Ford Edge. The real visibility is awful! Donald H. Snook ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
How about the Mercury Capri back in the early 70's? It was actually a reasonable car. Ford had some other things that they brought in and sold that were not all that great. My father had a Ford Cortina that was some sort of English Ford if I am not mistaken. It may not have been sold in the US but was in Canada. Randy -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Mitch Haley Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 10:16 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel Kevin Kraly wrote: In the past, Ford has brought a few models over, but they have all failed in the market. Wasn't the 1976-83 Ford Fiasco the first world car? Seems like it had an emblem on the back with a dozen countries' flags on it. http://www.carbodydesign.com/archive/2006/02/10-ford-fiesta-history/ford-fiesta-history.php I think the 1981 Ford Escargot/Mercury Jinx was Ford's first world car to be made in the USA. They sold millions of them over here, but they got a bad reputation due to two design features in the original 1.6L engine. It was in interference design, pistons hit valves if the timing belt broke. It was a stupid design, the water pump was driven by the timing belt. Water pump seizes, time for a top end rebuild. Or maybe that's a feature to keep you from overheating the engine when the water pump dies. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
So what is available over there in terms of trucks? North America runs on trucks. When I see photos of Europe, I see little snub nosed vans and flat nosed flat bed trucks but nothing that we think of as pickup trucks. Do they import Toyota and Nissan pickup trucks? Randy -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Jeff Zedic Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 8:44 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel Donald, I know!! I live there!! Actually, it's not THAT bad. First you need to keep in mind that US fuel is too cheap. ( in several ways). The price of petrol before the latest rise, was, in real dollar terms the cheapest it had ever been. Also, the US fuel isn't the cleanest...ever notice that sulphur stink when someone floors it to pass you? The price of petrol in the UK right now is about $7.80 per gallon. It was cheaper in France and Italy when I was there. In France, it was $7.33 per US gallon. BUT, most cars get SIGNIFICANTLY better fuel economy. We're talking about numbers the US auto companies only dream about!! A 2 litre engine is a big engine over there and believe me, it's got ballsnot like the wheezy shite here. If you see a 5 litre, it's someone with loads of cash and small of brain. Hey...wait a minute.aren't Ford and GM US?? Why can they do one thing on one continent and and a completely idiotic thing on another? Hmm..and yet they say it'll take ten to fifteen years to come up with the technology to achieve the desired resultsbut they already have this capability...what gives?? (who, me cynical?? NAH) Jeff Zedic ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Hi, Alles. Formula Ford has used Cortina engines and they are not slow. Car was the usual Brit POS and quite zippy. (I know, I'm old) Fred Moir Lynn MA It's Diesel this and Diesel that and chuck 'im out, the brute with apologies to R. Kipling At 12:02 PM 1/24/2008, you wrote: How about the Mercury Capri back in the early 70's? It was actually a reasonable car. Ford had some other things that they brought in and sold that were not all that great. My father had a Ford Cortina that was some sort of English Ford if I am not mistaken. It may not have been sold in the US but was in Canada. Randy ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
R A Bennell wrote: So what is available over there in terms of trucks? North America runs on trucks. When I see photos of Europe, I see little snub nosed vans and flat nosed flat bed trucks but nothing that we think of as pickup trucks. Do they import Toyota and Nissan pickup trucks? There is a Ford Ranger over there (or at least it is on Ford's UK website). I think the Top Gear episode on towing really sums it up. There is a national RV organization over there that reviews towing vehicles and the best one for towing your RV is a Civic/Accord sized car with a 2L diesel. Totally different mindset. Probably no 5th wheels or diesel pusher motorhomes either. John ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
There's lots of Toyota and Nissan p/ups in the UK as well as Mazda and Mitsubishi. What you see very few of thankfully, are the humongous things that are omnipresent here. Isn't the Ford Ranger really a Mazda anyway?? You mainly see Toyotas or proper Land Rovers. There's some joker near me that has a big Dodge and I've seen a Ford and a couple of GM. Saw poor slob was driving around in a 75 or so GMC camper van with UK plates. There's a US car specialist in west London that used to have lots of cool American cars but seems to have just ordinary junk now. Used to be Vettes and Camaro/Firebirds but he has Dodge Vans and a mid 70's Lincoln or T-bird...nothing interesting. Jeff Zedic ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Jeff Zedic wrote: Isn't the Ford Ranger really a Mazda anyway?? You mainly see Toyotas or proper Land Rovers. Other way around, Mazda pickups (since '94 at least) are Ford Rangers. I have a '95 Mazda B2300, and I go to the Ford dealership for parts. John ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
When living overseas as a kid, we had two Ford Capri's. Great cars. I think the Capri's at the time were manufactured in Germany. A friend also had a Cortina here in Canada, bought new. Ed 300E On 24/01/2008, R A Bennell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How about the Mercury Capri back in the early 70's? It was actually a reasonable car. Ford had some other things that they brought in and sold that were not all that great. My father had a Ford Cortina that was some sort of English Ford if I am not mistaken. It may not have been sold in the US but was in Canada. Randy -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Mitch Haley Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 10:16 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel Kevin Kraly wrote: In the past, Ford has brought a few models over, but they have all failed in the market. Wasn't the 1976-83 Ford Fiasco the first world car? Seems like it had an emblem on the back with a dozen countries' flags on it. http://www.carbodydesign.com/archive/2006/02/10-ford-fiesta-history/ford-fiesta-history.php I think the 1981 Ford Escargot/Mercury Jinx was Ford's first world car to be made in the USA. They sold millions of them over here, but they got a bad reputation due to two design features in the original 1.6L engine. It was in interference design, pistons hit valves if the timing belt broke. It was a stupid design, the water pump was driven by the timing belt. Water pump seizes, time for a top end rebuild. Or maybe that's a feature to keep you from overheating the engine when the water pump dies. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Rich Thomas wrote: Yes the US must immediately raise fuel prices by $5/gallon. I am sure the various governments involved would use the I know life will be better if only the US becomes more like Europe! He never said anything about raising the price of fuel over here Just that it wasn't as bad as you would think since the increase in fuel mileage correlates to the increase in fuel cost. John He sure implied it. First you need to keep in mind that US fuel is too cheap. - Jeff -- Philip ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Its the oil companies controlling all that over here. Jeff Zedic wrote: Donald, I know!! I live there!! Actually, it's not THAT bad. First you need to keep in mind that US fuel is too cheap. ( in several ways). The price of petrol before the latest rise, was, in real dollar terms the cheapest it had ever been. Also, the US fuel isn't the cleanest...ever notice that sulphur stink when someone floors it to pass you? The price of petrol in the UK right now is about $7.80 per gallon. It was cheaper in France and Italy when I was there. In France, it was $7.33 per US gallon. BUT, most cars get SIGNIFICANTLY better fuel economy. We're talking about numbers the US auto companies only dream about!! A 2 litre engine is a big engine over there and believe me, it's got ballsnot like the wheezy shite here. If you see a 5 litre, it's someone with loads of cash and small of brain. Hey...wait a minute.aren't Ford and GM US?? Why can they do one thing on one continent and and a completely idiotic thing on another? Hmm..and yet they say it'll take ten to fifteen years to come up with the technology to achieve the desired resultsbut they already have this capability...what gives?? (who, me cynical?? NAH) Jeff Zedic ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 94 E420, 92 300SD, 92 300D, 92 250D Turbo, 92 300E 4Matic, 91 300D, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 89 260E, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE 5.0 Euro, 84 190D, 84 300D euro manny, 81 240D, 81 380SLC, 80 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
My point about the fuel prices is that it seems the only way to get North Americans to conserve fuel is to raise the price. With it being so cheap, it just gets pissed away. People want the easy way out and that means cheap fuel no matter what they have to do to ensure it. (read into that one what you will) Small cars in North America, when made by certain companies, were shitbox deathtraps. It's like they were made badly on purpose. Jeff Zedic ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Jeff Zedic [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Small cars in North America, when made by certain companies, were shitbox deathtraps. It's like they were made badly on purpose. They were made badly to satisfy gov't requirements on fleet fuel economy, by companies who knew that their customers did not want the cars so why spend even more money to make them good? Allan -- 1983 300D 1966 230 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
The Capri had a 2.0 liter 4 cyl OHC mill in it that was the bomb. Same engine was in the early (70-71-1/2) Pintos, as I had one with it . A dead wicked engine with a lot of little tweaks you could do to really get it going. Dan --- Frederick W Moir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Alles. Formula Ford has used Cortina engines and they are not slow. Car was the usual Brit POS and quite zippy. (I know, I'm old) Fred Moir Lynn MA It's Diesel this and Diesel that and chuck 'im out, the brute with apologies to R. Kipling At 12:02 PM 1/24/2008, you wrote: How about the Mercury Capri back in the early 70's? It was actually a reasonable car. Ford had some other things that they brought in and sold that were not all that great. My father had a Ford Cortina that was some sort of English Ford if I am not mistaken. It may not have been sold in the US but was in Canada. Randy ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Some had a small V6 too I think as I seem to recall a friend having one. Probably back about 1972 or 1973? Randy -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of LWB250 Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 3:39 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel The Capri had a 2.0 liter 4 cyl OHC mill in it that was the bomb. Same engine was in the early (70-71-1/2) Pintos, as I had one with it . A dead wicked engine with a lot of little tweaks you could do to really get it going. Dan --- Frederick W Moir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Alles. Formula Ford has used Cortina engines and they are not slow. Car was the usual Brit POS and quite zippy. (I know, I'm old) Fred Moir Lynn MA It's Diesel this and Diesel that and chuck 'im out, the brute with apologies to R. Kipling At 12:02 PM 1/24/2008, you wrote: How about the Mercury Capri back in the early 70's? It was actually a reasonable car. Ford had some other things that they brought in and sold that were not all that great. My father had a Ford Cortina that was some sort of English Ford if I am not mistaken. It may not have been sold in the US but was in Canada. Randy ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
No, it's the traders who set the price. The oil companies make lots of money when it is high, and not so much when it is lower. The economics of the all bidness are sorta interesting, given the risks involved with multi-year lead times, huge expenditures required, dry holes, politics (think Hugo Chavez nationalizing your investments), etc etc. Oh, and the environmentalists who block new drilling and refineries. Not to ignore that the gummint provides lots of tax incentives, etc.but that is your gummint working for you. The upshot is to buy stock in the oil and support companies when it is a good time to do so, and profit when they do and ride it out when they don't. --R Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: Its the oil companies controlling all that over here. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Rich Thomas wrote: Oh, and the environmentalists who block new drilling and refineries. BINGO! That is why gas and diesel are so high. There are not enough refineries! The current refineries are aging and without replacements, gas is going to get more and more expensive. Koch Industries is headquartered here in Wichita. They are the world's largest refiner of oil. They can't keep up with the demand. More refining means more gas and diesel. Larger supplies would decrease the speculating traders from bumping up the price. Donald H. Snook ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
If I remember correctly the comment that I've heard in the news numerous times, there hasn't been a new refinery built in the U.S. for over 10 years. Sorta like Nuke plants... Dan --- Donald Snook [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rich Thomas wrote: Oh, and the environmentalists who block new drilling and refineries. BINGO! That is why gas and diesel are so high. There are not enough refineries! The current refineries are aging and without replacements, gas is going to get more and more expensive. Koch Industries is headquartered here in Wichita. They are the world's largest refiner of oil. They can't keep up with the demand. More refining means more gas and diesel. Larger supplies would decrease the speculating traders from bumping up the price. Donald H. Snook ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Didn't I see something on this in the news recently? I don't know how many refineries got blown out of the water on the Gulf Coast and STILL aren't back online. Others are down for upgrading that's gone on longer than expected. Lots of refineries are behind the times technology-wise. And then you get the NIMBY types.. they HAVE to be put somewhere since you're using so much fuel. Difficult situation.what's the easiest/most palatable solution? Jeff Zedic ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel -- now fuel and efficiency
Actually, today, some planned refinery expansions and new constructions are being (have been) put on hold because of projected decreases (or smaller increases) in consumption due to prices and govt plans to force auto makers to increase fuel economy. The refinery owners/operators don't see much reason to invest in lots of new capacity if demand is going to be lower (or not much higher) as it takes several years and lots of money to build a refinery and infrastructure to support it. Whether it goes up or not, they won't lose money, but might not make as much, so that is kind of a no-brainer decision for them given a risk assessment. Now, had the climate been more favorable to that over the last several years (i.e., environmental issues/constraints/impediments) then there would be more refinery capacity, and possibly lower prices/more supply of fuel. But lookie there -- lower prices, more supply means more use, which gets many exercised because it is causing all kinds of other problems. So now, we buy diesel from Europe where there is some excess refining capacity (and much higher taxes to control consumption), and gasoline from other countries (e.g., Hugo), instead of making here at home and lessening our trade imbalance, improving security, etc. I think India and China are not so concerned about the same issues, so we are shooting ourselves again. On another point, it is almost 1000 miles from one end of Texas to the other, which you can drive with NOT ONE traffic light, at pretty high speed with not a lot of traffic except in Houston and SA, perhaps a little different from driving across England or Germany or Belgium maybe. We also have lots of open space, and fairly new cities (except maybe in the NE) where there is lots of room for cars, unlike a lot of Europe, and a fairly affluent population. Also there is a history of freedom (not socialism) and less-than-usurious taxation in the US that suggests if one has the money to spend on something, then you can choose to spend it on that. Those factors differ from a lot of the rest of the world. Now, all that said, I happen to think it would be a good thing to have more efficient transportation options, but let them be options not what I am told to use by someone who seems to think they know what is better for me than I can figure out for myself. I have a calculator and can figure all that out, and consider other factors too. If someone thinks a higher price (taxes) is a good thing, y'all can send me that difference and I will make sure it is used well. Trust me! --R Donald Snook wrote: Rich Thomas wrote: Oh, and the environmentalists who block new drilling and refineries. BINGO! That is why gas and diesel are so high. There are not enough refineries! The current refineries are aging and without replacements, gas is going to get more and more expensive. Koch Industries is headquartered here in Wichita. They are the world's largest refiner of oil. They can't keep up with the demand. More refining means more gas and diesel. Larger supplies would decrease the speculating traders from bumping up the price. Donald H. Snook ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
most palatable solution for me is to make sure I'm putting the gas into a car that I really enjoy driving. If you really enjoy your time behind the wheel of whatever you're driving, seems to make handing over your money at the gas station a little easier. :-) Ed 300E On 24/01/2008, Jeff Zedic [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Didn't I see something on this in the news recently? I don't know how many refineries got blown out of the water on the Gulf Coast and STILL aren't back online. Others are down for upgrading that's gone on longer than expected. Lots of refineries are behind the times technology-wise. And then you get the NIMBY types.. they HAVE to be put somewhere since you're using so much fuel. Difficult situation.what's the easiest/most palatable solution? Jeff Zedic ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
It's true that there have not been any refineries built in 10 years but the statement is deceptive. What you don't hear about is the increased capacities of existing refineries, up quite a bit over the past 10 years. I remember reading the percentage but I don't like quoting something I can't reference. Also, they now have the ability to make lighter fuels from heavier oils through a cracking process and they actually get more than a barrel of gas from a barrel of oil. Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of LWB250 Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 4:02 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel If I remember correctly the comment that I've heard in the news numerous times, there hasn't been a new refinery built in the U.S. for over 10 years. Sorta like Nuke plants... Dan --- Donald Snook [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rich Thomas wrote: Oh, and the environmentalists who block new drilling and refineries. BINGO! That is why gas and diesel are so high. There are not enough refineries! The current refineries are aging and without replacements, gas is going to get more and more expensive. Koch Industries is headquartered here in Wichita. They are the world's largest refiner of oil. They can't keep up with the demand. More refining means more gas and diesel. Larger supplies would decrease the speculating traders from bumping up the price. Donald H. Snook ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.10/1241 - Release Date: 1/24/2008 9:58 AM ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
No, not really a current issue. All refineries need downtime for maintenance, and are constantly being maintained. I don't think there is much if any reduced capacity due to the hurricanes as any damage has been dealt with. I think there might have been one or two really old ones, or sections of bigger ones, that were not rebuilt or restarted but there was/is sufficient capacity in others to make up. There were short-term problems but not really long-term issues. There is no easy or most palatable solution, other than to make an individual choice as to how to deal with the situation. There is no guarantee that life will be easy. --R Jeff Zedic wrote: Didn't I see something on this in the news recently? I don't know how many refineries got blown out of the water on the Gulf Coast and STILL aren't back online. Others are down for upgrading that's gone on longer than expected. Lots of refineries are behind the times technology-wise. And then you get the NIMBY types.. they HAVE to be put somewhere since you're using so much fuel. Difficult situation.what's the easiest/most palatable solution? Jeff Zedic ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
BZZZT, WRONG. There has not been a new refinery built in over 30 years. 1976 or so LWB250 wrote: If I remember correctly the comment that I've heard in the news numerous times, there hasn't been a new refinery built in the U.S. for over 10 years. Sorta like Nuke plants... Dan -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 94 E420, 92 300SD, 92 300D, 92 250D Turbo, 92 300E 4Matic, 91 300D, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 89 260E, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE 5.0 Euro, 84 190D, 84 300D euro manny, 81 240D, 81 380SLC, 80 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Hi Dan, When they were talking about econo shitboxes I immediately thought of Pintos and Vegas. IMHO, the Capri was a high performance German built (?) that offered numberous states of tune. I looked at one in 74 or 75 that was a special sponsored model - kind of like the John Player Specials that Lotus built- but it was specifically for the Capri - wish I could recall the name of that model. It was a real hot rod. Seems like there was a V6 option in there somewhere - but maintanence was troublesome as the engine completely filled the engine compartment making spark plugs difficult. I think by the time the US carmakers realized VW was significant competition and discovered they had nothing to compete. Then the 73 oil imbargo happened and the US auto industry had empty showrooms for those looking for economy cars. Hence the Pinto and Vega were born. They were rushed thru design and RD was virtually non-existant. The Pinto were firebombs waiting for a rear end collision to happen and the Vega's Alum engine has sleeve problems IIRC. It was not their finest hour. Also, all carmakers were struggling to meet the 68 and later congress mandated safety and environmental requirements while struggling to control the constant demands of a wild union. Again, IIRC, that was about when the auto industry began to consolidate with large companies absorbing smaller ones vigorishly. Take care - Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs . - Original Message - From: LWB250 [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 4:39 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel The Capri had a 2.0 liter 4 cyl OHC mill in it that was the bomb. Same engine was in the early (70-71-1/2) Pintos, as I had one with it . A dead wicked engine with a lot of little tweaks you could do to really get it going. Dan --- Frederick W Moir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Alles. Formula Ford has used Cortina engines and they are not slow. Car was the usual Brit POS and quite zippy. (I know, I'm old) Fred Moir Lynn MA It's Diesel this and Diesel that and chuck 'im out, the brute with apologies to R. Kipling At 12:02 PM 1/24/2008, you wrote: How about the Mercury Capri back in the early 70's? It was actually a reasonable car. Ford had some other things that they brought in and sold that were not all that great. My father had a Ford Cortina that was some sort of English Ford if I am not mistaken. It may not have been sold in the US but was in Canada. Randy ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
While economizing to make oil last longer there is no escaping the need for new reserves of oil to keep our economy chugging along. Saving money with wind, solar, etc generators is fine but it;s a dropin the bucket when you look at the needs of this country on an overall basis. I'd like to see driling off our coasts, drilling in Anwar, building *lots* of nuclear power stations, oil refineries and as we go along, develop hybrids - but limit the gov't role and encourage the public to design things that are workable but need development. How about a company to collect all the WVO in the US and process it - distribute it at existing gas stations and offer incentives to get people to buy diesels. New diesels, old diesels - anyone with a diesel gets soe incentive - maybe 6 months of fuel? And while we're at it, push the global warming crowd to the back of the elevator becuae their proof doesn't meet the smell test. The world is preparing to spend billions on GW when the money could be better spent. One thing I;ve always wondered about Algore - why was he so quiet about GW when he was VP for 8 years? In what was possibly the 2nd best pulpit in the world to tell people stuff, yet he failed to say anything that I recall. Now, it's making him millions ... Sorry to blab on for so long - Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs . - Original Message - From: Donald Snook [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 4:57 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel Rich Thomas wrote: Oh, and the environmentalists who block new drilling and refineries. BINGO! That is why gas and diesel are so high. There are not enough refineries! The current refineries are aging and without replacements, gas is going to get more and more expensive. Koch Industries is headquartered here in Wichita. They are the world's largest refiner of oil. They can't keep up with the demand. More refining means more gas and diesel. Larger supplies would decrease the speculating traders from bumping up the price. Donald H. Snook ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Actually it's been 30 years. I worked on one of the last ones - in Port Arthur Tex for Texaco finish in ~1976. Same for Nukes - there were a dozen or so under construction in the mid-late 70s when they began to be shut down - usually a 2 unit nuke would be a 1 or a 4 unit would become a 2 unit. And it would take 15 years to design, buy equipment and build one. I believe Va Power requested one of their building permits be evaluated for re-activation last year. Maybe they plan to start building again? Overall it's not a pretty picture -- Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs . - Original Message - From: LWB250 [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 5:02 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel If I remember correctly the comment that I've heard in the news numerous times, there hasn't been a new refinery built in the U.S. for over 10 years. Sorta like Nuke plants... Dan --- Donald Snook [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rich Thomas wrote: Oh, and the environmentalists who block new drilling and refineries. BINGO! That is why gas and diesel are so high. There are not enough refineries! The current refineries are aging and without replacements, gas is going to get more and more expensive. Koch Industries is headquartered here in Wichita. They are the world's largest refiner of oil. They can't keep up with the demand. More refining means more gas and diesel. Larger supplies would decrease the speculating traders from bumping up the price. Donald H. Snook ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
There was supposed to be one built back in the 70's not 8 miles from my house. They protested and got it shut down so now the site is empty. Hear talk of building something there, maybe nuke, maybe coal. LarryT wrote: Actually it's been 30 years. I worked on one of the last ones - in Port Arthur Tex for Texaco finish in ~1976. Same for Nukes - there were a dozen or so under construction in the mid-late 70s when they began to be shut down - usually a 2 unit nuke would be a 1 or a 4 unit would become a 2 unit. And it would take 15 years to design, buy equipment and build one. I believe Va Power requested one of their building permits be evaluated for re-activation last year. Maybe they plan to start building again? Overall it's not a pretty picture -- Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs . - Original Message - From: LWB250 [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 5:02 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel If I remember correctly the comment that I've heard in the news numerous times, there hasn't been a new refinery built in the U.S. for over 10 years. Sorta like Nuke plants... Dan --- Donald Snook [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rich Thomas wrote: Oh, and the environmentalists who block new drilling and refineries. BINGO! That is why gas and diesel are so high. There are not enough refineries! The current refineries are aging and without replacements, gas is going to get more and more expensive. Koch Industries is headquartered here in Wichita. They are the world's largest refiner of oil. They can't keep up with the demand. More refining means more gas and diesel. Larger supplies would decrease the speculating traders from bumping up the price. Donald H. Snook ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 94 E420, 92 300SD, 92 300D, 92 250D Turbo, 92 300E 4Matic, 91 300D, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 89 260E, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE 5.0 Euro, 84 190D, 84 300D euro manny, 81 240D, 81 380SLC, 80 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel -- now fuel and efficiency
Hi Rich, This is such an incredibly complex issue. In addition to the things you mentioned, when oil prices go up, the reserves also go up becuase it become more economical to oil out of the ground. For instance if oil costs $3/gal to drag from the ground and gas is selling for $4/gal there's incentive to go after that more expensive fuel. $3/g starts to look cheap by comparision.Now that we have gas at nearly $4/g at the pump should mean (I believe) the oil in the ground can be brought out and still make a profit. (Regardles of what you might think of oil company profits, their shareholders expect them to make money - if they don;t make money they become a government or die!) IIRC, coal gasification begins to become economically viable at $5/g IIRC. But we need to push forward on all these fronts, not just one, 2 or 3. Wind, solar, coal, hybrids, new exploration, new refineries, new nukes, etc, etc - all need to move forward. Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs . - Original Message - From: Rich Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 5:27 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel -- now fuel and efficiency Actually, today, some planned refinery expansions and new constructions are being (have been) put on hold because of projected decreases (or smaller increases) in consumption due to prices and govt plans to force auto makers to increase fuel economy. The refinery owners/operators don't see much reason to invest in lots of new capacity if demand is going to be lower (or not much higher) as it takes several years and lots of money to build a refinery and infrastructure to support it. Whether it goes up or not, they won't lose money, but might not make as much, so that is kind of a no-brainer decision for them given a risk assessment. Now, had the climate been more favorable to that over the last several years (i.e., environmental issues/constraints/impediments) then there would be more refinery capacity, and possibly lower prices/more supply of fuel. But lookie there -- lower prices, more supply means more use, which gets many exercised because it is causing all kinds of other problems. So now, we buy diesel from Europe where there is some excess refining capacity (and much higher taxes to control consumption), and gasoline from other countries (e.g., Hugo), instead of making here at home and lessening our trade imbalance, improving security, etc. I think India and China are not so concerned about the same issues, so we are shooting ourselves again. On another point, it is almost 1000 miles from one end of Texas to the other, which you can drive with NOT ONE traffic light, at pretty high speed with not a lot of traffic except in Houston and SA, perhaps a little different from driving across England or Germany or Belgium maybe. We also have lots of open space, and fairly new cities (except maybe in the NE) where there is lots of room for cars, unlike a lot of Europe, and a fairly affluent population. Also there is a history of freedom (not socialism) and less-than-usurious taxation in the US that suggests if one has the money to spend on something, then you can choose to spend it on that. Those factors differ from a lot of the rest of the world. Now, all that said, I happen to think it would be a good thing to have more efficient transportation options, but let them be options not what I am told to use by someone who seems to think they know what is better for me than I can figure out for myself. I have a calculator and can figure all that out, and consider other factors too. If someone thinks a higher price (taxes) is a good thing, y'all can send me that difference and I will make sure it is used well. Trust me! --R Donald Snook wrote: Rich Thomas wrote: Oh, and the environmentalists who block new drilling and refineries. BINGO! That is why gas and diesel are so high. There are not enough refineries! The current refineries are aging and without replacements, gas is going to get more and more expensive. Koch Industries is headquartered here in Wichita. They are the world's largest refiner of oil. They can't keep up with the demand. More refining means more gas and diesel. Larger supplies would decrease the speculating traders from bumping up the price. Donald H. Snook ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
More like 20 years Dan, Marathon Refinery in St.James La. was the last one completed. They are now going thru a 10 Billion Over hall that will increase their Production tow fold. A friend of mine is the Chief Production Chemist there. BTW it took them about 8 years of hassle with the Enviros and gvmint to get approval. Russ W. LWB250 wrote: If I remember correctly the comment that I've heard in the news numerous times, there hasn't been a new refinery built in the U.S. for over 10 years. Sorta like Nuke plants... Dan --- Donald Snook [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rich Thomas wrote: Oh, and the environmentalists who block new drilling and refineries. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
On Jan 24, 2008, at 7:09 PM, LarryT wrote: Now, it's making him millions ... You've hit on his motivation ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Stuff isn't shipped with gasoline - it's shipped with Diesel, and Diesel is WAY too high now --- Higher gas prices in the US mean higher prices FOR everything in the US. Because the US is such a big country and shipping costs for everyday goods are very susceptible to increases in price, an increase in gas prices means, food will be more expensive as well as the cost of EVERY single product that is shipped. I understand the desire to decrease consumption of gas/oil, but I wish that fuel prices would go down. The economy would be a lot more stable if we had $1.50 gas (and $1.45 diesel) again. -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK There are three kinds of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics. -Benjamin Disraeli and/or Mark Twain '90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
looking for economy cars. Hence the Pinto and Vega were born. They were rushed thru design and RD was virtually non-existant. The '60 Falcon was Ford's first econo-box. I've gotten better than 30MPG in it more than once (after a fresh tuneup), and it seats six comfortably. The Pinto was a scaled down Falcon. Hard to believe, but that Falcon is now our largest car. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Hard to believe, but that Falcon is now our largest car. Even larger than the 300SDL? Kevin in Hillsboro, OR 1983 300SD 266Kmi, Ursula ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Hard to believe, but that Falcon is now our largest car. Even larger than the 300SDL? One holds six. The other, five. And I believe the Falcon is a little wider inside. The SDL has more legroom in back, but the Falcon has enough. (The truck also holds six, but the back seat is definitely a bit cramped.) -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
You also appreciate the Euro lights much more at night too!! My Audi A4 TDI has nicde birght lights as well as the dipping feature that doesn't exist in North America. I think my car has 4 settings for dippingalso has the original Euro trailer hitch and wiring! Gotta love Euro spec! Jeff Zedic ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
A few years back when there were a lot more W126s on the roads here, you would see the odd, Euro model. I always loved the slight differences between those, and our Canadian spec cars. I also thought the way they put the folds in the seats on the Euro cars was much cooler and more modern looking. Not sure if it's true or not, but I was once told, there were differences in the chassis between the US and Canadian W140s.? We in Canada according to them to a Euro chassis, and the US version was unique to that market. I know our bumper impact requirements are a little higher than than in the US, maybe that had something to do with it at the time? Ed 300E On 23/01/2008, Donald Snook [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I remember a discussion the other day about when the first diesel was mass produced. According to my handy dandy Ultimate History of Mercedes Benz (a book I bought for a friend for a birthday), the first mass produced diesel was the 1936 260D. Mercedes was putting diesels in commercial trucks and busses several years before that. I could not remember what the conclusion of the group was the other day. Just wanted to share what my source says. It really is a cool book and it shows almost every model with Euro headlights. They sure do make a car better looking IMO. Donald H. Snook ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
I often see pics of Euro spec Mercedes running around with trail hitches. I think you could get them factory ordered over there? I was told, they aren't an option here, and putting one on your car will void the warranty. Did Euro models get extra tranny coolers? Maybe Mercedes were worried about us Canadians towing our Ski-Doos around, 12 months of the year? :-) Ed 300E On 23/01/2008, Jeff Zedic [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You also appreciate the Euro lights much more at night too!! My Audi A4 TDI has nicde birght lights as well as the dipping feature that doesn't exist in North America. I think my car has 4 settings for dippingalso has the original Euro trailer hitch and wiring! Gotta love Euro spec! Jeff Zedic ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Most, if not all MB's have a tranny cooler anyway. Yes, the hitches are factory and if you look in the trunk floor pan area you'll probably see the nuts welded into the floor that are put there for the hitch. Euro hitches are much better designed than crappy NA onesIMHO.unfortunately they use a 50 mm ball so most of our stuff won't work. I've been really freaked out by the cars here ever since I got back to NA.bland bland bland styling.even the same models seem to have subtle variations that make them look different. It's like they're all higher off the ground toowouldn't surprise me. The new Civic looks much better in Europethe few times you do see one.Honda's are nowhere near as popular over there...they're considered an old fogies car! hahaha Euro lights, rear fogs, dipping headlights, Audis with diesels and 5 speedlots of nice little things. MB Canada is a bunch of dummies. Most of the people I've talked to here don't even know MB makes a diesel! Never mind that loads of the articulated buses in London are Benz. Police driving 5 series BMW's , Lexus IS200 diesels!! Yes Lexus diesels! Usually the trim spec is changed on models a year ahead of North America. I still can't get over the Smart car still isn't in the US yet13 years on. Not very popular back home...styling is now said to be a tad old, believe it or not. Mind you I wouldn't mind the Smart Roadster but I definitely do not like the Fourfour model. Not many people did...it sold poorly but I see lots of the Roadstersvery low to the ground and convertible top...wonder if they'll ever sell them here. Word is they're making an MPV or SUV soon, too.. Is the Mini Clubman is here yet? Looks nice but the Brits didn't like it because the long door is on the wrong side of the car. Jeff Zedic ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
I think the clubman is due here soon, if not already here. Yeah, I love some of the small cars in Europe. They seem to know how to make a small car fun and good looking. Most small cars here seem to me, to constantly remind you how little money you spent all the time. Oh well, just makes vacations overseas that much more fun to look forward to. :-) Vroom vroom. Ed 300E On 23/01/2008, Jeff Zedic [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Most, if not all MB's have a tranny cooler anyway. Yes, the hitches are factory and if you look in the trunk floor pan area you'll probably see the nuts welded into the floor that are put there for the hitch. Euro hitches are much better designed than crappy NA onesIMHO.unfortunately they use a 50 mm ball so most of our stuff won't work. I've been really freaked out by the cars here ever since I got back to NA.bland bland bland styling.even the same models seem to have subtle variations that make them look different. It's like they're all higher off the ground toowouldn't surprise me. The new Civic looks much better in Europethe few times you do see one.Honda's are nowhere near as popular over there...they're considered an old fogies car! hahaha Euro lights, rear fogs, dipping headlights, Audis with diesels and 5 speedlots of nice little things. MB Canada is a bunch of dummies. Most of the people I've talked to here don't even know MB makes a diesel! Never mind that loads of the articulated buses in London are Benz. Police driving 5 series BMW's , Lexus IS200 diesels!! Yes Lexus diesels! Usually the trim spec is changed on models a year ahead of North America. I still can't get over the Smart car still isn't in the US yet13 years on. Not very popular back home...styling is now said to be a tad old, believe it or not. Mind you I wouldn't mind the Smart Roadster but I definitely do not like the Fourfour model. Not many people did...it sold poorly but I see lots of the Roadstersvery low to the ground and convertible top...wonder if they'll ever sell them here. Word is they're making an MPV or SUV soon, too.. Is the Mini Clubman is here yet? Looks nice but the Brits didn't like it because the long door is on the wrong side of the car. Jeff Zedic ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] First MB Diesel
Righto Don. 1936 260D, the first mass produced Diesel car. There was one in the old Museum at Stuttgart. I am guessing it is in the new museum also. At 05:10 PM 1/23/2008, you wrote: I remember a discussion the other day about when the first diesel was mass produced. According to my handy dandy Ultimate History of Mercedes Benz (a book I bought for a friend for a birthday), the first mass produced diesel was the 1936 260D. Mercedes was putting diesels in commercial trucks and busses several years before that. I could not remember what the conclusion of the group was the other day. Just wanted to share what my source says. It really is a cool book and it shows almost every model with Euro headlights. They sure do make a car better looking IMO. Donald H. Snook ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Loren Faeth ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
