Re: signature delimiter
On Wed, Nov 28, 2001 at 12:00:37AM -0800, Dairy Wall Limey wrote: Reed Lai wrote: Seniors, As I remember, the signature delimiter -- in mail body is a -- Ah... I can not understand your answer... I mean... my question is that the -- is mentioned in which RFC document? he didn't answer your question directly. but the sig delimiter should be -- (ie two dashes followed by one, and ONLY one, space). http://www.math.fu-berlin.de/~guckes/elm/elm.sig.etiquette.html i did some searching on google and didn't turn up an rfc that specifically requires this. i always assumed it was more a matter of good etiquette, but it's very possible that an rfc exists. I have understood now. Thanks for all helps! -- Reed Lai http://w3.icpdas.com/reed/ | ICPDAS http://www.icpdas.com GnuPG (DSA/ElGamal) 0x7199EAD3 Reed Lai (key #1) [EMAIL PROTECTED] KeyServer: search.keyserver.net | HAM: BV4QO | NIC-handle: RL7000
Re : signature delimiter
Seniors, As I remember, the signature delimiter -- in mail body is a standard from RFC, but I forget which RCF is. Anybody remembers that please tell me. not -- but -- ! RFC 1036 (Standard for interchange of USENET messages)
Re: Re : signature delimiter
Wolfgang Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Seniors, As I remember, the signature delimiter -- in mail body is a standard from RFC, but I forget which RCF is. Anybody remembers that please tell me. not -- but -- ! RFC 1036 (Standard for interchange of USENET messages) Err, don't you mean -- \n? -- Brian Nelson [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://bignachos.com
Re : Re : signature delimiter
* Thus spake Brian Nelson [EMAIL PROTECTED]: As I remember, the signature delimiter -- in mail body is a standard from RFC, but I forget which RCF is. Anybody remembers that please tell me. not -- but -- ! RFC 1036 (Standard for interchange of USENET messages) Err, don't you mean -- \n? Of course ;-)
Re: Re : signature delimiter
On Wed, Nov 28, 2001 at 12:54:06AM -0800, Brian Nelson wrote: Wolfgang Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: not -- but -- ! RFC 1036 (Standard for interchange of USENET messages) Err, don't you mean -- \n? Err, don't you mean \n-- \n? :) -- Dave Pearson: | mutt.octet.filter - autoview octet-streams http://www.davep.org/ | mutt.vcard.filter - autoview simple vcards Mutt: | muttrc2html - muttrc - HTML utility http://www.davep.org/mutt/ | muttrc.sl - Jed muttrc mode
Re: mbox Postmark Line vs. Message Date Header?
* Vineet Kumar ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: * Thomas Hurst ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [011127 15:43]: The other thing, which it seems is often overlooked and underappreciated, is the ability to use nice things like grep, find, xargs and the like on your mail the way it oughta work. Hm, is there a quick way to convert a mbox to Maildir so I can have a quick look to see what it's like on a huge mailbox? (he says, blatently avoiding reading the manual) I do tend to leave deleting/archiving mail until I absolutely can't stand waiting for the client to load folders any more, though, so maybe that mainly applies to very large mailboxes. I've killed three MUA's doing that so far :) Well, I certainly don't mean to tell you how to live your life, but here's how I do mine: set mbox_type=Maildir set record=+archive/sent-mail/`date +%Y/%m-sent-mail-%Y'` set mbox=+archive/inbox/`date '+%Y/%m-inbox-%Y'` set move I do plan on doing something like this, it's just a matter of being bothered to do it. Maybe when my freebsd cvs-all folder gets tedious to open :) -- Thomas 'Freaky' Hurst - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.aagh.net/
Re: mbox Postmark Line vs. Message Date Header?
Thomas -- ...and then Thomas Hurst said... % * Vineet Kumar ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: % % * Thomas Hurst ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [011127 15:43]: % % The other thing, which it seems is often overlooked and % underappreciated, is the ability to use nice things like grep, find, % xargs and the like on your mail the way it oughta work. % % Hm, is there a quick way to convert a mbox to Maildir so I can have a % quick look to see what it's like on a huge mailbox? :set mbox_type=Maildir T. ;C/tmp/TestMailFolder/ to set your mbox type to maildir, tag all messages, and then copy them to a test maildir (but not flag them all for deletion in the current folder; if you want that then ;s(ave) instead of ;C(opy). % % (he says, blatently avoiding reading the manual) Yeah, obviously :-) % % I do tend to leave deleting/archiving mail until I absolutely can't % stand waiting for the client to load folders any more, though, so % maybe that mainly applies to very large mailboxes. I've killed % three MUA's doing that so far :) % % Well, I certainly don't mean to tell you how to live your life, but % here's how I do mine: % % set mbox_type=Maildir set record=+archive/sent-mail/`date % +%Y/%m-sent-mail-%Y'` set mbox=+archive/inbox/`date % '+%Y/%m-inbox-%Y'` set move % % I do plan on doing something like this, it's just a matter of being % bothered to do it. Maybe when my freebsd cvs-all folder gets tedious to % open :) Well, let's see, here... Now I'm finally curious. First I opened my big funnies folder and converted it to Maildir; on about 9400 messages that took mutt about 7 minutes to write using the exact method described above (but we don't have the fastest SCSI disk even though we are using reiserfs. When I open the folder both ways I get [zero] [10:14am] ~ time mutt -e push x -f Mail/F.funnies 4.460u 1.590s 1:18.68 7.6% 0+0k 0+0io 1747pf+0w [zero] [10:16am] ~ time mutt -e push x -f Mail/M.funnies 4.850u 3.370s 3:20.50 4.0% 0+0k 0+0io 1145pf+0w It looks like Maildir is distinctly worse for me. I should probably have used /dev/null for my muttrc since I push a collapse-all and sort by threads in there, but it applies to both and the sorting is quick; once the message count finishes, the screen only stays blank for a second or two saying sorting messages. It was interesting to me to find that the Maildir version does not show a percentage count as it counts up messages; it's comforting to see oneself getting closer and closer to 100% when you don't know how many messages are in the [large!] folder. I'd think that would be even easier with Maildir, since you need only look at the directory inodes rather than look through the whole mbox file, but perhaps that percentage is of the total size rather than the total number (and the size, of course, is easy to get on the way in). % % -- % Thomas 'Freaky' Hurst - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.aagh.net/ :-D -- David T-G * It's easier to fight for one's principles (play) [EMAIL PROTECTED] * than to live up to them. -- fortune cookie (work) [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.justpickone.org/davidtg/Shpx gur Pbzzhavpngvbaf Qrprapl Npg! msg20753/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
folder shortcut
Hi, I use an imap folder as my main spool file, and each time I want to change to that folder from another one, I type the long imap address, which quickly gets tiring. Is there away to set a default mailbox to goto, or a way to alias mailbox names so I don't have to type imap://host:port/FOLDER each time I want to change to my main mailbox? Thanks, - Paul -- Paul Roberts [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Maildir vs mbox (was: mbox Postmark Line vs. Message Date Header?)
* David T-G ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Thomas -- :set mbox_type=Maildir T. ;C/tmp/TestMailFolder/ Thanks. Well, let's see, here... Now I'm finally curious. First I opened my big funnies folder and converted it to Maildir; on about 9400 messages that took mutt about 7 minutes to write using the exact method described above (but we don't have the fastest SCSI disk even though we are using reiserfs. When I open the folder both ways I get It took about 10 seconds to convert the 4200 or so messages in cvs-all. [zero] [10:14am] ~ time mutt -e push x -f Mail/F.funnies 4.460u 1.590s 1:18.68 7.6% 0+0k 0+0io 1747pf+0w [zero] [10:16am] ~ time mutt -e push x -f Mail/M.funnies 4.850u 3.370s 3:20.50 4.0% 0+0k 0+0io 1145pf+0w It looks like Maildir is distinctly worse for me. mutt -e push q -f Mail/lists/cvs-all 2.03s user 0.55s system 98% cpu 2.619 total mutt -e push q -f Mail/TestMail 2.08s user 1.12s system 97% cpu 3.288 total Neither felt particularly different, although Maildir felt slightly snappier opening messages (presumably because seek()ing to a message in a mbox is more expensive than a simple fopen()), but in both cases it took a fraction of a second. Size wize, the mbox was 13600K compared with a 15207K Maildir. This is on UFS+FFS+SU, on a 384MB FreeBSD machine with dirhashing. It was interesting to me to find that the Maildir version does not show a percentage count as it counts up messages; it's comforting to see oneself getting closer and closer to 100% when you don't know how many messages are in the [large!] folder. I'd think that would be even easier with Maildir, since you need only look at the directory inodes rather than look through the whole mbox file, but perhaps that percentage is of the total size rather than the total number (and the size, of course, is easy to get on the way in). Would be nice to get a percentage count, even if the meaning was slightly different to that of a mbox. -- Thomas 'Freaky' Hurst - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.aagh.net/
Re: Which grepmail little mutt front-end ?
* Paul Roberts Student lab engineer ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Mon, Nov 26, 2001 at 01:56:23PM +0100, Gregor Zattler wrote: I'm interested in such thing. Where can i get this? Try: http://grepmail.sourceforge.net/ There's a link on that page to the mutt front-end too. http://mboxgrep.sf.net/ Is a nice alternative that doesn't use Perl (although it does support PCRE). grepmail's date support looks sweet though. -- Thomas 'Freaky' Hurst - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.aagh.net/
mutt for blind computerusers
Hi, I'm a blind computeruser who wants to use mutt. Most things are working very fine, I had only to change a view settings in the standardconfiguration to get mutt working with my special screenreading software (suse-blinux) and hardware devices (brailledisplay and speechsynt). But one thing is very uncomfortable... When reading a mail, there is no cursor inside mutt's internal pager which makes it unposible for my screenreading software to read the message with the normal keyboard by using the arrowkeys for example. I have to use the keys on my brailledisplay and thats really stressfull ;-). What I'm looking for is a posibility to get a cursor inside the pager which is positioned on the first letter of the line. When opening a message the cursor should be in teh first line of the mail and it would be cool to scroll to the next line (for example by pressing the arrow-down-key) and so on, till the last line of the messagetext. It would be great to be able navigating on every line of the message with the cursor, then it shuld be no problem reading a message with my screenreading software. As far as I know mutt doesn't have a solution for my problem, but maybe I'm wrong ??? Perhaps anyone has a tip how I can solve the problem or maybe it is posible to ad a new feature to mutt, that brings a cursor in to the internal pager. Thanks in advance, Schoeppi -- Christian Schoepplein| http://www.lily-rockt.de [EMAIL PROTECTED]| http://www.lavish.de
Re: mutt for blind computerusers
On Wed, Nov 28, 2001 at 08:26:35PM +0100, Christian Schoepplein wrote: Hi, I'm a blind computeruser who wants to use mutt. Most things are working very fine, I had only to change a view settings in the standardconfiguration to get mutt working with my special screenreading software (suse-blinux) and hardware devices (brailledisplay and speechsynt). But one thing is very uncomfortable... When reading a mail, there is no cursor inside mutt's internal pager which makes it unposible for my screenreading software to read the message with the normal keyboard by using the arrowkeys for example. I have to use the keys on my brailledisplay and thats really stressfull ;-). What I'm looking for is a posibility to get a cursor inside the pager which is positioned on the first letter of the line. When opening a message the cursor should be in teh first line of the mail and it would be cool to scroll to the next line (for example by pressing the arrow-down-key) and so on, till the last line of the messagetext. It would be great to be able navigating on every line of the message with the cursor, then it shuld be no problem reading a message with my screenreading software. As far as I know mutt doesn't have a solution for my problem, but maybe I'm wrong ??? Perhaps anyone has a tip how I can solve the problem or maybe it is posible to ad a new feature to mutt, that brings a cursor in to the internal pager. well, a workaround might be instead of viewing messages with enter, view with 'e' - edit-message. that will open the message in your defined editor, and you can scroll through it there with the cursor... when done, just quit your editor without saving, and you're back at the index. in my setup, the editor is set to : set editor=vim -u ~/.mutt/vimrc -c ':0;/^$' so that it automagically starts after the headers :) HTH! -- Dan Boger Linux MVP brainbench.com msg20758/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: mutt for blind computerusers
You can use an external pager with mutt. This would at least be a good interim solution. set pager=view or something. -Daniel On Wed, Nov 28, 2001 at 08:26:35PM +0100, Christian Schoepplein [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, I'm a blind computeruser who wants to use mutt. Most things are working very fine, I had only to change a view settings in the standardconfiguration to get mutt working with my special screenreading software (suse-blinux) and hardware devices (brailledisplay and speechsynt). But one thing is very uncomfortable... When reading a mail, there is no cursor inside mutt's internal pager which makes it unposible for my screenreading software to read the message with the normal keyboard by using the arrowkeys for example. I have to use the keys on my brailledisplay and thats really stressfull ;-). What I'm looking for is a posibility to get a cursor inside the pager which is positioned on the first letter of the line. When opening a message the cursor should be in teh first line of the mail and it would be cool to scroll to the next line (for example by pressing the arrow-down-key) and so on, till the last line of the messagetext. It would be great to be able navigating on every line of the message with the cursor, then it shuld be no problem reading a message with my screenreading software. As far as I know mutt doesn't have a solution for my problem, but maybe I'm wrong ??? Perhaps anyone has a tip how I can solve the problem or maybe it is posible to ad a new feature to mutt, that brings a cursor in to the internal pager. Thanks in advance, Schoeppi -- Christian Schoepplein| http://www.lily-rockt.de [EMAIL PROTECTED]| http://www.lavish.de -- Daniel E. Eisenbud [EMAIL PROTECTED] We should go forth on the shortest walk perchance, in the spirit of undying adventure, never to return,--prepared to send back our embalmed hearts only as relics to our desolate kingdoms. --Henry David Thoreau, Walking
Re: mutt for blind computerusers
On Wed, Nov 28, 2001 at 02:32:39PM -0500, Dan Boger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: well, a workaround might be instead of viewing messages with enter, view with 'e' - edit-message. that will open the message in your defined editor, and you can scroll through it there with the cursor... when done, just quit your editor without saving, and you're back at the index. Setting the pager to an editor (preferably started with a readonly flag) would be a lot less error-prone. -Daniel -- Daniel E. Eisenbud [EMAIL PROTECTED] We should go forth on the shortest walk perchance, in the spirit of undying adventure, never to return,--prepared to send back our embalmed hearts only as relics to our desolate kingdoms. --Henry David Thoreau, Walking
Re: mutt for blind computerusers
On Wed, Nov 28, 2001 at 02:36:06PM -0500, Daniel Eisenbud wrote: On Wed, Nov 28, 2001 at 02:32:39PM -0500, Dan Boger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: well, a workaround might be instead of viewing messages with enter, view with 'e' - edit-message. that will open the message in your defined editor, and you can scroll through it there with the cursor... when done, just quit your editor without saving, and you're back at the index. Setting the pager to an editor (preferably started with a readonly flag) would be a lot less error-prone. defenitly! I didn't actually know you could do that :) -- Dan Boger [EMAIL PROTECTED] msg20761/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: mutt for blind computerusers
Hi, * Christian Schoepplein [EMAIL PROTECTED] [01-11-28 20:26]: What I'm looking for is a posibility to get a cursor inside the pager which is positioned on the first letter of the line. What about: set pager=/your/favorite/pager This might even be your editor. (Crosspoint has an optional cursor for this very reason. Great program.) Thorsten -- They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. - Benjamin Franklin
Re: mutt for blind computerusers
On Wed, Nov 28, 2001 at 21:11:25 +0100, Christian Schoepplein wrote: Using a external editor or pager for viewing the messages has the disadvantage, that no mutt-internal commands are working. To go arround my problem both solutions are ok, but they are really only a workaround ;-). I agree with you. Perhaps there could be an optional cursor for the internal pager. PS: Your message doesn't contain a References or In-Reply-To header. Both headers should have been generated by Mutt when you replied; they are useful for threading the articles. Did you do a normal reply (or list-reply) with Mutt? Otherwise is there a problem with that? -- Vincent Lefèvre [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Web: http://www.vinc17.org/ - 100% validated HTML - Acorn Risc PC, Yellow Pig 17, Championnat International des Jeux Mathématiques et Logiques, TETRHEX, etc. Work: CR INRIA - computer arithmetic / SPACES project at LORIA
Re: folder shortcut
* Paul Roberts Student lab engineer [EMAIL PROTECTED] [28-11-2001 17:27]: | Hi, | | I use an imap folder as my main spool file, and each time I want to | change to that folder from another one, I type the long imap address, | which quickly gets tiring. Is there away to set a default mailbox to | goto, or a way to alias mailbox names so I don't have to type | imap://host:port/FOLDER each time I want to change to my main mailbox? If the imap folder is, like you say, your main spool file, a change-folder to ! should do the trick. -- René Clerc - ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) A budget is just a method of worrying before you spend money, as well as afterward. msg20767/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
how to get text from other messages into current?
Hi- Mutt's great! But I have a question. How can I cut text from a saved message and paste it into my current composition? --aaron
Re: how to get text from other messages into current?
Moin, * Aaron Falk [EMAIL PROTECTED] [01-11-29 00:05]: How can I cut text from a saved message and paste it into my current composition? I usually open up another Mutt and use X11's clipboard. Thorsten -- In dem Augenblick, wo wir anfangen unsere Freiheitsrechte einzuschränken, besorgen wird das Geschäft der Terroristen. - Günter Grass
Re: mutt for blind computerusers
On Wed, Nov 28, 2001 at 22:18:07 +0100, Christian Schoepplein wrote: That was my mistake... I first replyed with the fast-reply-function on one message with resulting in directly answering the person who wrote this mail not not replying to the list. After this I sent the same mail to this list, what causes the broken thread. Sorry for that ;-). You should have used a function that keeps the In-Reply-To and References headers. I know that bounce-message does this, but the To and Cc headers wouldn't have been changed, and this is a bit annoying as they are useful if someone wants to reply (but the Message-Id is kept too, which could be a good thing if you received a reply to your first mail). Perhaps resend-message could be better (it seems to keep the In-Reply-To header, and I hope it also keeps the References one). -- Vincent Lefèvre [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Web: http://www.vinc17.org/ - 100% validated HTML - Acorn Risc PC, Yellow Pig 17, Championnat International des Jeux Mathématiques et Logiques, TETRHEX, etc. Work: CR INRIA - computer arithmetic / SPACES project at LORIA
Bad Mail-Followup-To (was: mutt for blind computerusers)
Christian, Your Mail-Followup-To header is broken: Mail-Followup-To: Christian Schoepplein [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] as [EMAIL PROTECTED] doesn't exist, though your From header is correct. I don't know what the reason is. Any idea? Perhaps your From header isn't correct but it is modified by your local MTA? In this case, you should set it with the my_hdr command in your muttrc. If you subscribed to the mailing-list, you should use the subscribe command too. -- Vincent Lefèvre [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Web: http://www.vinc17.org/ - 100% validated HTML - Acorn Risc PC, Yellow Pig 17, Championnat International des Jeux Mathématiques et Logiques, TETRHEX, etc. Work: CR INRIA - computer arithmetic / SPACES project at LORIA
Mail-Followup-To
what other MTAs honor Mail-Followup-To, and is there a patch for pine to make it do this? i couldn't find any patches online for this. i don't use pine, but a number of colleagues do (and many use other, even more brain-dead MUAs). given that my chances of converting many of them are slim, is there any way to do this? i don't want to have to start using unique addresses for internal lists too, but it messes up my organization when list messages get in my inbox (due to use of 'reply-all'). w
Trailing Lines
Silly question that I need an answer to. I seem to have *lots* of trailing lines when I post or reply, how do I correct this? -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=--=-=-=-=-=-=-==-=-=---=-=-=-=-=-=- Registered Linux User #213656 access to power must be limited to those who are not in love with it --Plato
Re: Trailing Lines
On Thu, Nov 29, 2001 at 00:57:17 +, dallam wrote: Silly question that I need an answer to. I seem to have *lots* of trailing lines when I post or reply, how do I correct this? with another editor? -- Vincent Lefèvre [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Web: http://www.vinc17.org/ - 100% validated HTML - Acorn Risc PC, Yellow Pig 17, Championnat International des Jeux Mathématiques et Logiques, TETRHEX, etc. Work: CR INRIA - computer arithmetic / SPACES project at LORIA
Re: mbox Postmark Line vs. Message Date Header?
Vineet Kumar [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: * Samuel Padgett ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: So the advantage of Maildir is speed, and the disadvantage is that it eats inodes for breakfast? This is my experience, yes. Another advantage is peace of mind that you'll never again fall prey to a corrupted mailbox due to a delivery occurring at the wrong time. But shouldn't well-behaved MTAs and MUAs perform locking that prevents this from happening? Sam
Re: mutt for blind computerusers
* Christian Schoepplein [EMAIL PROTECTED] [011128 19:25]: Hi, I'm a blind computeruser who wants to use mutt. Most things are working very fine, I had only to change a view settings in the standardconfiguration to get mutt working with my special screenreading software (suse-blinux) and hardware devices (brailledisplay and speechsynt). But one thing is very uncomfortable... When reading a mail, there is no cursor inside mutt's internal pager which makes it unposible for my screenreading software to read the message with the normal keyboard by using the arrowkeys for example. I have to use the keys on my brailledisplay and thats really stressfull ;-). What I'm looking for is a posibility to get a cursor inside the pager which is positioned on the first letter of the line. When opening a message the cursor should be in teh first line of the mail and it would be cool to scroll to the next line (for example by pressing the arrow-down-key) and so on, till the last line of the messagetext. It would be great to be able navigating on every line of the message with the cursor, then it shuld be no problem reading a message with my screenreading software. As far as I know mutt doesn't have a solution for my problem, but maybe I'm wrong ??? Perhaps anyone has a tip how I can solve the problem or maybe it is posible to ad a new feature to mutt, that brings a cursor in to the internal pager. not sure if this is what u want but i have somthing like this in my muttrc bind pager Upprevious-line bind pager Down next-line Thanks in advance, Schoeppi no probs if it's any help
Re: mbox Postmark Line vs. Message Date Header?
Sam, This is my experience, yes. Another advantage is peace of mind that you'll never again fall prey to a corrupted mailbox due to a delivery occurring at the wrong time. But shouldn't well-behaved MTAs and MUAs perform locking that prevents this from happening? Yes, they should perform locking. No, it won't prevent it. 1) System crashes in the middle of delivering mail. 2) Filesystem a few bytes from full. Open mbox, read messages. Sync mailbox; it starts rewriting a bunch of Status: headers, which ends up extending the file. *boom* filesystem full, you've lost/overwritten/corrupted stuff. I'm sure with a bit of effort, we could find a number of other failure modes. -- Matthew Fuller (MF4839) |[EMAIL PROTECTED] Unix Systems Administrator |[EMAIL PROTECTED] Specializing in FreeBSD |http://www.over-yonder.net/ The only reason I'm burning my candle at both ends, is because I haven't figured out how to light the middle yet
mutt index_format and size of messages
by default, mutt displays the lines count in the index listing. the %c format option allows the display of the size in bytes. is there anyway to have mutt display size in kb, possibly rounded to 2 significant figures, or an accuracy of 0.1? mutt-users, please CC me on the reply. thanks, -- martin; (greetings from the heart of the sun.) \ echo mailto: !#^.*|tr * mailto:; net@madduck i took an iq test and the results were negative.
Re: mutt index_format and size of messages
* Justin R. Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2001.11.28 10:28:34-0500]: Thus spake martin f krafft ([EMAIL PROTECTED]): this on the personal side... why not make it Also sprach martin f krafft after all, the original was german... Mine shows KB, and I got it from mutt-users a while back. Don't have time to decode which letter it is now, but here's mine: set index_format=%4C %Z %{%b %d} %-15.15F (%4c) %s you rock! i saw %c and tried it, but it wouldn't succeed. i mean, it did work, but i had hooks overriding it. so now it's beautuitous! -- martin; (greetings from the heart of the sun.) \ echo mailto: !#^.*|tr * mailto:; net@madduck a good scapegoat is nearly as welcome as a solution to the problem.