RE: [OT] Big Windows 10 update

[Stephen Price]

Agreed! We need to make more noise about the lack of control.

I was at Rottnest last week, had my laptop and saw there was an update for 
VS2017. Limited bandwidth compared to when at home, but hey 25gb should be 
enough right?
Wrong. It got stuck trying to download the UWP SDK even though I unchecked the 
UWP option in the installer. I eventually cancelled it when I realised how much 
it was downloading.

End result, VS was dead. Repair might have worked but I didn't think to try it 
while offline until just now. Took a few days off from coding but my bandwidth 
is blown and have paid for extra gb. Someone at Microsoft I can send the bill? 
Nope. Knew the risk and got stung.

Also why is it so hard for an offline installer? I know it can be done but it's 
unnecessary gymnastics now. Bring back ISO versions.

On 13 Dec. 2017 11:17 am, Greg Low <g...@greglow.com> wrote:

Hey Steve, you have to be happy with change. That’s the nature of this industry.



But it’s the lack of control over when that occurs is the problem, coupled with 
the fact that it routinely breaks things. That’s the issue. If it almost always 
worked and didn’t break things, no problems.



Having a setup where relatively randomly, your machine is broken for you, no 
matter what you were in the middle of doing, or what you thought you needed to 
be using the machine for, is not cool.



Also not cool was when they changed my “connect when I decide to” internal 
broadband modem to “Windows will manage this” and turning it on automatically 
as part of the upgrade, when I was in Europe and paying extortionate data 
roaming charges on that modem, is also an example of not cool.



Regards,



Greg



Dr Greg Low



1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile│ +61 3 8676 4913 fax

SQL Down Under | Web: www.sqldownunder.com<http://www.sqldownunder.com/> 
|http://greglow.me<http://greglow.me/>



From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com<mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com> 
[mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com<mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com>] On 
Behalf Of Stephen Price
Sent: Wednesday, 13 December 2017 2:09 PM
To: ozDotNet <ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com<mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Subject: Re: [OT] Big Windows 10 update



What we are experiencing is not a new thing. Change is constant. Each new 
release of software, for all things, comes with new bug fixes, new bugs and new 
features. Some we need some we don't.

The pain we are feeling is a combination of lack of control combined with the 
frequency of these changes.

Once upon a time we had to wait several years for a new release (take Visual 
Studio as an example). Now we see new updates weekly and sometimes daily.

Hopefully the pain we feel is shorter lived as a result. We can communicate 
with the Devs much easier now. Often we can see the name of the developer who 
checked in the code. We can comment on the codebase and raise issues.

Take the recent icon colour change of VScode for example. For those who were 
not watching, they changed the colour to orange (or green depending on the 
branch). People were NOT happy. The Devs listened and in about a week or maybe 
two it was back to the familiar colour.

Imagine having to wait 2 years to get your icon colour fixed or some other life 
altering bug.

You can't make everyone happy all of the time. We are all at the whim of the 
developers of the code we use. If you don't like that, you have options. 
Feedback or change software. Or write your own.

If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change how you 
think of it.



Hmm, might make this a blog post.



On 13 Dec. 2017 9:10 am, David Connors 
<da...@connors.com<mailto:da...@connors.com>> wrote:

On Wed, 13 Dec 2017 at 10:08 Grant Maw 
<grant@gmail.com<mailto:grant@gmail.com>> wrote:

Never thought I'd ever see myself switching to Linux but I have to say that I'm 
starting to look very, very hard at it, for all the reasons that Mike and the 
Gregs have outlined above. I just wonder if I REALLY need to learn a new OS at 
my age ... life is too short :)



I bought a chromebox on a lark a while back.



It said it needed a new OS so I clicked reboot. OS installation and reboot was 
~10 seconds.



Le Sigh.



I was boned by one of these updates in a customer meeting. It half installs 
before it wants to reboot and that took out my WiFi. Windows said it wanted to 
reboot - sure fine. 1 hour later...



David.



--

David Connors
da...@connors.com<mailto:da...@connors.com> | @davidconnors | 
https://t.me/davidconnors | LinkedIn | +61 417 189 363

RE: [OT] Big Windows 10 update

[Ken Schaefer]

You might want to bookmark this link (note, the dates are displayed in US 
format). Expect a major update every ~6 months if you are on Current Branch. If 
you have access to installed Enterprise Edition, you can move to Long Term 
Servicing Branch, which means you only get major updates every 2-3 years (like 
deploying a new OS version like you used to do)

https://technet.microsoft.com/en-au/windows/release-info

The updates from 1511 -> 1607 -> 1703 -> 1709 are these “big updates” that you 
are seeing.

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On 
Behalf Of Greg Keogh
Sent: Tuesday, 12 December 2017 3:23 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Subject: [OT] Big Windows 10 update

Folks, I didn't know it was coming, but I accepted a big Windows 10 update last 
night. An unfamiliar large blue notification tray window warned me it was a 
major update that would take a while. So I went and talked to the cats while it 
updated.

Well, this is a big update. User profiles seem to be recreated on first login. 
Wallpaper went black. All The crappy Universal apps I removed came back, 
including new ones like "Mixed Reality" that you can't get rid of, even using 
PowerShell as real Admin. All file-open dialogs changed size. The Start menu 
was full of dozens of repeated "NoUIEntryPoints-DesignMode" items and other app 
menus that were never seen before. Registry adjustments to take stupid nodes 
out of the Windows Explorer tree were undone. New icons appeared in the tray by 
default (but could be hidden). And other little things as well... I spent over 
an hour trying to clean all the "garbage" out again.

Overall, I'm quite pissed off. Every major Windows update seems to take more 
and more control away from me, and I'm being told what I should use and like (I 
can use a Mac if want that!).

So just a warning.

Greg K

RE: [OT] Big Windows 10 update

[Greg Low]

That’s exactly it. It’s like someone randomly just says “forget what you
were planning to do the next day or so, you now need to start researching
how to fix your machine”. Then doing that more than once per year.



I thrive on change but that’s not reasonable.

Regards,



Greg



Dr Greg Low



1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile│ +61 3 8676 4913 fax

SQL Down Under | Web: www.sqldownunder.com |http://greglow.me



*From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com]
*On Behalf Of *Tony McGee
*Sent:* Wednesday, 13 December 2017 2:27 PM
*To:* ozDotNet <ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>
*Subject:* Re: [OT] Big Windows 10 update



Although there's plenty of room for improvements on scheduling when updates
happen (e.g. "active hours" as currently designed isn't good enough IMHO), I
don't see many complaints here about change or the frequency of updates.



Complaints are quite rightly that the software was working before it was
updated, and then afterwards it ranges from flaky to utterly broken.



I'm sure Microsoft is keenly aware of the complexities of updating billions
of Windows devices globally, but the rest of us just want a hassle free
update process and to get on with it. :)







On 13 Dec 2017 13:09, "Stephen Price" <step...@lythixdesigns.com> wrote:

What we are experiencing is not a new thing. Change is constant. Each new
release of software, for all things, comes with new bug fixes, new bugs and
new features. Some we need some we don't.

The pain we are feeling is a combination of lack of control combined with
the frequency of these changes.

Once upon a time we had to wait several years for a new release (take
Visual Studio as an example). Now we see new updates weekly and sometimes
daily.

Hopefully the pain we feel is shorter lived as a result. We can communicate
with the Devs much easier now. Often we can see the name of the developer
who checked in the code. We can comment on the codebase and raise issues.

Take the recent icon colour change of VScode for example. For those who
were not watching, they changed the colour to orange (or green depending on
the branch). People were NOT happy. The Devs listened and in about a week
or maybe two it was back to the familiar colour.

Imagine having to wait 2 years to get your icon colour fixed or some other
life altering bug.

You can't make everyone happy all of the time. We are all at the whim of
the developers of the code we use. If you don't like that, you have
options. Feedback or change software. Or write your own.

If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change how
you think of it.



Hmm, might make this a blog post.



On 13 Dec. 2017 9:10 am, David Connors <da...@connors.com> wrote:

On Wed, 13 Dec 2017 at 10:08 Grant Maw <grant@gmail.com> wrote:

Never thought I'd ever see myself switching to Linux but I have to say that
I'm starting to look very, very hard at it, for all the reasons that Mike
and the Gregs have outlined above. I just wonder if I REALLY need to learn
a new OS at my age ... life is too short :)



I bought a chromebox on a lark a while back.



It said it needed a new OS so I clicked reboot. OS installation and reboot
was ~10 seconds.



Le Sigh.



I was boned by one of these updates in a customer meeting. It half installs
before it wants to reboot and that took out my WiFi. Windows said it wanted
to reboot - sure fine. 1 hour later...



David.



-- 

David Connors
da...@connors.com | @davidconnors | https://t.me/davidconnors | LinkedIn | +61
417 189 363 <+61%20417%20189%20363>

Re: [OT] Big Windows 10 update

[Tony McGee]

Although there's plenty of room for improvements on scheduling when updates
happen (e.g. "active hours" as currently designed isn't good enough IMHO), I
don't see many complaints here about change or the frequency of updates.

Complaints are quite rightly that the software was working before it was
updated, and then afterwards it ranges from flaky to utterly broken.

I'm sure Microsoft is keenly aware of the complexities of updating billions
of Windows devices globally, but the rest of us just want a hassle free
update process and to get on with it. :)



On 13 Dec 2017 13:09, "Stephen Price"  wrote:

What we are experiencing is not a new thing. Change is constant. Each new
release of software, for all things, comes with new bug fixes, new bugs and
new features. Some we need some we don't.
The pain we are feeling is a combination of lack of control combined with
the frequency of these changes.
Once upon a time we had to wait several years for a new release (take
Visual Studio as an example). Now we see new updates weekly and sometimes
daily.
Hopefully the pain we feel is shorter lived as a result. We can communicate
with the Devs much easier now. Often we can see the name of the developer
who checked in the code. We can comment on the codebase and raise issues.
Take the recent icon colour change of VScode for example. For those who
were not watching, they changed the colour to orange (or green depending on
the branch). People were NOT happy. The Devs listened and in about a week
or maybe two it was back to the familiar colour.
Imagine having to wait 2 years to get your icon colour fixed or some other
life altering bug.
You can't make everyone happy all of the time. We are all at the whim of
the developers of the code we use. If you don't like that, you have
options. Feedback or change software. Or write your own.
If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change how
you think of it.

Hmm, might make this a blog post.

On 13 Dec. 2017 9:10 am, David Connors  wrote:

On Wed, 13 Dec 2017 at 10:08 Grant Maw  wrote:

Never thought I'd ever see myself switching to Linux but I have to say that
I'm starting to look very, very hard at it, for all the reasons that Mike
and the Gregs have outlined above. I just wonder if I REALLY need to learn
a new OS at my age ... life is too short :)


I bought a chromebox on a lark a while back.

It said it needed a new OS so I clicked reboot. OS installation and reboot
was ~10 seconds.

Le Sigh.

I was boned by one of these updates in a customer meeting. It half installs
before it wants to reboot and that took out my WiFi. Windows said it wanted
to reboot - sure fine. 1 hour later...

David.

-- 
David Connors
da...@connors.com | @davidconnors | https://t.me/davidconnors | LinkedIn | +61
417 189 363 <+61%20417%20189%20363>

RE: [OT] Big Windows 10 update

[Stephen Price]

Totally agree.

We need to make lots of noise and let them know.

We all know first hand that the driving forces of software often puts stability 
lower down the list than new features.

I think the downside of more frequent releases means less fear around releasing 
bugs. Because they can always fix them when we (the users) find them for them.

Not ideal for us, the unpaid testers.

On 13 Dec. 2017 11:12 am, Nick Randolph <n...@builttoroam.com> wrote:

But that’s no excuse for breaking stuff….. enough said.



Both Windows and Visual Studio need to slow down, focus on stability and 
performance, before shipping any new features. Greg’s experience (and he’s not 
alone as I’ve seen reports from others with the same issue) is not acceptable; 
neither are the repeated drops of VS where perf sux or stability is an issue.



Nick Randolph | Built to Roam Pty Ltd | Microsoft MVP – Windows Platform 
Development | +61 412 413 425 | @thenickrandolph | skype:nick_randolph
The information contained in this email is confidential. If you are not the 
intended recipient, you may not disclose or use the information in this email 
in any way. Built to Roam Pty Ltd does not guarantee the integrity of any 
emails or attached files. The views or opinions expressed are the author's own 
and may not reflect the views or opinions of Built to Roam Pty Ltd.



From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On 
Behalf Of Stephen Price
Sent: Wednesday, 13 December 2017 2:09 PM
To: ozDotNet <ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>
Subject: Re: [OT] Big Windows 10 update



What we are experiencing is not a new thing. Change is constant. Each new 
release of software, for all things, comes with new bug fixes, new bugs and new 
features. Some we need some we don't.

The pain we are feeling is a combination of lack of control combined with the 
frequency of these changes.

Once upon a time we had to wait several years for a new release (take Visual 
Studio as an example). Now we see new updates weekly and sometimes daily.

Hopefully the pain we feel is shorter lived as a result. We can communicate 
with the Devs much easier now. Often we can see the name of the developer who 
checked in the code. We can comment on the codebase and raise issues.

Take the recent icon colour change of VScode for example. For those who were 
not watching, they changed the colour to orange (or green depending on the 
branch). People were NOT happy. The Devs listened and in about a week or maybe 
two it was back to the familiar colour.

Imagine having to wait 2 years to get your icon colour fixed or some other life 
altering bug.

You can't make everyone happy all of the time. We are all at the whim of the 
developers of the code we use. If you don't like that, you have options. 
Feedback or change software. Or write your own.

If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change how you 
think of it.



Hmm, might make this a blog post.



On 13 Dec. 2017 9:10 am, David Connors 
<da...@connors.com<mailto:da...@connors.com>> wrote:

On Wed, 13 Dec 2017 at 10:08 Grant Maw 
<grant@gmail.com<mailto:grant@gmail.com>> wrote:

Never thought I'd ever see myself switching to Linux but I have to say that I'm 
starting to look very, very hard at it, for all the reasons that Mike and the 
Gregs have outlined above. I just wonder if I REALLY need to learn a new OS at 
my age ... life is too short :)



I bought a chromebox on a lark a while back.



It said it needed a new OS so I clicked reboot. OS installation and reboot was 
~10 seconds.



Le Sigh.



I was boned by one of these updates in a customer meeting. It half installs 
before it wants to reboot and that took out my WiFi. Windows said it wanted to 
reboot - sure fine. 1 hour later...



David.



--

David Connors
da...@connors.com<mailto:da...@connors.com> | @davidconnors | 
https://t.me/davidconnors | LinkedIn | +61 417 189 363

Re: [OT] Big Windows 10 update

[Greg Keogh]

I'm progressive and I say "If it ain't broke, fix it until it is".
I welcome change and quicker turnaround for software and OSs. However, I
don't welcome being told without warning what icons, colours, animation,
names, styles, messages and conventions I must use by my merciless
overlords. And then I find I can't remove/hide things I don't like or want
without jumping though flaming hoops.

If you can't change it, change how you think of it.
>

That's what Winston Smith did in the tragic final pages of 1984.

*GK*

P.S. An update to VS2017 is coming now, and it's big. Lord knows what's
going to happen!?!

RE: [OT] Big Windows 10 update

[Greg Low]

Hey Steve, you have to be happy with change. That’s the nature of this
industry.



But it’s the lack of control over when that occurs is the problem, coupled
with the fact that it routinely breaks things. That’s the issue. If it
almost always worked and didn’t break things, no problems.



Having a setup where relatively randomly, your machine is broken for you,
no matter what you were in the middle of doing, or what you thought you
needed to be using the machine for, is not cool.



Also not cool was when they changed my “connect when I decide to” internal
broadband modem to “Windows will manage this” and turning it on
automatically as part of the upgrade, when I was in Europe and paying
extortionate data roaming charges on that modem, is also an example of not
cool.



Regards,



Greg



Dr Greg Low



1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile│ +61 3 8676 4913 fax

SQL Down Under | Web: www.sqldownunder.com |http://greglow.me



*From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com]
*On Behalf Of *Stephen Price
*Sent:* Wednesday, 13 December 2017 2:09 PM
*To:* ozDotNet <ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>
*Subject:* Re: [OT] Big Windows 10 update



What we are experiencing is not a new thing. Change is constant. Each new
release of software, for all things, comes with new bug fixes, new bugs and
new features. Some we need some we don't.

The pain we are feeling is a combination of lack of control combined with
the frequency of these changes.

Once upon a time we had to wait several years for a new release (take
Visual Studio as an example). Now we see new updates weekly and sometimes
daily.

Hopefully the pain we feel is shorter lived as a result. We can communicate
with the Devs much easier now. Often we can see the name of the developer
who checked in the code. We can comment on the codebase and raise issues.

Take the recent icon colour change of VScode for example. For those who
were not watching, they changed the colour to orange (or green depending on
the branch). People were NOT happy. The Devs listened and in about a week
or maybe two it was back to the familiar colour.

Imagine having to wait 2 years to get your icon colour fixed or some other
life altering bug.

You can't make everyone happy all of the time. We are all at the whim of
the developers of the code we use. If you don't like that, you have
options. Feedback or change software. Or write your own.

If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change how
you think of it.



Hmm, might make this a blog post.



On 13 Dec. 2017 9:10 am, David Connors <da...@connors.com> wrote:

On Wed, 13 Dec 2017 at 10:08 Grant Maw <grant@gmail.com> wrote:

Never thought I'd ever see myself switching to Linux but I have to say that
I'm starting to look very, very hard at it, for all the reasons that Mike
and the Gregs have outlined above. I just wonder if I REALLY need to learn
a new OS at my age ... life is too short :)



I bought a chromebox on a lark a while back.



It said it needed a new OS so I clicked reboot. OS installation and reboot
was ~10 seconds.



Le Sigh.



I was boned by one of these updates in a customer meeting. It half installs
before it wants to reboot and that took out my WiFi. Windows said it wanted
to reboot - sure fine. 1 hour later...



David.



-- 

David Connors
da...@connors.com | @davidconnors | https://t.me/davidconnors
| LinkedIn | +61 417 189 363

Re: [OT] Big Windows 10 update

[David Burstin]

>> If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change
how you think of it.

That is my new motto. Thanks :)

On 13 December 2017 at 14:09, Stephen Price 
wrote:

> What we are experiencing is not a new thing. Change is constant. Each new
> release of software, for all things, comes with new bug fixes, new bugs and
> new features. Some we need some we don't.
> The pain we are feeling is a combination of lack of control combined with
> the frequency of these changes.
> Once upon a time we had to wait several years for a new release (take
> Visual Studio as an example). Now we see new updates weekly and sometimes
> daily.
> Hopefully the pain we feel is shorter lived as a result. We can
> communicate with the Devs much easier now. Often we can see the name of the
> developer who checked in the code. We can comment on the codebase and raise
> issues.
> Take the recent icon colour change of VScode for example. For those who
> were not watching, they changed the colour to orange (or green depending on
> the branch). People were NOT happy. The Devs listened and in about a week
> or maybe two it was back to the familiar colour.
> Imagine having to wait 2 years to get your icon colour fixed or some other
> life altering bug.
> You can't make everyone happy all of the time. We are all at the whim of
> the developers of the code we use. If you don't like that, you have
> options. Feedback or change software. Or write your own.
> If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change how
> you think of it.
>
> Hmm, might make this a blog post.
>
> On 13 Dec. 2017 9:10 am, David Connors  wrote:
>
> On Wed, 13 Dec 2017 at 10:08 Grant Maw  wrote:
>
> Never thought I'd ever see myself switching to Linux but I have to say
> that I'm starting to look very, very hard at it, for all the reasons that
> Mike and the Gregs have outlined above. I just wonder if I REALLY need to
> learn a new OS at my age ... life is too short :)
>
>
> I bought a chromebox on a lark a while back.
>
> It said it needed a new OS so I clicked reboot. OS installation and reboot
> was ~10 seconds.
>
> Le Sigh.
>
> I was boned by one of these updates in a customer meeting. It half
> installs before it wants to reboot and that took out my WiFi. Windows said
> it wanted to reboot - sure fine. 1 hour later...
>
> David.
>
> --
> David Connors
> da...@connors.com | @davidconnors | https://t.me/davidconnors
> | LinkedIn | +61 417 189 363 <+61%20417%20189%20363>
>
>
>

Re: [OT] Big Windows 10 update

[Stephen Price]

What we are experiencing is not a new thing. Change is constant. Each new 
release of software, for all things, comes with new bug fixes, new bugs and new 
features. Some we need some we don't.
The pain we are feeling is a combination of lack of control combined with the 
frequency of these changes.
Once upon a time we had to wait several years for a new release (take Visual 
Studio as an example). Now we see new updates weekly and sometimes daily.
Hopefully the pain we feel is shorter lived as a result. We can communicate 
with the Devs much easier now. Often we can see the name of the developer who 
checked in the code. We can comment on the codebase and raise issues.
Take the recent icon colour change of VScode for example. For those who were 
not watching, they changed the colour to orange (or green depending on the 
branch). People were NOT happy. The Devs listened and in about a week or maybe 
two it was back to the familiar colour.
Imagine having to wait 2 years to get your icon colour fixed or some other life 
altering bug.
You can't make everyone happy all of the time. We are all at the whim of the 
developers of the code we use. If you don't like that, you have options. 
Feedback or change software. Or write your own.
If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change how you 
think of it.

Hmm, might make this a blog post.

On 13 Dec. 2017 9:10 am, David Connors  wrote:
On Wed, 13 Dec 2017 at 10:08 Grant Maw 
> wrote:
Never thought I'd ever see myself switching to Linux but I have to say that I'm 
starting to look very, very hard at it, for all the reasons that Mike and the 
Gregs have outlined above. I just wonder if I REALLY need to learn a new OS at 
my age ... life is too short :)

I bought a chromebox on a lark a while back.

It said it needed a new OS so I clicked reboot. OS installation and reboot was 
~10 seconds.

Le Sigh.

I was boned by one of these updates in a customer meeting. It half installs 
before it wants to reboot and that took out my WiFi. Windows said it wanted to 
reboot - sure fine. 1 hour later...

David.

--
David Connors
da...@connors.com | @davidconnors | https://t.me/davidconnors | LinkedIn | +61 
417 189 363

Re: [OT] Big Windows 10 update

[David Connors]

On Wed, 13 Dec 2017 at 10:08 Grant Maw  wrote:

> Never thought I'd ever see myself switching to Linux but I have to say
> that I'm starting to look very, very hard at it, for all the reasons that
> Mike and the Gregs have outlined above. I just wonder if I REALLY need to
> learn a new OS at my age ... life is too short :)
>

I bought a chromebox on a lark a while back.

It said it needed a new OS so I clicked reboot. OS installation and reboot
was ~10 seconds.

Le Sigh.

I was boned by one of these updates in a customer meeting. It half installs
before it wants to reboot and that took out my WiFi. Windows said it wanted
to reboot - sure fine. 1 hour later...

David.

-- 
David Connors
da...@connors.com | @davidconnors | https://t.me/davidconnors | LinkedIn | +61
417 189 363

Re: [OT] Big Windows 10 update

[mike smith]

Apparently we need to avoid systemd - you get a windows like effect with it

On 13 Dec. 2017 11:08, "Grant Maw"  wrote:

> Never thought I'd ever see myself switching to Linux but I have to say
> that I'm starting to look very, very hard at it, for all the reasons that
> Mike and the Gregs have outlined above. I just wonder if I REALLY need to
> learn a new OS at my age ... life is too short :)
>
> On 12 December 2017 at 15:15, Stephen Price 
> wrote:
>
>> Haha. Yep, time for people to switch over to Linux.
>>
>> Dotnet core runs there just fine, what's holding you back? Surely it's
>> not driver support or anything right?
>>
>> Kids theses days... Want everything now now now, and then when they get
>> it, they cry. Bit like wanting to go to the shops, and then having to be
>> dragged there crying. ;)
>>
>> Welcome to the future. Let's hope you like it because you can't go back
>> in time (yet)
>>
>> On 12 Dec. 2017 12:42 pm, mike smith  wrote:
>>
>> Makes you wish there was an os you could compile with what you wanted in
>> it. Oh wait there is
>>
>>
>> On 12 Dec. 2017 15:29, "Greg Low"  wrote:
>>
>> I’ve had the last two updates break mobile device configuration as well.
>>
>>
>>
>> Can’t say I love the random, forced breaking of my machine every few
>> months. As a policy, I think it’s pretty questionable.
>>
>>
>>
>> Mind you, ask me what I think about iOS 11…
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>>
>>
>> Greg
>>
>>
>>
>> Dr Greg Low
>>
>>
>>
>> 1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775 <1300%20775%20775>) office | +61 419201410
>> <0419%20201%20410> mobile│ +61 3 8676 4913 <%2803%29%208676%204913> fax
>>
>> SQL Down Under | Web: www.sqldownunder.com |http://greglow.me
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-bounces@ozdot
>> net.com] *On Behalf Of *Greg Keogh
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, 12 December 2017 3:23 PM
>> *To:* ozDotNet 
>> *Subject:* [OT] Big Windows 10 update
>>
>>
>>
>> Folks, I didn't know it was coming, but I accepted a big Windows 10
>> update last night. An unfamiliar large blue notification tray window warned
>> me it was a major update that would take a while. So I went and talked to
>> the cats while it updated.
>>
>>
>>
>> Well, this is a big update. User profiles seem to be recreated on first
>> login. Wallpaper went black. All The crappy Universal apps I removed came
>> back, including new ones like "Mixed Reality" that you can't get rid of,
>> even using PowerShell as real Admin. All file-open dialogs changed size.
>> The Start menu was full of dozens of repeated "NoUIEntryPoints-DesignMode"
>> items and other app menus that were never seen before. Registry adjustments
>> to take stupid nodes out of the Windows Explorer tree were undone. New
>> icons appeared in the tray by default (but could be hidden). And other
>> little things as well... I spent over an hour trying to clean all the
>> "garbage" out again.
>>
>>
>>
>> Overall, I'm quite pissed off. Every major Windows update seems to take
>> more and more control away from me, and I'm being told what I should use
>> and like (I can use a Mac if want that!).
>>
>>
>>
>> So just a warning.
>>
>>
>>
>> *Greg K*
>>
>>
>>
>

Re: [OT] Big Windows 10 update

[Grant Maw]

Never thought I'd ever see myself switching to Linux but I have to say that
I'm starting to look very, very hard at it, for all the reasons that Mike
and the Gregs have outlined above. I just wonder if I REALLY need to learn
a new OS at my age ... life is too short :)

On 12 December 2017 at 15:15, Stephen Price 
wrote:

> Haha. Yep, time for people to switch over to Linux.
>
> Dotnet core runs there just fine, what's holding you back? Surely it's not
> driver support or anything right?
>
> Kids theses days... Want everything now now now, and then when they get
> it, they cry. Bit like wanting to go to the shops, and then having to be
> dragged there crying. ;)
>
> Welcome to the future. Let's hope you like it because you can't go back in
> time (yet)
>
> On 12 Dec. 2017 12:42 pm, mike smith  wrote:
>
> Makes you wish there was an os you could compile with what you wanted in
> it. Oh wait there is
>
>
> On 12 Dec. 2017 15:29, "Greg Low"  wrote:
>
> I’ve had the last two updates break mobile device configuration as well.
>
>
>
> Can’t say I love the random, forced breaking of my machine every few
> months. As a policy, I think it’s pretty questionable.
>
>
>
> Mind you, ask me what I think about iOS 11…
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> Greg
>
>
>
> Dr Greg Low
>
>
>
> 1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775 <1300%20775%20775>) office | +61 419201410
> <0419%20201%20410> mobile│ +61 3 8676 4913 <%2803%29%208676%204913> fax
>
> SQL Down Under | Web: www.sqldownunder.com |http://greglow.me
>
>
>
> *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-bounces@ozdot
> net.com] *On Behalf Of *Greg Keogh
> *Sent:* Tuesday, 12 December 2017 3:23 PM
> *To:* ozDotNet 
> *Subject:* [OT] Big Windows 10 update
>
>
>
> Folks, I didn't know it was coming, but I accepted a big Windows 10 update
> last night. An unfamiliar large blue notification tray window warned me it
> was a major update that would take a while. So I went and talked to the
> cats while it updated.
>
>
>
> Well, this is a big update. User profiles seem to be recreated on first
> login. Wallpaper went black. All The crappy Universal apps I removed came
> back, including new ones like "Mixed Reality" that you can't get rid of,
> even using PowerShell as real Admin. All file-open dialogs changed size.
> The Start menu was full of dozens of repeated "NoUIEntryPoints-DesignMode"
> items and other app menus that were never seen before. Registry adjustments
> to take stupid nodes out of the Windows Explorer tree were undone. New
> icons appeared in the tray by default (but could be hidden). And other
> little things as well... I spent over an hour trying to clean all the
> "garbage" out again.
>
>
>
> Overall, I'm quite pissed off. Every major Windows update seems to take
> more and more control away from me, and I'm being told what I should use
> and like (I can use a Mac if want that!).
>
>
>
> So just a warning.
>
>
>
> *Greg K*
>
>
>

RE: [OT] Big Windows 10 update

[Stephen Price]

Haha. Yep, time for people to switch over to Linux.

Dotnet core runs there just fine, what's holding you back? Surely it's not 
driver support or anything right?

Kids theses days... Want everything now now now, and then when they get it, 
they cry. Bit like wanting to go to the shops, and then having to be dragged 
there crying. ;)

Welcome to the future. Let's hope you like it because you can't go back in time 
(yet)

On 12 Dec. 2017 12:42 pm, mike smith  wrote:
Makes you wish there was an os you could compile with what you wanted in it. Oh 
wait there is


On 12 Dec. 2017 15:29, "Greg Low" > 
wrote:

I’ve had the last two updates break mobile device configuration as well.



Can’t say I love the random, forced breaking of my machine every few months. As 
a policy, I think it’s pretty questionable.



Mind you, ask me what I think about iOS 11…



Regards,



Greg



Dr Greg Low



1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 
419201410 mobile│ +61 3 8676 
4913 fax

SQL Down Under | Web: www.sqldownunder.com 
|http://greglow.me



From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com 
[mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On 
Behalf Of Greg Keogh
Sent: Tuesday, 12 December 2017 3:23 PM
To: ozDotNet >
Subject: [OT] Big Windows 10 update



Folks, I didn't know it was coming, but I accepted a big Windows 10 update last 
night. An unfamiliar large blue notification tray window warned me it was a 
major update that would take a while. So I went and talked to the cats while it 
updated.



Well, this is a big update. User profiles seem to be recreated on first login. 
Wallpaper went black. All The crappy Universal apps I removed came back, 
including new ones like "Mixed Reality" that you can't get rid of, even using 
PowerShell as real Admin. All file-open dialogs changed size. The Start menu 
was full of dozens of repeated "NoUIEntryPoints-DesignMode" items and other app 
menus that were never seen before. Registry adjustments to take stupid nodes 
out of the Windows Explorer tree were undone. New icons appeared in the tray by 
default (but could be hidden). And other little things as well... I spent over 
an hour trying to clean all the "garbage" out again.



Overall, I'm quite pissed off. Every major Windows update seems to take more 
and more control away from me, and I'm being told what I should use and like (I 
can use a Mac if want that!).



So just a warning.



Greg K

RE: [OT] Big Windows 10 update

[mike smith]

Makes you wish there was an os you could compile with what you wanted in
it. Oh wait there is


On 12 Dec. 2017 15:29, "Greg Low"  wrote:

> I’ve had the last two updates break mobile device configuration as well.
>
>
>
> Can’t say I love the random, forced breaking of my machine every few
> months. As a policy, I think it’s pretty questionable.
>
>
>
> Mind you, ask me what I think about iOS 11…
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> Greg
>
>
>
> Dr Greg Low
>
>
>
> 1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775 <1300%20775%20775>) office | +61 419201410
> <0419%20201%20410> mobile│ +61 3 8676 4913 <(03)%208676%204913> fax
>
> SQL Down Under | Web: www.sqldownunder.com |http://greglow.me
>
>
>
> *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-bounces@
> ozdotnet.com] *On Behalf Of *Greg Keogh
> *Sent:* Tuesday, 12 December 2017 3:23 PM
> *To:* ozDotNet 
> *Subject:* [OT] Big Windows 10 update
>
>
>
> Folks, I didn't know it was coming, but I accepted a big Windows 10 update
> last night. An unfamiliar large blue notification tray window warned me it
> was a major update that would take a while. So I went and talked to the
> cats while it updated.
>
>
>
> Well, this is a big update. User profiles seem to be recreated on first
> login. Wallpaper went black. All The crappy Universal apps I removed came
> back, including new ones like "Mixed Reality" that you can't get rid of,
> even using PowerShell as real Admin. All file-open dialogs changed size.
> The Start menu was full of dozens of repeated "NoUIEntryPoints-DesignMode"
> items and other app menus that were never seen before. Registry adjustments
> to take stupid nodes out of the Windows Explorer tree were undone. New
> icons appeared in the tray by default (but could be hidden). And other
> little things as well... I spent over an hour trying to clean all the
> "garbage" out again.
>
>
>
> Overall, I'm quite pissed off. Every major Windows update seems to take
> more and more control away from me, and I'm being told what I should use
> and like (I can use a Mac if want that!).
>
>
>
> So just a warning.
>
>
>
> *Greg K*
>

RE: [OT] Big Windows 10 update

[Greg Low]

I’ve had the last two updates break mobile device configuration as well.



Can’t say I love the random, forced breaking of my machine every few
months. As a policy, I think it’s pretty questionable.



Mind you, ask me what I think about iOS 11…



Regards,



Greg



Dr Greg Low



1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile│ +61 3 8676 4913 fax

SQL Down Under | Web: www.sqldownunder.com |http://greglow.me



*From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com]
*On Behalf Of *Greg Keogh
*Sent:* Tuesday, 12 December 2017 3:23 PM
*To:* ozDotNet 
*Subject:* [OT] Big Windows 10 update



Folks, I didn't know it was coming, but I accepted a big Windows 10 update
last night. An unfamiliar large blue notification tray window warned me it
was a major update that would take a while. So I went and talked to the
cats while it updated.



Well, this is a big update. User profiles seem to be recreated on first
login. Wallpaper went black. All The crappy Universal apps I removed came
back, including new ones like "Mixed Reality" that you can't get rid of,
even using PowerShell as real Admin. All file-open dialogs changed size.
The Start menu was full of dozens of repeated "NoUIEntryPoints-DesignMode"
items and other app menus that were never seen before. Registry adjustments
to take stupid nodes out of the Windows Explorer tree were undone. New
icons appeared in the tray by default (but could be hidden). And other
little things as well... I spent over an hour trying to clean all the
"garbage" out again.



Overall, I'm quite pissed off. Every major Windows update seems to take
more and more control away from me, and I'm being told what I should use
and like (I can use a Mac if want that!).



So just a warning.



*Greg K*