Dear Gary and others,
Having read this it occurred to me that in practopoietic systems the
sign would correspond to downward pressure for adjustment. That is,
the components of the system, individually or more of them collectively,
detect signs indicating that there is a need to act -- a
Cathy, list,
I was hoping to post sooner, but just got around to it; I'm sorry for the
late contribution.
First of all, I find myself in agreement with Frederik's proposed view of
the Kandinskys, namely that they form a part of Peirce's analysis of
natural classes in the manuscript, and probably
Yogi, Gary, list(s),
I'm not on the biosemiotics list, so I can't send my reply there. If
someone wants to forward it for me, that would be nice; or if I should join
that list-serv, please me know that I should do so and how.
On the subject of the pragmatic maxim, Yogi says:
A sign’s immediate
Hello list,I have a quick question. What publications address the use of Peirce
for the discussion ofsymbol grounding, not just the symbol grounding problem
per se, but also the topic of the ground of the sign in general?
(other than these)Deacon 1997Steels 2008Queiroz 2009
thanks in
Yogi, Cathy L., lists,
This is quite an admirable and thought-provoking summary of the
concluding chapters of NP. I think Stjernfelt has opened some new doors
to the fuller comprehension of Peircean semiotics and its contribution
to cenoscopy, and your post in turn opens some doors to the
List, I'm forwarding Stan's response posted to Yogi's post Gary
[image: Gary Richmond]
*Gary Richmond*
*Philosophy and Critical Thinking*
*Communication Studies*
*LaGuardia College of the City University of New York*
*C 745*
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-- Forwarded message --
From: Stanley N
That is not the source of my criticism. My criticism is toward the
mathematics, that make not sense what so ever.
Steven
On Mon, Mar 30, 2015 at 11:03 AM, John Collier colli...@ukzn.ac.za wrote:
Steven,
You can use words however you want, but to criticize a view because it
uses words
Danko,
Indeed, What is important is that we understand each other. But that takes
time, and since you’ve been getting so many good responses to your posts and
your paper, I probably should have held my peace, given that I currently don’t
have the time it would take to give proper attention
Oh, I think they make sense. The question is whether the mathematics can do
what the authors claim. This requires a bit deeper analysis than you have
shown, so I retain my belief that you are considering what they say as having
interpretation that fits your usages, and probably not theirs. Of
Ah, so, to you, 'information is a way of speaking about something'. To me,
information is 'matter-that-is-organized' such that it is differentiated from
other matter. This matter exists because it is in-form-ed, i.e., organized
within a particular form. Therefore, I agree with the outline
Steven - are you saying that information 'is nothing'?
Edwina
- Original Message -
From: Steven Ericsson-Zenith
To: Biosemiotics
Cc: Peirce Discussion Forum (peirc...@iulist.iupui.edu)
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2015 1:22 PM
Subject: [PEIRCE-L] Re: [biosemiotics:8138] Article
Steven,
You can use words however you want, but to criticize a view because it uses
words differently than you do and to put your own interpretation on it is just
silly, and should be dismissed and disregarded.
There is certain information in the paper. Like all information it requires
The answer to ex nihilo
is not that hard to find
First scuttle all our disciplines
Yes leave them all behind
Next think about it for a while
you're bound to think of something
Wait I just did it esto style!
There never was a nothing
Books http://buff.ly/15GfdqU
-
Not enough detail to understand what your beef with it is, Steven. They refer
to some plausible work that argues that information is logically prior to
matter and energy (not temporally on most accounts) and time (or at least
temporal direction). What I have trouble with is the idea that the
Again, referring to my previous posting, arguments that place information
first appear to be arguing from the position of strict idealism and
dismissing the ontological world.
Apart from this, we appear to not disagree.
My particular concerns are very much the same. Beginning with bits is a
Yeh, the sort of information talked about in the article is “stuff”. It from
bit.
John
From: Edwina Taborsky [mailto:tabor...@primus.ca]
Sent: March 30, 2015 5:18 PM
To: Biosemiotics; peirce-l@list.iupui.edu
Subject: [biosemiotics:8156] Re: Article on origina of the universe
Steven - I'd agree
Forgive the auto-correct error: Perigean should read Peircean.
Steven
On Mon, Mar 30, 2015 at 1:05 PM, Steven Ericsson-Zenith ste...@iase.us
wrote:
I think this brief discussion is most instructive and it may highlight the
source of much discontent over the years in the community discussing
Nice :-)
On Mon, Mar 30, 2015 at 11:30 AM, Stephen C. Rose stever...@gmail.com
wrote:
The answer to ex nihilo
is not that hard to find
First scuttle all our disciplines
Yes leave them all behind
Next think about it for a while
you're bound to think of something
Wait I just did it esto
I think this brief discussion is most instructive and it may highlight the
source of much discontent over the years in the community discussing the
Perigean works.
Pierce put ideas first. So if we take this position then I begin to
understand Edwina's position as Ideal. And in this sense she may
I understand what you say but that really is not it. I do try to interpret
mathematical physics in non-philosophical ways. The base assumptions have
no justification and the mathematical leaps are simply not credible.
Steven
On Mon, Mar 30, 2015 at 11:08 AM, John Collier colli...@ukzn.ac.za
Steven - I'd agree that information is, as it exists, an action. In my view,
matter only exists as 'organized' and thus is in a differentiated form, which
is to say, it is 'in-formation'. BUT this organization operates within
networked interactions; in other words - there is no such thing as,
If there is anything that I have learned at all, ever and anywhere, it is
that because people think for a long time that it is so, it does not make
it so.
This is why humanity invented the scientific method and it is the entire
reason for Epistemology as a discipline ... to keep us honest. You
Since information is [active] organized matter or information is matter
that is organized and further that there is no matter that is not
organized (by definition), according to Edwina - we have a chicken and the
egg problem. From where does anything that is in-formation or matter
come? And if I
Hi,
Interesting discussions about the nature of information, but the concept of
information may not be definable in terms of one or more simple sentences
but requires a system of nodes and arrows organized as an irreducible triad
as shown in Figure 1 below.
There is no doubt that information is
“It from bit.” Information as the ground of “stuff”.
Well I guess you have to have a modicum of understanding of the physics (my
original field). To understand what is meant by the slogan it helps to study
the writings on the topic of Wheeler, Gell-Mann and Seth Lloyd, and the
literature on
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