Comrade Mark J was talking about something with a lot more depth than the
price form.
^
CB: Yes, I have been wanting to suggest this for a while in this debate. I
don't quite see how that literally and rigorously the 2nd law of
thermodynamics is expressed or causes a limit with respect to
Yea, the depletion and other ecological matters are potentially political in
that they are the fault of capitalism, and they should be a basis for
enormous political agitation and education against capitalism as a system.
Why would leftists give up a profoundly material argument for the necessity
Actually, anthropology finds the distinction to be more that humans
distinguish themselves from animals by kinship systems, socialiality,
especially connections between generations. Hunting and gatherering, the
mode of production from the transition to human and for most of human
existence,is not
In a message dated 6/16/2004 12:22:06 PM Central Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Comrade Mark J was talking about something with a lot more depth than the
price form.
^
CB: Yes, I have been wanting to suggest this for a while in this debate. I
don't quite see how that literally and
erlich vs simon in texas death match, loser leave town...
simon's argument that, by definition, there can be no finite resources
because it is impossible to know what quantity of a given resource
exists squares with historical belief in infinite supply, which was
logical throughout much of human
erlich vs simon in texas death re-match, loser leave town...
simon's argument that, by definition, there can be no finite resources
because it is impossible to know what quantity of a given resource
exists squares with historical belief in infinite supply, which was
logical throughout much of
Michael Hoover wrote:
erlich vs simon in texas death match, loser leave town...
simon's argument that, by definition, there can be no finite resources
because it is impossible to know what quantity of a given resource
exists squares with historical belief in infinite supply, which was
ravi wrote:
aren't there enough examples of resource exhaustion for other species
(often brought about by man) that has in fact led to their extinction?
or is it that man will wipe out other species with his technological
progress, but use the same (technological progress) to generate infinite
aren't there enough examples of resource exhaustion for other species
(often brought about by man) that has in fact led to their extinction?
or is it that man will wipe out other species with his technological
progress, but use the same (technological progress) to generate infinite
resources
]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, June 13, 2004 8:24 AM
Subject: Re: [PEN-L] Further confirmation of Mark Jones
ravi wrote:
aren't there enough examples of resource exhaustion for other species
(often brought about by man) that has in fact led to their extinction?
or is it that man
. Sawicky [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sat 6/12/2004 6:16 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc:
Subject: Re: [PEN-L] Further confirmation of Mark Jones
I beg your pardon, but I predict that the next
time there's a supply bottleneck
NY Times, June 12, 2004
An Oil Enigma: Production Falls Even as Reserves Rise
By ALEX BERENSON
or six consecutive years, ChevronTexaco has had good news for anyone
worried that the world is running out of oil: the company has found more
oil and natural gas than it has produced. Over that time,
Here we go again:
I read it in the (New York Times, Newsweek, National Geographic, the
National Enquirer, All of the Above); I saw it on TV; I heard (Colin
Campbell, Mike Davis, Homer Simpson, All of the Above) say it. Ergo Mark
Jones was right.
Amazing. In the very midst of the exposure
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc:
Subject: Re: [PEN-L] Further confirmation of Mark Jones
Here we go again:
I read it in the (New York Times, Newsweek, National Geographic, the
National Enquirer, All of the Above); I saw it on TV; I
Proven reserves are very unreliable. That point seems to be key to the new Out of
Gas book. He asserts that the production curve is a lagged reserves curve.
Just as we cannot predict the future based on a couple of data points of GDP or
unemployment, the NYT article is only a suggestion of a
In a message dated 6/12/2004 9:00:35 AM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
"I read it in the (New York Times, Newsweek, National Geographic, theNational Enquirer, All of the Above); I saw it on TV; I heard (ColinCampbell, Mike Davis, Homer Simpson, All of the Above) say it. Ergo
than they were during
previous oil crises).
jd
-Original Message-
From: sartesian [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sat 6/12/2004 10:00 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc:
Subject: Re: [PEN-L] Further confirmation of Mark Jones
Michael Perelman wrote:
Proven reserves are very unreliable. That point seems to be key to the new Out of
Gas book. He asserts that the production curve is a lagged reserves curve.
Just as we cannot predict the future based on a couple of data points of GDP or
unemployment, the NYT article
I have to disagree. Such knowledge is not sufficient. It may not be necessary, but
understanding how material conditions evolve will certainly give activists a valuable
edge.
On Sat, Jun 12, 2004 at 10:32:35AM -0500, Carrol Cox wrote:
In what way does knowledge of the future of oil contribute
I am in general not known for agreeing with others, but hey in an infinite
universe
The point is, if predicative science is inherently unreliable, then
clearly we need to look at the function of such predictions, and that
function is ideological, to obscure the origins of economic, social,
On Sat, 12 Jun 2004, Carrol Cox wrote:
The material facts regarding oil depletion, global warming, mercury
poisoning of the seas, have _never_ been a central issue except in the
thought of those who cannot or who refuse to think politically. And
thinking politically involves NOT What should
Devine, James wrote:
By the way, in the article posted to pen-l, Mike Davis didn't say that we were running
into the Malthus/Ricardo stationary state driven by the absolute scarcity of oil (it's
running out! it's running out! we went over H's peak!). Rather, he made it clear that
he _assumed_
Carrol Cox wrote:
The material facts regarding oil depletion, global warming, mercury
poisoning of the seas, have _never_ been a central issue except in the
thought of those who cannot or who refuse to think politically. And
thinking politically involves NOT What should the government(s) do?
But
You know what I like about baseball? Almost everything, but most of all that
anybody can play the game, once social impediments are removed. There is no
biological, natural restriction on learning and playing the game. All the
restrictions are social in nature and exist to be overthrown.
The
Michael Perelman wrote:
I have to disagree. Such knowledge is not sufficient. It may not be necessary, but
understanding how material conditions evolve will certainly give activists a valuable
edge.
It already has given activists an edge -- my point was that nothing
could be added to that
- Original Message -
From: Carrol Cox [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
In other words, our time and energy needs to be spent in turning greens
red, not in the hopeless task of bringing more people into the general
movement through green agitation. The knowledge we had by 1980 of
Radicals trying to parse bourgeois discourse around oil now should
remember that a lot of it is infected by market sentiment, and with
oil up 250% over the last five years, market sentiment is very
frothy. (Sentiment follows prices, it doesn't lead them.) A lot of
the recent gains were driven by
Carrol Cox wrote:
In other words, our time and energy needs to be spent in turning greens
red, not in the hopeless task of bringing more people into the general
movement through green agitation. The knowledge we had by 1980 of the
ongoing damage to our living space by capitalist progress was
- Original Message -
From: Doug Henwood [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, June 12, 2004 10:00 AM
Subject: Re: [PEN-L] Further confirmation of Mark Jones
I suspect we're closer to a price peak than further sustained increases.
Doug
__
Frightening
A week or so ago, Ian Masters interviewed Fadel Gheit, Vice President for Oil and Gas
Research with Oppenheimer Inc. He was explaining how many $$ each international
flash point added to the price of oil. Several dollars each for Nigeria, Venezuela,
Saudi Arabia Iraq. I think that it was on
Michael Perelman wrote:
A week or so ago, Ian Masters interviewed Fadel Gheit, Vice
President for Oil and Gas
Research with Oppenheimer Inc. He was explaining how many $$ each
international
flash point added to the price of oil. Several dollars each for
Nigeria, Venezuela,
Saudi Arabia Iraq. I
Michael Perelman wrote:
A week or so ago, Ian Masters interviewed Fadel Gheit, Vice
President for Oil and Gas Research with Oppenheimer Inc. He was
explaining how many $$ each international flash point added to the
price of oil. Several dollars each for Nigeria, Venezuela, Saudi
Arabia Iraq. I
I beg your pardon, but I predict that the next
time there's a supply bottleneck or cartel tightening,
people will start talking about Hubbert's Peak again.
mbs
the big problem is that because no-one can predict the future, it's very
easy for superficial observers to confuse a short-term
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