On 2019-12-11 14:26, Joseph Brenner wrote:
Joseph Brenner wrote:
The signatures in the documentation are certainly helpful, but they're
no substitute for code examples. I'd go after adding more code
examples, rather than removing other stuff.
But then, maybe I'm coming into this
On 2019-12-11 14:06, Joseph Brenner wrote:
The signatures in the documentation are certainly helpful, but they're
no substitute for code examples. I'd go after adding more code
examples, rather than removing other stuff.
Hi Joseph,
I would compromise on that.
I would also like to see
Joseph Brenner wrote:
> The signatures in the documentation are certainly helpful, but they're
> no substitute for code examples. I'd go after adding more code
> examples, rather than removing other stuff.
But then, maybe I'm coming into this discussion in the middle-- is the
topic here adding
The signatures in the documentation are certainly helpful, but they're
no substitute for code examples. I'd go after adding more code
examples, rather than removing other stuff.
I would argue that signatures are great for any command line script
because you can use them with MAIN to get input checking.
On Wed, 11 Dec 2019, 18:07 Veesh Goldman, wrote:
> I believe there's a disparity here between the needs of a sysadmin and
> people who program hardcore with Raku.
I believe there's a disparity here between the needs of a sysadmin and
people who program hardcore with Raku. That's what I'm seeing in the
discussion here.
Signatures are very important to those who write programs, because they
help you arrange your code in a clean and maintainable and
> The signatures are very important to the developers.
> They only confuse the programmer.
Speak for yourself, I'm not developing the innards of Raku, I'm just using
it for projects- like you. And I NEED the signatures. They tell me so much!!
-y
On Mon, Dec 9, 2019 at 6:53 PM ToddAndMargo via
On 2019-12-10 16:07, Trey Harris wrote:
On Mon, Dec 9, 2019 at 9:53 PM ToddAndMargo via perl6-users
mailto:perl6-us...@perl.org>> wrote:
On 2019-12-09 09:44, Trey Harris wrote:
> Signatures are important to Raku.
Trey,
The signatures are very important to the developers.
On Mon, Dec 9, 2019 at 9:53 PM ToddAndMargo via perl6-users <
perl6-us...@perl.org> wrote:
On 2019-12-09 09:44, Trey Harris wrote:
> > Signatures are important to Raku.
>
> Trey,
>
> The signatures are very important to the developers.
> They only confuse the programmer.
>
I explained in the
Hi Folks,
While the tone of this conversation is a little unpleasant
I think there are good points about the readability of the
reference documentation.
For instance, I understand that List inherits from
"Cool", but listing trigonometric functions on this
page
https://docs.raku.org/type/List
On 2019-12-10 03:31, Veesh Goldman wrote:
Nobody said not to do it. Please make more documentation available to
the public.
But that doesn't mean that these docs need to change. It's reference,
not guides.
And also it doesn't need to be a wiki. You could do everything on
GitHub, where most
On 2019-12-10 03:02, ToddAndMargo via perl6-users wrote:
I would
"It would", not "I would"
Stinkin' typos
Nobody said not to do it. Please make more documentation available to the
public.
But that doesn't mean that these docs need to change. It's reference, not
guides.
And also it doesn't need to be a wiki. You could do everything on GitHub,
where most people already do their collaboration, with the
On 2019-12-10 02:37, ToddAndMargo via perl6-users wrote:
On 2019-12-10 01:14, Simon Proctor wrote:
On Tue, 10 Dec 2019 at 02:40, ToddAndMargo via perl6-users
mailto:perl6-us...@perl.org>> wrote:
On 2019-12-09 07:21, Simon Proctor wrote:
> I think this does highlight something we
On 2019-12-10 01:14, Simon Proctor wrote:
On Tue, 10 Dec 2019 at 02:40, ToddAndMargo via perl6-users
mailto:perl6-us...@perl.org>> wrote:
On 2019-12-09 07:21, Simon Proctor wrote:
> I think this does highlight something we probably should document
more.
>
> How to
On 2019-12-10 00:57, Fernando Santagata wrote:
On Tue, Dec 10, 2019 at 3:53 AM ToddAndMargo via perl6-users
mailto:perl6-us...@perl.org>> wrote:
On 2019-12-09 09:44, Trey Harris wrote:
> Signatures are important to Raku.
Trey,
The signatures are very important to the
On Tue, 10 Dec 2019 at 02:40, ToddAndMargo via perl6-users <
perl6-us...@perl.org> wrote:
> On 2019-12-09 07:21, Simon Proctor wrote:
> > I think this does highlight something we probably should document more.
> >
> > How to read signatures. Because it's a *very* powerful part of the
> > language
On Tue, Dec 10, 2019 at 3:53 AM ToddAndMargo via perl6-users <
perl6-us...@perl.org> wrote:
> On 2019-12-09 09:44, Trey Harris wrote:
> > Signatures are important to Raku.
>
> Trey,
>
> The signatures are very important to the developers.
> They only confuse the programmer.
>
> -T
>
I'm a
On 2019-12-09 09:44, Trey Harris wrote:
ToddAndMargo, I have watched you on these lists and on GitHub issues for
years. I’ve engaged a few times but have generally pulled back again,
always in reaction to the same pattern of behavior:
1. You ask a question about something.
2. It is explained
On 2019-12-09 07:24, Curt Tilmes wrote:
The reference documentation (especially deep inside) is NOT intended for
brand new people to the language.
They need to start with the introduction, the tutorials, the books, even
classes (many are available for free on youtube).
That, and asking a
On 2019-12-09 09:44, Trey Harris wrote:
Signatures are important to Raku.
Trey,
The signatures are very important to the developers.
They only confuse the programmer.
-T
On 2019-12-09 07:35, Curt Tilmes wrote:
Hmm... Project for someone bored -- We've already got a great Signature
parser, how about creating a simplified human (HTML) description
automagically from any Signature, then linking it from the actual
Signature on each page...
I second that request!
On 2019-12-09 07:21, Simon Proctor wrote:
I think this does highlight something we probably should document more.
How to read signatures. Because it's a *very* powerful part of the
language that if you don't understand you're only using it at half strength.
multi method contains(Str:D:
On 2019-12-09 12:31, Philip Hazelden wrote:
On Mon, Dec 9, 2019 at 1:47 AM ToddAndMargo via perl6-users
mailto:perl6-us...@perl.org>> wrote:
Hi Phillip,
Have you ever been to an IEEE seminar and attended a lecture
on a subject that you have intimate knowledge on hoping
to
(Apologies, forgot to reply all.)
On Mon, Dec 9, 2019 at 1:47 AM ToddAndMargo via perl6-users <
perl6-us...@perl.org> wrote:
> Hi Phillip,
> Have you ever been to an IEEE seminar and attended a lecture
> on a subject that you have intimate knowledge on hoping
> to pick up some additional tips.
On Mon, Dec 9, 2019 at 10:25 Simon Proctor wrote:
> I *highly* advise learning how signatures work.
>
This, this, a thousand times this.
ToddAndMargo, I have watched you on these lists and on GitHub issues for
years. I’ve engaged a few times but have generally pulled back again,
always in
That looks like a great recommendation.
On 12/9/19, Mike Stok wrote:
>
>> On Dec 9, 2019, at 10:24 AM, Curt Tilmes wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, Dec 9, 2019 at 10:07 AM ToddAndMargo via perl6-users
>> mailto:perl6-us...@perl.org>> wrote:
>> On 2019-12-09 02:00, JJ Merelo wrote:
>> > Other than that,
> On Dec 9, 2019, at 10:24 AM, Curt Tilmes wrote:
>
> On Mon, Dec 9, 2019 at 10:07 AM ToddAndMargo via perl6-users
> mailto:perl6-us...@perl.org>> wrote:
> On 2019-12-09 02:00, JJ Merelo wrote:
> > Other than that, it's clear from the context that it returns a Boolean
> You still need to
On Mon, Dec 9, 2019 at 10:29 AM Simon Proctor
wrote:
> I think this does highlight something we probably should document more.
>
> How to read signatures. Because it's a *very* powerful part of the
> language that if you don't understand you're only using it at half strength.
>
> multi method
On Mon, Dec 9, 2019 at 10:07 AM ToddAndMargo via perl6-users <
perl6-us...@perl.org> wrote:
> On 2019-12-09 02:00, JJ Merelo wrote:
> > Other than that, it's clear from the context that it returns a Boolean
> You still need to change the target audience of the docs
> from the Developers to the
I think this does highlight something we probably should document more.
How to read signatures. Because it's a *very* powerful part of the language
that if you don't understand you're only using it at half strength.
multi method contains(Str:D: Cool:D $needle, Cool:D $pos --> Bool:D)
If not
On 2019-12-09 02:00, JJ Merelo wrote:
Other than that, it's clear from the context that it returns a Boolean
JJ,
You are a teacher. In technical writing, you NEVER leave
anything to "Context", even if it is "intuitively
obvious to the student and left for him to figure out
on his own".
If
El lun., 9 dic. 2019 a las 2:48, ToddAndMargo via perl6-users (<
perl6-us...@perl.org>) escribió:
> On 2019-12-07 08:17, Philip Hazelden wrote:
> > This is not IEEE-ese. Earlier, you defined IEEE-ese as
> >
> > Technical written material that uses so many obscure
> > terms and
On 2019-12-07 08:17, Philip Hazelden wrote:
This is not IEEE-ese. Earlier, you defined IEEE-ese as
Technical written material that uses so many obscure
terms and unnecessary technical jargon mixed with
deliberate obscurities that even a reader with
intimate knowledge of
all.
>> >
>> > -- Forwarded message -
>> > From: *Tom Browder* > tom.brow...@gmail.com>>
>> > Date: Sat, Dec 7, 2019 at 04:58
>> > Subject: Raku, docs, help [was: Re: vulgar?]
>> > To: ToddAndMargo mailto:toddandma...@zoho.
m
> >>
> > Date: Sat, Dec 7, 2019 at 04:58
> > Subject: Raku, docs, help [was: Re: vulgar?]
> > To: ToddAndMargo mailto:toddandma...@zoho.com>>
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Dec 6, 2019 at 23:23 ToddAndMargo via perl6-users
> > mailto:perl6-us...@perl.org&g
On 2019-12-07 03:59, ToddAndMargo via perl6-users wrote:
On 2019-12-07 03:00, Tom Browder wrote:
Forgot to reply to all.
-- Forwarded message -
From: *Tom Browder* <mailto:tom.brow...@gmail.com>>
Date: Sat, Dec 7, 2019 at 04:58
Subject: Raku, docs, help [was: R
On 2019-12-07 03:00, Tom Browder wrote:
Forgot to reply to all.
-- Forwarded message -
From: *Tom Browder* mailto:tom.brow...@gmail.com>>
Date: Sat, Dec 7, 2019 at 04:58
Subject: Raku, docs, help [was: Re: vulgar?]
To: ToddAndMargo mailto:toddandma...@zoho.com>>
O
On 2019-12-07 01:42, Elizabeth Mattijsen wrote:
Well, for one you seem to have missed the fact that RT is no longer used to
report bugs in Rakudo. So I'd argue, yes, you do appear*not* to know how to
report bugs.
I haven't reported any in a while to Perl 6, so I you
won't find any of my
On 2019-12-07 01:37, Elizabeth Mattijsen wrote:
On 7 Dec 2019, at 01:17, ToddAndMargo via perl6-users
wrote:
Oh and not to beat a dead horse, but perl 5's perldocs
wipes raku's docs face.
Now, that is what *I* call vulgar.
Interesting. It means it outdoes you by quiet a bit.
Another way
Forgot to reply to all.
-- Forwarded message -
From: Tom Browder
Date: Sat, Dec 7, 2019 at 04:58
Subject: Raku, docs, help [was: Re: vulgar?]
To: ToddAndMargo
On Fri, Dec 6, 2019 at 23:23 ToddAndMargo via perl6-users <
perl6-us...@perl.org> wrote:
> On 2019-12-06 1
> On 7 Dec 2019, at 00:30, ToddAndMargo via perl6-users
> wrote:
> What makes you think I do not know how to use
> the bug reporting system?
Well, for one you seem to have missed the fact that RT is no longer used to
report bugs in Rakudo. So I'd argue, yes, you do appear *not* to know how to
> On 7 Dec 2019, at 01:17, ToddAndMargo via perl6-users
> wrote:
> Oh and not to beat a dead horse, but perl 5's perldocs
> wipes raku's docs face.
Now, that is what *I* call vulgar.
> So it is possible to write
> a doc reference that serves both the developer and
> the
On 2019-12-06 18:34, Tom Browder wrote:
On Fri, Dec 6, 2019 at 17:31 ToddAndMargo via perl6-users
wrote:
On 2019-12-06 04:19, Tom Browder wrote:
Todd, arguing via email is almost guaranteed to be fruitless. You need
to learn to use Github and make pull requests (PRs) for the EXACT
changes
On Fri, Dec 6, 2019 at 17:31 ToddAndMargo via perl6-users
wrote:
>
> On 2019-12-06 04:19, Tom Browder wrote:
> > Todd, arguing via email is almost guaranteed to be fruitless. You need
> > to learn to use Github and make pull requests (PRs) for the EXACT
> > changes you think should be made to
On 2019-12-06 15:30, ToddAndMargo via perl6-users wrote:
On 2019-12-06 04:19, Tom Browder wrote:
Todd, arguing via email is almost guaranteed to be fruitless. You need
to learn to use Github and make pull requests (PRs) for the EXACT
changes you think should be made to the docs.
Hi Tom,
On 2019-12-06 04:19, Tom Browder wrote:
Todd, arguing via email is almost guaranteed to be fruitless. You need
to learn to use Github and make pull requests (PRs) for the EXACT
changes you think should be made to the docs.
Hi Tom,
What makes you think I do not know how to use
the bug
It has been said that any sound the human voice can utter is rude in
some language.
It is also rather obvious that people who acquire second and
subsequent languages informally tend to learn a very high proportion
of "taboo" expressions. (Possibly because in many cases their
principal source is
> On 6 Dec 2019, at 13:19, Tom Browder wrote:
> Note the Perl docs have been refined, by experts, since the late
> 1980s, while the Raku docs have been expanding, by individuals with
> itches to scratch and varying talents, for probably much less than 20
> years.
The very first commit (by
On Fri, Dec 6, 2019 at 05:04 ToddAndMargo via perl6-users
wrote:
> I have uncovered several booboos in the docs. I find them
> to not be all that accurate either. I really don't trust
> them. And since they are written in IEEE-eese, booboos are
> really hard to spot.
...
> And when I do spot
On 2019-12-06 01:24, Laurent Rosenfeld via perl6-users wrote:
Manual pages (which are reference material) and tutorials are two very
different kinds of writing. Manual pages are usually more difficult to
understand than (good) tutorials, because they have to be *very
accurate* and as complete
Manual pages (which are reference material) and tutorials are two very
different kinds of writing. Manual pages are usually more difficult to
understand than (good) tutorials, because they have to be *very accurate*
and as complete as possible (if not exhaustive), while tutorials can leave
out
On 2019-12-05 03:03, William Michels via perl6-users wrote:
I trust you'll find Andy Shitov meant no vulgarity on his blog. I've
been meaning to invite more people via CC: when I send emails to
perl6-us...@perl.org. Your comment gives me an excuse to contact Andy
so he can tell you that himself.
On 2019-12-05 02:38, Tom Browder wrote:
I have had several email conversations with Andrew and he seems like a
nice person to me. I sometimes think non-native English speakers pick up
bad speech habits because of the absolutely sewer-mouthed "popular"
folks on Twitter.
For a non-native
g and examples
for Perl6.
But he can be a bit vulgar at times, which I ignore.
Is he doing it on purpose?
Todd, I took a quick glance at the link you gave and all I saw
was reference to the Brain* language (whose author I believe
should be ashamed of himse
> for Perl6.
>
> But he can be a bit vulgar at times, which I ignore.
> Is he doing it on purpose? Or is there some translation
> error and he does not realize he is swearing?
>
> Warning: if you go here there are some dirty words
> in the titles:
>
> https://andrewshitov.com/category/using-perl-6/
>
> -T
see on basic cable or the Linux
> Kernel mailing list.
>
> Erez
> On 12/5/19 12:38 PM, Tom Browder wrote:
>
> On Thu, Dec 5, 2019 at 03:57 Todd Chester via perl6-users <
> perl6-us...@perl.org> wrote
> ...
>
>> I really like this guys style of writing and exampl
>> wrote
...
I really like this guys style of writing and examples
for Perl6.
But he can be a bit vulgar at times, which I ignore.
Is he doing it on purpose?
Todd, I took a quick glance at the link you gave and all I saw was
reference to the Brain* language (whose author I b
On Thu, Dec 5, 2019 at 03:57 Todd Chester via perl6-users <
perl6-us...@perl.org> wrote
...
> I really like this guys style of writing and examples
> for Perl6.
>
> But he can be a bit vulgar at times, which I ignore.
> Is he doing it on purpose?
Todd, I took a quick glance
Hi All,
I really like this guys style of writing and examples
for Perl6.
But he can be a bit vulgar at times, which I ignore.
Is he doing it on purpose? Or is there some translation
error and he does not realize he is swearing?
Warning: if you go here there are some dirty words
in the titles
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