Brent 'Dax' Royal-Gordon writes:
If the inside of a hash indexer consists entirely of \w characters, it
will be interpreted as the name of a hash key. If you want it to call a
subroutine instead, add a ~ stringifying operator to the beginning of
the call, or a pair of parentheses to the
Juerd wrote:
Brent 'Dax' Royal-Gordon skribis 2004-04-15 16:56 (-0700):
1. Allow %hashfoo to be typed as %hashfoo. There would be a
conflict with numeric less-than, but we can disambiguate with
whitespace if necessary. After all, we took the same solution with
curlies.
Curlies which, as
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Juerd) writes:
I think it has to go because `pwd`, `hostname`, `wget -O - $url`
should not be easier than the purer Perl equivalents and because
``'s interpolation does more harm than good.
I have to disagree with you here. The Perl way is not always the Perl
way -- the
On Thu, Apr 15, 2004 at 12:27:12PM -0700, Scott Walters wrote:
* Rather than eliciting public comment on %hash`foo (and indeed %hashfoo)
the proposal is being rejected out of hand (incidentally, the mantra of the Java
community Process seems to be you don't need X, you've got Y, and it took
Brent 'Dax' Royal-Gordon skribis 2004-04-15 16:56 (-0700):
1. Allow %hashfoo to be typed as %hashfoo. There would be a
conflict with numeric less-than, but we can disambiguate with
whitespace if necessary. After all, we took the same solution with
curlies.
Curlies which, as said, I
Austin Hastings skribis 2004-04-15 19:37 (-0400):
I'm sure that if Juerd or someone were to write a PublicHash class,
they would cleverly reverse the access so that some collision-unlikely
path would get the methods.
I'm sure I have explained several times already why I think using the .
On 2004-04-15 at 19:39:25, Austin Hastings wrote:
Of course you used for buffers that were not powers of 2. Had they
been powers of 2, you would have used or ~. The fact that you
didn't use a power of 2 is pretty questionable. The dread Unix
wizards will no doubt have questions for you about
On 2004-04-16 at 00:25:51, Brent 'Dax' Royal-Gordon wrote:
Number of keystrokes isn't our only concern here. This is Perl, not
APL--we care about the size of the language and its intuitiveness too.
(Perhaps not much, but we do.)
In any case, Perl is far more typable than APL unless you have
On 2004-04-16 at 09:23:44, Mark J. Reed wrote:
On 2004-04-15 at 19:39:25, Austin Hastings wrote:
Of course you used for buffers that were not powers of 2. Had they
been powers of 2, you would have used or ~. The fact that you
didn't use a power of 2 is pretty questionable. The dread Unix
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Mark J. Reed) writes:
The biggest use of modulus is in implementing hashes
Rather, one of the biggest uses. I don't have documentation to support
the claim that it is the biggest, and there are certainly others -
date arithmetic, astronomy etc.
I'll bet you the actual
On Apr 16, 2004, at 7:19 AM, Simon Cozens wrote:
I'll bet you the actual most *common* use of modulus is:
until ( my ($percent_done=done()) == 100 ) {
do_work();
print $percent_done,\n unless $percent_done % 10;
}
And I'll bet it's something like this:
for my $i
-Original Message-
From: Mark J. Reed [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On 2004-04-15 at 19:39:25, Austin Hastings wrote:
Of course you used for buffers that were not powers of 2. Had they
been powers of 2, you would have used or ~. The fact that you
didn't use a power of 2 is pretty
-Original Message-
From: David Wheeler [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Apr 16, 2004, at 7:19 AM, Simon Cozens wrote:
I'll bet you the actual most *common* use of modulus is:
until ( my ($percent_done=done()) == 100 ) {
do_work();
print $percent_done,\n
On Fri, 2004-04-16 at 10:56, David Wheeler wrote:
On Apr 16, 2004, at 7:19 AM, Simon Cozens wrote:
I'll bet you the actual most *common* use of modulus is:
[...]
print $percent_done,\n unless $percent_done % 10;
And I'll bet it's something like this:
my $css_class = $i % 2 ?
On 2004-04-16 at 11:17:41, Austin Hastings wrote:
I'm totally willing to agree with you, Mark.
A) Do you code hashing algorithms so frequently that you need a special,
low-cost-of-access operator built in to the language to support it?
Nope. I'd be perfectly happy if the modulus operator
Mark J. Reed wrote:
Nope. I'd be perfectly happy if the modulus operator were spelled mod
instead of %, which has never struck me as particularly intuitive.
I always saw it as being a funny division sign. See the little slash in
there?
--
Brent Dax Royal-Gordon [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Perl and
-Original Message-
From: Mark J. Reed [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, 16 April, 2004 11:43 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: backticks
On 2004-04-16 at 11:17:41, Austin Hastings wrote:
I'm totally willing to agree with you, Mark.
A) Do you code hashing algorithms
On 2004-04-16 at 08:50:38, Brent 'Dax' Royal-Gordon wrote:
Mark J. Reed wrote:
Nope. I'd be perfectly happy if the modulus operator were spelled mod
instead of %, which has never struck me as particularly intuitive.
I always saw it as being a funny division sign. See the little slash in
On Apr 16, 2004, at 10:14 AM, Juerd wrote:
Even with the xx Inf? Why?
Oh, right, missed that. Sorry.
David
On Thu, 2004-04-15 at 18:23, Austin Hastings wrote:
@matrix... = 1 0 0 1;
Keep in mind that you're using a quoting operator. For numbers, you can just
use (0, 1, 2, 3)
and probably be better understood. (The list of numbers approach will
work, but it will take all the numbers through a
Juerd wrote:
Brent 'Dax' Royal-Gordon skribis 2004-04-16 0:25 (-0700):
I don't like %hash{'foo'} because it's ugly. I don't like %hashfoo
because it's ugly and adds syntax. I don't like %hash`foo because it's
ugly, adds syntax, and looks nothing like an indexing operator. (I'll
revisit this
Sean O'Rourke skribis 2004-04-15 8:55 (-0700):
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Juerd) writes:
I think it has to go because `pwd`, `hostname`, `wget -O - $url`
should not be easier than the purer Perl equivalents and because
``'s interpolation does more harm than good.
I have to disagree with you here.
Brent 'Dax' Royal-Gordon skribis 2004-04-16 0:25 (-0700):
Number of keystrokes isn't our only concern here. This is Perl, not
APL--we care about the size of the language and its intuitiveness too.
(Perhaps not much, but we do.)
Not the only concern, but to me, it is as important as
David Wheeler skribis 2004-04-16 9:58 (-0700):
for @thingies, qw(blue yellow) xx Inf - $thingy, $class {
print qq[tr class=$classtd$thingy/td/tr\n;
}
I think that $class would be Cundef after the second record in
@thingies, unfortunately.
Even with the xx Inf? Why?
Juerd
Aaron Sherman skribis 2004-04-16 9:52 (-0400):
3. You proposed (late in the conversation) that both could co-exist, and
while that's true from a compiler point of view, it also leads to:
`stuff``stuff`stuff
Huh? No. That is a syntax error.
$a`a=$a`b~`a` # Try to tell your editor
David Wheeler skribis 2004-04-16 7:56 (-0700):
And I'll bet it's something like this:
for my $i (0..$#thingies) {
my $css_class = $i % 2 ? 'blue' : 'yellow';
print tr class=$css_classtd$thingies[$i]/td/tr\n;
}
Probably.
Can't we in Perl 6 just use something like this?
for
On Fri, Apr 16, 2004 at 10:44:47AM -0700, Brent 'Dax' Royal-Gordon wrote:
Regex aliases, threads, lexicals, junctions, and dwimmery make things a
*lot* easier to program. This syntactic sugar you're proposing doesn't.
But it *does* make an oft-used construct easier to type. That adds up
On Fri, Apr 16, 2004 at 07:12:44PM +0200, Juerd wrote:
Aaron Sherman skribis 2004-04-16 9:52 (-0400):
3. You proposed (late in the conversation) that both could co-exist, and
while that's true from a compiler point of view, it also leads to:
`stuff``stuff`stuff
Huh? No. That is a syntax
Larry Wall skribis 2004-04-16 11:50 (-0700):
On Fri, Apr 16, 2004 at 07:12:44PM +0200, Juerd wrote:
: Except for the shocking number of closed-minded people on this list.
You seem to be one of them. From my point of view, you've had your
ego plastered all over this proposal from the start,
Jonathan Scott Duff wrote:
On Fri, Apr 16, 2004 at 10:44:47AM -0700, Brent 'Dax' Royal-Gordon wrote:
Regex aliases, threads, lexicals, junctions, and dwimmery make things a
*lot* easier to program. This syntactic sugar you're proposing doesn't.
But it *does* make an oft-used construct easier
Brent 'Dax' Royal-Gordon skribis 2004-04-16 13:17 (-0700):
Clever definition of the colon operator, or creation of a
bareword-quoting operator, would allow you to use barewords anywhere
you wanted to.
Defining ` to be a bareword quoting operator would be only one step away
from what I
On Fri, 2004-04-16 at 12:35, Juerd wrote:
backticks encourage interpolation.
... and?
From the point of view of a Web developer who deals with (potentially)
hostile data, I see the problem (though the solution is smarter
tainting, not removing functionality). From the point of view of a
On Fri, Apr 16, 2004 at 01:17:10PM -0700, Brent 'Dax' Royal-Gordon wrote:
I don't claim that they won't be used often. I claim that the *best*
solution is to fix the syntax we already have, not add more. Failing
that, we should make sure that the syntax we add is as globally useful
as
On Fri, Apr 16, 2004 at 09:16:15PM +0200, Juerd wrote:
However, I could be guessing badly. It could be that someone who says
Perl 6 should not have a third syntax because there are already two
really has thought about it. We have many ways of saying foo() if not
$bar in Perl 5 and I use most
On Fri, 16 Apr 2004, Aaron Sherman wrote:
@matrix... = 1 0 0 1;
In the case of:
@matrix = 1 2 3 4 5;
You need only add the type:
int @matrix = 1 2 3 4 5;
There is no string phase, or at least should never be.
The compiler can
pre-compute the list:
int
Jonathan Scott Duff skribis 2004-04-16 15:51 (-0500):
To get an item out of a hash, you can write %varname{key}.
You can also write %varnamekey if there aren't any spaces in
the key. Finally, if the key doesn't have any characters in it
except for letters, numbers and
Perl.com has just made A12 available:
http://www.perl.com/pub/a/2004/04/16/a12.html
Warning -- 20 pages, the first of which is a table of contents.
Enjoy,
-- c
On Fri, 16 Apr 2004, Juerd wrote:
Defining ` to be a bareword quoting operator would be only one step away
from what I suggested initially:
1. %hash`key
2. %array`5
3. :key`value
4. say `hello;
This would make it like now, but allowing only one bareword, and
only if it is simple
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