Re: Iranian Calendar (P.S.)
On Wed, 2004-05-19 at 14:05, Hooman Mehr wrote: > The fact that Iranian authorities in this regard act as if they are > directly appointed by God is another story... Don't get hot, please. roozbeh PS: Where is this admin hat? I left it just here last time! :'-( roozbeh ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing
Re: Iranian Calendar (P.S.)
On Wed, 2004-05-19 at 10:25, C Bobroff wrote: > Is there any way to type a hyphen > that will resist break-up during wrapping? Use the "Insert | Symbol" menu in MS Word for lots of other things also, copyright symbols, non-breaking spaces, longer dashes, ... roozbeh ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing
Re: Iranian Calendar (P.S.)
On Thu, 20 May 2004, Hooman Mehr wrote: > I'll write some crime stories. But don't expect anything this week, I > am very busy. OK! But if we are to properly judge your confession of past crimes, be sure to not leave out any details and please start from the beginning. You know, the glaciers were receding, the dinosaurs suddenly vanished, then...? Just deliver in small morsels as time permits! -Connie ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing
Re: Iranian Calendar (P.S.)
Hi Connie, OK, white flag up! I'll write some crime stories. But don't expect anything this week, I am very busy. Hooman On May 20, 2004, at 2:16 AM, C Bobroff wrote: Dear Hooman, I may move these stories to my pending weblog which hopefully will open in the next several days. Why should you move to your weblog? I can't think of a better place for the story of Persian computing than PersianComputing. One more thing, the reason that I may seem talented for story telling is that I am an INFP (http://www.personalitypage.com/INFP.html), so be-warned. Glad to know just what we're up against here! -Connie ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing
Re: Iranian Calendar (P.S.)
On Wed, 19 May 2004, Behnam wrote: > I don't see its use in Perso-Arabic script. I meant both Latin input and output here. The punishment for misunderstanding the question is that you have to answer some Mac questions! (New form of flaming, hope you like it!) I'm getting 1 or 2 Mac users per week asking for info on how to type Persian and I just am not sure what the state of the technology is so can you please give the definitive guide? (And anyone else who can please contribute, also, so there is one place with the basic info.) See my next post. Thanks in advance! -Connie > On 19-May-04, at 5:38 PM, C Bobroff wrote: > > > U+2011 should definitely be part of the custom Perso-Arabic > > transliteration keyboards. (Hint to Peter) > > ___ > PersianComputing mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing > ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing
Re: Iranian Calendar (P.S.)
On 19-May-04, at 1:55 AM, C Bobroff wrote: Actually, all this off-topic mix of calendars and philosophy has reminded me that when I was writing something (in English) a few months ago on Al-Biruni, whenever his name came up at the end of the line in Word, it would wrap and so the "Al-" would be on one line and the "Biruni" would go down to the next. This seemed not very respectful to break up a great man's name like that! Is there any way to type a hyphen that will resist break-up during wrapping? -Connie The Unicode character is U-2011, Non-Breaking Hyphen. If you don't have it on your keyboard, you may be able to use this information to type it with other tools or utilities. Or you can drop the "Al-" altogether. If I remember correctly, his street name in Iran was "Biruni" short and simple! Behnam ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing
Re: Iranian Calendar (P.S.)
I don't see its use in Perso-Arabic script. B. On 19-May-04, at 5:38 PM, C Bobroff wrote: U+2011 should definitely be part of the custom Perso-Arabic transliteration keyboards. (Hint to Peter) ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing
Re: Iranian Calendar (P.S.)
Dear Hooman, > I may move these stories to my pending > weblog which hopefully will open in the next several days. Why should you move to your weblog? I can't think of a better place for the story of Persian computing than PersianComputing. > One more thing, the reason that I may seem talented for story telling > is that I am an INFP (http://www.personalitypage.com/INFP.html), so > be-warned. Glad to know just what we're up against here! -Connie ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing
Re: Iranian Calendar (P.S.)
On Wed, 19 May 2004, Behnam wrote: > The Unicode character is U-2011, Non-Breaking Hyphen. If you don't have > it on your keyboard, you may be able to use this information to type it > with other tools or utilities. As Ordak D. Coward reports, Ctrl-Shift-Hyphen instead of hyphen does the trick in Word. (I checked.) I never thought of using Help. What a novel idea! U+2011 should definitely be part of the custom Perso-Arabic transliteration keyboards. (Hint to Peter) > Or you can drop the "Al-" altogether. If I remember correctly, his > street name in Iran was "Biruni" short and simple! Yes, you have to keep the audience in mind and pick from Abu Rayhan, Biruni, al-Biruni. Worse with (al-)Ghaz(z)ali. -Connie ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing
Re: Iranian Calendar (P.S.)
Dear Connie, Thank you very much for your interest and support. I will try to start talking about such things soon. I may move these stories to my pending weblog which hopefully will open in the next several days. When I start the weblog I will announce it here. Although my limited time may prevent me from posting often. One more thing, the reason that I may seem talented for story telling is that I am an INFP (http://www.personalitypage.com/INFP.html), so be-warned. Hooman On May 19, 2004, at 10:24 AM, C Bobroff wrote: On Tue, 18 May 2004, Hooman Mehr wrote: On a second thought, I got reluctant to discuss this matter on the list. It would be way off topic. Moreover, I am afraid that whatever I say could be interpreted as political statement or religious evangelism and start flamewars. Looks like Fortune smiled upon you and you managed to post without getting flamed. So, with this newly acquired confidence and since you have some talent in story-telling, are you going to please tell us about your past crimes soon? Nimrooz, etc? I mean, from the beginning and please don't skimp on the details. I think I'm not the only one who would love to hear it! -Connie ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing
Re: Iranian Calendar (P.S.)
Hi Ordak, What you say makes perfect sense. I just didn't want to go into detail of everything in this regard. Suffice it so say, in such cases people come to agreement on establishing such authorities as part of their civil society. I vaguely hinted this in my post. Such an authority develops out of the needs of daily social life and as a normal (say democratic) civil authority and not a dictated sacred authority which could abuse its power by taking calendar hostage. Note that it gets very tricky for a religion to define and establish something. There is endless potential for abuse. People tend to put a sacred halo around it, and you know what happens next... So, the calendar authority is needed but religion is not in the right entity to establish it. When a religion needs to rely on a calendar, it needs to establish it in a way that the algorithm is very simple and accessible for ordinary people and ensure that it leaves the origin of the authority (or decision) with people so that they can delegate their right as they see fit. The fact that Iranian authorities in this regard act as if they are directly appointed by God is another story... Hooman On May 19, 2004, at 3:04 AM, Ordak D. Coward wrote: Dear Hooman, I am not trying to be annoyingly responsive, it is just a bad habit! What you said is fine, but I have to add that a calendar authority -- be it a person, a group, or just an algorithm -- is necessary in resolving conflicts in observation of the date and time. For example, if a contract between A and B requires A delivering a product to B at a certain date, then the two entities would need to choose an authority to resolve their confict in case of B's claim that A did not deliver on time. -- ODC On Tue, 18 May 2004 20:48:09 +0430, Hooman Mehr <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On May 18, 2004, at 2:48 AM, C Bobroff wrote: On Mon, 17 May 2004, Hooman Mehr wrote: P.S.: Although Hijri calendar (and definition of the prayer times) look very strange and primitive, there is a very good philosophical reason behind it which makes sense once you know it. Do you know the reason or want to know it? Please continue. We are listening. You have a very nice narrative style! -Connie Hi Connie, Thank you for the nice complement. On a second thought, I got reluctant to discuss this matter on the list. It would be way off topic. Moreover, I am afraid that whatever I say could be interpreted as political statement or religious evangelism and start flamewars. Just to keep my word while trying to do minimal damage to the list, I'll write a paragraph: In original Islam, the definitions of calendar and prayer times are based on observation of simple natural phenomenon by ordinary human beings and assuring the individuals that their observation is valid and sufficient. The calendar authority is people, it comes from individual people with their personal observation, interpretation and judgment. Everybody can verify claims made by others. People usually voluntarily delegate this observation to a trustworthy group in a civil society. On the other hand, they may collaborate to ease the observation and get reassurance and support of others, while still keeping the final decision to themselves. This concept is closely related to some modern day concepts like human rights, diversity, democracy and freedom of information. To put it better in perspective, contrast this with the role of the religious calendars in ancient South American civilizations. Hooman Mehr ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing
Re: Iranian Calendar (P.S.)
Microsoft Word help says that you can do this by typing Ctrl-Shift-Hyphen instead of hyphen. -- ODC On Tue, 18 May 2004 22:55:50 -0700 (PDT), C Bobroff <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Actually, all this off-topic mix of calendars and philosophy > has reminded me that when I was writing something (in English) a few > months ago on Al-Biruni, whenever his name came up at the end of the line > in Word, it would wrap and so the "Al-" would be on one line and the > "Biruni" would go down to the next. This seemed not very respectful to > break up a great man's name like that! Is there any way to type a hyphen > that will resist break-up during wrapping? > > -Connie > > > ___ > PersianComputing mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing > ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing
Re: Iranian Calendar (P.S.)
Actually, all this off-topic mix of calendars and philosophy has reminded me that when I was writing something (in English) a few months ago on Al-Biruni, whenever his name came up at the end of the line in Word, it would wrap and so the "Al-" would be on one line and the "Biruni" would go down to the next. This seemed not very respectful to break up a great man's name like that! Is there any way to type a hyphen that will resist break-up during wrapping? -Connie ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing
Re: Iranian Calendar (P.S.)
On Tue, 18 May 2004, Hooman Mehr wrote: > On a second thought, I got reluctant > to discuss this matter on the list. It would be way off topic. > Moreover, I am afraid that whatever I say could be interpreted as > political statement or religious evangelism and start flamewars. Looks like Fortune smiled upon you and you managed to post without getting flamed. So, with this newly acquired confidence and since you have some talent in story-telling, are you going to please tell us about your past crimes soon? Nimrooz, etc? I mean, from the beginning and please don't skimp on the details. I think I'm not the only one who would love to hear it! -Connie ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing
Re: Iranian Calendar (P.S.)
Dear Hooman, I am not trying to be annoyingly responsive, it is just a bad habit! What you said is fine, but I have to add that a calendar authority -- be it a person, a group, or just an algorithm -- is necessary in resolving conflicts in observation of the date and time. For example, if a contract between A and B requires A delivering a product to B at a certain date, then the two entities would need to choose an authority to resolve their confict in case of B's claim that A did not deliver on time. -- ODC On Tue, 18 May 2004 20:48:09 +0430, Hooman Mehr <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On May 18, 2004, at 2:48 AM, C Bobroff wrote: > > On Mon, 17 May 2004, Hooman Mehr wrote: > >> P.S.: Although Hijri calendar (and definition of the prayer times) > >> look > >> very strange and primitive, there is a very good philosophical reason > >> behind it which makes sense once you know it. Do you know the reason > >> or > >> want to know it? > > Please continue. We are listening. You have a very nice narrative > > style! > > -Connie > > Hi Connie, > > Thank you for the nice complement. On a second thought, I got reluctant > to discuss this matter on the list. It would be way off topic. > Moreover, I am afraid that whatever I say could be interpreted as > political statement or religious evangelism and start flamewars. > > Just to keep my word while trying to do minimal damage to the list, > I'll write a paragraph: > > In original Islam, the definitions of calendar and prayer times are > based on observation of simple natural phenomenon by ordinary human > beings and assuring the individuals that their observation is valid and > sufficient. The calendar authority is people, it comes from individual > people with their personal observation, interpretation and judgment. > Everybody can verify claims made by others. People usually voluntarily > delegate this observation to a trustworthy group in a civil society. On > the other hand, they may collaborate to ease the observation and get > reassurance and support of others, while still keeping the final > decision to themselves. This concept is closely related to some modern > day concepts like human rights, diversity, democracy and freedom of > information. To put it better in perspective, contrast this with the > role of the religious calendars in ancient South American > civilizations. > > Hooman Mehr > > ___ > PersianComputing mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing > ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing
Re: Iranian Calendar (P.S.)
On May 18, 2004, at 2:48 AM, C Bobroff wrote: On Mon, 17 May 2004, Hooman Mehr wrote: P.S.: Although Hijri calendar (and definition of the prayer times) look very strange and primitive, there is a very good philosophical reason behind it which makes sense once you know it. Do you know the reason or want to know it? Please continue. We are listening. You have a very nice narrative style! -Connie Hi Connie, Thank you for the nice complement. On a second thought, I got reluctant to discuss this matter on the list. It would be way off topic. Moreover, I am afraid that whatever I say could be interpreted as political statement or religious evangelism and start flamewars. Just to keep my word while trying to do minimal damage to the list, I'll write a paragraph: In original Islam, the definitions of calendar and prayer times are based on observation of simple natural phenomenon by ordinary human beings and assuring the individuals that their observation is valid and sufficient. The calendar authority is people, it comes from individual people with their personal observation, interpretation and judgment. Everybody can verify claims made by others. People usually voluntarily delegate this observation to a trustworthy group in a civil society. On the other hand, they may collaborate to ease the observation and get reassurance and support of others, while still keeping the final decision to themselves. This concept is closely related to some modern day concepts like human rights, diversity, democracy and freedom of information. To put it better in perspective, contrast this with the role of the religious calendars in ancient South American civilizations. Hooman Mehr ___ PersianComputing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/persiancomputing
