On Wed, 17 Dec 2003, Gabor Grothendieck wrote:
In rereading this one idea occurred to me. What if the entire R help
system were turned into a wiki? That is,
?whatever
would take you to the help page, but not on your computer --
rather to the same page on the wiki.
This
Tony == Tony Plate [EMAIL PROTECTED]
on Wed, 17 Dec 2003 18:04:34 -0700 writes:
Tony The suggestions of Tom (posting guide) and Andy (Eric
Tony Raymond's How To Ask Questions The Smart Way) are
Tony both good. Perhaps a good place to put an actual
Tony posting guide and a
A 14:57 17/12/2003 +0100, Martin Wegmann a écrit:
Hello,
Roger Bivand wrote:
appropriate light. One basic characteristic seems to be that if the
question does indicate seriousness about trying to analyse data, respect
for the task at hand, then predictably lots of good advice comes quickly.
On Thu, 18 Dec 2003, Mulholland, Tom wrote:
1 An assumption on my part is that there is fundamental agreement that
the document is the best source for advice on how to ask questions of
this list
I don't think its the best possible source. It may well be the best
existing source.
On bug
On Wed, 17 Dec 2003, Gabor Grothendieck wrote:
In rereading this one idea occurred to me. What if the entire R help
system were turned into a wiki? That is,
?whatever
would take you to the help page, but not on your computer --
rather to the same page on the wiki.
This seems to
], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [R] mailing list for basic questions - preliminary sum up
On Wed, 17 Dec 2003, Gabor Grothendieck wrote:
In rereading this one idea occurred to me. What if the entire R help
system were turned into a wiki? That is,
?whatever
would take you to the help
: Martin Wegmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Spencer Graves [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [R] mailing list for basic questions - preliminary sum up
Hello,
I agree completely that well thought out questions are important to receive
good and quick
After thinking this over, I think it's a good idea to have the beginner
list (and I have subscribed).
While I greatly appreciate this list, and the tremendous amount of help
I've gotten from it, the style of this list is, usually, to give fairly
short replies (e.g. try ?function) This is fine.
Gabor Grothendieck wrote:
My personal view on this is that there is need for a friendly
list with a more customer service attitude than r-help.
God save us from a ``customer service attitude'' --- bland,
fatuous, feel-good useless twaddle! If you want a ``custome
service'' attitude go and
On 17-Dec-03 Peter Flom wrote:
After thinking this over, I think it's a good idea to have the beginner
list (and I have subscribed).
[...]
What do others think? Has anyone else subscribed to the beginner list
yet?
Peter
Perhaps there has now been enough discussion of whether such a
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [R] mailing list for basic questions - preliminary sum up
My opinion is that separate lists are not needed (and I'm not clear on how
the person with the original idea summarized opinions in a way that
led to the conclusion that a new list is needed
I completely agree with Frank Harrell's suggestion that email is
a problem for beginners (who often don't know about the various
searchable archives, or find them overwhelming because the
massive amount that they contain, much of which is bound to be
irrelevant or too advanced).
I don't think a
Hello,
Roger Bivand wrote:
appropriate light. One basic characteristic seems to be that if the
question does indicate seriousness about trying to analyse data, respect
for the task at hand, then predictably lots of good advice comes quickly.
yes, I also experienced that (from the questioner
: [R] mailing list for basic questions - preliminary sum up
Hello,
I agree completely that well thought out questions are important to receive
good and quick replies and I agree as well that the replies on the R-help
list are very good and helpful.
But I had to learn and I am still
Rolf Turner wrote:
Gabor Grothendieck wrote:
My personal view on this is that there is need for a friendly
list with a more customer service attitude than r-help.
God save us from a ``customer service attitude'' --- bland,
fatuous, feel-good useless twaddle! If you want a ``custome
]
To: rhelp [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [R] mailing list for basic questions - preliminary sum up
My opinion is that separate lists are not needed (and I'm not clear on how
the person with the original idea summarized opinions in a way that
led to the conclusion that a new list is needed
On 12/17/03 12:19, Gabor Grothendieck wrote:
In rereading this one idea occurred to me. What if the entire R help
system were turned into a wiki? That is,
?whatever
would take you to the help page, but not on your computer --
rather to the same page on the wiki. You would then find the
But this is a lot of work to set up. I'd rather take small
steps. I do plan to look into phpbb as an alternative to
bazookaboard*, but not today, and probably not tomorrow. So if
things proceed without me, so be it.
Or set up a server running Zope and Plone, and then you can have
wikis,
Barry Rowlingson [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
But this is a lot of work to set up. I'd rather take small
steps. I do plan to look into phpbb as an alternative to
bazookaboard*, but not today, and probably not tomorrow. So if
things proceed without me, so be it.
Or set up a server running
On 17 Dec 2003 at 12:51, Jonathan Baron wrote:
On 12/17/03 12:19, Gabor Grothendieck wrote:
In rereading this one idea occurred to me. What if the entire R help
system were turned into a wiki? That is,
?whatever
would take you to the help page, but not on your computer --
rather
and preferred that.
---
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 18:20:26 -0400
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Gabor Grothendieck [EMAIL PROTECTED],Jonathan Baron [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [R] mailing list for basic questions - preliminary sum up
On 17 Dec 2003 at 12
PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Gabor Grothendieck
Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2003 7:09 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [R] mailing list for basic questions - preliminary sum up
A two level solution
From: Tom Mulholland
I have empathy for lots of the points already made, more
often on the life
is not always easy and you have to work at it flavour because
that's where
you make the real gains.
One particular message early in the piece cited an example of
what a good
request
The suggestions of Tom (posting guide) and Andy (Eric Raymond's How To Ask
Questions The Smart Way) are both good. Perhaps a good place to put an
actual posting guide and a link to Raymond's page would be at the page
pointed to by the link at the bottom of every posting to R-help (ie
list for basic questions - preliminary sum up
From: Tom Mulholland
I have empathy for lots of the points already made, more
often on the life
is not always easy and you have to work at it flavour because
that's where
you make the real gains.
One particular message early in the piece
Dear R-user,
I already received quite a lot of replies to this mail and like to do a
preliminary sum up.
A few were sceptical about the use of such a beginner mailing list.
The arguments were that people starting with R will only stay subscribed for
a short time
until they reached the
my opinion.
- Iyue
-Original Message-
From: Martin Wegmann [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2003 8:18 AM
To: R-list
Subject: Re: [R] mailing list for basic questions - preliminary sum up
Dear R-user,
I already received quite a lot of replies to this mail
Martin Wegmann wrote:
Dear R-user,
I already received quite a lot of replies to this mail and like to do a
preliminary sum up.
A few were sceptical about the use of such a beginner mailing list.
The arguments were that people starting with R will only stay subscribed for
a short time
Pascal A. Niklaus [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
- In my experience even *very* basic questions *relating to the R
language* do get answered on r-help. I'm impressed by how much time
some members of the R core team spend answering relatively basic
questions, and by how elaborate their answers
On 12/16/03 16:09, Pascal A. Niklaus wrote:
- In my experience even *very* basic questions *relating to the R
language* do get answered on r-help. I'm impressed by how much time some
members of the R core team spend answering relatively basic questions,
and by how elaborate their answers generally
I agree with Tony's observation that well thought out questions
are more likely to receive an answer than something that is long,
rambling, and poorly focused. Many questions take more time to read
than I have available, so I don't bother. I like questions that include
toy examples in a
: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [R] mailing list for basic questions - preliminary sum up
On 12/16/03 16:09, Pascal A. Niklaus wrote:
- In my experience even *very* basic questions *relating to the R
language* do get answered on r-help. I'm impressed by how much time some
members of the R
Hello,
I agree completely that well thought out questions are important to receive
good and quick replies and I agree as well that the replies on the R-help
list are very good and helpful.
But I had to learn and I am still learing how to write good questions and
appreciate Spencer's
My experience in several mailing lists and newsgroups has been that
help from other beginners very often deserves the scare quotes.
The advice is often extremely bad.
The situation for R is quite different: R has the best documentation I've
ever seen for any open-source package, and it's better
not to learn R.
---
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 00:49:15 +0100
From: Martin Wegmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Spencer Graves [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [R] mailing list for basic questions - preliminary sum up
Hello,
I agree completely that well thought
From: Martin Wegmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Spencer Graves [EMAIL PROTECTED],
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [R] mailing list for basic questions -
preliminary sum up
Hello,
I agree completely that well thought out questions are
important to receive
good
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