[RBW] Re: Post-Thanksgiving Ride

2010-11-03 Thread manueljohnacosta
Sounds goods let see if it fits my schedule. On Nov 3, 7:04 pm, cyclotourist wrote: > Sounds fantastic, Eric! > > > > > > On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 5:17 PM, Eric Norris wrote: > > If anyone on this list is interested in joining a small group of riders for > > a ride on the day after Thanksgiving, pl

[RBW] Re: Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread Lynne Fitz
After much experimentation with MY commuter-loaded Bleriot multi- moding it out to my last contract job on the PDX Tri-Met MAX light rail (current contract job is EZ ride :-) ), I decided it is all in how you pick it up! Grab the front fork and the seat tube, and lift it up that way. For the reco

[RBW] Re: Singlespeed wheelset advice needed

2010-11-03 Thread Dlbracey
Longleaf seems like a great option - seems to be a smaller operation than some of the other custom places and the prices are really reasonable. I may just order a set through them. Thanks for the advice. On Nov 3, 1:13 pm, Lee wrote: > You may try contacting Anthony over at Longleaf (longleafbi

[RBW] Re: Singlespeed wheelset advice needed

2010-11-03 Thread Dlbracey
Jim, Unfortunately those won't work with my frame spacing. On Nov 3, 1:09 pm, "Jim M." wrote: > Riv has these for > $200:http://www.rivbike.com/products/show/budget-twin-hollow-wheelset/18-312 > . I weigh 220 and have used these wheels for a budget project. They > ride well and I've had no prob

[RBW] Re: Soma B Line vs Express vs Pari Moto 650b tires

2010-11-03 Thread jsk
Thanks everyone, The input is really helpful ... Lee and Bruce, I don't know where you guys ride and never get flats but I can certainly say I'm jealous! I'm going to slog along on the PM's a bit longer and see if maybe I'm just having a run of bad luck. If I bail soon, it will be for the 38/B- Li

[RBW] Re: Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread Erik
Amtrak's lack of progressive thinking, and inability to accommodate potential allies in alternative transportation, has frustrated me, as well. As a side-note to Bobbie B's comment about the Portland to Boston line (Downeaster)...I live on that line, and unfortunately they only let bikes board at

[RBW] Re: Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread Kelly
I've had several great experiances traveling in Missouri via Amtrak with roll on service. My problem is even a boxed type ride is expensive. By the time they treat each of my panniers as a seperate bag, and the bike addition and the ticket, I'm cheaper to fly. Kelly -- You received this messag

[RBW] 10 dayish Tour Destination

2010-11-03 Thread Kelly
My wife and I had a wonderful time riding the C&O ToePath from Washington DC to Cumberland then the Allegeny on to Pittsburgh in early Oct. Then I was thinking of my tour from Boulder Co to St Louis Mo and remembered making a wrong turn and riding some wonderful gravel road rollers for 20 miles or

[RBW] Re: Fenders and Speed

2010-11-03 Thread kevin lindsey
Allan - Yes, you are alone. Kevin On Nov 3, 9:32 am, Allan in Portland wrote: > No test to determine whether the hammered honjo, like dimples on a > golf ball, gives better aerodynamics than the smooth? :-) I've always > been partial to the fluted fenders. The flutes create laminar flow > channel

[RBW] Re: The takeover is progressing

2010-11-03 Thread TJ Ramb
Okay - call me Mr technobabble, I'll have a GPS thanks! Mainly for navigation of back country adventures, but I only used my computer for navigation anyway. I did learn along the way to be good at estimating how far I'd gone over a variety of terrain in a certain amount of time, so that it became

Re: [RBW] Post-Thanksgiving Ride

2010-11-03 Thread cyclotourist
Sounds fantastic, Eric! On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 5:17 PM, Eric Norris wrote: > If anyone on this list is interested in joining a small group of riders for > a ride on the day after Thanksgiving, please email me off-list. We'll be > riding from Davis to San Francisco via Napa, Petaluma, Marin Coun

Re: [RBW] Re: Stolen QB in San Diego

2010-11-03 Thread cyclotourist
FWIW, I lock my bikes inside of my locked garage. From my foppish Riv to my rusty Schwinn. On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 5:55 PM, Esteban wrote: > After reading ride reports of midwest farm roads, winding paths > through the Cascades, D2R2 in my old stomping grounds of New England, > the quiet street

[RBW] Re: Riv Railroad shirt question

2010-11-03 Thread kps
i have a medium and should have bought a small -k On Nov 3, 8:32 pm, Lee wrote: > Thanks for the good knowledge, everyone! I think I'll go for a size > smaller and possibly shrink as needed. > > Lee > > On Nov 3, 5:57 pm, Esteban wrote: > > > They fit really big for me.  I got one that fit a

[RBW] Re: Riv Railroad shirt question

2010-11-03 Thread Lee
Thanks for the good knowledge, everyone! I think I'll go for a size smaller and possibly shrink as needed. Lee On Nov 3, 5:57 pm, Esteban wrote: > They fit really big for me.  I got one that fit and was happy that it > shrunk a bit. > > Esteban > San Diego, Calif. > > On Nov 3, 5:12 pm, EricP w

[RBW] Re: Riv Railroad shirt question

2010-11-03 Thread Esteban
They fit really big for me. I got one that fit and was happy that it shrunk a bit. Esteban San Diego, Calif. On Nov 3, 5:12 pm, EricP wrote: > Mine did not.  They are XL (have two).  Feel the size is cut slightly > large.  No complaints, though.  (Feel they are a better fit for me > than the Ro

[RBW] Re: Stolen QB in San Diego

2010-11-03 Thread Esteban
After reading ride reports of midwest farm roads, winding paths through the Cascades, D2R2 in my old stomping grounds of New England, the quiet streets of the South - and after riding my folder extensively in Austin, Chicago, Kansas -- I think its fair to say that there's fantastic riding everywher

[RBW] FS or FT: Velo Orange Model 6 Saddle

2010-11-03 Thread MikeC
Selling a like-new saddle that is similar in style to a Brooks Swallow. Black, chrome rails, mounted once and ridden three times maybe 60 mi. total. Just doesn't work for me. $90 new, will sell for $80 shipped. Will also consider trade for like-new VO Model 1 or 3, Brooks B17, Pro, or Selle Anatomi

[RBW] Re: Stolen QB in San Diego

2010-11-03 Thread EricP
Yeah, and the beer is terrible. Specifically stuff from Ballast Point or that microbrew at the gyros place on Coronado near the ferry. And the city is packed with midwestern tourists getting away from . . . well, whatever it is we get away from. Still hoping to figure out a way to get back there

[RBW] Post-Thanksgiving Ride

2010-11-03 Thread Eric Norris
If anyone on this list is interested in joining a small group of riders for a ride on the day after Thanksgiving, please email me off-list. We'll be riding from Davis to San Francisco via Napa, Petaluma, Marin County and Sausalito, then riding BART and Amtrak back to Davis. Or route last year

[RBW] Re: Riv Railroad shirt question

2010-11-03 Thread EricP
Mine did not. They are XL (have two). Feel the size is cut slightly large. No complaints, though. (Feel they are a better fit for me than the Rockmount cowboy shirts. Those are not for my body shape.) Eric Platt On Nov 3, 1:43 pm, scott wrote: > Mine shrunk some. Give it a good dry on high.

Re: [RBW] Re: Hunqa Prototype

2010-11-03 Thread cyclotourist
The Barralumin font looks familiar ... On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 4:45 PM, Oliver S. wrote: > I found the owner's recent blog post: > > http://vintagebicyc

RE: [RBW] Re: OT: New Venture

2010-11-03 Thread Joe Bartoe
Sorry, some have reporte issues with the link, but if you copy and paste : www.synapticcycles.com into your browser it should work. Joe > Date: Wed, 3 Nov 2010 15:54:05 -0700 > Subject: [RBW] Re: OT: New Venture > From: mhech...@gmail.com > To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com > > Joe, your li

RE: [RBW] Re: OT: New Venture

2010-11-03 Thread Joe Bartoe
Sounds great! If you need a bike while you're here I'll provide a bit of a discount. Joe > From: orthie...@gmail.com > Date: Wed, 3 Nov 2010 15:59:03 -0700 > Subject: Re: [RBW] Re: OT: New Venture > To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com > > I opened it and checked your site. I'll be going to Da

[RBW] Re: Hunqa Prototype

2010-11-03 Thread Oliver S.
I found the owner's recent blog post: http://vintagebicycle.wordpress.com/2010/08/30/barralumin-laterale-randonneuse-c-1948-50/ On Nov 3, 4:38 pm, "Oliver S." wrote: > Built by French constructeur Nicola Barra > More pics and info on this bike > here:http://www.flickr.com/photos/oldbicycles/4767

[RBW] Re: Hunqa Prototype

2010-11-03 Thread Oliver S.
Built by French constructeur Nicola Barra More pics and info on this bike here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/oldbicycles/4767853429/in/pool-650b -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners

[RBW] Re: Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread MichaelH
I believe the OP was talking about the northeast corridor. Hearing about opportunities on the west coast, just leaves the rest of us wondering why not us too. For almost decade, my daughter lived in DC and traveled home to VT regularly. Unfortunately, she could not bring her bike - boxed or rol

[RBW] Re: OT: New Venture

2010-11-03 Thread cyclotour...@gmail.com
You're awesome, Joe! BTW, the link isn't working in google groups. Got a 404 error. I had to cut and paste and it was fine. http://synapticcycles.com/ On Nov 3, 3:15 pm, Joe Bartoe wrote: > Hi Everyone, > > A  while back, I put a bunch o' stuff on sale that was supposed to go toward > a new

Re: [RBW] Re: OT: New Venture

2010-11-03 Thread Rene Sterental
I opened it and checked your site. I'll be going to Dana Point on business in January. If I have the time, I'll contact you so I ca go for a ride in the area. René Sent from my iPhone 4 On Nov 3, 2010, at 3:54 PM, MichaelH wrote: > Joe, your link does not open for me, michael > > On Nov 3, 6:1

[RBW] Re: Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread cyclotour...@gmail.com
I've been able to ride Metrolink few times the last couple of years, and have always had a very good experience. Bungies are a must, and be ready to hop of the train fast! On Nov 3, 1:40 pm, doug peterson wrote: > In Southern California, the AMTRAK Surfliner allows 3 bikes per car, > but no rese

[RBW] Re: OT: New Venture

2010-11-03 Thread MichaelH
Joe, your link does not open for me, michael On Nov 3, 6:15 pm, Joe Bartoe wrote: > Hi Everyone, > > A  while back, I put a bunch o' stuff on sale that was supposed to go toward > a new adventure and I have finally gotten everything up and running so I'm > ready to announce it. > > Please, stop

[RBW] Re: Stolen QB in San Diego

2010-11-03 Thread cyclotour...@gmail.com
My co-worker's car was stolen in Solana Beach last week. Definitely a crime wave there. On Nov 3, 3:48 pm, Esteban wrote: > Mike - that's great news! > > For the rest of you: San Diego is a horrible place to live.  The ocean > is really loud.  The mountains are really uphill.  All of this on top

[RBW] Re: Stolen QB in San Diego

2010-11-03 Thread Esteban
Mike - that's great news! For the rest of you: San Diego is a horrible place to live. The ocean is really loud. The mountains are really uphill. All of this on top of the bike theft means you'd probably not want to move here. I heard Portland is cool. Best regards, Esteban San "fiercely local

[RBW] Re: Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread Montclair BobbyB
Yeah, but then as you're pedaling you'd be missing the ride of your Bleriot, right? On Nov 3, 5:29 pm, kevin lindsey wrote: > On the very positive side is the Valley Transportation Authority > (VTA), the light rail service here in Silicon Valley.  I take it every > morning; racks are almost alway

[RBW] Re: Stolen QB in San Diego

2010-11-03 Thread Michael_S
you can't trust those people in that city! Seriously, I just closed escrow on a place down there Friday. I'll just be down there on weekends (many I hope) until next summer. Further South in SoCal ~Mike~ On Nov 3, 3:08 pm, "cyclotour...@gmail.com" wrote: > Well that sucks immensely. > > On

[RBW] OT: New Venture

2010-11-03 Thread Joe Bartoe
Hi Everyone, A while back, I put a bunch o' stuff on sale that was supposed to go toward a new adventure and I have finally gotten everything up and running so I'm ready to announce it. Please, stop by my website and take a look: www.synapticcycles.com It is a bicycle rental business in SoCa

Re: [RBW] Re: Hunqa Prototype

2010-11-03 Thread Ray Shine
So, someone please explain to me how the derailers work. Is it a manual change, like the QB? From: scott To: RBW Owners Bunch Sent: Wed, November 3, 2010 1:39:43 PM Subject: [RBW] Re: Hunqa Prototype "That bike needs to be resurrected in a modern style" I

[RBW] Re: Stolen QB in San Diego

2010-11-03 Thread cyclotour...@gmail.com
Well that sucks immensely. On Nov 3, 12:45 pm, Esteban wrote: > Not mine - its a friend's: green, 62 or 64 (I forget), currently set > up with Albatross bars, taped to the stem, Brooks, etc. > > It was taken out of his garage in the costal area.  No other bike has > those rear fork ends, so even

[RBW] Re: Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread kevin lindsey
On the very positive side is the Valley Transportation Authority (VTA), the light rail service here in Silicon Valley. I take it every morning; racks are almost always available and, if not, I'm free to stand with my bike so long as I don't block the aisles. The trains linger at the stations long

[RBW] Re: Hunqa Prototype

2010-11-03 Thread William
Kind of. If somebody orders a new Diago-bomba and has dual pump pegs put on behind the seat tube and sets it up in heavy duty Campeur style with a color matched lugged stem and fenders and such. That would be epic. On Nov 3, 1:39 pm, scott wrote: > "That bike needs to be resurrected in a modern

[RBW] Re: Hunqa Prototype

2010-11-03 Thread William
I see. That is an actual hanger. I thought it looked like that L shaped thing was actually connected to the seatstays and headtube. Now that I think about it, that wouldn't make any sense. Steering would put on the brakes! Duh. It's just a primitive hanger. Nevermind! On Nov 3, 1:26 pm, Peter

[RBW] Re: Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread doug peterson
In Southern California, the AMTRAK Surfliner allows 3 bikes per car, but no reservations. The bikes hang by one wheel from hooks. This can be inconvenient when loaded down as the area is near a door. If all the cars are full, they've allowed me to put my bike in the baggage car but this is at th

[RBW] Re: Hunqa Prototype

2010-11-03 Thread scott
"That bike needs to be resurrected in a modern style" Isn't that what the new Bombadil's are? http://www.rivbike.com/products/show/bombadil/50-640 On Nov 3, 3:15 pm, William wrote: > I'd like to see how those brakes work.  Does the cable pull through > that L shaped bracket and pull one arm, w

[RBW] Re: Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread Montclair BobbyB
These are all GREAT stories and ideas... keep em coming, folks... Thanks! Anne, what you did is exactly what I'd love to do virtually anywhere in the US... To board a train to take me to a starting point of my choosing, then to ride to another destination, then complete the trip by train.. To me t

[RBW] Re: Hunqa Prototype

2010-11-03 Thread Peter Pesce
Gorgeous bike! I can't wait until all the paint ships off my Sam so I can have a raw finish, too. I think the brakes work like any canti brakes, but the cables have been replaced by what appear to be spokes. Aside from being rather finicky to adjust, I can't see what that wouldn't work. -Pete On

[RBW] Re: Hunqa Prototype

2010-11-03 Thread William
I'd like to see how those brakes work. Does the cable pull through that L shaped bracket and pull one arm, which makes the L-bracket pivot, pulling the other arm? That bike needs to be resurrected in a modern style. That would be beyond cool. On Nov 2, 4:52 pm, Jeffrey wrote: > I find this bik

Re: [RBW] Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread Anne Paulson
On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 10:26 AM, Montclair BobbyB wrote: > > This was my first (of hopefully many future) bike-train trip(s).  Does > anyone else have experiences travelling with your bike by train?  How > would you rate YOUR train service in terms of bike-friendliness? This summer I took the Am

[RBW] Stolen QB in San Diego

2010-11-03 Thread Esteban
Not mine - its a friend's: green, 62 or 64 (I forget), currently set up with Albatross bars, taped to the stem, Brooks, etc. It was taken out of his garage in the costal area. No other bike has those rear fork ends, so even if rattle canned, it should stand out. Keep an eye out! Ne really needs

Re: [RBW] Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread erik jensen
*transportation policy hat on* BART did have a dedicated train car once upon a time, unfortunately the number of bikes coming on and off--combined with the difficulty of maneuvering said bicycles around other bicycles--resulted in long dwell times at the station. too long, in fact, for a service o

Re: [RBW] Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread Ray Shine
The most convenient and user-friendly bike/train experience I have found is the local CalTrain line that runs between San Francisco and Gilroy. I have bike/trained on Amtrak to from Oakland to Portland (14 hours late due to mandatory ceding of right-of-way to freight haulers), Capital Express t

[RBW] Re: Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread Montclair BobbyB
Jim: For all those with folding bikes, S&S coupled bikes or who live near a train hub with baggage service, life is good. But I have none of these options, and neither do most people living along train routes. And to be fair I did consider the box option. When planning my Washington trip I even

[RBW] Re: Riv Railroad shirt question

2010-11-03 Thread scott
Mine shrunk some. Give it a good dry on high. On Nov 3, 12:09 pm, Lee wrote: > Thanks, Mitch. Hmm, maybe I'll need to size down a step. I usually > wear medium shirts but this one hangs pretty long on my 5'7" frame, > haha. > > Best, > Lee > > On Nov 3, 9:50 am, Mitch Browne wrote: > > > > > Lee

[RBW] Re: Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread Montclair BobbyB
Seth, I agree they have some physical limitations with their current trains, but so do NJ Transit and SEPTA, yet NJT and SEPTA have figured a way to make it work with what they have. Amtrak, by comparison has made only token changes to accommodate bikes and has established a smattering of trains wi

[RBW] Re: Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread Jeremy Till
I've got three major experiences: BART, Amtrak California, and Amtrak -BART allows bicycles to roll on but only during non-commute hours, which is great for one-time trips or if you're lucky enough to have a flexible commuting schedule but sucks if you actually want to do a multi-modal commute (es

[RBW] Re: Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery
I agree that roll-on bike service would be great, but I have found Amtrak to be a wonderful way to travel with a bicycle. If you are traveling between two stations that offer luggage service, then simply use one of the Amtrak bike boxes. It's not ideal, but it's not as bad as people often imagine i

[RBW] Re: Singlespeed wheelset advice needed

2010-11-03 Thread Jeremy Till
As long as the retailer specifies that the wheels are handbuilt, i wouldn't worry about it. It's the machine built wheels that are the source of the horror stories. The formula hubs are a good deal, i've used them before and been satisfied; they perform well and the bearings last a long time. Ju

Re: [RBW] Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread Seth Vidal
On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 1:26 PM, Montclair BobbyB wrote: > > - In the hall of shame is Amtrak, which although they allow folding > bicycles at all times, they prohibit roll-on/roll-off along the > Northeast Corridor line (even during off-hours), a situation that > frankly is unacceptable.  This is

[RBW] Riv & Rail - Travelling by Bike and Train

2010-11-03 Thread Montclair BobbyB
I can't stop thinking about my experience this past weekend, travelling to the Philly Bike Expo on my Bombadil and the train. It definitely opened my eyes to the possibilities of this kind of combo travel, but perhaps more important it exposed weaknesses in the train transit system that will need

[RBW] Re: Singlespeed wheelset advice needed

2010-11-03 Thread Greg
I have a QB wheel (well, the same hub, different rim) that I'm not using for sale. I got this from Franklyn on this list a while back, and have put a couple hundred miles on it, but I'm in a paring-down mode. I believe this was laced up by a local shop in Berkeley and the axle changed to a solid

[RBW] Re: Singlespeed wheelset advice needed

2010-11-03 Thread Lee
You may try contacting Anthony over at Longleaf (longleafbicycles.com) to see if he has a budget SS wheelset sitting around. I believe he specializes in SS and fixed wheel-buidling. Note: I am not related nor an investor nor getting any kickbacks from Longleaf :) Or contact Rich himself to see what

[RBW] Re: Riv Railroad shirt question

2010-11-03 Thread Lee
Thanks, Mitch. Hmm, maybe I'll need to size down a step. I usually wear medium shirts but this one hangs pretty long on my 5'7" frame, haha. Best, Lee On Nov 3, 9:50 am, Mitch Browne wrote: > Lee, > > My experience is it does not shrink much. > > I have a medium,  and there's still plenty of roo

[RBW] Re: Singlespeed wheelset advice needed

2010-11-03 Thread Jim M.
Riv has these for $200: http://www.rivbike.com/products/show/budget-twin-hollow-wheelset/18-312 . I weigh 220 and have used these wheels for a budget project. They ride well and I've had no problems with them. They have cassette hub, but you just need some spacers and a cog to make them SS compati

[RBW] Re: Singlespeed wheelset advice needed

2010-11-03 Thread jlvota
I also wish that the Quickbeam wheelset was offered seperately, as I would also be interested in them (or atleast the QR flip/flop hubset). I have been very happy with a bike of mine that has A319 rims and would definately put them on another. They are affordable but definately don't feel cheap a

[RBW] Re: Riv Railroad shirt question

2010-11-03 Thread Mitch Browne
Lee, My experience is it does not shrink much. I have a medium, and there's still plenty of room inside. I'm about 5' 10 / 170lb Cheers, Mitch. On Nov 3, 9:21 am, Lee wrote: > Morning all. Do any of you know if the Riv Railroad shirts have some > initial shrinkage? I just received one as a g

[RBW] Singlespeed wheelset advice needed

2010-11-03 Thread Dlbracey
I'm building a commuter bike right now and I need a strong singlespeed wheelset for my 225lb self. I'd like to be able to run 35mm tires and I have a limited budget. Basically, I'm looking for a set of Quickbeam wheels, but they don't seem to be available for purchase from riv. I'm considering t

[RBW] Re: Fenders and Speed

2010-11-03 Thread Allan in Portland
No test to determine whether the hammered honjo, like dimples on a golf ball, gives better aerodynamics than the smooth? :-) I've always been partial to the fluted fenders. The flutes create laminar flow channels at speeds above 32kph. And speaking of aerodynamics, am I alone in having considered

[RBW] Riv Railroad shirt question

2010-11-03 Thread Lee
Morning all. Do any of you know if the Riv Railroad shirts have some initial shrinkage? I just received one as a gift and it seems a size too large. But before exchanging it, I wanted to know if I could expect it to shrink some. Thanks! Lee -- You received this message because you are subscribed

[RBW] Re: Fenders and Speed

2010-11-03 Thread Jan Heine
On Nov 3, 5:30 am, Ken Freeman wrote: > Jan, what was the fender shape that you tested? A smooth Honjo 43 mm fender. We made an extension for the front fender to test different lengths beyond the fork crown. We tested it with both 31 mm Grand Bois and 25 mm Vittoria tires. Jan Heine Editor Bicyc

Re: [RBW] Re: Fenders and Speed

2010-11-03 Thread Ken Freeman
Jan, what was the fender shape that you tested? On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 9:24 PM, Jan Heine wrote: > We spent two days in the wind tunnel testing fenders, jackets, hand > position, lower handlebars, etc. The fenders made remarkably little > difference to aerodynamics. Of course, it probably depend