[RBW] Re: Long Chainstays - What Problem/Deficiency Do They Solve?

[fiddl...@gmail.com]

Ribeye vs Burger: both get the same job done in different ways…neither is a 
bad way to go
On Sunday, March 31, 2024 at 1:50:18 PM UTC-4 John Hawrylak, Woodstown NJ 
wrote:

> Enjoyed reading the thread "Anyone else not a fan of long chainstays?", 
> especially Bill L's explanation of the RBW bike design philosophy.   Seems 
> the prevailing thought is long stays are better for
> upright riding
> single track type trails (vs a Rails to Trails type trail)
>
> I'll just note 2 'facts'
> 1  The vast majority of RBW models (except the Roadeo type frame) use 
> slack STA and HTA which may contribute to the ride effect when coupled with 
> long stays.
> 2.  In the beginning RBW addressed getting the bars higher and adopting a 
> non-racer riding style (back at 45° with hands on hoods), which IMHO were 
> solutions to actual problems.
>
> *So What problem or current deficiency in bike design is Grant solving by 
> using long chain stays*
> Just to bring bikes to market that no one else is building??
> Or do they solve a real problem???
>
> John Hawrylak
> Woodstown NJ
>
> FWIW 2 of 3 of my frames have 44 to 45cm chain stays, and 1 has a 43cm 
> chain stay.It's hard to notice a ride difference.
>

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[RBW] Re: Eroica California

[Bill Lindsay]

I've got the bike for it, and I'm just waiting for the stars to align to do 
the ride.  My "Eroica Bike" is a time capsule 1983 Univega Gran Premio. 
 I've got ~700 miles on it, and will not have any issue using it for an 
Eroica day.  

https://flickr.com/photos/45758191@N04/49563967306/in/album-72157713199195553/

BL in EC

On Tuesday, April 2, 2024 at 9:41:21 AM UTC-7 chefd...@gmail.com wrote:

> Curious if anyone on this forum is also a Vintage enthusiast and has 
> interest in the Eroica event that is run on the Central Coast of 
> California. I've ridden it a few times on my PX-10... its a great ride, 
> although the organization that runs the event has had its ups and downs 
> over the years. Currently, the website lists September 22, 2024 as the run 
> date, but the registration button leads to last year's sign-updoes 
> anyone have any better intel? 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Eroica California

[Patrick Moore]

I certainly won't be riding Eroica, but I am very interested in hearing
more from RBW-listers who will be, and to hearing about and seeing pictures
of the bikes they plan to ride in the event, doubtless Rivendell KOF bikes.

I'm certainly not a vintage enthusiast as exhibited on the CR list, but I
guess my bikes, all customs at this point, are KOFs, more or less, and
feature old and even ancient componentry, tho' not so much (a *little,* but
not *principally*) for the historical schtick as for the type of riding I
like, which in many respects can't be achieved with modern components --
multispeed, commuter and errand fixed gear road bikes, fat-tire sandy
but pavement-worthy road bikes, light, fixed-gear gofast road bikes;
eventually, beater, nice-light-531-frame fixed gear errand bikes.

I do think that a Rambouillet, Heron, Roadeo, RoadUno, Quickbeam, Roadini,
Redwood, etc etc, not to mention Riv Road customs, can fit right into the
Eroica mold and I'd love to see Eroica-approved Rivendell builds.

On Tue, Apr 2, 2024 at 2:59 PM Jkarlin  wrote:

> I'm also curious about this. I tried sending an email to the contact on
> the webpage (*i...@eroicacalifornia.com)*, but I got a message back
> saying the address couldn't be found or was unable to receive mail.
>
> On Tuesday, April 2, 2024 at 9:41:21 AM UTC-7 chefd...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Curious if anyone on this forum is also a Vintage enthusiast and has
>> interest in the Eroica event that is run on the Central Coast of
>> California. I've ridden it a few times on my PX-10... its a great ride,
>> although the organization that runs the event has had its ups and downs
>> over the years. Currently, the website lists September 22, 2024 as the run
>> date, but the registration button leads to last year's sign-updoes
>> anyone have any better intel?
>
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> 
> .
>


-- 

Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
---

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---

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[RBW] Re: Eroica California

[Jkarlin]

I'm also curious about this. I tried sending an email to the contact on the 
webpage (*i...@eroicacalifornia.com)*, but I got a message back saying the 
address couldn't be found or was unable to receive mail.

On Tuesday, April 2, 2024 at 9:41:21 AM UTC-7 chefd...@gmail.com wrote:

> Curious if anyone on this forum is also a Vintage enthusiast and has 
> interest in the Eroica event that is run on the Central Coast of 
> California. I've ridden it a few times on my PX-10... its a great ride, 
> although the organization that runs the event has had its ups and downs 
> over the years. Currently, the website lists September 22, 2024 as the run 
> date, but the registration button leads to last year's sign-updoes 
> anyone have any better intel? 

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Re: [RBW] Re: [BOB] Re: Bump! ISO: 10-speed spacers. And question.

[Patrick Moore]

Thanks, Garth; I get that impression. I'll probably order lots of both 2.0
and 2.35. Thanks again for the link.

Patrick Moore, who would find life much easier if he really knew what he
was doing (but then again, that's what lists are for).



On Tue, Apr 2, 2024 at 12:22 PM Garth  wrote:

> I don't think it has to be exact down to the .00's Patrick, even if
> indexing, certainly not for friction shifting. Use the 2mm ones you have. I
> don't think the plastic spacers compress in a cassette. You might be able
> to gouge one with a sharp instrument, but to compress the entire circle in
> a relatively low torque setting ? I think not.
> On Tuesday, April 2, 2024 at 2:06:57 PM UTC-4 travis...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Patrick:
>>
>> As Roseanne Rosanadanna said many times and many years ago: "You sure
>> gotta lotta questions."
>>
>>  Which are the same question.
>>
>> Go to a bike shop and hand over a $tenner for a collection of used / worn
>> cassettes, explaining that spider-less ones are of special interest because
>> you want spacers, not cogs.
>>
>> Why you want only Shimano and not SRAM or any aftermarket cassettes
>> spacers is something you can keep secret. Me? I get infinite miles out of
>> cassette spacers. And they are in my DEI program and practice
>>
>>
>> --
>> Harry P Travis
>> Portland Oregon USA
>> 17.4.1
>>
>> On Apr 2, 2024, at 10:54 AM, Patrick Moore  wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>> I forgot to add that Sheldon says 2.35 mm for 10 sp; but mine (assume 10
>> sp because so ordered) are 2.04, again consistently with Park digital
>> caliper. Is 2.04 (or 2 mm -- willing to consider 4/100 mm user or
>> instrument error, or mfr error) for 11 speed? At any rate, my various 10 sp
>> home brew cassettes have been shifting wonderfully with the 2.04 mm ones.
>>
>> And someone on the RBW list pointed me to the right page on AliExpress
>> where I can find 2.35, 2.18, and 2.0 as well as 2.5 mm. Just want
>> clarification on the 2.0/2.04 and confirmation for the 2.35.
>>
>> It's all so confusing.
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 2, 2024 at 11:43 AM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>>
>>> *ISO* at least 7 and better 9, 10-speed spacers. Happy to salvage from
>>> worn out cassette. Please? $, trade, or charity.
>>>
>>> *Question: *Where can I find a reliable chart showing manufacturer's
>>> (Shimano; not interested in other mfrs) width specs for spacers and cogs
>>> for 9, 10, and 11 speed drivetrains? If chains included, so much the
>>> better. Sheldon has a chart that includes 9 and 10 but does not include 11
>>> but I'd like to compare 11 and confirm 9 and 10.
>>>
>>> The 2 spare 10-sp cassette spacers I have (red plastic, ordered for
>>> Shimano 10 sp from Cycle Clinic)  measure 2.04 mm, but I stumbled across 6
>>> alum spacers that measure 2mm. Are these alum spacers for 11 sp?
>>>
>>> At any rate, I would like to find at least 7, better 9 2.04 mm spacers
>>> for the Shimano spline pattern.
>>>
>>> I can find them new online for $6 per + shipping; can't find them on
>>> AliExpress; if youse plural have online sources reasonably priced, I'd be
>>> grateful to hear of them.
>>>
>>> Thanks.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Mar 30, 2024 at 2:34 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>>>
 Welp, the otherwise very competent LBS that built my new Oracle Ridge
 wheelset flubbed my special order of a dozen 10-sp Shimano spacers. I stole
 the spacers from the older, Soma slick wheelset, but I'd like to find at
 least 9 and up to a dozen 10 sp spacers. A second LBS I checked with just
 now doesn't carry loose spacers, at least, unless you can find them in an
  ods-and-ends bin.

>>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Patrick Moore
>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>
>> ---
>>
>> Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing
>> services
>>
>>
>> ---
>>
>> *When thou didst not, savage, k**now thine own meaning,*
>>
>> *But wouldst gabble like a** thing most brutish,*
>>
>> *I endowed thy purposes w**ith words that made them known.*
>>
>> --
>> To post to this group, send email to intern...@googlegroups.com. For
>> more options, group rules and how to contact the moderation team, visit
>> this group at https://groups.google.com/d/forum/internet-bob?hl=en
>> ---
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>> 
>> .
>>
>> --
> You 

[RBW] Re: Bump! ISO: 10-speed spacers. And question.

[Bill Lindsay]

Patrick Moore claims to be confused, which I believe.
Patrick Moore claims to have bought a product that he understands to be a 
10-speed spacer, and that object measures 2.04mm in thickness
Patrick Moore notes that St Sheldon's site says that 10-speed inter-cog 
spacers are 2.35mm in thickness

Patrick Moore requests an explanation of the above apparent discrepancy

I suspect Patrick Moore bought a different product than he thinks he 
bought.  There is a common product that enables one to fit a 10sp cassette 
onto an 11sp road cassette driver.  That product is a spacer, and that 
spacer is 2.0mm thick.  Problem Solvers is one vendor that sells such a 
product, and it has nothing to do with inter-cog spacers.  

I use 2.35mm when calculating 10-speed stack ups and I use 2.18mm when 
calculating 11-speed stack ups.   

The Performance webstore has a <$25 price on the Shimano HG-500 10-speed 
11-25 cassette.  That would yield a bunch of spacers and a bunch of useful 
cogs.  The HG-500 model has no spider stuff.  It's all cogs and spacers, 
riveted together and the rivets are easy to scrub out.  

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA
On Tuesday, April 2, 2024 at 11:05:18 AM UTC-7 Patrick Moore wrote:

> Perhaps -- guessing -- the 2.0 spacer is for 11 sp cassettes, and the 
> (consistently measured) 2.04 mm plastic ones are so made to accommodate a 
> bit of compression which the 2.0 (consistent) aluminum ones don't suffer?
>
> So: 2.0 = 11 speed?
>
> 2.35: 10 speed?
>
> 2.54: 9 speed?
>
> Cogs:
>
> 11 speed: ?
>
> 10 speed: 1.6 mm per Sheldon and my caliper
>
> 9 speed: ~1.8 mm per Sheldon (1.78) and my caliper.
>
>

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[RBW] Re: [BOB] Re: Bump! ISO: 10-speed spacers. And question.

[Garth]

I don't think it has to be exact down to the .00's Patrick, even if 
indexing, certainly not for friction shifting. Use the 2mm ones you have. I 
don't think the plastic spacers compress in a cassette. You might be able 
to gouge one with a sharp instrument, but to compress the entire circle in 
a relatively low torque setting ? I think not. 
On Tuesday, April 2, 2024 at 2:06:57 PM UTC-4 travis...@gmail.com wrote:

> Patrick:
>
> As Roseanne Rosanadanna said many times and many years ago: "You sure 
> gotta lotta questions."
>
>  Which are the same question.
>
> Go to a bike shop and hand over a $tenner for a collection of used / worn 
> cassettes, explaining that spider-less ones are of special interest because 
> you want spacers, not cogs.
>
> Why you want only Shimano and not SRAM or any aftermarket cassettes 
> spacers is something you can keep secret. Me? I get infinite miles out of 
> cassette spacers. And they are in my DEI program and practice
>
>
> --
> Harry P Travis
> Portland Oregon USA 
> 17.4.1
>
> On Apr 2, 2024, at 10:54 AM, Patrick Moore  wrote:
>
> 
>
> I forgot to add that Sheldon says 2.35 mm for 10 sp; but mine (assume 10 
> sp because so ordered) are 2.04, again consistently with Park digital 
> caliper. Is 2.04 (or 2 mm -- willing to consider 4/100 mm user or 
> instrument error, or mfr error) for 11 speed? At any rate, my various 10 sp 
> home brew cassettes have been shifting wonderfully with the 2.04 mm ones.
>
> And someone on the RBW list pointed me to the right page on AliExpress 
> where I can find 2.35, 2.18, and 2.0 as well as 2.5 mm. Just want 
> clarification on the 2.0/2.04 and confirmation for the 2.35.
>
> It's all so confusing.
>
> On Tue, Apr 2, 2024 at 11:43 AM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>
>> *ISO* at least 7 and better 9, 10-speed spacers. Happy to salvage from 
>> worn out cassette. Please? $, trade, or charity.
>>
>> *Question: *Where can I find a reliable chart showing manufacturer's 
>> (Shimano; not interested in other mfrs) width specs for spacers and cogs 
>> for 9, 10, and 11 speed drivetrains? If chains included, so much the 
>> better. Sheldon has a chart that includes 9 and 10 but does not include 11 
>> but I'd like to compare 11 and confirm 9 and 10.
>>
>> The 2 spare 10-sp cassette spacers I have (red plastic, ordered for 
>> Shimano 10 sp from Cycle Clinic)  measure 2.04 mm, but I stumbled across 6 
>> alum spacers that measure 2mm. Are these alum spacers for 11 sp?
>>
>> At any rate, I would like to find at least 7, better 9 2.04 mm spacers 
>> for the Shimano spline pattern.
>>
>> I can find them new online for $6 per + shipping; can't find them on 
>> AliExpress; if youse plural have online sources reasonably priced, I'd be 
>> grateful to hear of them.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Mar 30, 2024 at 2:34 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>>
>>> Welp, the otherwise very competent LBS that built my new Oracle Ridge 
>>> wheelset flubbed my special order of a dozen 10-sp Shimano spacers. I stole 
>>> the spacers from the older, Soma slick wheelset, but I'd like to find at 
>>> least 9 and up to a dozen 10 sp spacers. A second LBS I checked with just 
>>> now doesn't carry loose spacers, at least, unless you can find them in an 
>>>  ods-and-ends bin.
>>>
>>
>
> -- 
>
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
> ---
>
> Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing 
> services
>
>
> ---
>
> *When thou didst not, savage, k**now thine own meaning,*
>
> *But wouldst gabble like a** thing most brutish,*
>
> *I endowed thy purposes w**ith words that made them known.*
>
> -- 
> To post to this group, send email to intern...@googlegroups.com. For more 
> options, group rules and how to contact the moderation team, visit this 
> group at https://groups.google.com/d/forum/internet-bob?hl=en
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>  
> 
> .
>
>

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[RBW] Re: [BOB] Re: Bump! ISO: 10-speed spacers. And question.

[Harry Travis]

Patrick:As Roseanne Rosanadanna said many times and many years ago: "You sure gotta lotta questions." Which are the same question.Go to a bike shop and hand over a $tenner for a collection of used / worn cassettes, explaining that spider-less ones are of special interest because you want spacers, not cogs.Why you want only Shimano and not SRAM or any aftermarket cassettes spacers is something you can keep secret. Me? I get infinite miles out of cassette spacers. And they are in my DEI program and practice--Harry P TravisPortland Oregon USA 17.4.1On Apr 2, 2024, at 10:54 AM, Patrick Moore  wrote:I forgot to add that Sheldon says 2.35 mm for 10 sp; but mine (assume 10 sp because so ordered) are 2.04, again consistently with Park digital caliper. Is 2.04 (or 2 mm -- willing to consider 4/100 mm user or instrument error, or mfr error) for 11 speed? At any rate, my various 10 sp home brew cassettes have been shifting wonderfully with the 2.04 mm ones.And someone on the RBW list pointed me to the right page on AliExpress where I can find 2.35, 2.18, and 2.0 as well as 2.5 mm. Just want clarification on the 2.0/2.04 and confirmation for the 2.35.It's all so confusing.On Tue, Apr 2, 2024 at 11:43 AM Patrick Moore  wrote:ISO at least 7 and better 9, 10-speed spacers. Happy to salvage from worn out cassette. Please? $, trade, or charity.Question: Where can I find a reliable chart showing manufacturer's (Shimano; not interested in other mfrs) width specs for spacers and cogs for 9, 10, and 11 speed drivetrains? If chains included, so much the better. Sheldon has a chart that includes 9 and 10 but does not include 11 but I'd like to compare 11 and confirm 9 and 10.The 2 spare 10-sp cassette spacers I have (red plastic, ordered for Shimano 10 sp from Cycle Clinic)  measure 2.04 mm, but I stumbled across 6 alum spacers that measure 2mm. Are these alum spacers for 11 sp?At any rate, I would like to find at least 7, better 9 2.04 mm spacers for the Shimano spline pattern.I can find them new online for $6 per + shipping; can't find them on AliExpress; if youse plural have online sources reasonably priced, I'd be grateful to hear of them.Thanks.On Sat, Mar 30, 2024 at 2:34 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:Welp, the otherwise very competent LBS that built my new Oracle Ridge wheelset flubbed my special order of a dozen 10-sp Shimano spacers. I stole the spacers from the older, Soma slick wheelset, but I'd like to find at least 9 and up to a dozen 10 sp spacers. A second LBS I checked with just now doesn't carry loose spacers, at least, unless you can find them in an  ods-and-ends bin.
-- Patrick MooreAlburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum---Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing services---When thou didst not, savage, know thine own meaning,But wouldst gabble like a thing most brutish,I endowed thy purposes with words that made them known.



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[RBW] Re: Bump! ISO: 10-speed spacers. And question.

[Patrick Moore]

Perhaps -- guessing -- the 2.0 spacer is for 11 sp cassettes, and the
(consistently measured) 2.04 mm plastic ones are so made to accommodate a
bit of compression which the 2.0 (consistent) aluminum ones don't suffer?

So: 2.0 = 11 speed?

2.35: 10 speed?

2.54: 9 speed?

Cogs:

11 speed: ?

10 speed: 1.6 mm per Sheldon and my caliper

9 speed: ~1.8 mm per Sheldon (1.78) and my caliper.

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Re: [RBW] Craigslist, etc 2024

[Matthew Williams]

Appaloosa F/F/HS/BB
54cm
1550
Livonia, MI
https://www.ebay.com/itm/176315160619


Sam Hillborne F/F/HS/BB
51cm
1550
Livonia, MI
https://www.ebay.com/itm/176315208003


Sam Hillborne
“Large” (contact seller for size)
2500
El Cerrito, CA
https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/bik/d/el-cerrito-rivendell-sam-hillborne/7733161410.html


Saluki F/F/HS/BB
62cm
1800
Brick, NJ
https://www.ebay.com/itm/335313651470

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[RBW] Re: Bump! ISO: 10-speed spacers. And question.

[Patrick Moore]

I forgot to add that Sheldon says 2.35 mm for 10 sp; but mine (assume 10 sp
because so ordered) are 2.04, again consistently with Park digital caliper.
Is 2.04 (or 2 mm -- willing to consider 4/100 mm user or instrument error,
or mfr error) for 11 speed? At any rate, my various 10 sp home brew
cassettes have been shifting wonderfully with the 2.04 mm ones.

And someone on the RBW list pointed me to the right page on AliExpress
where I can find 2.35, 2.18, and 2.0 as well as 2.5 mm. Just want
clarification on the 2.0/2.04 and confirmation for the 2.35.

It's all so confusing.

On Tue, Apr 2, 2024 at 11:43 AM Patrick Moore  wrote:

> *ISO* at least 7 and better 9, 10-speed spacers. Happy to salvage from
> worn out cassette. Please? $, trade, or charity.
>
> *Question: *Where can I find a reliable chart showing manufacturer's
> (Shimano; not interested in other mfrs) width specs for spacers and cogs
> for 9, 10, and 11 speed drivetrains? If chains included, so much the
> better. Sheldon has a chart that includes 9 and 10 but does not include 11
> but I'd like to compare 11 and confirm 9 and 10.
>
> The 2 spare 10-sp cassette spacers I have (red plastic, ordered for
> Shimano 10 sp from Cycle Clinic)  measure 2.04 mm, but I stumbled across 6
> alum spacers that measure 2mm. Are these alum spacers for 11 sp?
>
> At any rate, I would like to find at least 7, better 9 2.04 mm spacers for
> the Shimano spline pattern.
>
> I can find them new online for $6 per + shipping; can't find them on
> AliExpress; if youse plural have online sources reasonably priced, I'd be
> grateful to hear of them.
>
> Thanks.
>
>
>
> On Sat, Mar 30, 2024 at 2:34 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>
>> Welp, the otherwise very competent LBS that built my new Oracle Ridge
>> wheelset flubbed my special order of a dozen 10-sp Shimano spacers. I stole
>> the spacers from the older, Soma slick wheelset, but I'd like to find at
>> least 9 and up to a dozen 10 sp spacers. A second LBS I checked with just
>> now doesn't carry loose spacers, at least, unless you can find them in an
>>  ods-and-ends bin.
>>
>

-- 

Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
---

Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing
services

---

*When thou didst not, savage, k**now thine own meaning,*

*But wouldst gabble like a** thing most brutish,*

*I endowed thy purposes w**ith words that made them known.*

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[RBW] 10 speed spacers: source found, but now confusion and question.

[Patrick Moore]

Re-threading this:

Thanks, Garth; you're fingers are obviously more deft than mine.

But a question, because now I'm confused (per other thread): how wide are
Shimano 10 sp spacers?

You say 2.35, Sheldon says 2.35mm, mine measure consistent 2.04 mm -- the
red plastic ones I ordered from Cycle Clinic (expressly for 10 sp
cassettes) in 2020. *And * I found a half-dozen alum spacers in my bin that
measure a consistent 2.0 mm.

So: is 2.04 -- 2.0 the 11 speed spacer?

The 14-28 10 sp cassette, as well as the 13-25, both use the red 2.04 mm
spacers with an 11 sp chain and it all shifts wonderfully.

*SO:* please tell me what I want!

Thanks!

On Tue, Apr 2, 2024 at 11:28 AM Garth  wrote:

> I case you come up empty here Patrick, there's aliexpress wholesale
> website. I've ordered from the website from various companies without any
> issues.
> https://www.aliexpress.us/w/wholesale-10-speed-cassette-spacers-2.35mm.html.
> You can also get spare cogs there.
> https://www.aliexpress.us/w/wholesale-10-speed-cassette-cogs.html
>
> If anyone made an 7-speed freehub, and it didn't make noise, I'd buy some
> and make my own cassettes.
>

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[RBW] Bump! ISO: 10-speed spacers. And question.

[Patrick Moore]

*ISO* at least 7 and better 9, 10-speed spacers. Happy to salvage from worn
out cassette. Please? $, trade, or charity.

*Question: *Where can I find a reliable chart showing manufacturer's
(Shimano; not interested in other mfrs) width specs for spacers and cogs
for 9, 10, and 11 speed drivetrains? If chains included, so much the
better. Sheldon has a chart that includes 9 and 10 but does not include 11
but I'd like to compare 11 and confirm 9 and 10.

The 2 spare 10-sp cassette spacers I have (red plastic, ordered for Shimano
10 sp from Cycle Clinic)  measure 2.04 mm, but I stumbled across 6 alum
spacers that measure 2mm. Are these alum spacers for 11 sp?

At any rate, I would like to find at least 7, better 9 2.04 mm spacers for
the Shimano spline pattern.

I can find them new online for $6 per + shipping; can't find them on
AliExpress; if youse plural have online sources reasonably priced, I'd be
grateful to hear of them.

Thanks.



On Sat, Mar 30, 2024 at 2:34 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:

> Welp, the otherwise very competent LBS that built my new Oracle Ridge
> wheelset flubbed my special order of a dozen 10-sp Shimano spacers. I stole
> the spacers from the older, Soma slick wheelset, but I'd like to find at
> least 9 and up to a dozen 10 sp spacers. A second LBS I checked with just
> now doesn't carry loose spacers, at least, unless you can find them in an
>  ods-and-ends bin.
>

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[RBW] Re: [650B] Different tire size front and rear.?

[Garth]

I case you come up empty here Patrick, there's aliexpress wholesale 
website. I've ordered from the website from various companies without any 
issues. 
https://www.aliexpress.us/w/wholesale-10-speed-cassette-spacers-2.35mm.html. 
You can also get spare cogs there. 
https://www.aliexpress.us/w/wholesale-10-speed-cassette-cogs.html

If anyone made an 7-speed freehub, and it didn't make noise, I'd buy some 
and make my own cassettes. 

On Tuesday, April 2, 2024 at 12:30:54 PM UTC-4 Joan wrote:

> What Sheldon has to say - a number of years ago, I wanted wider tires (35 
> or 38 at the time) on one of my bikes for a tour that involved some badly 
> paved roads. It turned out that the front clearance was fine, but not the 
> rear. So I looked up what Sheldon had to say and happily used a wider tire 
> on the front, noticing nothing.
> Mixing/Matching Tires
> Most bikes come with identical tires front and rear. This is all right for 
> general use, but if you want to optimize your bike, you should consider 
> using different tires front and rear. The front and rear tires have 
> different loadings and different requirements.
>
>- Narrower Front, Wider RearIf lightness is the primary goal, tire 
>width/weight is limited by the risk of pinch cut flats 
>, a.k.a. "snake 
>bites. " Since 
>there is more weight carried on the rear tire, you can get away with a 
>slightly narrower tire in front than you can in back.
>- Wider Front, Narrower RearA wider front tire makes sense in many 
>applications, however, when handling and ride comfort are considered. A 
>wider tire will generally provide better cornering traction 
> than a narrower 
>one, assuming appropriate inflation pressure 
>.
>
>A wider tire also provides superior shock absorbency. I personally 
>prefer a slightly wider tire in front, since I suffer from some wrist 
>discomfort on occasion.
>- Off-Road Issues
>
>Bicycles that are used some of the time on loose surfaces often 
>benefit from a wider front tire, with a fairly aggressive tread 
>, coupled with a 
>somewhat narrower, smoother rear tire.
>
>The wide, knobby front tire will provide the all-important front-wheel 
>traction. Front-wheel skidding almost always leads to a crash. For riding 
>on soft surfaces, such as sand or mud, a wide front tire is essential. If 
>the front tire sinks in and gets bogged down, you're stuck. If the front 
>tire rolls through a soft patch OK, you can generally power the rear 
>through to follow it.
>
>The narrower, smoother rear tire will have lower rolling resistance. 
>Since most of the weight is carried by the rear tire, rolling resistance 
> is 
>more important on the rear than the front. If the rear tire slips, in most 
>cases the worst that will happen is that you'll have to get off and walk.
>
>This is a great idea that developed out of BMX racing.
>
>Some mountain-bike tires come in matched sets, with different tread 
>front/rear. The front tires tend to have the knobs set up more or less 
>parallel to the direction of travel, for improved lateral grip and better 
>steering control. The rears tend to have transverse knobs for 
>driving/braking traction.
>
> Joan O.
> Arlington, VA
>
>
>
> On Sat, Mar 30, 2024 at 4:54 PM Bernard Duhon  
> wrote:
>
>>  
>>
>>  
>>
>>  
>>
>>  
>>
>>  
>>
>>  
>>
>> Gang, 
>>
>> In my quest for fitting the largest tires my frames will take, I have put 
>> a larger tire on the front 38 mm of my 700 C and 35mm  in the rear.
>>
>>  
>>
>> On my 650 B conversion of a 700 C bike I have a 42 mm in the front and a 
>> 38 mm in the rear.
>>
>>  
>>
>> The larger tire is 3.5 mm taller than the smaller tire on an unweighted 
>> bike  
>>
>> I suspect the lower tire pressures would result in an even smaller 
>> difference when I ride  the bike.
>>
>>  
>>
>> In any event I have noticed little difference.
>>
>>  
>>
>> Am I missing something here?
>>
>>  
>>
>> Bernard
>>
>>  
>>
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CALuTfgvvFWkaR1h5YWtB9JveLtVjDHPkzShVy7%2BtQQg9CUNrFw%40mail.gmail.com
>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> 

[RBW] Eroica California

[Stephen Durfee]

Curious if anyone on this forum is also a Vintage enthusiast and has 
interest in the Eroica event that is run on the Central Coast of 
California. I've ridden it a few times on my PX-10... its a great ride, 
although the organization that runs the event has had its ups and downs 
over the years. Currently, the website lists September 22, 2024 as the run 
date, but the registration button leads to last year's sign-updoes 
anyone have any better intel? 

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[RBW] Re: [650B] Different tire size front and rear.?

[JSO]

What Sheldon has to say - a number of years ago, I wanted wider tires (35
or 38 at the time) on one of my bikes for a tour that involved some badly
paved roads. It turned out that the front clearance was fine, but not the
rear. So I looked up what Sheldon had to say and happily used a wider tire
on the front, noticing nothing.
Mixing/Matching Tires
Most bikes come with identical tires front and rear. This is all right for
general use, but if you want to optimize your bike, you should consider
using different tires front and rear. The front and rear tires have
different loadings and different requirements.

   - Narrower Front, Wider RearIf lightness is the primary goal, tire
   width/weight is limited by the risk of pinch cut flats
   , a.k.a. "snake bites.
   " Since there is more
   weight carried on the rear tire, you can get away with a slightly narrower
   tire in front than you can in back.
   - Wider Front, Narrower RearA wider front tire makes sense in many
   applications, however, when handling and ride comfort are considered. A
   wider tire will generally provide better cornering traction
    than a narrower one,
   assuming appropriate inflation pressure
   .

   A wider tire also provides superior shock absorbency. I personally
   prefer a slightly wider tire in front, since I suffer from some wrist
   discomfort on occasion.
   - Off-Road Issues

   Bicycles that are used some of the time on loose surfaces often benefit
   from a wider front tire, with a fairly aggressive tread
   , coupled with a somewhat
   narrower, smoother rear tire.

   The wide, knobby front tire will provide the all-important front-wheel
   traction. Front-wheel skidding almost always leads to a crash. For riding
   on soft surfaces, such as sand or mud, a wide front tire is essential. If
   the front tire sinks in and gets bogged down, you're stuck. If the front
   tire rolls through a soft patch OK, you can generally power the rear
   through to follow it.

   The narrower, smoother rear tire will have lower rolling resistance.
   Since most of the weight is carried by the rear tire, rolling resistance is
   more important on the rear than the front. If the rear tire slips, in most
   cases the worst that will happen is that you'll have to get off and walk.

   This is a great idea that developed out of BMX racing.

   Some mountain-bike tires come in matched sets, with different tread
   front/rear. The front tires tend to have the knobs set up more or less
   parallel to the direction of travel, for improved lateral grip and better
   steering control. The rears tend to have transverse knobs for
   driving/braking traction.

Joan O.
Arlington, VA



On Sat, Mar 30, 2024 at 4:54 PM Bernard Duhon 
wrote:

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Gang,
>
> In my quest for fitting the largest tires my frames will take, I have put
> a larger tire on the front 38 mm of my 700 C and 35mm  in the rear.
>
>
>
> On my 650 B conversion of a 700 C bike I have a 42 mm in the front and a
> 38 mm in the rear.
>
>
>
> The larger tire is 3.5 mm taller than the smaller tire on an unweighted
> bike
>
> I suspect the lower tire pressures would result in an even smaller
> difference when I ride  the bike.
>
>
>
> In any event I have noticed little difference.
>
>
>
> Am I missing something here?
>
>
>
> Bernard
>
>
>
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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> 
> .
>
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> 
> .
>

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[RBW] Rene Herse April Fool's Journal

[Bill Lindsay]

I always look forward to Rene Herse's April Fools Journal.  They always 
offer a new product with a very sincere parody of their own product 
descriptions describing why it's good.  This one was particularly 
convincing ( I thought)

https://www.renehersecycles.com/journal/

It was especially on-target in that the forthcoming Roaduno is largely 
going to be a 3x1, and could be achieved with no tensioner, if we employ 
the very fake-product that Rene Herse is describing.  It's brilliant!  

It's a shame that Rene Herse has comments disabled everywhere they post 
things.  I know it's because people are such jerks "in the comments", but 
it would have been really entertaining to see the comments section for this 
one.  

I might go make one of these bearing, chain-keepers.  

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA

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[RBW] Re: Clem Chainstay Ding Peer Review Request

[Chris Halasz]

Thanks all so much for your thoughtful and generous input! The consistent 
nature of the responses was welcomed. 

The frame is a keeper, and the seller is sending a refund. The seller 
offered for the frame and fork to be returned, but that would've incurred 
losses on all sides, including my return of the parts I was receiving from 
RBW for the build. 

Off to find some primer and paint today to cover the dings, and will be 
sure to post photos of that build once complete! 

 - Chris 

On Sunday, March 31, 2024 at 4:53:02 AM UTC-7 ascpgh wrote:

> Tough scenario...
>
> I agree with Patrick, it's a new to you item damaged from when you put 
> your money  into the bike you wanted but is now different of condition. A 
> detail that kicking in your buyer's foothold includes is the seller's 
> option to refund you and take it back. I'm thinking that may not be the 
> resolution that best suits your interest in this purchase.
>
> I agree with Josiah that this is essentially a cosmetic fault at this 
> time, it's close enough to a weld that there is plenty of metal in that 
> tube's wall thickness. Being at the low end of the frame, if it was mine, 
> I'd pick the flaked paint until I reached the margin of the firmly intact 
> and execute a DYI spot refinish/repaint to protect the bare metal and ride 
> on. 
>
> Once you mount the BB and your crank, the spot of that ding and the 
> degradation to the nice Clem you found will be difficult to see. This is on 
> par with chainsuck damage occurring to folks who subsequently had no issues 
> with for many miles and years of riding.  I think you could touch up the 
> fork crown ding with adequate fill and finish to make it easily get lost in 
> the enjoyment of the riding. 
>
> I'd land in the middle and ask the seller for a little perk for the fork 
> and stay damage, dress the paint nicks appropriately, build it up and ride. 
> I don't think anyone would consider my Rambouillet's patina-ed condition in 
> comparison, it would probably rank as salvage under the 20 years' 
> "beausage" as Grant defined. I think it's next level, what I think of as 
> beausavage. Nothing structural (broken rear dropout replaced with a new 
> pair and the  brake bridge re-brazed) but definitely aesthetically 
> detrimental, and I love it still.
>
> Andy Cheatham
> Pittsburgh
> On Friday, March 29, 2024 at 2:47:17 PM UTC-4 Chris Halasz wrote:
>
>> Received a used XL Clem frame, and the removed fork separated from its 
>> packaging, and nestled into the chainstay. 
>>
>> The ding is about a third of an inch long, a quarter inch wide, and 
>> 0.023" deep. 
>>
>> Curious to know whether others have experienced similar, and whether 
>> there's consensus for repair. 
>>
>> I'll refrain from biasing the jury. 
>>
>> The interface: 
>>
>> [image: Clem_Fork_Ding.jpeg]
>>
>> Closeup of the damage. 
>>
>> [image: Clem_Chainstay.jpeg]
>>
>> Thanks all! 
>>
>> Chris 
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Question about rear brake cable housing routing with low friction on a Clem

[Kim H.]

@John - 
Right on !

Kim Hetzel.

On Tuesday, April 2, 2024 at 5:49:23 AM UTC-7 JohnS wrote:

> +1 for Universal Cycles, they are my go to for Jagwire cables, SRAM chains 
> and other mundane parts that I use when rebuilding a bike. Also always 
> impressed with the creative use of brake cable noodles. As I recall someone 
> posted using one at the stem or some such.
>
> JohnS
>
>
> On Tuesday, April 2, 2024 at 8:35:53 AM UTC-4 Kim H. wrote:
>
>> @Allan -
>> I thank-you for sharing with me the details of how your 135 degree brake 
>> noodle fits onto your rear brake cable housing. I appreciate it very much. 
>> Thank-you for the noodle link, as well. Universal Cycles is relatively 
>> close to me out of Oregon.
>>
>> Kim Hetzel.
>>
>> On Tuesday, April 2, 2024 at 3:48:57 AM UTC-7 Allan McLane wrote:
>>
>>> Kim,
>>>
>>> The photo shows how Riv arranged the cable housing guide braze-on on 
>>> this bike, a Rosco Platypus. The entire housing slides through the braze-on 
>>> and the end of the housing slips into the entrance of the noodle. It isn’t 
>>> really necessary but I also slipped a short length of clear tubing around 
>>> the outside of noodle about midway along, just to hold it off the seat tube 
>>> paint.
>>>
>>> Here’s one source for that part:
>>> https://www.universalcycles.com/shopping/product_details.php?id=205
>>>
>>> Allan in SE Vt
>>>
>>>
>>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Question about rear brake cable housing routing with low friction on a Clem

[JohnS]

+1 for Universal Cycles, they are my go to for Jagwire cables, SRAM chains 
and other mundane parts that I use when rebuilding a bike. Also always 
impressed with the creative use of brake cable noodles. As I recall someone 
posted using one at the stem or some such.

JohnS


On Tuesday, April 2, 2024 at 8:35:53 AM UTC-4 Kim H. wrote:

> @Allan -
> I thank-you for sharing with me the details of how your 135 degree brake 
> noodle fits onto your rear brake cable housing. I appreciate it very much. 
> Thank-you for the noodle link, as well. Universal Cycles is relatively 
> close to me out of Oregon.
>
> Kim Hetzel.
>
> On Tuesday, April 2, 2024 at 3:48:57 AM UTC-7 Allan McLane wrote:
>
>> Kim,
>>
>> The photo shows how Riv arranged the cable housing guide braze-on on this 
>> bike, a Rosco Platypus. The entire housing slides through the braze-on and 
>> the end of the housing slips into the entrance of the noodle. It isn’t 
>> really necessary but I also slipped a short length of clear tubing around 
>> the outside of noodle about midway along, just to hold it off the seat tube 
>> paint.
>>
>> Here’s one source for that part:
>> https://www.universalcycles.com/shopping/product_details.php?id=205
>>
>> Allan in SE Vt
>>
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Question about rear brake cable housing routing with low friction on a Clem

[Kim H.]

@Allan -
I thank-you for sharing with me the details of how your 135 degree brake 
noodle fits onto your rear brake cable housing. I appreciate it very much. 
Thank-you for the noodle link, as well. Universal Cycles is relatively 
close to me out of Oregon.

Kim Hetzel.

On Tuesday, April 2, 2024 at 3:48:57 AM UTC-7 Allan McLane wrote:

> Kim,
>
> The photo shows how Riv arranged the cable housing guide braze-on on this 
> bike, a Rosco Platypus. The entire housing slides through the braze-on and 
> the end of the housing slips into the entrance of the noodle. It isn’t 
> really necessary but I also slipped a short length of clear tubing around 
> the outside of noodle about midway along, just to hold it off the seat tube 
> paint.
>
> Here’s one source for that part:
> https://www.universalcycles.com/shopping/product_details.php?id=205
>
> Allan in SE Vt
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Question about rear brake cable housing routing with low friction on a Clem

[Allan McLane]

Kim,

The photo shows how Riv arranged the cable housing guide braze-on on this 
bike, a Rosco Platypus. The entire housing slides through the braze-on and 
the end of the housing slips into the entrance of the noodle. It isn’t 
really necessary but I also slipped a short length of clear tubing around 
the outside of noodle about midway along, just to hold it off the seat tube 
paint.

Here’s one source for that part:
https://www.universalcycles.com/shopping/product_details.php?id=205

Allan in SE Vt


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[RBW] Re: Silver shifters, v1 vs. v2

[John Johnson]

I will share a personal anecdote about my V1 shifters. I disassembled them 
to switch from being bar-end back to being down tube shifters. When I put 
them on the downtube, one of them kept slipping and wouldn't hold no matter 
how hard I tightened the bolt (and I broke a few plastic washers). After a 
day or two, I opened it up and realized I'd put the sprocket in backwards 
(so yeah, duh, it definitely wouldn't hold). I'm sure that's not your 
case...

The newer replacement washers did work better for me (but they still crack 
over time). The brass replacement washers is what I have now, and they work 
well. 

cheers,

John (near Fontainebleau)



On Tuesday, April 2, 2024 at 3:52:05 AM UTC+2 Jay wrote:

> I'm sure that is frustrating!  I feel for you.  I don't like when anything 
> mechanical is not functioning up to par.
>
> I only have experience with Dia-Compe Ene 11s.  They slipped once on me, 
> without realizing what was happening.  I got home, googled it, figured it 
> out and only had to tighten the 'd' ring and that has so far solved the 
> problem.  I bought loc-tite but haven't used it.
>
> Good luck!
>
> On Monday, April 1, 2024 at 11:13:13 AM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:
>
>> Ian,
>> I had slippage with Silver v2 set up on my Clem. I used Loctite and it 
>> solved the issue for awhile then they slipped again. After switching to 
>> Microshift I not longer had any slippage. I am not an experienced bike 
>> mechanic so my installation may have been off with the Silvers but the 
>> Microshift worked for me.
>> Doug
>>
>> On Saturday, March 30, 2024 at 9:37:26 AM UTC-4 ian m wrote:
>>
>>> I have completely disassembled and reassembled more than a couple times, 
>>> both intentionally and un. I have run my set on both the downtube and 
>>> bar-ends on more than one bike, and my wife has a set on the bar-ends of 
>>> her Hillborne. We have broken so many plastic washers trying to keep them 
>>> from slipping that I have multiple back-up bags.
>>>
>>> On checking the Riv product page now it looks like the complete shifters 
>>> come with a "new and improved" plastic washer that isn't available 
>>> separately. Can anyone speak to an improved user experience? I have the 
>>> older L/R version rather than the newer X/O version also.
>>>
>>> I do think these shift fantastically and are in every way superior to 
>>> the Sunrace shifters I used previously, it's only the slippage that grinds 
>>> my gears.
>>>
>>> On Friday, March 29, 2024 at 11:09:11 PM UTC-4 Pam Bikes wrote:
>>>
 I'm not sure if I have the v1 or v2 but probably the v1 and earlier but 
 I've never had slippage.  You do have to line up the square piece when 
 installing them and get the plastic washer lined up too but after that 
 it's 
 tight enough to hold.  The exploded view that Eric Marth will help show 
 you 
 the critical points of contact to line up.  I do know the plastic washers 
 break after a while but that's usually when the bike falls and the shifter 
 takes most of the force of the fall.

 On Friday, March 29, 2024 at 6:56:26 PM UTC-4 ian m wrote:

> I love the look of the Silver1 shifters. IMO they are the platonic 
> ideal whether on downtube or bar-end. Yet I find in my experience the 
> performance refuses to meet the aesthetic quality. Try as I may I can't 
> get 
> the shifter to stay put. Loctite or beeswax, slippage, then 
> over-tightening. There's still no better option than the plastic washer? 
> Hoped the brass bit over the plastic would protect it, no such luck they 
> always crack. I'm tired of trying to make these work. 
>
> Do the newer Silver2 shifters improve in performance where they've... 
> let's just say changed in aesthetics? It reads as though they have the 
> same 
> internals which I would assume is the issue. While they do have a look 
> that 
> maybe only a mother could love I'm willing to give them a shot if it's a 
> noticeable difference.
>
> I am index curious but not sure I'd want to pay the Dura-Ace bar-end 
> price rather than making the all-out switch to brifters. Any thoughts or 
> advice welcome.
>


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