Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements
I'm only looking to recoup what I have invested in them... $50 for the pair. At the moment, I have lots of spares, but sure, I'll take another set. If you do Paypal, you can pay me at ka3...@aol.com. George, KA3HSW From: Jeff Lavoie - KB1SPH/WQEX694 kb1...@wqex694.info To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 10:17:12 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements Actually 462.600 is the frequency I'm currently running my Kenwood on. I would probably be putting the Motorola on the same frequency with a different PL at a different location. That would solve a lot of headaches if you're willing to part with them. I was thinking about doing ham later down the road if GMRS goes away, I'm sure you've all heard about the proposed rule changes. But until I hear that GMRS repeaters are not allowed (or must be narrow band) I'll be setting it up on GMRS. The Kenwood is more set up for a portable repeater for events right now. A group of us get together and help out with events when there aren't enough ham volunteers. Let me know what you want for the channel elements. If you're interested I would be willing to send you a set of channel elements back if you need them as spares. Jeff, KB1SPH / WQEX694 -- From: George Henry ka3...@att.net Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 1:59 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements What frequencies are you looking for? Ham or GMRS, I presume... I've got a bunch of MSR-2K elements if you need any, including a set for a 462.600 GMRS repeater. George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413 From: Jeff Lavoie - KB1SPH/WQEX694 kb1...@wqex694.info To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 1:15:28 AM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements (and a guacamole recipe) Thanks Skipp, that helps a great deal. I've found a lot of usefule information on repeater-builder.com over the years, but I just finally signed up for the yahoo group yesterday, I don't know why I waited. Bomar sounds like a good place to start with. I got this MSR-2000 for $25 at a hamfest because the guy didn't want to load it up in his truck to take it back home. I was buying a Kenwood TKR-820 and he said, I'll tell you what, I'll give you the pair for $50. How could I go wrong? The Kenwood is working great thanks to repeater-builder.com. On another note, I sent you a message a few days ago, but sometimes yahoo blocks my messagesnot sure why. I was wondering if you had any information about a CSI-32 tone panel and possible firmware upgrades. The EPROM inside has a sticker on it that says the following. 128 v4.0 6289 (I think, hard to read) © CSI - Jeff
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements
George, sent the money. It will come from a different e-mail address, but it will have my name. Jeff, KB1SPH / WQEX694 -- From: George Henry ka3...@att.net Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 1:49 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements I'm only looking to recoup what I have invested in them... $50 for the pair. At the moment, I have lots of spares, but sure, I'll take another set. If you do Paypal, you can pay me at ka3...@aol.com. George, KA3HSW From: Jeff Lavoie - KB1SPH/WQEX694 kb1...@wqex694.info To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 10:17:12 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements Actually 462.600 is the frequency I'm currently running my Kenwood on. I would probably be putting the Motorola on the same frequency with a different PL at a different location. That would solve a lot of headaches if you're willing to part with them. I was thinking about doing ham later down the road if GMRS goes away, I'm sure you've all heard about the proposed rule changes. But until I hear that GMRS repeaters are not allowed (or must be narrow band) I'll be setting it up on GMRS. The Kenwood is more set up for a portable repeater for events right now. A group of us get together and help out with events when there aren't enough ham volunteers. Let me know what you want for the channel elements. If you're interested I would be willing to send you a set of channel elements back if you need them as spares. Jeff, KB1SPH / WQEX694 -- From: George Henry ka3...@att.net Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 1:59 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements What frequencies are you looking for? Ham or GMRS, I presume... I've got a bunch of MSR-2K elements if you need any, including a set for a 462.600 GMRS repeater. George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413 From: Jeff Lavoie - KB1SPH/WQEX694 kb1...@wqex694.info To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 1:15:28 AM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements (and a guacamole recipe) Thanks Skipp, that helps a great deal. I've found a lot of usefule information on repeater-builder.com over the years, but I just finally signed up for the yahoo group yesterday, I don't know why I waited. Bomar sounds like a good place to start with. I got this MSR-2000 for $25 at a hamfest because the guy didn't want to load it up in his truck to take it back home. I was buying a Kenwood TKR-820 and he said, I'll tell you what, I'll give you the pair for $50. How could I go wrong? The Kenwood is working great thanks to repeater-builder.com. On another note, I sent you a message a few days ago, but sometimes yahoo blocks my messagesnot sure why. I was wondering if you had any information about a CSI-32 tone panel and possible firmware upgrades. The EPROM inside has a sticker on it that says the following. 128 v4.0 6289 (I think, hard to read) © CSI - Jeff Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements
Great! I'll dig them out first thing tomorrow get them shipped out no later than Thursday. George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413 - Original Message - From: Jeff Lavoie - KB1SPH/WQEX694 kb1...@wqex694.info To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 10:24 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements George, sent the money. It will come from a different e-mail address, but it will have my name. Jeff, KB1SPH / WQEX694 -- From: George Henry ka3...@att.net Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 1:49 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements I'm only looking to recoup what I have invested in them... $50 for the pair. At the moment, I have lots of spares, but sure, I'll take another set. If you do Paypal, you can pay me at ka3...@aol.com. George, KA3HSW From: Jeff Lavoie - KB1SPH/WQEX694 kb1...@wqex694.info To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 10:17:12 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements Actually 462.600 is the frequency I'm currently running my Kenwood on. I would probably be putting the Motorola on the same frequency with a different PL at a different location. That would solve a lot of headaches if you're willing to part with them. I was thinking about doing ham later down the road if GMRS goes away, I'm sure you've all heard about the proposed rule changes. But until I hear that GMRS repeaters are not allowed (or must be narrow band) I'll be setting it up on GMRS. The Kenwood is more set up for a portable repeater for events right now. A group of us get together and help out with events when there aren't enough ham volunteers. Let me know what you want for the channel elements. If you're interested I would be willing to send you a set of channel elements back if you need them as spares. Jeff, KB1SPH / WQEX694 -- From: George Henry ka3...@att.net Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 1:59 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements What frequencies are you looking for? Ham or GMRS, I presume... I've got a bunch of MSR-2K elements if you need any, including a set for a 462.600 GMRS repeater. George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413 From: Jeff Lavoie - KB1SPH/WQEX694 kb1...@wqex694.info To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 1:15:28 AM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements (and a guacamole recipe) Thanks Skipp, that helps a great deal. I've found a lot of usefule information on repeater-builder.com over the years, but I just finally signed up for the yahoo group yesterday, I don't know why I waited. Bomar sounds like a good place to start with. I got this MSR-2000 for $25 at a hamfest because the guy didn't want to load it up in his truck to take it back home. I was buying a Kenwood TKR-820 and he said, I'll tell you what, I'll give you the pair for $50. How could I go wrong? The Kenwood is working great thanks to repeater-builder.com. On another note, I sent you a message a few days ago, but sometimes yahoo blocks my messagesnot sure why. I was wondering if you had any information about a CSI-32 tone panel and possible firmware upgrades. The EPROM inside has a sticker on it that says the following. 128 v4.0 6289 (I think, hard to read) © CSI - Jeff Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements (and a guacamole recipe)
Thanks Skipp, that helps a great deal. I've found a lot of usefule information on repeater-builder.com over the years, but I just finally signed up for the yahoo group yesterday, I don't know why I waited. Bomar sounds like a good place to start with. I got this MSR-2000 for $25 at a hamfest because the guy didn't want to load it up in his truck to take it back home. I was buying a Kenwood TKR-820 and he said, I'll tell you what, I'll give you the pair for $50. How could I go wrong? The Kenwood is working great thanks to repeater-builder.com. On another note, I sent you a message a few days ago, but sometimes yahoo blocks my messagesnot sure why. I was wondering if you had any information about a CSI-32 tone panel and possible firmware upgrades. The EPROM inside has a sticker on it that says the following. 128 v4.0 6289 (I think, hard to read) © CSI - Jeff -- From: skipp025 skipp...@yahoo.com Sent: Sunday, July 11, 2010 10:52 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements (and a guacamole recipe) Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements Path_Finder.Geo kb1...@... wrote: Hi everyone, I am going to post this message here because batlabs didn't approve my post. Apparently it's too harsh to tell people, PLEASE DO NOT TELL ME TO HAVE SOMEONE ELSE DO IT. Hi Jeff, Apparently you do not play the BatLabs Game very well? I'm sure you'll survive with the ever so perky bunch over here. I am looking for information on how exactly to re-tune a channel element for a MSR repeater. I've seen instructions as far as what to adjust on the element itself, but what I really need to know is; what equipment is required, how to hook that equipment up to the channel element, and what to look for while adjusting the channel element. The transmit channel element is best adjusted for frequency center by using a Communications Service Monitor setup to sample (off the on-air signal) read the main carrier channel/frequency. The simple way to set the IDC Control/Pot is to set the Transmit CTCSS (PL) Tone deviation to about 750Hz. In a stock MSR-2000 the repeat audio level is then set using the level pot on the Squelch Gate Module. If you don't have access to a Service Monitor, a decent Frequency Counter will at least let you net (adjust) the frequency to F-center (on the desired frequency). If you move the transmitter more than say... 500 kHz from its last alignment location, you should repeat the Service Manual Alignment steps on or near the new frequency. The Receiver is a different animal. Take the Receiver frequency and add and/or subtract the receiver IF frequency (most often 10.7 or 10.8 MHz for the VHF Receiver). The formula you use depends on your receivers IF Frequency and Injection Chain, which translates to which side of the IF the multiplied crystal frequency ends up on. In your example it's probably F-frequency minus the IF Frequency equals the multiplied Channel Element injection frequency, which is what you want to set/align. Put a X1 Scope/Text Probe on your Service Monitor (or Frequency Counter) Antenna (Low Level RF) Input and place it down onto/near the receiver circuit board. You can also use a decent quality frequency counter if you're more careful. At some location on or near the board you will be able to monitor and measure the output of the RX Channel Element Frequency, then set it for the expected Injection Frequency. As an example: A receive frequency of 151.625 MHz minus a 10.7 IF frequency equals 140.925 MHz. Sniff around the receiver board until you observe a signal in that area, then net (adjust) the channel element frequency to the expected 140.925 F-center location. If you can't find the expected frequency you might run the numbers for a 10.8 IF Frequency and sniff around 140.825 for the channel element injection frequency. In both the above examples, a X1 (times-1) Scope Probe or something similar is handy to use. If you can't get/find a signal, make a short antenna probe by clipping a small length of insulated regular wire onto the end of the probe. The end of the wire held by the Scope Probe jaws should obviously be stripped bare. Try not to allow the sampling wire and/or probe to directly contact/short any of the exposed metal parts on the receiver board. Now I realize that I need a new crystal as well, and I realize it can all be done professionally with temperature compensation. Yeah but in many cases professional is a lot more expensive than it really has to be. But what I want to know is how I can do it myself just to get started and make sure everything is going to work the way I want before I pay out big bucks to have it all done the right way. I have an extra set of channel elements, so playing around with one set isn't going to affect having the other set done professionally if I
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements
What frequencies are you looking for? Ham or GMRS, I presume... I've got a bunch of MSR-2K elements if you need any, including a set for a 462.600 GMRS repeater. George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413 From: Jeff Lavoie - KB1SPH/WQEX694 kb1...@wqex694.info To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 1:15:28 AM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements (and a guacamole recipe) Thanks Skipp, that helps a great deal. I've found a lot of usefule information on repeater-builder.com over the years, but I just finally signed up for the yahoo group yesterday, I don't know why I waited. Bomar sounds like a good place to start with. I got this MSR-2000 for $25 at a hamfest because the guy didn't want to load it up in his truck to take it back home. I was buying a Kenwood TKR-820 and he said, I'll tell you what, I'll give you the pair for $50. How could I go wrong? The Kenwood is working great thanks to repeater-builder.com. On another note, I sent you a message a few days ago, but sometimes yahoo blocks my messagesnot sure why. I was wondering if you had any information about a CSI-32 tone panel and possible firmware upgrades. The EPROM inside has a sticker on it that says the following. 128 v4.0 6289 (I think, hard to read) © CSI - Jeff
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements
Actually 462.600 is the frequency I'm currently running my Kenwood on. I would probably be putting the Motorola on the same frequency with a different PL at a different location. That would solve a lot of headaches if you're willing to part with them. I was thinking about doing ham later down the road if GMRS goes away, I'm sure you've all heard about the proposed rule changes. But until I hear that GMRS repeaters are not allowed (or must be narrow band) I'll be setting it up on GMRS. The Kenwood is more set up for a portable repeater for events right now. A group of us get together and help out with events when there aren't enough ham volunteers. Let me know what you want for the channel elements. If you're interested I would be willing to send you a set of channel elements back if you need them as spares. Jeff, KB1SPH / WQEX694 -- From: George Henry ka3...@att.net Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 1:59 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements What frequencies are you looking for? Ham or GMRS, I presume... I've got a bunch of MSR-2K elements if you need any, including a set for a 462.600 GMRS repeater. George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413 From: Jeff Lavoie - KB1SPH/WQEX694 kb1...@wqex694.info To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 1:15:28 AM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements (and a guacamole recipe) Thanks Skipp, that helps a great deal. I've found a lot of usefule information on repeater-builder.com over the years, but I just finally signed up for the yahoo group yesterday, I don't know why I waited. Bomar sounds like a good place to start with. I got this MSR-2000 for $25 at a hamfest because the guy didn't want to load it up in his truck to take it back home. I was buying a Kenwood TKR-820 and he said, I'll tell you what, I'll give you the pair for $50. How could I go wrong? The Kenwood is working great thanks to repeater-builder.com. On another note, I sent you a message a few days ago, but sometimes yahoo blocks my messagesnot sure why. I was wondering if you had any information about a CSI-32 tone panel and possible firmware upgrades. The EPROM inside has a sticker on it that says the following. 128 v4.0 6289 (I think, hard to read) © CSI - Jeff Yahoo! Groups Links
[Repeater-Builder] Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements (and a guacamole recipe)
Recrystal MSR-2000 Channel Elements Path_Finder.Geo kb1...@... wrote: Hi everyone, I am going to post this message here because batlabs didn't approve my post. Apparently it's too harsh to tell people, PLEASE DO NOT TELL ME TO HAVE SOMEONE ELSE DO IT. Hi Jeff, Apparently you do not play the BatLabs Game very well? I'm sure you'll survive with the ever so perky bunch over here. I am looking for information on how exactly to re-tune a channel element for a MSR repeater. I've seen instructions as far as what to adjust on the element itself, but what I really need to know is; what equipment is required, how to hook that equipment up to the channel element, and what to look for while adjusting the channel element. The transmit channel element is best adjusted for frequency center by using a Communications Service Monitor setup to sample (off the on-air signal) read the main carrier channel/frequency. The simple way to set the IDC Control/Pot is to set the Transmit CTCSS (PL) Tone deviation to about 750Hz. In a stock MSR-2000 the repeat audio level is then set using the level pot on the Squelch Gate Module. If you don't have access to a Service Monitor, a decent Frequency Counter will at least let you net (adjust) the frequency to F-center (on the desired frequency). If you move the transmitter more than say... 500 kHz from its last alignment location, you should repeat the Service Manual Alignment steps on or near the new frequency. The Receiver is a different animal. Take the Receiver frequency and add and/or subtract the receiver IF frequency (most often 10.7 or 10.8 MHz for the VHF Receiver). The formula you use depends on your receivers IF Frequency and Injection Chain, which translates to which side of the IF the multiplied crystal frequency ends up on. In your example it's probably F-frequency minus the IF Frequency equals the multiplied Channel Element injection frequency, which is what you want to set/align. Put a X1 Scope/Text Probe on your Service Monitor (or Frequency Counter) Antenna (Low Level RF) Input and place it down onto/near the receiver circuit board. You can also use a decent quality frequency counter if you're more careful. At some location on or near the board you will be able to monitor and measure the output of the RX Channel Element Frequency, then set it for the expected Injection Frequency. As an example: A receive frequency of 151.625 MHz minus a 10.7 IF frequency equals 140.925 MHz. Sniff around the receiver board until you observe a signal in that area, then net (adjust) the channel element frequency to the expected 140.925 F-center location. If you can't find the expected frequency you might run the numbers for a 10.8 IF Frequency and sniff around 140.825 for the channel element injection frequency. In both the above examples, a X1 (times-1) Scope Probe or something similar is handy to use. If you can't get/find a signal, make a short antenna probe by clipping a small length of insulated regular wire onto the end of the probe. The end of the wire held by the Scope Probe jaws should obviously be stripped bare. Try not to allow the sampling wire and/or probe to directly contact/short any of the exposed metal parts on the receiver board. Now I realize that I need a new crystal as well, and I realize it can all be done professionally with temperature compensation. Yeah but in many cases professional is a lot more expensive than it really has to be. But what I want to know is how I can do it myself just to get started and make sure everything is going to work the way I want before I pay out big bucks to have it all done the right way. I have an extra set of channel elements, so playing around with one set isn't going to affect having the other set done professionally if I mess something up. For me there are two regular places to order crystals. The first is International Crystal Manufacturing, always high quality but you will find the pricing a bit steep for any casual crystal/channel element work. The second location for me is Bomar, where I pretty much buy all my channel element crystals. Their quality, pricing and wait time is in my opinion more than fair. Their only down side (to me) is their $50 min order amount. So you might need to order a few extra crystals to make an order amount. Not a problem if you think ahead or pal-up with someone else to place an order. I call Bomar with a Visa Card in the other hand, tell them I want Crystals for Mitrek/MSR-2000 Channel Elements KXN-1086 and KXN-1088 types. There are other MSR Channel Element numbers you can use, but the above model numbers are the most popular and should be interchangeable with anything you might have. At a price of about $15/$20 per crystal (last time I had some cut) I order at least 4 crystals to make the min order amount. Wait the normal time (they do have rush service for more $$)
