Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Hendrik Visage wrote: > > On 16 Aug 2019, at 23:29 , Stefan Claas wrote: > > Please explain in 2019 to you friends, wishing to learn secure email > > communications, that they should use PGP, while everybody can sign > > their pub key with arbritary (and illegal) data, thanks to SKS. > > The

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Ryan Hunt wrote: > Its quite simple really, you sign a revocation of the key and create a new > one, just like you'd do if you ever suspected your private key had been > compromised. Excuse me, I can't follow you (maybe a language barrier from my side). If something nasty or bad sticks on my

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> On 16 Aug 2019, at 23:29 , Stefan Claas wrote: > > Hendrik Visage wrote: > >> SKS network contains *PUBLIC* keys. It’s purpose, is to PUBLICLY make your >> communications, signed/etc. with the associated *private* key, by directed to >> you and associated with you to proof that it was *you*

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Its quite simple really, you sign a revocation of the key and create a new one, just like you'd do if you ever suspected your private key had been compromised. -R On Fri, Aug 16, 2019 at 3:29 PM Stefan Claas wrote: > Hendrik Visage wrote: > > > SKS network contains *PUBLIC* keys. It’s purpose,

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Hendrik Visage wrote: > SKS network contains *PUBLIC* keys. It’s purpose, is to PUBLICLY make your > communications, signed/etc. with the associated *private* key, by directed to > you and associated with you to proof that it was *you* that > signed/produced/etc. that piece of communication. That

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> On 16 Aug 2019, at 22:45 , Stefan Claas wrote: > > O.k. I understand your point, but what I like to say is that I or anybody > else can download a dump without running a key server. While running a > key server requires a dump, it would be really nice if dumps are only > available to a

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Andrew Gallagher wrote: > > > On 16 Aug 2019, at 20:31, Stefan Claas wrote: > > > > You guys need a lot of brainstorming IMHO on how to improve the SKS > > infrastructure to get back users. > > I dunno, I’ve been brainstorming pretty hard on this list recently... :-p > > > Maybe it would be

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Andrew Gallagher wrote: > > > On 16 Aug 2019, at 19:48, Stefan Claas wrote: > > > > People, like me, do not > > like the idea of sharing dumps to 3rd parties (hello GDPR), without our > > consent. > > There is no net difference between distributing a dump and peering with > another sks

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> On 16 Aug 2019, at 20:31, Stefan Claas wrote: > > You guys need a lot of brainstorming IMHO on how to improve the SKS > infrastructure to get back users. I dunno, I’ve been brainstorming pretty hard on this list recently... :-p > Maybe it would be a good idea to > get the hockeypuck author

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> On 16 Aug 2019, at 19:48, Stefan Claas wrote: > > People, like me, do not > like the idea of sharing dumps to 3rd parties (hello GDPR), without our > consent. There is no net difference between distributing a dump and peering with another sks server. I don’t understand why you keep going on

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

st...@yakamo.org wrote: > I was not aware of mailvelopes keyserver, looks good! Indeed! I just did a quick test and compared to Hagrid my CA sig3 from Governikus is not stripped off. :-) Regards Stefan -- box: 4a64758de9e8ceded2c481ee526440687fe2f3a828e3a813f87753ad30847b56 GPG:

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

I was not aware of mailvelopes keyserver, looks good! Yakamo On Fri, 16 Aug 2019 21:31:55 +0200 Stefan Claas wrote: > Todd Fleisher wrote: > > > I will also point out there is a movement amongst several major software > > distributions that bring PGP support to the masses (especially as it

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> Hansen its 2019 not 1990 and you need to evolve your thinking beyond your own > personal interests! Yawn. Call me when you've given up on the ad hominem. > Do you think the GDPR is a bad thing? I think it's a law enacted by a nation I'm not party to and am not obligated to obey. That means

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Todd Fleisher wrote: > I will also point out there is a movement amongst several major software > distributions that bring PGP support to the masses (especially as it relates > to email) that are migrating away from the SKS network in large part because > of this very issue

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Stefan Claas wrote: > Dumps can be used for a variety of tasks. I remember rjh once saying that > people asked him if they can trust the key servers. Does this trust mean: > Can a key been removed or faked, or a dump been used for analyzing social > graphs of non-trained dissidents, activists

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Todd Fleisher wrote: > > On Aug 16, 2019, at 10:24 AM, Stefan Claas wrote: > > > > DevPGSV Pablo wrote: > > > > O.k. I must admit I did not thought about the centralization issue, > > people might have. > > > > Well, then operators could put that on a link of their own WWW key > > server

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> On Aug 16, 2019, at 10:42 AM, Ryan Hunt wrote: > > Its role as a decentralized, tamper resistant key storage solution is still > vital, and I would love it if we had the development going on to address the > stability issues, but thats simply not the case at this point in time and > until

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

I guess we will have to agree to disagree, i dont think we will get any further with this. I fully support the GDPR as do alot of people in the EU. You have made it clear where you stand as i have. Still not sure what Austraila has to do with the EU and the GDPR though? But i do know that the

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> On Aug 16, 2019, at 10:24 AM, Stefan Claas wrote: > > DevPGSV Pablo wrote: > > O.k. I must admit I did not thought about the centralization issue, > people might have. > > Well, then operators could put that on a link of their own WWW key > server interface and Kristian could add only a

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

SKS is still resilient to anyone wiping out all references to my public key and replacing with their own for a man in the middle attack, you can go check multiple servers and compare keys against each other.. I can check keys in my local keystore or transmitted via other means against whats in

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

DevPGSV Pablo wrote: > Please, if you consider the canary... > Don't centralize it. > SKS is supposed to be decentralized. > If the power to ban someone from the public pool or from peers, or > somewhere else, falls on a single person, then you are centralizing an > important part of SKS. > SKS

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> On Aug 16, 2019, at 10:19 AM, Kiss Gabor (Bitman) wrote: > >> So to answer your questions: > > Ryan, have you ever seen this funny picture? :) > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:DoNotFeedTroll.svg > > Gabor +1 to this sentiment If some really want to continue to debate particulars of the

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> So to answer your questions: Ryan, have you ever seen this funny picture? :) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:DoNotFeedTroll.svg Gabor ___ Sks-devel mailing list Sks-devel@nongnu.org https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/sks-devel

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Please, if you consider the canary... Don't centralize it. SKS is supposed to be decentralized. If the power to ban someone from the public pool or from peers, or somewhere else, falls on a single person, then you are centralizing an important part of SKS. SKS is already broken due to the

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

On 16/08/2019 17:23, Stefan Claas wrote: > They should not vouch for others only sign a monthly statement, which > Kristian can add to a column in his pool site. And like I said it > would *not* hurt! If however more key server operators are against > this suggestion then IMHO at least people

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Hendrik Visage wrote: > > > > On 16 Aug 2019, at 18:01 , Andrew Gallagher wrote: > > > > Signed PGP part > > On 16/08/2019 16:13, Stefan Claas wrote: > >> It should tell users that SKS operators share no dumps with 3rd > >> parties for key analysis, i.e. social graph research etc. Those > >>

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Andrew Gallagher wrote: > On 16/08/2019 16:13, Stefan Claas wrote: > > It should tell users that SKS operators share no dumps with 3rd > > parties for key analysis, i.e. social graph research etc. Those > > who publish a warrant canary can stay in the pool, while others > > who don't like to do

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

On Fri, 16 Aug 2019 09:12:30 -0600 Ryan Hunt wrote: > Yakamo, > it still does its job of ensuring published keys are not tampered with, it > was not designed to be resilient to denial attacks.. That does not > interfere with the trust of PGP, its why there are local keystores.. and > the SKS

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> On 16 Aug 2019, at 18:01 , Andrew Gallagher wrote: > > Signed PGP part > On 16/08/2019 16:13, Stefan Claas wrote: >> It should tell users that SKS operators share no dumps with 3rd >> parties for key analysis, i.e. social graph research etc. Those >> who publish a warrant canary can stay in

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

st...@yakamo.org wrote: > Once again pointing out the obvious that everyone is avoiding. > > The keyservers don't have any mechanisms as required by the GDPR to remove > data. > > So once again if you load up someone else's personal data with out permission > the servers instantly break the law

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Once again pointing out the obvious that everyone is avoiding. The keyservers don't have any mechanisms as required by the GDPR to remove data. So once again if you load up someone else's personal data with out permission the servers instantly break the law due to the lack of those mechanisms.

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Steffen Kaiser wrote: > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- > Hash: SHA1 > > On Thu, 15 Aug 2019, Stefan Claas wrote: > > > And has Mr. Rude then the right to freely distribute this data, without > > "this data" => SKS stores private data, which are public by design and in > consens with the

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Thu, 15 Aug 2019, Stefan Claas wrote: And has Mr. Rude then the right to freely distribute this data, without "this data" => SKS stores private data, which are public by design and in consens with the uploader, Art5 (1) a) and b) Those dumps

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Mostly this is a response to Arnold, as for some reason his email never showed up in my inbox: > I thought SKS and PGP-keys is about one's ability to hide private > data (by encryption). Tools do not have intrinsic purposes. There's the stuff they're designed for and there's the stuff they

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

One could argue the inverse, to me its very strange that administrators of a scheme designed from the onset to be resilient to governmental scale interference would widely open their arms to multinational scale interference. Its about pretty good privacy, not perfect privacy.. by design w/PGP and

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

I thought SKS and PGP-keys is about one's ability to hide private data (by encryption). GDPR is also about one's ability to hide private data (by having private data, that can be used in correlations, removed from large databases). Yet, SKS administrators who apparently live outside the EU argue

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> Well, it was just one of many example sites... Again: I'm going to go with the real advice given to me by real lawyers. > So as an example, US SKS key server operators do not have to honor > removal request (in this case shut-down the server) from EU citizens, > when they receive a letter from

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Robert J. Hansen wrote: > I'm going to believe the privacy lawyer I pay $450 an hour to more than > I'm going to trust a sketchy website that's not even officially > affiliated with the EU. Well, it was just one of many example sites, when one is googling for "has the US comply to the GDPR". If

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> Please have a read: Did. I'm going to believe the privacy lawyer I pay $450 an hour to more than I'm going to trust a sketchy website that's not even officially affiliated with the EU. Quoting from it: "You may be wondering how the European Union will enforce a law in territory it does not

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

I guess I'm pointing out the obvious to most readers, but despite that official-looking domain name, "This is not an official EU Commission or Government resource. The europa.eu webpage concerning GDPR can be found here [link removed]. Nothing found in this portal constitutes legal advice." On Aug

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> On 15 Aug 2019, at 00:29 , Stefan Claas wrote: > > https://gdpr.eu/compliance-checklist-us-companies/ > Interesting wordings, ie. The law also includes the threat of large fines for non-compliance, which can reach 4% of global revenue

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Robert J. Hansen wrote: > Enforcement is the sine qua non of law. GDPR does not apply to purely > US-based operators because there is no way for the EU to either compel > our compliance or punish our noncompliance. Please have a read: https://gdpr.eu/compliance-checklist-us-companies/ If this

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> Fair enough. Then you're ignoring the consequences (or rather believe > that none exist) rather than saying that the GDPR wouldn't apply to US- > based operators. Enforcement is the sine qua non of law. GDPR does not apply to purely US-based operators because there is no way for the EU to

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Hi, On Tue, 2019-08-13 at 11:59 -0400, Robert J. Hansen wrote: > If I, as a US citizen with no > overseas business ties, receive a GDPR notice, I'm going to laugh and > throw it away as it's not binding within the US. The EU can't even > haul me into court over it. Fair enough. Then you're

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

I don't believe anything you do in public has any expectation of privacy.. no moral qualms about it. On Tue, Aug 13, 2019 at 10:09 AM Philihp Busby wrote: > You should respect their right to privacy, if not for legal ones, then > moral. > > On Tue, Aug 13, 2019 at 16:04 Ryan Hunt wrote: > >>

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

You should respect their right to privacy, if not for legal ones, then moral. On Tue, Aug 13, 2019 at 16:04 Ryan Hunt wrote: > EU Can write whatever it wants down on a piece of paper, but that dont > mean its anything more than a piece of paper to me... they have no > authority here, I don't

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

EU Can write whatever it wants down on a piece of paper, but that dont mean its anything more than a piece of paper to me... they have no authority here, I don't recognize their authority and there is absolutely nothing that they can do about it.. So it dont really matter if they say its

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

>> There are (or at least were) a large number of US-based keyserver >> operators who were immune to the GDPR. > > I fail to see how this is in accordance with the GDPR. The EU is free to claim whatever authority it wants, but until it can enforce that authority it's bluster. If I, as a US

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Hi, On Tue, 2019-08-13 at 11:00 -0400, Robert J. Hansen wrote: > > They are! > > No, they're not. I think your assessment is wrong. > > There are (or at least were) a large number of US-based keyserver > operators who were immune to the GDPR. I fail to see how this is in accordance with the

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

None of that is correct. The GDPR does not only apply to business entities, it does not only apply to trade, it does not only apply to EU citizens and it does not only apply in EU member nations. For a short introduction, look at this article:

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> They are! No, they're not. GDPR only applies to business entities that trade with EU citizens in EU member nations. If a German boards a flight in Colorado to travel to Texas, they don't get to claim GDPR protections on their tickets. It's once the flight connects to an EU member state the

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Yakamo, Hmmm… please define/explain how servers hosted in the Republic of South Africa is subjected to GDPR? (We have our own/similar version, but NOT GDPR) > On 13 Aug 2019, at 15:59 , st...@yakamo.org wrote: > > They are! > > Yakamo > > On Tue, 13 Aug 2019 08:57:37 -0500 > Travis Megee

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

They are! Yakamo On Tue, 13 Aug 2019 08:57:37 -0500 Travis Megee wrote: > You're also assuming all admins are subject to GDPR. > > Travis > > On 8/13/2019 8:56 AM, st...@yakamo.org wrote: > > Also would like to point out that this is Kristian covering his own ass not > > the admins! > > > >

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

You're also assuming all admins are subject to GDPR. Travis On 8/13/2019 8:56 AM, st...@yakamo.org wrote: > Also would like to point out that this is Kristian covering his own ass not > the admins! > > Please read it again! > > Yakamo > > > On Tue, 13 Aug 2019 15:46:39 +0200 > Tobias Frei

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Also would like to point out that this is Kristian covering his own ass not the admins! Please read it again! Yakamo On Tue, 13 Aug 2019 15:46:39 +0200 Tobias Frei wrote: > Hi Yakamo, > > Have you already seen these two messages? > >

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Yes i have, and the important key part here is that it was sent to the wrong individual to handle it. So it was dismissed, its important to take note of that. Kristian has made the error in assuming this covers the admins, it does not! That person needs to reapply and make sure they are

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Hi Yakamo, Have you already seen these two messages? https://lists.nongnu.org/archive/html/sks-devel/2019-02/msg00070.html https://lists.nongnu.org/archive/html/sks-devel/2019-03/msg00026.html Best regards Tobias Frei Am 13.08.19 um 15:41 schrieb st...@yakamo.org: Hi Boti, SKS servers are

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Hi Boti, SKS servers are breaking the GDPR in multiple ways, its just a matter of time before something happens. All it would take is one motivated person and things get serious real quick. Especially i would say right now for the admin of mattrude or any others allowing the free distribution

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

In many country of EU there were a period of patience to let firms fully covers their GDPR implementation. However we have GDPR in effect last two years but authorities still had a so called "soft" penalty or no penalty just warn practice which is nearly over.In mid and longer term the penalty

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

ive seen it go as low as 12. On Tue, 13 Aug 2019 06:38:44 +0200 (CEST) "Kiss Gabor (Bitman)" wrote: > > > At this moment there is only 27 members of pool.sks-keyservers.net. > > > > JFR: The new negative record is 25... > > 21. > > Gabor > > ___ >

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> > At this moment there is only 27 members of pool.sks-keyservers.net. > > JFR: The new negative record is 25... 21. Gabor ___ Sks-devel mailing list Sks-devel@nongnu.org https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/sks-devel

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

On Fri, 21 Jun 2019, Kiss Gabor (Bitman) wrote: > At this moment there is only 27 members of pool.sks-keyservers.net. JFR: The new negative record is 25... Gabor ___ Sks-devel mailing list Sks-devel@nongnu.org

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

SKS logs to syslog, so it gets picked up by log rotate automatically. As for the DB itself, make sure you put the sample DB_CONFIG file in place in your KDB/DB and PTree directories before you started the SKS DB process to handle the DB log files. -T > On Jun 23, 2019, at 9:05 AM, Skip Carter

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

On Fri, 2019-06-21 at 12:22 -0700, Todd Fleisher wrote: > FWIW - in my experience, once you get things setup & dialed-in there > is no need for daily poking at it. My load balanced pools have been > running for months with only the occasional intervention required by > me. What do you do for log

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> On Jun 21, 2019, at 8:00 AM, Skip Carter wrote: > > Signed PGP part > As a newcomer to the pool, I have to agree. > There are several impediments to becoming a keyserver that just > shouldn't be and the need for daily poking at it is just one of those > things. There were several times where

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

As a newcomer to the pool, I have to agree. There are several impediments to becoming a keyserver that just shouldn't be and the need for daily poking at it is just one of those things. There were several times where I was just ready to give up on it. On Fri, 2019-06-21 at 07:43 -0500, Daniel

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

> On 21 Jun 2019, at 15:14 , Kristian Fiskerstrand > wrote: > > Signed PGP part > On 6/21/19 2:43 PM, Daniel Roesler wrote: >> I'd love to keep my server in the pool consistently, but until >> Issue #61 is resolved[1], my server will spike to 100% CPU for >> several minutes and become

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

On 6/21/19 2:43 PM, Daniel Roesler wrote: > I'd love to keep my server in the pool consistently, but until > Issue #61 is resolved[1], my server will spike to 100% CPU for > several minutes and become unresponsive as it tries to deal with > the huge troll keys. Sure, but this isn't an issue if

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA512 I'd love to keep my server in the pool consistently, but until Issue #61 is resolved[1], my server will spike to 100% CPU for several minutes and become unresponsive as it tries to deal with the huge troll keys. Running a server in the pool is no

Re: [Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

On 6/21/19 6:53 AM, Kiss Gabor (Bitman) wrote: > Dear Kristian, Hi Gabor, > > At this moment there is only 27 members of pool.sks-keyservers.net. > And no more than 3 HKPS server are enlisted. > It is a real possibility that this number drops below 1. > Below 2 is actually the minimum for it

[Sks-devel] The pool is shrinking

Dear Kristian, At this moment there is only 27 members of pool.sks-keyservers.net. And no more than 3 HKPS server are enlisted. It is a real possibility that this number drops below 1. Don't you want to revise your strict policy about issuing certificates? Regards Gabor