[freenet-support] Freenet 0,5 and 0,7
>>Freenet 0.5 is an opennet. You connect to any random node that happens >>to be on. Freenet 0.7 doesn't have this yet. In 0.7, there is no main >>network. There might be now, but the idea of the way it currently is >>setup is to allow small groups to connect without connecting to >>everyone else. > >That is not true. Freenet 0.7 is designed to form one global network, not >multiple independent networks consisting of small groups. > >Ian. Ian, How can freenet grow to be a global network unless someone in one group trades connection information with someone in another group? Hypothetical - A group of people in England, another in France, another in Russia, and another in China have grown individual trusted 0.7 freenets. No one in any of these groups knows someone in the other freenet group, and they don't want to just advertise in IRC chat to find someone to connect to because they don't know and trust this as a way to add people to their freenet. How will these freenet groups become a part of a global network? _ Don't just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.com/
[freenet-support] Freenet 0,5 and 0,7
Yea, but you don't know all the nodes in the network, you just know the ones your connected to. So if one of those links between the networks goes down, half your downloads stall out and die. And wouldn't that put a pretty big strain on certain computers? I mean, if you get this global network of small networks...90% of the data you request will probably be on another 'network'. The number of connections between these networks is going to be a lot smaller than connections within the network. Therefore the computers that connect between them are gonna have a much greater strain on them than the ones that are only linked to one 'network'. And if these individual networks fully connect and integrate...you have an opennet. Except you have to physically get your node connections from someone else. So you have an opennet with much fewer connections, which doesn't seem like a good thing. On 8/26/06, Evan Daniel wrote: > On 8/26/06, diddler4u at hotmail.com wrote: > > >>Freenet 0.5 is an opennet. You connect to any random node that happens > > >>to be on. Freenet 0.7 doesn't have this yet. In 0.7, there is no main > > >>network. There might be now, but the idea of the way it currently is > > >>setup is to allow small groups to connect without connecting to > > >>everyone else. > > > > > >That is not true. Freenet 0.7 is designed to form one global network, not > > >multiple independent networks consisting of small groups. > > > > > >Ian. > > > > Ian, > > > > How can freenet grow to be a global network unless someone in one group > > trades connection information with someone in another group? > > > > Hypothetical - A group of people in England, another in France, another in > > Russia, and another in China have grown individual trusted 0.7 freenets. No > > one in any of these groups knows someone in the other freenet group, and > > they don't want to just advertise in IRC chat to find someone to connect to > > because they don't know and trust this as a way to add people to their > > freenet. How will these freenet groups become a part of a global network? > > They won't. But your assumptions are off -- there's lots of good > reasons to assume that once a small local network passes a handful of > connected users it will gain a connection to a different network. And > then you have a global network. This is what is meant when people say > 0.7 is designed to form a global network -- there is no magic, except > for the underlying properties of the social connections the network is > built upon. > > Evan > ___ > Support mailing list > Support at freenetproject.org > http://news.gmane.org/gmane.network.freenet.support > Unsubscribe at http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/support > Or mailto:support-request at freenetproject.org?subject=unsubscribe > -- http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliates&id=0&t=57";>http://sfx-images.mozilla.org/affiliates/Buttons/180x60/blank.gif"/>
[freenet-support] Freenet 0,5 and 0,7
On 8/26/06, diddler4u at hotmail.com wrote: > >>Freenet 0.5 is an opennet. You connect to any random node that happens > >>to be on. Freenet 0.7 doesn't have this yet. In 0.7, there is no main > >>network. There might be now, but the idea of the way it currently is > >>setup is to allow small groups to connect without connecting to > >>everyone else. > > > >That is not true. Freenet 0.7 is designed to form one global network, not > >multiple independent networks consisting of small groups. > > > >Ian. > > Ian, > > How can freenet grow to be a global network unless someone in one group > trades connection information with someone in another group? > > Hypothetical - A group of people in England, another in France, another in > Russia, and another in China have grown individual trusted 0.7 freenets. No > one in any of these groups knows someone in the other freenet group, and > they don't want to just advertise in IRC chat to find someone to connect to > because they don't know and trust this as a way to add people to their > freenet. How will these freenet groups become a part of a global network? They won't. But your assumptions are off -- there's lots of good reasons to assume that once a small local network passes a handful of connected users it will gain a connection to a different network. And then you have a global network. This is what is meant when people say 0.7 is designed to form a global network -- there is no magic, except for the underlying properties of the social connections the network is built upon. Evan
Re: [freenet-support] Freenet 0,5 and 0,7
When I opened the message below all that displayed was an icon. When I attempted to save the icon all hell broke loose. My mail client was closed. After some attempts I was able to reboot and the spamblocker (earthlink) had examined the message and found nothing suspicious. However now I found that a message was displayed as shown below. A similar behavior with the message immediately preceding and with the same "i" icon. Anyone have some suggestions of what had happened or why the message behaved so peculiarly? Incidently the icon was "utitled" when I attempted to save it -- my common practice when a mail message appears to be peculiar. > [Original Message] > From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: > Date: 8/27/2006 12:19:54 AM > Subject: Re: [freenet-support] Freenet 0,5 and 0,7 > > I agree. I wouldn't want to be the only connection between 2 networks, or > even one of a small few. I simply don't have the bandwidth. Maybe a T1 or T3 > could handle it, but not what 90+% of the people using freenet would have to > work with. > > As I follow these threads I begin to see a core group of people that are > promoting 0.7 as the way to go. They have ideas about how it will work, but > so far I haven't seen convincing evidence to show how it's going to actually > do what they say. I understand 0.7 is in it's infancy, but it's really > premature and living in an incubator. It's got a long way to go to be able > to meet the level of use people are claiming it will have. > > I was running 0.7, I'm in the process of changing OS on the PC that was > running it, but I did not like having to exchange information with someone > on IRC. It's the first time I've ever had anything to do with IRC, and > though some people are IRC advocates I've never been one. I didn't know the > people I was connecting to at all, and the only reason it didn't bother me > was because I was simply provide a computer and bandwidth. If I had an > agenda, or a real reason to be using freenet, I would never have considered > giving out information. I was about as anonymous as if I had posted my IP > address on Google for everyone to view. > > It may be called darknet, but someone forgot to turn off the light. > > > >Yea, but you don't know all the nodes in the network, you just know > >the ones your connected to. So if one of those links between the > >networks goes down, half your downloads stall out and die. And > >wouldn't that put a pretty big strain on certain computers? I mean, if > >you get this global network of small networks...90% of the data you > >request will probably be on another 'network'. The number of > >connections between these networks is going to be a lot smaller than > >connections within the network. Therefore the computers that connect > >between them are gonna have a much greater strain on them than the > >ones that are only linked to one 'network'. And if these individual > >networks fully connect and integrate...you have an opennet. Except you > >have to physically get your node connections from someone else. So you > >have an opennet with much fewer connections, which doesn't seem like a > >good thing. > > > > > >On 8/26/06, Evan Daniel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>On 8/26/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> > >>Freenet 0.5 is an opennet. You connect to any random node that > >>happens > >> > >>to be on. Freenet 0.7 doesn't have this yet. In 0.7, there is no main > >> > >>network. There might be now, but the idea of the way it currently is > >> > >>setup is to allow small groups to connect without connecting to > >> > >>everyone else. > >> > > > >> > >That is not true. Freenet 0.7 is designed to form one global > >>network, not > >> > >multiple independent networks consisting of small groups. > >> > > > >> > >Ian. > >> > > >> > Ian, > >> > > >> > How can freenet grow to be a global network unless someone in one group > >> > trades connection information with someone in another group? > >> > > >> > Hypothetical - A group of people in England, another in France, another > >>in > >> > Russia, and another in China have grown individual trusted 0.7 > >>freenets. No > >> > one in any of these groups knows someone in the other freenet group, > >>and > >> > they don't want to just advertise in IRC chat to find someone to > >>connect to > >> > because they don't know and trust this as a way to add people to their > >> > freenet. How will these freenet groups become a part of a global > >>network? > >> > >>They won't. But your assumptions are off -- there's lots of good > >>reasons to assume that once a small local network passes a handful of > >>connected users it will gain a connection to a different network. And > >>then you have a global network. This is what is meant when people say > >>0.7 is designed to form a global network -- there is no magic, except > >>for the underlying properties of the social connections the network is > >>built upon. > >> > >>Evan > >>
Re: [freenet-support] Freenet 0,5 and 0,7
I agree. I wouldn't want to be the only connection between 2 networks, or even one of a small few. I simply don't have the bandwidth. Maybe a T1 or T3 could handle it, but not what 90+% of the people using freenet would have to work with. As I follow these threads I begin to see a core group of people that are promoting 0.7 as the way to go. They have ideas about how it will work, but so far I haven't seen convincing evidence to show how it's going to actually do what they say. I understand 0.7 is in it's infancy, but it's really premature and living in an incubator. It's got a long way to go to be able to meet the level of use people are claiming it will have. I was running 0.7, I'm in the process of changing OS on the PC that was running it, but I did not like having to exchange information with someone on IRC. It's the first time I've ever had anything to do with IRC, and though some people are IRC advocates I've never been one. I didn't know the people I was connecting to at all, and the only reason it didn't bother me was because I was simply provide a computer and bandwidth. If I had an agenda, or a real reason to be using freenet, I would never have considered giving out information. I was about as anonymous as if I had posted my IP address on Google for everyone to view. It may be called darknet, but someone forgot to turn off the light. Yea, but you don't know all the nodes in the network, you just know the ones your connected to. So if one of those links between the networks goes down, half your downloads stall out and die. And wouldn't that put a pretty big strain on certain computers? I mean, if you get this global network of small networks...90% of the data you request will probably be on another 'network'. The number of connections between these networks is going to be a lot smaller than connections within the network. Therefore the computers that connect between them are gonna have a much greater strain on them than the ones that are only linked to one 'network'. And if these individual networks fully connect and integrate...you have an opennet. Except you have to physically get your node connections from someone else. So you have an opennet with much fewer connections, which doesn't seem like a good thing. On 8/26/06, Evan Daniel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 8/26/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>Freenet 0.5 is an opennet. You connect to any random node that happens > >>to be on. Freenet 0.7 doesn't have this yet. In 0.7, there is no main > >>network. There might be now, but the idea of the way it currently is > >>setup is to allow small groups to connect without connecting to > >>everyone else. > > > >That is not true. Freenet 0.7 is designed to form one global network, not > >multiple independent networks consisting of small groups. > > > >Ian. > > Ian, > > How can freenet grow to be a global network unless someone in one group > trades connection information with someone in another group? > > Hypothetical - A group of people in England, another in France, another in > Russia, and another in China have grown individual trusted 0.7 freenets. No > one in any of these groups knows someone in the other freenet group, and > they don't want to just advertise in IRC chat to find someone to connect to > because they don't know and trust this as a way to add people to their > freenet. How will these freenet groups become a part of a global network? They won't. But your assumptions are off -- there's lots of good reasons to assume that once a small local network passes a handful of connected users it will gain a connection to a different network. And then you have a global network. This is what is meant when people say 0.7 is designed to form a global network -- there is no magic, except for the underlying properties of the social connections the network is built upon. Evan ___ Support mailing list Support@freenetproject.org http://news.gmane.org/gmane.network.freenet.support Unsubscribe at http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/support Or mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliates&id=0&t=57";>http://sfx-images.mozilla.org/affiliates/Buttons/180x60/blank.gif"/> ___ Support mailing list Support@freenetproject.org http://news.gmane.org/gmane.network.freenet.support Unsubscribe at http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/support Or mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ ___ Support mailing list Support@freenetproject.org http://news.gmane.org/gmane.network.freenet.support Unsubscribe at http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/support Or
Re: [freenet-support] Freenet 0,5 and 0,7
Yea, but you don't know all the nodes in the network, you just know the ones your connected to. So if one of those links between the networks goes down, half your downloads stall out and die. And wouldn't that put a pretty big strain on certain computers? I mean, if you get this global network of small networks...90% of the data you request will probably be on another 'network'. The number of connections between these networks is going to be a lot smaller than connections within the network. Therefore the computers that connect between them are gonna have a much greater strain on them than the ones that are only linked to one 'network'. And if these individual networks fully connect and integrate...you have an opennet. Except you have to physically get your node connections from someone else. So you have an opennet with much fewer connections, which doesn't seem like a good thing. On 8/26/06, Evan Daniel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 8/26/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>Freenet 0.5 is an opennet. You connect to any random node that happens > >>to be on. Freenet 0.7 doesn't have this yet. In 0.7, there is no main > >>network. There might be now, but the idea of the way it currently is > >>setup is to allow small groups to connect without connecting to > >>everyone else. > > > >That is not true. Freenet 0.7 is designed to form one global network, not > >multiple independent networks consisting of small groups. > > > >Ian. > > Ian, > > How can freenet grow to be a global network unless someone in one group > trades connection information with someone in another group? > > Hypothetical - A group of people in England, another in France, another in > Russia, and another in China have grown individual trusted 0.7 freenets. No > one in any of these groups knows someone in the other freenet group, and > they don't want to just advertise in IRC chat to find someone to connect to > because they don't know and trust this as a way to add people to their > freenet. How will these freenet groups become a part of a global network? They won't. But your assumptions are off -- there's lots of good reasons to assume that once a small local network passes a handful of connected users it will gain a connection to a different network. And then you have a global network. This is what is meant when people say 0.7 is designed to form a global network -- there is no magic, except for the underlying properties of the social connections the network is built upon. Evan ___ Support mailing list Support@freenetproject.org http://news.gmane.org/gmane.network.freenet.support Unsubscribe at http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/support Or mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliates&id=0&t=57";>http://sfx-images.mozilla.org/affiliates/Buttons/180x60/blank.gif"/> ___ Support mailing list Support@freenetproject.org http://news.gmane.org/gmane.network.freenet.support Unsubscribe at http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/support Or mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[freenet-support] Freenet 0,5 and 0,7
Through the opennet. Which won't exist for, like, a year. Hmmm. On 8/26/06, diddler4u at hotmail.com wrote: > >>Freenet 0.5 is an opennet. You connect to any random node that happens > >>to be on. Freenet 0.7 doesn't have this yet. In 0.7, there is no main > >>network. There might be now, but the idea of the way it currently is > >>setup is to allow small groups to connect without connecting to > >>everyone else. > > > >That is not true. Freenet 0.7 is designed to form one global network, not > >multiple independent networks consisting of small groups. > > > >Ian. > > Ian, > > How can freenet grow to be a global network unless someone in one group > trades connection information with someone in another group? > > Hypothetical - A group of people in England, another in France, another in > Russia, and another in China have grown individual trusted 0.7 freenets. No > one in any of these groups knows someone in the other freenet group, and > they don't want to just advertise in IRC chat to find someone to connect to > because they don't know and trust this as a way to add people to their > freenet. How will these freenet groups become a part of a global network? > > _ > Don't just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! > http://search.msn.com/ > > ___ > Support mailing list > Support at freenetproject.org > http://news.gmane.org/gmane.network.freenet.support > Unsubscribe at http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/support > Or mailto:support-request at freenetproject.org?subject=unsubscribe > -- http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliates&id=0&t=57";>http://sfx-images.mozilla.org/affiliates/Buttons/180x60/blank.gif"/>
Re: [freenet-support] Freenet 0,5 and 0,7
On 8/26/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>Freenet 0.5 is an opennet. You connect to any random node that happens >>to be on. Freenet 0.7 doesn't have this yet. In 0.7, there is no main >>network. There might be now, but the idea of the way it currently is >>setup is to allow small groups to connect without connecting to >>everyone else. > >That is not true. Freenet 0.7 is designed to form one global network, not >multiple independent networks consisting of small groups. > >Ian. Ian, How can freenet grow to be a global network unless someone in one group trades connection information with someone in another group? Hypothetical - A group of people in England, another in France, another in Russia, and another in China have grown individual trusted 0.7 freenets. No one in any of these groups knows someone in the other freenet group, and they don't want to just advertise in IRC chat to find someone to connect to because they don't know and trust this as a way to add people to their freenet. How will these freenet groups become a part of a global network? They won't. But your assumptions are off -- there's lots of good reasons to assume that once a small local network passes a handful of connected users it will gain a connection to a different network. And then you have a global network. This is what is meant when people say 0.7 is designed to form a global network -- there is no magic, except for the underlying properties of the social connections the network is built upon. Evan ___ Support mailing list Support@freenetproject.org http://news.gmane.org/gmane.network.freenet.support Unsubscribe at http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/support Or mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [freenet-support] Freenet 0,5 and 0,7
Through the opennet. Which won't exist for, like, a year. Hmmm. On 8/26/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>Freenet 0.5 is an opennet. You connect to any random node that happens >>to be on. Freenet 0.7 doesn't have this yet. In 0.7, there is no main >>network. There might be now, but the idea of the way it currently is >>setup is to allow small groups to connect without connecting to >>everyone else. > >That is not true. Freenet 0.7 is designed to form one global network, not >multiple independent networks consisting of small groups. > >Ian. Ian, How can freenet grow to be a global network unless someone in one group trades connection information with someone in another group? Hypothetical - A group of people in England, another in France, another in Russia, and another in China have grown individual trusted 0.7 freenets. No one in any of these groups knows someone in the other freenet group, and they don't want to just advertise in IRC chat to find someone to connect to because they don't know and trust this as a way to add people to their freenet. How will these freenet groups become a part of a global network? _ Don't just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.com/ ___ Support mailing list Support@freenetproject.org http://news.gmane.org/gmane.network.freenet.support Unsubscribe at http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/support Or mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliates&id=0&t=57";>http://sfx-images.mozilla.org/affiliates/Buttons/180x60/blank.gif"/> ___ Support mailing list Support@freenetproject.org http://news.gmane.org/gmane.network.freenet.support Unsubscribe at http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/support Or mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [freenet-support] Freenet 0,5 and 0,7
Freenet 0.5 is an opennet. You connect to any random node that happens to be on. Freenet 0.7 doesn't have this yet. In 0.7, there is no main network. There might be now, but the idea of the way it currently is setup is to allow small groups to connect without connecting to everyone else. That is not true. Freenet 0.7 is designed to form one global network, not multiple independent networks consisting of small groups. Ian. Ian, How can freenet grow to be a global network unless someone in one group trades connection information with someone in another group? Hypothetical - A group of people in England, another in France, another in Russia, and another in China have grown individual trusted 0.7 freenets. No one in any of these groups knows someone in the other freenet group, and they don't want to just advertise in IRC chat to find someone to connect to because they don't know and trust this as a way to add people to their freenet. How will these freenet groups become a part of a global network? _ Don't just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.com/ ___ Support mailing list Support@freenetproject.org http://news.gmane.org/gmane.network.freenet.support Unsubscribe at http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/support Or mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [freenet-support] Freenet 0,5 and 0,7
On 24 Aug 2006, at 12:01, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Freenet 0.5 is an opennet. You connect to any random node that happensto be on. Freenet 0.7 doesn't have this yet. In 0.7, there is no mainnetwork. There might be now, but the idea of the way it currently issetup is to allow small groups to connect without connecting toeveryone else. That is not true. Freenet 0.7 is designed to form one global network, not multiple independent networks consisting of small groups.Ian. Ian Clarke: Co-Founder & Chief Scientist Revver, Inc. phone: 323.871.2828 | personal blog - http://locut.us/blog ___ Support mailing list Support@freenetproject.org http://news.gmane.org/gmane.network.freenet.support Unsubscribe at http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/support Or mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[freenet-support] Freenet 0,5 and 0,7
On 24 Aug 2006, at 12:01, urza9814 at gmail.com wrote: > Freenet 0.5 is an opennet. You connect to any random node that happens > to be on. Freenet 0.7 doesn't have this yet. In 0.7, there is no main > network. There might be now, but the idea of the way it currently is > setup is to allow small groups to connect without connecting to > everyone else. That is not true. Freenet 0.7 is designed to form one global network, not multiple independent networks consisting of small groups. Ian. Ian Clarke: Co-Founder & Chief Scientist Revver, Inc. phone: 323.871.2828 | personal blog - http://locut.us/blog -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <https://emu.freenetproject.org/pipermail/support/attachments/20060826/7b424f61/attachment.html>
