Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

On 25/11/18 09:42, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: sent from a phone On 24. Nov 2018, at 16:20, Allan Mustard > wrote: I don't think OSM should be in the business of writing its own dictionary and defining terms independently of the rest of society.  That's a slippery

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

sent from a phone > On 24. Nov 2018, at 16:20, Allan Mustard wrote: > > I don't think OSM should be in the business of writing its own dictionary and > defining terms independently of the rest of society. That's a slippery slope. > it is not exactly the same as a dictionary, but similar,

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

sent from a phone > On 24. Nov 2018, at 08:08, Eugene Alvin Villar wrote: > > Unlike regular banks, central banks usually only have other banks and their > government as their sole customers and in many countries, central banks act > as a regulatory agency for banks and other financial insti

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

W dniu 24.11.2018 o 16:20, Allan Mustard pisze: > > I don't think OSM should be in the business of writing its own > dictionary and defining terms independently of the rest of society.  > That's a slippery slope. > We should not diverge too far from common meaning, but sometimes it needs some twea

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

I don't think OSM should be in the business of writing its own dictionary and defining terms independently of the rest of society.  That's a slippery slope. If a bank is a bank, it's a bank.  If it is part of the banking system and is regulated as a bank, it's a bank. If we want to differentiate r

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Nobody is going to dispute that Central Bank can be considered as a bank (see name). But amenity=bank if for places that perform bank-like services for public - it excludes somebanks and includes some companies that technically are not banks. 24. Nov 2018 15:31 by al...@mustard.net

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Here, I just looked up "bank" on 411.com (online directory assistance) for Kansas City, Missouri: https://www.411.com/business/MO/Kansas-city/bank and guess what, Federal Reserve Bank of Kansas City, the Kansas City branch of America's central bank, is listed... https://www.411.com/business/MO/K

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Most people are non-experts in most things. The map should be made for most people, so that most people can use it. And most people would expect something mapped as a bank to be available for their use. Much like a cafe or a pub. They would not expect it to be only for certain groups of instit

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Sounds to me like the OSM wiki article in question was written by a non-expert in banking and finance and should be corrected/expanded. Cheers, apm-wa Sent from my iPhone > On Nov 24, 2018, at 12:08 PM, Eugene Alvin Villar wrote: > >> On Sat, Nov 24, 2018 at 12:45 AM Allan Mustard wrote: >> W

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

On Sat, Nov 24, 2018 at 12:45 AM Allan Mustard wrote: > Well, a central bank is a bank, after all, whether it is owned by the > government or is a "private" parastatal organization. I would tag it as > amenity=bank since it is a bank. Not all banks offer consumer services, so > the fact that an

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Thanks Alan, once again you make perfect sense! Graeme ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Well, a central bank is a bank, after all, whether it is owned by the government or is a "private" parastatal organization.  I would tag it as amenity=bank since it is a bank.  Not all banks offer consumer services, so the fact that an individual cannot open an account in a central bank doesn't dis

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

On Fri, 23 Nov 2018 at 07:04, SelfishSeahorse wrote: > > You're right, most central banks are independent from politics, but > aren't they called governmental institutions nevertheless? Or rather > state institutions? (I'm not so fluent in English and not an expert on > state/economy.) > Tricky

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Thank you, Martin and Sergio, for your input. On Wed, 21 Nov 2018 at 00:49, Sergio Manzi wrote: > > Correct: it very much depends and vary from state to state: Italy's central > bank, Bank of Italy, is not a goverenmental institution (it has > shareholders...), and the same is true (afaik, but

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Correct: it very much depends and vary from state to state: Italy's central bank, Bank of Italy, is not a goverenmental institution (/it has shareholders.../), and the same is true (/afaik, but haven't checked/) for the US Federal Reserve Bank... On 2018-11-21 00:16, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

sent from a phone > On 20. Nov 2018, at 21:05, SelfishSeahorse wrote: > > I'm wondering whether central banks should be included or excluded > from landuse=governmental. Actually, a central bank isn't a part of > the government, but is a governmental institution. However, it belongs > to the c

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Hello Thank you all for your feedback on this proposal so far. I'm wondering whether central banks should be included or excluded from landuse=governmental. Actually, a central bank isn't a part of the government, but is a governmental institution. However, it belongs to the core of the state and

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

sent from a phone On 4. Nov 2018, at 22:56, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote: >> the tag is about land used by government. > > "Owned" or "used"? used___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

4. Nov 2018 22:52 by 61sundow...@gmail.com : > excludes:Land owned by the government, but not used for governing (e.g. > national forests or parks) > > Sorry .. but ownership is some thing mappers may find hard to determine. > The point of this exclusion is that

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

On Sun, 4 Nov 2018 at 23:44, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: > > > sent from a phone > > > On 4. Nov 2018, at 14:21, SelfishSeahorse > wrote: > > > > 'Land owned by the government, > > > I would not insist on the ownership at all in the definition, the tag is > about land used by government. > "Own

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

On 05/11/18 00:21, SelfishSeahorse wrote: Hi Mateusz, Thank you for your feedback! "for marking government premises" sounds like replacement of office=* tag I've changed the definition (back) to 'land used by government bodies / for governing'. Current definitions "This excludes: (...) Land

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

4. Nov 2018 14:43 by dieterdre...@gmail.com : > > > sent from a phone > >> On 4. Nov 2018, at 14:21, SelfishSeahorse <>> selfishseaho...@gmail.com >> >> > wrote: >> >> 'Land owned by the government, but not used for governing' > >

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

sent from a phone > On 4. Nov 2018, at 14:21, SelfishSeahorse wrote: > > 'Land owned by the government, but not used for governing' doesn’t this make it hard to verify? I would not insist on the ownership at all in the definition, the tag is about land used by government. Cheers, Martin

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Hi Mateusz, Thank you for your feedback! > "for marking government premises" sounds like replacement of office=* tag I've changed the definition (back) to 'land used by government bodies / for governing'. > Current definitions "This excludes: (...) Land ''owned'' by the government" > means tha

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Current definitions "This excludes: (...) Land ''owned'' by the government" means thatparliament complex owned by government is not landuse=government. "Excludes" should be replaced by something like "This is not sufficient to classify as thislanduse by itself" (but in way that is understandable)

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

link: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/landuse%3Dgovernmental I think that proposal is not making clear that it should be used for areas of land wherethis land use dominates. "for marking governm

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Hello! I've made following additions to the proposal: * Addition of the new tag governmental=legislature/executive/judiciary for specifying the governmental branch. * Reuse of the existing tag admin_level=* for indicating the administrative level (country, state, municipal etc.). Are the

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

On Wed, 31 Oct 2018 at 12:00, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: > > WRT to Joseph's comment about "municipal, statal and federal", I would > welcome adding a property for the level (if a generic level is chosen for > landuse), maybe "admin_level" would suit best? This seems like a good idea. > How wi

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Am Mi., 31. Okt. 2018 um 11:49 Uhr schrieb SelfishSeahorse < selfishseaho...@gmail.com>: > I think if editors will name the landuse=governmental preset > 'government premises', there won't be a high risk that people would > use this tag for land owned or regulated by the government. > Alternativel

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

On Sun, 14 Oct 2018 at 04:02, Joseph Eisenberg wrote: > > However, I'm not sure that "governmental" is the best value for the landuse > key. I think there would be a risk of mappers finding this tag in the editors > and using it for all governnment-owned land, not just for administrative > offi

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

> On Oct 16, 2018, at 7:13 AM, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote: > > How about those "public safety" groups that are manned & operated by unpaid > volunteers, often with minimum (or no) Govt funding? A building dedicated to a volunteer fire department - where they keep the truck and the hoses - is s

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

On Tue, 16 Oct 2018 at 07:17, John Willis wrote: > > Landuse=public_safety would be generic enough to be for police stations, > rangers, lifeguards, snow patrol, highway patrol, harbor patrol, fire > stations, wildfire stations, and other "official" services offered to the > public to ensure thei

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Javbw > On Oct 16, 2018, at 5:32 AM, SelfishSeahorse > wrote: > > No, landuse=governmental is intended for the land used for organising > a country, state, municipality etc., that is, the 'core functions' of > a country, state, municipality etc., which are administering it, > making rules (la

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

On Mon, 15 Oct 2018 at 22:32, SelfishSeahorse wrote: > > However, the problem of how to call the sub-tag(s) for public administration, > executive, parliament and courts were exactly the same as without > landuse=institutional + sub-tags. PS: The only benefit i see of landuse=institutional + su

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Hi, Martin! On Mon, 15 Oct 2018 at 01:09, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: > > So police stations are out? The ministry of defense is in, but the > subordinate units of it are out (because military)? Courts are in? Prisons? > Storage (e.g. > https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_strategic_petroleum

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

On Sun, 14 Oct 2018 at 20:35, Tom Hardy wrote: > > Just to throw a couple more your way: > > https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/622149574 > landuse=garages is a staging area for city public works and county truck > repair, and > > https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/448672572 > amenity=recycling is f

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

So police stations are out? The ministry of defense is in, but the subordinate units of it are out (because military)? Courts are in? Prisons? Storage (e.g. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_strategic_petroleum_reserves )? What about publicly owned companies? Does it matter whether they are

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

On 15/10/18 05:34, Tom Hardy wrote: On Sunday, 14 October 2018 12:30:49 CDT SelfishSeahorse wrote: Do you or anyone else have another idea how to name land used for governing or how to solve this problem differently? It doesn't seem to be an easy task ... Just to throw a couple more your way

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

On Sunday, 14 October 2018 12:30:49 CDT SelfishSeahorse wrote: > Do you or anyone else have another idea how to name land used for > governing or how to solve this problem differently? It doesn't seem to > be an easy task ... Just to throw a couple more your way: https://www.openstreetmap.org/w

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

On Sun, Oct 14, 2018 at 6:32 PM SelfishSeahorse wrote: > > Do you or anyone else have another idea how to name land used for > governing or how to solve this problem differently? > landuse=scoundrels -- Paul ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstree

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

On Sun, 14 Oct 2018 at 17:42, SelfishSeahorse wrote: > > Because at least offices of the public administration and the > executive body are often located in the same building. PS: Public administration is actually considered being a part of the executive. Do you or anyone else have another idea

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Hi! On Sun, 14 Oct 2018 at 17:16, marc marc wrote: > > > But dividing land used for governing would complicate mapping too much > > why not ? school/education and military already exist. Because at least offices of the public administration and the executive body are often located in the same bu

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Le 14. 10. 18 à 14:42, SelfishSeahorse a écrit : > public_administration isn't unproblematic too, because, if i'm not > mistaken, legislature facilities (places where > assembly/parliament/congress meets) and courts are another divisions > of government and don't belong to the public administration

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Thank you, Joseph and Warin, for your feedback! On Sun, 14 Oct 2018 at 04:02, Joseph Eisenberg wrote: > > However, I'm not sure that "governmental" is the best value for the landuse > key. I think there would be a risk of mappers finding this tag in the editors > and using it for all governnmen

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

I think that there first need to be clear definitions of what are: * public administration * executive * Legislature * Judiciary (courts) and where things fit... police (national, state, municipal) military - excluded? libraries (national, state, municipal) schools - excluded? tax offic

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Thanks for working on this proposal, Markus. I agree that it would be useful to have an approved type of land use for the administrative offices of governments. However, I'm not sure that "governmental" is the best value for the landuse key. I think there would be a risk of mappers finding this t

[Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse=governmental

Hello everyone! I am proposing a new tag, landuse=governmental, for marking land that is used for governing: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/landuse%3Dgovernmental Regards Markus ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org