Re: [Tagging] Ski picnic room
On 2/3/2020 5:55 PM, Warin wrote: On 30/1/20 9:23 pm, MARLIN LUKE wrote: Noticed amenity=shelter. I initially thought about combining it with shelter-type:picnic, but it seems too... "open" for me. Like, not a complete building. I'll use this in the meantime There is shelter_type=weather_shelter that looks more enclosed. Perhaps shelter_type=picnic_enclosed? I'm not a skier myself, but while hiking I've encountered ski shelters that sound similar to the one Martin was describing, though a little more primitive (ie, no vending machines.) I've heard them called "warming huts" but I don't know how universal that terminology is. Checking taginfo for shelter_type=warming_hut shows exactly one use. And the ones I've seen are more like cabins than huts, so I'd be reluctant to tag shelter_type=warming_hut unless the meaning is quite clear. One of the more popular values of shelter_type is simply shelter_type=building. To me this would mean enclosed, but wouldn't imply picnic facilities (which could of course be mapped separately.) Jason ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Ski picnic room
On 30/1/20 9:23 pm, MARLIN LUKE wrote: Noticed amenity=shelter. I initially thought about combining it with shelter-type:picnic, but it seems too... "open" for me. Like, not a complete building. I'll use this in the meantime There is shelter_type=weather_shelter that looks more enclosed. Perhaps shelter_type=picnic_enclosed? ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Ski picnic room
On Mon, 3 Feb 2020 at 12:34, Ture Pålsson wrote: > I am fairly sure that I have seen "picnic area" in some London museums. At > least the Science Museum uses the phrase on their web site. > They use the term "picnic area" but not "picnic room." As a google search on site:sciencemuseum.org.uk "picnic room" will confirm. Although https://www.sciencemuseum.org.uk/visit/food-and-drink#picnic-areas isn't clear, the wording implies that the areas are not rooms. One is definitely outside and the other is a terrace. At least partially open to the elements. -- Paul ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Ski picnic room
2020-02-03 13:17 skrev Paul Allen: > [...] > > I'm hoping somebody will come up with a less generic name. Or a better name > than "indoor_food_consumption" that means the same thing. Failing that, > "dining_area" is the least bad name I've thought of so far. Or "eating_area" > might be better. I am fairly sure that I have seen "picnic area" in some London museums. At least the Science Museum uses the phrase on their web site.___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Ski picnic room
On Mon, 3 Feb 2020 at 10:37, MARLIN LUKE wrote: "Picnic room" seems to be used by some ski resort in France, and I've seen > it on some tourism forums on ski threads so it might at least be understood > by english skiers. > Understood by those English speakers who have used that resort in France or read those forums. Not a good basis for a tag that most will find confusing. > > I'm unsure whether creating something like "indoor_food_consumption" is a > good idea if the only usage is for ski resorts and a less-generic name > exists. > I'm hoping somebody will come up with a less generic name. Or a better name than "indoor_food_consumption" that means the same thing. Failing that, "dining_area" is the least bad name I've thought of so far. Or "eating_area" might be better. -- Paul ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Ski picnic room
Thank you for the detailed mail. The tags I've used indeed doesn't exactly fit, as you figured out during your search. I couldn't find anything existing that would be a better match. "Picnic room" seems to be used by some ski resort in France, and I've seen it on some tourism forums on ski threads so it might at least be understood by english skiers. I'm unsure whether creating something like "indoor_food_consumption" is a good idea if the only usage is for ski resorts and a less-generic name exists. What do you think? De : Paul Allen Envoyé : jeudi 30 janvier 2020 12:05 À : Tag discussion, strategy and related tools Objet : Re: [Tagging] Ski picnic room On Thu, 30 Jan 2020 at 10:26, MARLIN LUKE mailto:luke.mar...@viacesi.fr>> wrote: Noticed amenity=shelter. I initially thought about combining it with shelter-type:picnic, but it seems too... "open" for me. Like, not a complete building. Shelter seems "open." But so does "picnic." Wikipedia confirms my understanding of "picnic" - an outdoors meal: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Picnic All I've managed to turn up on Google for "picnic room" are translations of "salle hors sac" made by people who don't speak English as a first language. Google Translate gives me "out of bag" for "hors sac" which in colloquial English would be "packed meal." And you take a packed meal on a picnic, so "salle hors sac" turns into "picnic room." Which is not colloquial English or anything a British English speaker would comprehend as being what you want to map. What you're describing is almost a cafeteria (which we already have a tag for) except that there may not be any purchasable food and, if there is purchasable food, it's from a vending machine whereas real cafeterias generally offer self-service food. So fast_food=cafeteria is a better fit, but still not a good fit. A better fit would be automat, although I think that's an American term with little or no usage in British English. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automat And, if I understand you correctly, there may not be vending machines in some of these places, and most real automats wouldn't let you bring your own food. I can't think of any good term for a building which contains tables and chairs which you can use to eat a packed meal. We have leisure=outdoor_seating for consumption of meals/drinks, but that is open, even if covered. And the tag value itself doesn't convey that it's for food, you have to look at the wiki page or see that it is used near to somewhere serving food which is tagged as having outdoor seating. So inventing leisure=indoor_seating is probably a bad idea, especially if there are no vending machines. It probably needs something along the lines of leisure=indoor_food_consumption (needs a better name than that) with optional amenity=vending_machine + vending=food|drinks nodes. And maybe an explicit bring_your_own_food=yes tag (needs a better name than that). Actually, leisure=dining_room might be a better name than leisure=indoor_food_consumption, except it's not really used in British English for a public room but for a room in a house or guest house. -- Paul ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Ski picnic room
On Thu, 30 Jan 2020 at 10:26, MARLIN LUKE wrote: > Noticed amenity=shelter. I initially thought about combining it with > shelter-type:picnic, but it seems too... "open" for me. Like, not a > complete building. > Shelter seems "open." But so does "picnic." Wikipedia confirms my understanding of "picnic" - an outdoors meal: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Picnic All I've managed to turn up on Google for "picnic room" are translations of "salle hors sac" made by people who don't speak English as a first language. Google Translate gives me "out of bag" for "hors sac" which in colloquial English would be "packed meal." And you take a packed meal on a picnic, so "salle hors sac" turns into "picnic room." Which is not colloquial English or anything a British English speaker would comprehend as being what you want to map. What you're describing is almost a cafeteria (which we already have a tag for) except that there may not be any purchasable food and, if there is purchasable food, it's from a vending machine whereas real cafeterias generally offer self-service food. So fast_food=cafeteria is a better fit, but still not a good fit. A better fit would be automat, although I think that's an American term with little or no usage in British English. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automat And, if I understand you correctly, there may not be vending machines in some of these places, and most real automats wouldn't let you bring your own food. I can't think of any good term for a building which contains tables and chairs which you can use to eat a packed meal. We have leisure=outdoor_seating for consumption of meals/drinks, but that is open, even if covered. And the tag value itself doesn't convey that it's for food, you have to look at the wiki page or see that it is used near to somewhere serving food which is tagged as having outdoor seating. So inventing leisure=indoor_seating is probably a bad idea, especially if there are no vending machines. It probably needs something along the lines of leisure=indoor_food_consumption (needs a better name than that) with optional amenity=vending_machine + vending=food|drinks nodes. And maybe an explicit bring_your_own_food=yes tag (needs a better name than that). Actually, leisure=dining_room might be a better name than leisure=indoor_food_consumption, except it's not really used in British English for a public room but for a room in a house or guest house. -- Paul ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Ski picnic room
Noticed amenity=shelter. I initially thought about combining it with shelter-type:picnic, but it seems too... "open" for me. Like, not a complete building. I'll use this in the meantime ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Ski picnic room
amenity=shelter? Jan 29, 2020, 20:20 by luke.mar...@viacesi.fr: > I'm trying to tag a building which is a shelter with some vending machines, > tables and benches. > This type of building is called "salle hors sac" in french, and it seems that > the english counterpart would be "picnic room". > They are places where you are allowed to bring your own food and eat it. > > I've found nothing in the ski wiki page [1]. > > What tag(s) should be used for this? > > [1] > https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit#map=20/49.55149/5.81066 > ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
[Tagging] Ski picnic room
I'm trying to tag a building which is a shelter with some vending machines, tables and benches. This type of building is called "salle hors sac" in french, and it seems that the english counterpart would be "picnic room". They are places where you are allowed to bring your own food and eat it. I've found nothing in the ski wiki page [1]. What tag(s) should be used for this? [1] https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit#map=20/49.55149/5.81066 ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
