Re: [Tagging] Beaches

2010-04-08 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/4/8 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: From http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Beach Beach areas should always meet with a natural=coastline way. Do not use this tag for patches of sand/gravel which are not by a coastline. Note that the natural=coastline should ideally be positioned

Re: [Tagging] Beaches

2010-04-10 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/4/9 Richard Welty rwe...@averillpark.net: many towns in upstate NY have town beaches on local lakes. In Berlin we have beaches (Oststrand [1+2] ) at the river and even in the zoo ;-) [3] cheers, Martin btw.: what about tagging (and rendering) surface=sand ? IMHO the beaches-hack is not

Re: [Tagging] Additional value for tracktype

2010-04-10 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/4/10 Ben Laenen benlae...@gmail.com: Now, about paved on the outside and unpaved in the middle: given the fact that paved roads shouldn't be tagged as tracks anyway, ... why not? Of course they are: grade1-tracks have to be paved (or similar surface like very compounded hardcore).

Re: [Tagging] Beaches

2010-04-10 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
M∡rtin Koppenhoefer an John Details anzeigen 17:04 (Vor 0 Minuten) 2010/4/10 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: - Zitierten Text anzeigen - On 11 April 2010 00:18, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: btw.: what about tagging (and rendering) surface=sand ? IMHO

Re: [Tagging] Beaches

2010-04-11 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/4/11 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: On 11 April 2010 20:40, Roy Wallace waldo000...@gmail.com wrote: Surely these should be tagged golf_course=bunker, or something. I was hoping for something a little more generic since you can also have beach volley ball areas that are no where

Re: [Tagging] Beaches

2010-04-12 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/4/12 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: On 12 April 2010 09:09, Steve Doerr steve.do...@blueyonder.co.uk wrote: Sand is not a necessary element of a beach in any case. In fact, the original meaning of 'beach' was: 'The loose water-worn pebbles of the sea-shore; shingle.' All this

Re: [Tagging] Is highway=service, service=drive_thru a good idea?

2010-04-12 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/4/12 Anthony o...@inbox.org: No.  There are probably more OSMers that know basic English than OSMers that know basic German.  And we all know where the hyphen key is. Don't know if that's true, but if I see how many complaints there are about the ÖPNV-Karte, which ist just one word,

Re: [Tagging] Entrances..

2010-04-20 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/4/20 Erik Johansson erjo...@gmail.com: Wouldn't it be great if railway=subway_entrance was rendering +1 currently I'm mapping them with barrier=wall (U-form) and highway=steps in the middle (and on the end subway_entrance) but it would be nice to have them show up. , and if we had a

Re: [Tagging] Tagging buildings

2010-04-26 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/4/26 Jukka Rahkonen jukka.rahko...@mmmtike.fi: Area=yes is unnecessary. +1 And then the buildings have properties like architect, height, number of floors etc. ideally yes. To find out which tags you can really find associated, simply use tagwatch or analyse the planet ;-) cheers,

Re: [Tagging] A shop selling fish and seafood

2010-04-30 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/4/30 Jonathan Bennett openstreet...@jonno.cix.co.uk: On 30/04/2010 09:57, Claudius Henrichs wrote: I'm trying to get some input on how to tag a shop selling fish and seafood from some english speaking users. For the sake of sanity I'd use   shop=fishmonger This describes what the

Re: [Tagging] A shop selling fish and seafood

2010-04-30 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/4/30 Richard Mann richard.mann.westoxf...@googlemail.com: poissonerie, surely? Poissonnerie http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poissonnerie cheers, Martin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org

Re: [Tagging] A shop selling fish and seafood

2010-04-30 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
what about a simple shop=fish ? Martin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] City Walls and multipolygons in Osmarender

2010-05-03 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/3 Seventy 7 seven...@operamail.com: The existing walls have been tagged historic=citywalls which render as a thick grey line in Mapnik and don't render at all in Osmarender. This is an undocumented tag as far as I can tell. thanks for this, I was mapping city-walls in Rome and the

Re: [Tagging] City Walls and multipolygons in Osmarender

2010-05-03 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/3 Seventy 7 seven...@operamail.com: The existing walls have been tagged historic=citywalls which render as a thick grey line in Mapnik and don't render at all in Osmarender. This is an undocumented tag as far as I can tell. The documented (and therefore correct?) tag is

Re: [Tagging] Cleaning up

2010-05-05 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/5 Jonas Minnberg sas...@gmail.com: I am currently working on cleaning up stuff in Stockholm, and I was wondering if it was OK do to things like: * Remove cycleways parallel to other ways and add a cycleway=track to that way instead. no, you should rather do the opposite: remove the

Re: [Tagging] Cleaning up

2010-05-05 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/5 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: On 5 May 2010 23:57, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: I suggest to change leisure=park to landuse=grass if it is not a park. This was covered in another thread, landcover isn't the same thing as landuse, the only landuse=grass I

Re: [Tagging] Cleaning up

2010-05-05 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/5 Jonas Minnberg sas...@gmail.com: If they aren't parks, then what are they? They are trees or sometimes small areas of grass next to buildings. For instance; use landuse=grass, that's IMHO not wrong regarding landuse-use ;-) in general. cheers, Martin

Re: [Tagging] Cleaning up

2010-05-05 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/5 Jonas Minnberg sas...@gmail.com: Shouldn't you expect - you know - *grass* in areas with landuse=grass ? :9 Seriously though, from the image of the actual street you can see that it is a sidewalk. The only people who see the green surface are the ones flying over it. I must admit I

Re: [Tagging] Cleaning up

2010-05-05 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/5 Jonas Minnberg sas...@gmail.com: I will not join together joining areas since there doesn't seem to be consensus on that. I think there is consensus that the nodes should be connected (and I'll even go so far to say it is wrong if they are not connected). The open question is whether

Re: [Tagging] Cleaning up

2010-05-05 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/5 Jonas Minnberg sas...@gmail.com: Well since we need space for all those thousands of sidewalks that people want to add maybe we better leave space around all roads anyway :) IMHO the sidewalk (and the street) are not part of the adjacent landuses anyway. I thought you were asking for

Re: [Tagging] Use of column and period in tagging namespace design

2010-05-05 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/5 ivom ivo.vdmaagdenb...@pandora.be: Just wondering when the use of : of . is most appropriate with regard to namespace tags in mind. Some examples like this tree:height=20m or shop.restaurant.parking=yes is what I mean. Is the : de-facto the namespace divider of choice or does the .

Re: [Tagging] tagging for discount stores in US

2010-05-06 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/6 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: On 6 May 2010 19:27, Richard Mann richard.mann.westoxf...@googlemail.com wrote: In the UK, they'd almost certainly be tagged as supermarkets, since our stores tend to have one product area dominant (eg groceries). Department stores are large

Re: [Tagging] Cleaning up

2010-05-06 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/6 Tyler Gunn ty...@egunn.com: Here's the same area in OSM; I've added a lot of detail to this shopping district including parking lots, buildings, and started to put in POIs.  I think this is a HUGE improvement over what Google Maps shows:

Re: [Tagging] tagging for discount stores in US

2010-05-06 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/6 John F. Eldredge j...@jfeldredge.com: From my experience (in the USA), most WalMarts and KMarts only allocate a small percentage of their floor space to groceries.  The so-called super WalMarts have a full range of groceries; even so, the grocery section takes up only 20 percent or

Re: [Tagging] Green areas that are not parks (revisited)

2010-05-06 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/6 Jonas Minnberg sas...@gmail.com: landuse=lawn (For smaller areas of kept grass that are either inaccessible or not meant to - you know - picnic on or similar). landuse=yard (For private backyards etc, usually inaccessible, even if they may look park-like on the satellite). For the

Re: [Tagging] tagging for discount stores in US

2010-05-06 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/6 Richard Welty rwe...@averillpark.net: most of these stores devote no more than 5 or 10% of their floorspace to food, and are otherwise inexpensive department stores, and i'm certainly having trouble seeing how 10% of their stock overrides the other 90% when it comes to tagging. I

Re: [Tagging] Cleaning up

2010-05-06 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/6 Tyler Gunn ty...@egunn.com: On Thu, 6 May 2010 12:37:10 +0200, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer +1, nice. cheers, Martin It definitely shows how incredibly pedestrian-unfriendly these big suburban box store malls are.  There are buildings in a sea of parking lots.  Lol. sure. Mapping

Re: [Tagging] Green areas that are not parks (revisited)

2010-05-06 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/6 Cartinus carti...@xs4all.nl: On Thursday 06 May 2010 15:06:36 Jonas Minnberg wrote: for the latter highway=pedestrian, area=yes. For accessibility use the access-tags, e.g. in your examples access=no and access=private. This would really confuse I think. This is not confusing,

Re: [Tagging] Green areas that are not parks (revisited)

2010-05-06 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/6 Petr Morávek [Xificurk] xific...@gmail.com: To the proposed solutions in this thread: * highway=pedestrian, area=yes - It doesn't really make sense to me to tag private fenced and _green_ areas by highway tag. sure, for green areas it isn't, for paved ones it IMO is. *

Re: [Tagging] Green areas that are not parks (revisited)

2010-05-07 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/7 Petr Morávek [Xificurk] xific...@gmail.com: * surface=grass, surface=lawn, surface=whatever - I don't like this because what I really want to map is not that my neighbour has a lawn behind his house, but the fact that there is a private green property add access=private? You

[Tagging] Draft - new barrier values

2010-05-12 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
I set up a page (Draft) for additional barrier-values. If you want to contribute I will be glad. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/New_barrier_types cheers, Martin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org

Re: [Tagging] Draft - new barrier values

2010-05-12 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/12 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/New_barrier_types Why not just start using these values? I'm already using them The whole proposal seems pretty inconsequential, it's not like you are trying to make a well sued highway

Re: [Tagging] Draft - new barrier values

2010-05-12 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/12 Craig Wallace craig...@fastmail.fm: On 12/05/2010 14:41, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer wrote: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/New_barrier_types I don't think barrier=swing_gate is really needed. Its still a type of gate, so it should just be tagged barrier=gate. Maybe

Re: [Tagging] Draft - new barrier values

2010-05-13 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/14 Steve Bennett stevag...@gmail.com: On Thu, May 13, 2010 at 12:05 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: The whole proposal seems pretty inconsequential, it's not like you are trying to make a well sued highway tagging scheme redundant. Do we agree there is a basic goal of

Re: [Tagging] Draft - new barrier values

2010-05-14 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/14 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: You missed the important point I made, which was the bit about these types of tags being incosequential in the entire scheme of things, documenting them is more important than any vote when it won't have any great effect on anything else. I

Re: [Tagging] Landuse border alignment

2010-05-14 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/14 Jonas Minnberg sas...@gmail.com: What about bordering buildings - ie buldings sharing walls but having different addresses/uses ? Is it better to draw the as a single area or as separate but with shared nodes? IMHO the more you can separate them, the better. Usually I would expect

Re: [Tagging] Green areas that are not parks (revisited)

2010-05-14 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/14 Petr Morávek [Xificurk] xific...@gmail.com: And the added bonus of abusing leisure=garden tag... Let me one more time explain what I think is wrong on this tag, so here is an example: Step two: Which one of these lines better describes the area? A) Place where flowers and other

Re: [Tagging] Green areas that are not parks (revisited)

2010-05-14 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/14 Petr Morávek [Xificurk] xific...@gmail.com: That's the part of copied text from wikipedia, that really significantly changed the meaning of leisure=garden page on OSM wiki. Take a look at the history, only few weeks ago the content said something completely different (although it was

Re: [Tagging] Landuse border alignment

2010-05-14 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/14 Jonas Minnberg sas...@gmail.com: Oh and I forgot: * landuse=grass overlapping landuse=wood, grass set as layer=-1 is this inside a building or are there platforms or what is the purpose of this layer-tag? cheers, Martin ___ Tagging

Re: [Tagging] Landuse border alignment

2010-05-14 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/14 Jonas Minnberg sas...@gmail.com: OK, some real world examples; * Two overlapping wood-areas, one named, the other not. Generally it's a good idea to tidy up your area, given you know the area, so in this case: either you know the extent of the named area in real life, or you

Re: [Tagging] Landuse border alignment

2010-05-14 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/14 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: On 15 May 2010 05:27, Jonas Minnberg sas...@gmail.com wrote: Oh and I forgot: * landuse=grass overlapping landuse=wood, grass set as layer=-1 Are you mixing up landuse and land cover by any chance? you're insisting on this one? Yes, you are

Re: [Tagging] Green areas that are not parks (revisited)

2010-05-14 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/14 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_garden http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_garden I don't really see what the big deal is, leisure=garden can mean a lot of different things to a lot of different people, so it needs to be sub-tagged, +1

Re: [Tagging] Green areas that are not parks (revisited)

2010-05-14 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/14 Liz ed...@billiau.net: On Sat, 15 May 2010, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer wrote: what if someone decides not to cut his grass? It would IMHO still be a  garden. My grass is rarely cut (climatic reasons) and we have left the main grassed area to become /meadow/. It's not a garden now in any

Re: [Tagging] Green areas that are not parks (revisited)

2010-05-14 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/15 Petr Morávek [Xificurk] xific...@gmail.com: but before neither ;-) I disagree, it was pretty simple to ask myself if the area is Place where flowers and other plants are grown in a decorative and structured manner or for scientific purposes. - Botanical garden - yes, Japanese

Re: [Tagging] land cover/surface=* tagging Re: Landuse border alignment

2010-05-14 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/14 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: On 15 May 2010 05:50, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: Thanks for opening a new thread. I filed a bug for surface=grass, we also possibly need one for natural=beach, surface=sand|gravel etc... +1 encourage people to change

Re: [Tagging] Roadside maps

2010-05-15 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/15 Jonas Minnberg sas...@gmail.com: Is it OK to use information you find on map-signs next to streets or suburban areas? Usually they show the houses and street names in a certain area (residential or commercial most often). None I have found have ever had any sort of copyright text on

Re: [Tagging] Parking Lots

2010-05-16 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/16 Pieren pier...@gmail.com: +1 I submitted a ticket to revert this change : http://trac.openstreetmap.org/ticket/2970 Mapnik cannot display all tags and all information in OSM. Showing all private things will result of an unreadable map. It depends on the way the information is

Re: [Tagging] Roadside maps

2010-05-16 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/16 Andre Engels andreeng...@gmail.com: That doesn't matter for OSM. All things are copyrighted, you said it yourself. Whether it's fact or knowledge doesn't matter. no, you can't put copyright on facts. cheers, Martin ___ Tagging mailing

Re: [Tagging] Updated cross-renderer/editor support table

2010-05-17 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/17 Steve Bennett stevag...@gmail.com: it doesn't seem to work for e.g. amenity=drinking_water (you list just Osmarender, but it is also displayed in Mapnik, the cyclemap and JOSM and probably others as well). cheers, Martin ___ Tagging mailing

Re: [Tagging] Landuse border alignment

2010-05-17 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/16 Zeke Farwell ezeki...@gmail.com: On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 10:29 AM, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: IMHO yes, as natural is mainly about landcover (what you physically encounter on the spot) while landuse is about usage. If you want do some extremely detailed

Re: [Tagging] Landuse border alignment

2010-05-17 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/17 Pieren pier...@gmail.com: On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 2:00 PM, Jonas Minnberg sas...@gmail.com wrote: I'm kind of considering if this is right or not - if a road is the divider between two landuses, is it still best to unglue it from the landuse(s) and move it into one or the other?

Re: [Tagging] Parking for businesses..

2010-05-18 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/18 Ulf Lamping ulf.lamp...@googlemail.com: Use access=permissive instead of access=customer and you get what's in use for years. +1 cheers, Martin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (Garden specification)

2010-05-18 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/18 Petr Morávek [Xificurk] xific...@gmail.com: Hi, I had finally some time to write down some proposal of sub-tagging for leisure=garden as discussed earlier. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Garden_specification Since I'm no big gardener any comments and

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (Garden specification)

2010-05-18 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
There is maybe also some potential conflict with allotment gardens? cheers, Martin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Parking for businesses..

2010-05-18 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/19 Greg Troxel g...@ir.bbn.com: I would call the first access=destination and the second access=permissive. yes, by thinking it over I also see some space for a restriction between permissive and private and destination is more elegant cause it uses an already introduced value for

Re: [Tagging] Fixed position GPS receivers

2010-05-18 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/19 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: On 19 May 2010 12:56, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: or at least a more specific tag than man_made=gps_receiver. If you want a dedicated tag use sth. like plate_tectonic_monitoring I wasn't feeling inspired today, which is why

Re: [Tagging] FW: Parking for businesses..

2010-05-20 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/19 Anthony o...@inbox.org: One problem I have with the concept of access=destination, even beyond the fact that it says right of access, is that parking lots quite often aren't connected to the places they serve.  Something like access=customer is therefore *more general*.  The parking

Re: [Tagging] Fixed position GPS receivers

2010-05-21 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/19 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: yes, I guess it helps more to speak German ;-). In German highway=ford translates to Furt and this is the definition in OSM. Mostly you can guess the meaning of tags by typing them into an English-German-dictionary and look up the various

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (Garden specification)

2010-05-22 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/19 Petr Morávek [Xificurk] xific...@gmail.com: I see your point... I think the wiki definition of landuse=recreation_ground is a bit in conflict with common sense (like the leisure=garden was) and it should be changed. I don't think so. Recreation ground is a term that is refering to

Re: [Tagging] wine roads in openstreetmap

2010-05-23 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/23 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: On 23 May 2010 08:24, Liz ed...@billiau.net wrote: If so, then a relation would be a sensible suggestion I think we have used relation for Tourist Route in Australia. Tourist routes aren't only used for winery tours, maybe there needs to be a

Re: [Tagging] What is a marina?

2010-05-28 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/28 Steve Bennett stevag...@gmail.com: When tagging an area leisure=marina, do you include: - just the area on water - the water and the immediate area around it (ie, slipways, mooring points etc) - facilities like boat storage I would include all of these. Probably this is a use

Re: [Tagging] Proposed feature : World wide place=* standardisation only based on population

2010-05-30 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/29 Roy Wallace waldo000...@gmail.com: Please compare this situation to what happened recently with the meaning of highway=*. Do you think highway=* tags are used to tag for the renderer? In some ways, yes, they are. But more specifically, highway=* tags are a very general and sometimes

Re: [Tagging] Proposed feature : World wide place=* standardisation only based on population

2010-05-30 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/28 sylvain letuffe li...@letuffe.org: showed the labels, but we created a list of cities because *those* *are* the cities in Italy. So every città in Italy is tagged place=city ? So you can have a 1 to 1 cittàcity ? So all this are tagged place=city :

Re: [Tagging] religion

2010-05-30 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/30 Liz ed...@billiau.net: If Neopaganism is what is meant, then why wasn't it used? +1 I also think that neopagan is closer to what is probably meant and avoid confusion with the christian point of view of seeing all non-christians as pagans. cheers, Martin

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - traffic jam warning

2010-05-31 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/31 Steve Bennett stevag...@gmail.com: IMHO, if there is not signage or some sort of official designation to back it up, this kind of subjective, user-supplied information belongs somewhere other than the OSM database. It's certainly valuable, if it is, I believe we should also put it

Re: [Tagging] Highway=raceway, leisure=track

2010-05-31 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/31 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: leisure=track is for racing animals like greyhounds/horses, although the map features page also suggests cycling. Besides cyclists and animals, isn't leisure=track used for tracks for running humans as well (like you can find in a stadium)?

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - traffic jam warning

2010-05-31 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/31 Steve Bennett stevag...@gmail.com: By permanent you presumably mean stable. Nodes and ways have IDs, so it doesn't seem like a difficult problem to me. if you're talking about static (OSM-)data this is indeed simple, otherwise it requires quite some effort: nodes are deleted, moved,

Re: [Tagging] religion

2010-05-31 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/31 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: together under a single banner. Buildings/temples and other places of worship still exist from these religions, like ancient Greek and Roman temples, pyramids in Egypt and south America, Stone Henge in the UK and native scared sites in various

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - traffic jam warning

2010-05-31 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/31 Pieren pier...@gmail.com: ...but it's not a reason to accept everything, especially data changing daily. yes, I totally agree that highly dynamic data like actual traffic jams are not to be put into OSM database, but here the suggestion was to put information about typical locations

Re: [Tagging] Proposed feature : World wide place=* standardisation only based on population

2010-06-01 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/28 sly (sylvain letuffe) sylv...@letuffe.org: First, I'm aware that full classification of every populated places is not possible world wide with one tag only, ...The problem I see with actual place usage is that it is not standardazided world wide ... IMHO place is a rough estimate

Re: [Tagging] Proposed feature : World wide place=* standardisation only based on population

2010-06-01 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/1 Martin Simon grenzde...@gmail.com: 2010/6/1 M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com: If you can read German I also suggest this one, which is not comparable to the English version: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stadt How about this approach? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki

Re: [Tagging] New Keys?

2010-06-01 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/1 Liz ed...@billiau.net: A large factory may consist of a number of smaller parts, some of which are workshops. Other areas may be assembly lines / bottling plants / first aid posts. of course, it might also have its own fire department, police, shops, restaurants, traffic enforcement,

Re: [Tagging] Beauty parlour

2010-06-02 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/2 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: On 2 June 2010 17:50, Pieren pier...@gmail.com wrote: It is a french word meaning ... 'shop'. So, what is suggested is shop=shop as a french reader could interpret it. Ain't english grand? From wikipedia: A boutique, from the French word for

Re: [Tagging] Proposed feature : World wide place=* standardisation only based on population

2010-06-02 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/2 Martin Simon grenzde...@gmail.com: For example, I've been in a Croatian Island for mapping, er, vacation last year. The capital of this island has half the population of the village in Germany where I lived in my childhood, but it's a real town, so simply tag it as place=town,

Re: [Tagging] Sedimentation tank

2010-06-03 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/3 M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com: 2010/6/2 y...@o2.pl y...@o2.pl: Hi, I'm wondering how to tag sedimentation tank at a sewage treatment. I'm thinking about 'landuse=reservoir' + 'man_made=sedimentation_tank'. +1, good suggestion I don't think it is useful (like

Re: [Tagging] Sedimentation tank

2010-06-03 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/3 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: On 3 June 2010 22:59, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: probably I wouldn't tag it as landuse=reservoir. Tag the tanks just as sedimentation_tank but use the landuse for the whole area (maybe industrial or something more specific

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting - Base transceiver station

2010-06-03 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/3 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: #2 is a tower for historical reasons only imho, yes, it might have been higher in the past presuming that the ground level now is higher, and the same as for #1 applies; #1 is just some shed/building, I wouldn't consider it a tower it isn't

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting - Base transceiver station

2010-06-03 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/3 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: This thread has gone from communication towers to other towers, in any case for #1 I'd be hard press to call this a tower, even if it had elevation due to geographical features, I'd go for command centre or something similar before I'd ever

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting - Base transceiver station

2010-06-03 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/3 Liz ed...@billiau.net: On Fri, 4 Jun 2010, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer wrote: if you see it in its historical context, it does look much more like a tower though: http://www.checkpoint-bravo.de/grafik/ausstellung.jpg It isn't a tower, but it functioned as a watchtower So is a tower in OSM

Re: [Tagging] Proposing bazaars

2010-06-07 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/7 y...@o2.pl y...@o2.pl: I was also thinking about marketplace=street_market rather than bazaar. But maybe there is a place for both tags, e.g. bazaar IMO looks like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Kapali_Carsi-Grand_Bazar-Istanbul-Sep08.jpg, this looks like highway=pedestrian to

Re: [Tagging] Cable distribution cabinet

2010-06-08 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/8 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: power=sub_station voltage:from=330kV voltage:to=100kV following recent discussions on Talk-DE, this would be power=station, while the power station (generating station) itself is called power=generator. At least that's what they wrote. or in

Re: [Tagging] [OSM-talk] Tagging wide steps (tribune / terrace)

2010-06-08 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/7 Roy Wallace waldo000...@gmail.com: On Mon, Jun 7, 2010 at 10:46 PM, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: Martin, I don't really know what you mean. Perhaps I don't understand the type=area proposal properly. Can you give us a full example (i.e. the tags) of how you

Re: [Tagging] [OSM-talk] Tagging wide steps (tribune / terrace)

2010-06-08 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/9 Roy Wallace waldo000...@gmail.com: So just to summarise, you would have a relation: type=area highway=steps step_count=15 (already documented on the wiki) with way members: role=lower, role=upper, and two role=lateral (I don't think these values need to be prefixed with steps:)

Re: [Tagging] [OSM-talk] Tagging wide steps (tribune / terrace)

2010-06-08 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/9 M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com: 0 for the lowest way 1 is at higher elevation than 0 2 3 sorry, forget about this, it makes things too complicated. cheers, Martin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http

Re: [Tagging] Cable distribution cabinet

2010-06-09 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/9 Steve Bennett stevag...@gmail.com: Yes, but this scheme will never work because it's totally at odds with English. When English is your second language, all tags seem equally arbitrary, but English speakers will expect power=station to be a power station, and power=sub_station to be a

Re: [Tagging] [OSM-talk] Tagging wide steps (tribune / terrace)

2010-06-10 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/10 fly lowfligh...@googlemail.com: validator gives warnings about the lower/upper way because these ways do not have any tag. Do we need a tag for these ways ? IMHO it shouldn't as the way is part of a relation. It doesn't for mp-relations for instance. cheers, Martin

Re: [Tagging] [OSM-talk] Tagging wide steps (tribune / terrace)

2010-06-10 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/10 fly lowfligh...@googlemail.com: http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/relation/957489 I still do not know where to put the information that you have to drop steps from the bottom and not from the top. if you have different amount of steps inside the area, you will currently have to

Re: [Tagging] [OSM-talk] Tagging wide steps (tribune / terrace)

2010-06-10 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/10 fly lowfligh...@googlemail.com: Have a look: http://www.fotocommunity.de/pc/pc/display/17927910 I said it is even more complicated and even on this picture you do not see all steps ! OK, but the steps on the picture are not that complicated. You need only 2 relations: one with 11

Re: [Tagging] [OSM-talk] Tagging wide steps (tribune / terrace)

2010-06-10 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/10 M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com: 2010/6/10 fly lowfligh...@googlemail.com: Have a look: http://www.fotocommunity.de/pc/pc/display/17927910 I said it is even more complicated and even on this picture you do not see all steps ! OK, but the steps on the picture

Re: [Tagging] highway=motorway and motorroad (implies)

2010-06-10 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/10 Elena of Valhalla elena.valha...@gmail.com: On 6/10/10, fly lowfligh...@googlemail.com wrote: Am 10.06.2010 15:23, schrieb Pieren:     1. I know some motorways which are not oneway. not in Europe yes, in Germany. If the Road is in/under cronstuction and also some ends of motorways.

Re: [Tagging] highway=motorway and motorroad (implies)

2010-06-10 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/10 Elena of Valhalla elena.valha...@gmail.com: On 6/10/10, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: http://de.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Datei:Zeichen_334.svgfiletimestamp=20060506221325 everything in between is a motorway. In Italy e.g. the end of motorway sign (like

Re: [Tagging] highway=motorway and motorroad (implies)

2010-06-12 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/12 Roy Wallace waldo000...@gmail.com: why not just service=motorway? To me, service=motorway implies that the feature is a motorway. How would you describe the feature? - use that as the value. +1, that's why it is considered appropriate: the service area is indeed part of the

Re: [Tagging] highway=motorway and motorroad (implies)

2010-06-13 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/12 Nathan Edgars II nerou...@gmail.com: class than the segments that prohibit bikes. They should be tagged highway=motorway bicycle=yes or bicycle=designated. +1, that's the point: tag the exception, and not bicycle=no on every other piece of motorway. At least for motorways this

Re: [Tagging] Aeroway=Aerodrome Modifier Tags?

2010-06-15 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/15 Zeke Farwell ezeki...@gmail.com: Well aeroway=helipad is documented on the wiki.  Doesn't render currently though. It does render in t...@h, mapnik doesn't show it. What about creating a site-relation for airports, where the runways are entered and the application can then decide

Re: [Tagging] highway=motorway and motorroad (implies)

2010-06-15 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/15 Steve Bennett stevag...@gmail.com: And since there isn't much difference between a shoulder and a bike lane there is a huge difference IMO. The presence of a bike lane suggests that the road was thought (or later adapted) also for bicycle use, it will usually be convenient to enter

Re: [Tagging] Aeroway=Aerodrome Modifier Tags?

2010-06-16 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/16 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: The problem with using subjective tagging is you can't easily quantify it, where as things like air traffic is objective. But what you can do is compare it to the surrounding / context / nationwide / worldwide. It's like the highway key for

Re: [Tagging] Aeroway=Aerodrome Modifier Tags?

2010-06-17 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/17 Zeke Farwell ezeki...@gmail.com: On Thu, Jun 17, 2010 at 12:21 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: Everything you talked about above is specifically about rendering, not about mapping, in terms of mapping airports you really need to base things on a 1:1 basis  If you

Re: [Tagging] What classification for a connecting link?

2010-06-17 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/17 char...@cferrero.net: The highway tag is the primary tag used for highways. It is often the only tag.  It is a very general and sometimes vague description of the importance of the highway for the road grid. The term importance isn't defined Why shouldn't importance not be

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting - Advanced stop line

2010-06-17 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/17 Alex Wardle awar...@gmx.com: Could people please look and vote on this proposal. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Advanced_stop_line IMHO before voting you should make the actual tags to describe the situation more visible on the proposal page. There were also

Re: [Tagging] What classification for a connecting link?

2010-06-18 Thread Mrtin Koppenhoefer
2010/6/18 Richard Mann richard.mann.westoxf...@googlemail.com: The first one is motorway_link, the second primary (because it's two-way), the third primary_link, the fourth could be just about anything from trunk to service. Mapnik makes a mess if a link intersects a service, but that's cos

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