Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-18 Thread NopMap
Hi! No idea what Oliver talked about either, but I work in the automotive industry myself. I can tell you that some of the major players have looked at using OSM data several times. They decided against it primarily because of the lack of a binding tagging scheme and the basic unreliability of

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-18 Thread Florian Lohoff
Hi, On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 08:41:02AM -0400, Phil! Gold wrote: Google appears to do both, probably because they've gotten really good at data conflation. They already pull data from multiple datasets, including proprietary data like Telenav's, public domain data from governments and such,

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-17 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
Am 17/mar/2014 um 02:28 schrieb Greg Morgan dr.kludge...@gmail.com: If I need to split a building, the original primary key does not stay with one of the two pieces of the building. Two new buildings are created with two new primary keys. as a side note this is not like you

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-17 Thread Serge Wroclawski
Alex, Some of the points you continue to make are patently false. 1. There is more open data coming online by the day and we are not compatible Let's take this apart. If the data is open, by which you mean that it would fall into something like the definition of freedomdefined.org, then there

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-17 Thread Michael Kugelmann
Am 17.03.2014 04:53, schrieb Hans Schmidt: If I, as a company, would use some map provider, I would definitely go for at least everywhere a minimum level of coverage instead of only a few places with excellent coverage. There was a comparison about Google and OSM a fow years ago. It showed that

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-17 Thread Johan C
So we're wondering why OpenStreetMap, being better (superior?) than Google in map data, is not used by commercial companies like BMW. Is there a native German on this list who can ask BMW why they're not using OSM? 2014-03-17 21:55 GMT+01:00 Michael Kugelmann michaelk_...@gmx.de: Am 17.03.2014

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-17 Thread Fernando Trebien
Possible reasons: - they don't want their clients to think they're being guided by maps that are not made by professionals (a silly prejudice) - they don't want to tell the world that OpenStreetMap exists by adding attribution to their software UI (possibly due to existing contracts or branding)

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-17 Thread Michael Kugelmann
Am 17.03.2014 23:05, schrieb Johan C: So we're wondering why OpenStreetMap, being better (superior?) than Google in map data, is not used by commercial companies like BMW. Is there a native German on this list who can ask BMW why they're not using OSM? for Navigation it's not only about having

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-17 Thread Christian Quest
Nobody remembers Bosch talk at SOTM Tokyo ? This make me think that the automotive industry is already working on using OSM data in the not so far future... and Bosch already have a bicycle oriented GPS using OSM: http://www.bosch-presse.de/presseforum/details.htm?txtID=6377locale=en 2014-03-18

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-16 Thread Florian Lohoff
Hi, On Sat, Mar 15, 2014 at 11:03:41AM -0400, Phil! Gold wrote: If, however, you want to foster a community around a larger scale project, I think share-alike is a better path to take. If OSM switched to public domain licensing today, there would almost certainly be more people using and

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-16 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
2014-03-16 10:38 GMT+01:00 Florian Lohoff f...@zz.de: We have much better Map Data - so why does BMW offer Google? My guess is that they are looking also beyond the German border when choosing their data provider ;-). Not everywhere our map is superior to Google's. And secondly, they might

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-16 Thread Phil! Gold
* Florian Lohoff f...@zz.de [2014-03-16 10:38 +0100]: On Sat, Mar 15, 2014 at 11:03:41AM -0400, Phil! Gold wrote: I suspect that Map Maker would attract more people that might otherwise have ended up contributing to OSM, which would hurt community growth and benefit Google at the expense of

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-16 Thread Lester Caine
Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: Not everywhere our map is superior to Google's. But in places where we are mapping fine detail that Google has no idea about we are ... In my area of the UK Google has large blank areas where OSM has all the footpaths and roadways that are needed simply to navigate

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-16 Thread Hans Schmidt
Am 17.03.2014 00:59, schrieb Lester Caine: But in places where we are mapping fine detail that Google has no idea about we are ... In my area of the UK Google has large blank areas where OSM has all the footpaths and roadways that are needed simply to navigate to many local businesses. Only

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-15 Thread Phil! Gold
* Alex Barth a...@mapbox.com [2014-03-13 10:26 -0400]: http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/lxbarth/diary/21221 This is really similar to the discussions that periodically happen in the open source software community over whether share-alike licenses like the GPL or open-use licenses like the

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-14 Thread Russ Nelson
Alex Barth writes: http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/lxbarth/diary/21221 Another aspect of where the ODbL hurts us: Because we are using a restrictive license, we cannot argue against other parties that use a restrictive license. Look at New York State's GIS Clearinghouse. Individuals not

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-14 Thread Steve Coast
I disagree. This is about money; my personal belief is that CloudMade would have made more dollars without having to ShareAlike. More business models open up, and it wouldn’t have had to deal with the community. Indeed I imagine this was a topic of continual discussion. The ODbL requires only

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-13 Thread Richard Weait
On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 10:26 AM, Alex Barth a...@mapbox.com wrote: Hello everyone - I've been sitting on writing about the detrimental effects of OpenStreetMap's share-alike license (ODbL) for a while and finally decided to, um, share. I've been listening long to many OpenStreetMappers I

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike

2014-03-13 Thread Ian Dees
Richard Weait wrote On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 10:26 AM, Alex Barth lt; alex@ gt; wrote: Hello everyone - I've been sitting on writing about the detrimental effects of OpenStreetMap's share-alike license (ODbL) for a while and finally decided to, um, share. I've been listening long to many