Re[2]: Troubles with an account...

2001-11-25 Thread Bonny

TF be easiest to cp the log here (go to the account and press
TF shft-crtl-A) right after a failed send attempt. This way, we can
TF analyse the problem for you.

This is what my LOG says:

!25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - Il messaggio non è stato inviato. Il server ha risposto 
-
!25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - Il server restituisce un errore. La risposta è: 
+25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - Connessione terminata - 0 di 4 messaggi inviati
?25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - Some messages were not sent - check the log for details

obviously it's italian, so I'll translate it for you all:

!25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - The message hasn't been sent. Server replied -
!25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - The server returns an error. The reply is:
+25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - Connection terminated - 0 of 4 messages sent
?25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - Some messages were not sent - check the log for details


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Re: Troubles with an account...

2001-11-25 Thread Thomas F

Hello Bonny,

On Sun, 25 Nov 2001 12:06:12 +0100 GMT (25/11/2001, 19:06 +0800 GMT),
Bonny wrote:

B !25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - The message hasn't been sent. Server replied -
B !25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - The server returns an error. The reply is:

The server does not give an error message. Hmm.

Check your POP settings. Also check whether you need some kind of
encryption to check your mail.

By the way, how did you read my message?

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Re[3]: Troubles with an account...

2001-11-25 Thread David Elliott

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Hi Bonny

On 25 November 2001 at 12:06:12 +0100 (which was 11:06 where I live) Bonny
rearranged electrons to get

B !25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - The message hasn't been sent. Server replied -
B !25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - The server returns an error. The reply is:
B +25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - Connection terminated - 0 of 4 messages sent
B ?25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - Some messages were not sent - check the log for 
details

I get this if I can not connect to the server.

- --

 Thanks,   ___
  David   |  SecureBat!  1.54/9/iKey1000  | E-mailaholics |
 _|  Win 2K Server  5.0.2195 SP2  | International |
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-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (MingW32)
Comment: GnuPG Signed, sealed, delivered.

iD8DBQE8APov+Yrx5mUPRTQRAhkeAJkBKbf7rfxRsiSYOR3YxYq3Q2vjMQCg8vYW
pWsWNYNpE0B6D87y942v+Ok=
=NMvm
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Re: How avoid header-quotation when forwarding?

2001-11-25 Thread Dierk Haasis

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Hello Peter!

On Samstag, 24. November 2001 at 21:32:46 you wrote:

 Either you have chosen to display RFC-822 headers in your viewer (menu
 View / RFC-822 headers) or you have to alter your Reply (why the
 subject is about 'Forwarding'?) template. If you in fact meant
 'forwarding' instead of 'replying' edit the forward template.
 Somewhere there the headers are included. Look for '%OFrom',
 '%OSubject' or in worst case '%HEADERS'.

Hmm, I see that you are answering the original question. But I think
that there is a very good reason behind leaving all RFC headers in a
forwarded message, don't you?


- --
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http://www.Write4U.de

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-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 6.5.8ckt
Comment: Privacy is the core element to Freedom!

iQA/AwUBPACmrPTo1oA8g8dLEQJkfACghgkDfLxDZxqcixLHRu+Te40+En8AoOFR
8lKIc42ydB2H2y0tpW3y4JUT
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Re: Troubles with an account...

2001-11-25 Thread Thomas F

Hello David,

On Sun, 25 Nov 2001 14:03:25 + GMT (25/11/2001, 22:03 +0800 GMT),
David Elliott wrote:

B !25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - The message hasn't been sent. Server replied -
B !25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - The server returns an error. The reply is:
  
DE I get this if I can not connect to the server.

I get Could not connect to server when that is the case.

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Re[2]: Troubles with an account...

2001-11-25 Thread David Elliott

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Hi Thomas

On 25 November 2001 at 22:35:21 +0800 (which was 14:35 where I live) Thomas
F rearranged electrons to get

B !25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - The message hasn't been sent. Server replied -
B !25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - The server returns an error. The reply is:
TF   
DE I get this if I can not connect to the server.

TF I get Could not connect to server when that is the case.

True.

It was a bit remiss of me I should have pointed out that I use a mapped port
with X-Ray so The Bat! believes that it has contacted a server but if X-Ray
can not contact server that this is what I get.

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-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (MingW32)
Comment: GnuPG Signed, sealed, delivered.

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1kGXGLEhT+Y0Jw7UJrLCSwc=
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Re: How avoid header-quotation when forwarding?

2001-11-25 Thread Peter Palmreuther

Hello Dierk,

On Sunday, 25. November 2001 at 10:07:06 you wrote (at least in
part):

DH But I think
DH that there is a very good reason behind leaving all RFC headers in a
DH forwarded message, don't you?

No I don't. I don't know why somebody should be interested in
full RFC-headers as macro '%HEADERS' outputs them.
I first wanted to get rid of that _full_ header quoting as requested,
the second step is to implement useful macros like '%SUBJECT',
'%OFROM', etc ...
Full RFC-headers contain also 'Received-Lines'  more that nobody else
is interested in.
If I want to forward a message 'like is' I could use the
'MIME-forward' option :-)
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Memos

2001-11-25 Thread Zach Robbins

I discovered on accident that memos can be appended to messages either
under composition, or in the message list window. This is done with
CTRL-Shift-I.

I'm using 1.53d. I don't see anything in the Help describing the memo
feature. Nor do I see any menu item or button that might conjure the
memo entry applet. Is this anything that might deserve a little more
publicity in TB!'s documentation?

Also, for those who have known about the feature's existence, what is
the most practical use you have for it? I was thinking that it could
be used as a way of categorizing messages for quick  accurate results
from using the Message Search function. Message Search does have a
checkbox for including the memo field in the search. Important
messages could be given memo keywords for ease of future searches.

Zach

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TB! V1.54/10 - SPAM blank messages

2001-11-25 Thread jan

Hello TBUDListers.

   I have started getting SPAM msgs that are blank (text)
   with HTML links.

   No commonalities that I can find in the headers.

   Any ideas how I can filter these out?

   TIA

-- 
Jan Rifkinson
Ridgefield, CT USA
TB! V1.54/10/W2K_SP2/PGP Key ID: 0x3F14A060
ICQ 41116329


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Could it be a non-working SMTP address?

2001-11-25 Thread Kara Denizi

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

G'day Bonny

Sunday, November 25, 2001, 06:06:12, you wrote:

B This is what my LOG says:...

B obviously it's italian, so I'll translate it for you all:

B !25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - The message hasn't been sent.
Server replied -
B !25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - The server returns an error. The
reply is:
B +25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - Connection terminated - 0 of 4
messages sent
B ?25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - Some messages were not sent - check
the log for details

I have no idea if it's related but most of yesterday when I tried to
send messages they weren't sent.  When I looked in the log I saw
this:
 ! has not been sent.  Server reply -- replying to  email address
 given here  prohibited by administrator.

After checking and double checking all my settings I still couldn't
figure out what the problem was.  Finally I called my ISP (Internet
Service Provider) and found the error was some software problem on
their
SMTP server.  They gave  me a different address to use for SMTP
purposes
and that cured the problem.

Again, don't know if that's your difficulty but it might be worth
checking with your ISP.

- - --

Cordially

 Karamailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: PGP 7.0.4
Comment: For Public Key go to: http://home.earthlink.net/~karadenizi

iQA/AwUBPAFNuV53vJhoKTxHEQI15ACgr4DUi/5TUl9MWfxM0mPK0WUFOJQAn0+T
3BqAT5qNhKKC/goYWhw6YlTC
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Re[2]: Troubles with an account...

2001-11-25 Thread Bonny

Ciao Thomas,

nel remoto Sunday, November 25, 2001, 2:49:26 PM, mi giunse:

TF Hello Bonny,

TF On Sun, 25 Nov 2001 12:06:12 +0100 GMT (25/11/2001, 19:06 +0800 GMT),
TF Bonny wrote:

B !25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - The message hasn't been sent. Server replied -
B !25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - The server returns an error. The reply is:

TF The server does not give an error message. Hmm.

TF Check your POP settings. Also check whether you need some kind of
TF encryption to check your mail.

TF By the way, how did you read my message?


I can READ every message, but not reply... listen: I've found out that
using The Bat! from the PC that's DIRECTLY connected to the Internet
everything works fine, but behind that machine, the client sends only
messages which are smaller tha 1500 bytes (maybe the MTU of the
LAN?!?)...

What can you suggest? (I'm now on the Internet connected PC)

-- 
Saluti, Bonny
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


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Re: Could it be a non-working SMTP address?

2001-11-25 Thread Bonny

Ciao Kara,

nel remoto Sunday, November 25, 2001, 9:00:08 PM, mi giunse:

KD -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
KD Hash: SHA1

KD G'day Bonny

KD Sunday, November 25, 2001, 06:06:12, you wrote:

B This is what my LOG says:...

B obviously it's italian, so I'll translate it for you all:

B !25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - The message hasn't been sent.
KD Server replied -
B !25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - The server returns an error. The
KD reply is:
B +25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - Connection terminated - 0 of 4
KD messages sent
B ?25/11/2001, 11.50.09: SEND  - Some messages were not sent - check
KD the log for details

KD I have no idea if it's related but most of yesterday when I tried to
KD send messages they weren't sent.  When I looked in the log I saw
KD this:
KD  ! has not been sent.  Server reply -- replying to  email address
KD  given here  prohibited by administrator.

KD After checking and double checking all my settings I still couldn't
KD figure out what the problem was.  Finally I called my ISP (Internet
KD Service Provider) and found the error was some software problem on
KD their
KD SMTP server.  They gave  me a different address to use for SMTP
KD purposes
KD and that cured the problem.

KD Again, don't know if that's your difficulty but it might be worth
KD checking with your ISP.

KD - - --

KD Cordially

KD  Karamailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

KD -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
KD Version: PGP 7.0.4
KD Comment: For Public Key go to: http://home.earthlink.net/~karadenizi

KD iQA/AwUBPAFNuV53vJhoKTxHEQI15ACgr4DUi/5TUl9MWfxM0mPK0WUFOJQAn0+T
KD 3BqAT5qNhKKC/goYWhw6YlTC
KD =vB+q
KD -END PGP SIGNATURE-



ISP is OK... I use it from my Internet connected PC (the other has a
LAN connection).

-- 
Saluti, Bonny
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


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Re: Could it be a non-working SMTP address?

2001-11-25 Thread Lars Geiger

Hi Bonny,
On Sunday, November 25, 2001 at 22:29:05 [GMT +0100], you wrote:

B ISP is OK... I use it from my Internet connected PC (the other has a
B LAN connection).

What router programme do you use?

Does your problem also occur with a different email program? (Although
I really know better I will now say the evil words: Outlook Express, or
some other MUA?)

-- 
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Lars

The Bat! 1.54/10 on Windows NT 5.0 Build 2195 Service Pack 2
 
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screwed up admin rights..please help

2001-11-25 Thread Rick Reumann

I don't know what the heck I did. I was trying to set up a group so my wife could 
check her email accounts and I (the admin) could check mine. I tried setting up a 
group called 'rick' and a group called 'rachel' and tried giving each a password. For 
some reason I can only log in to my wife's account and I can't seem to log in to mine. 
Is there anyone that could help? The help files were very inadequate in trying to 
explain setting up this group stuff and I know I should have been more careful. I know 
the two group names I used (rick and rachel) and I know the only two passwords I tried 
to set up, but no combination seems to get open the main admin accounts. What can I 
do? This is very frustrating.
Thanks so much for any help.
Rick

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Re[2]: Beta Version

2001-11-25 Thread Haye

Saturday, November 24, 2001, 11:23:11 PM, you wrote:


[...]

R And where can I get Beta/10 ?

MDP You could try RITLabs FTP site ftp://ftp.ritlabs.com/pub/the_bat/beta.
MDP The latest beta is 10e. I'm not certain whether or not you'll be able
MDP to get 10.

 i don't see the latest beta is 10e, but tb154b10.rar :)


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more on screwed up adiminstration

2001-11-25 Thread Rick Reumann

A little more info if it helps on trying to figure out what the heck I did wrong and 
how to fix it.

When I type in rachel who is just supposed to be a user and don't put in a password 
I get in to the Bat as a rachel user and see the one account.

When I type in rick who is supposed to be the admin (me) and no password I don't get 
an error message or anything ..it just sort of hangs on that log in window. I have to 
ctrl-alt-delete end task. Any of the passwords I try to get in don't work either (and 
I know which password I would have used).

I'm still stumped. Should I do what someone on another thread mentioned and delete the 
user info key in the registry and then the users.ini file under mail?

Maybe there is something else I could try?

Thanks
Rick

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Re: more on screwed up adiminstration

2001-11-25 Thread Thomas F

Hi Rick,

On Sun, 25 Nov 2001 21:24:38 -0500GMT (26/11/2001, 10:24 +0800GMT),
Rick Reumann wrote:

RR When I type in rick who is supposed to be the admin (me) and no password I don't 
get 
RR an error message or anything ..it just sort of hangs on that log in window. I have 
to 
RR ctrl-alt-delete end task. Any of the passwords I try to get in don't work either 
(and 
RR I know which password I would have used).

I don't really know this, but it sounds to me like TB requires a
password for the admin account. You created the admin log-on without
password, right? Could me a bug.

RR I'm still stumped. Should I do what someone on another thread mentioned and delete 
the 
RR user info key in the registry and then the users.ini file under mail?

I would have no other idea, but wait until the day shift wakes up. ;-)

RR Maybe there is something else I could try?

Johnny Walker Black Label usually helps to bridge the time.

-- 

Cheers,
Thomas.

Moderator der deutschen The Bat! Beginner Liste. Anmeldung unter:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  

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Re: Troubles with an account...

2001-11-25 Thread Thomas F

Hi Bonny,

On Sun, 25 Nov 2001 22:27:21 +0100GMT (26/11/2001, 05:27 +0800GMT),
Bonny wrote:

TF Check your POP settings. Also check whether you need some kind of
TF encryption to check your mail.

B I can READ every message, but not reply... listen: I've found out that
B using The Bat! from the PC that's DIRECTLY connected to the Internet
B everything works fine, but behind that machine, the client sends only
B messages which are smaller tha 1500 bytes (maybe the MTU of the
B LAN?!?)...

I think you have just answered your own question. ;-)

B What can you suggest? (I'm now on the Internet connected PC)

Talk to your sysad, he set the limit too small. If it were me, I would
send it to 100K, or in these days of brandband connections, to 1MB.
But 1.5K is certainly to small.

-- 

Cheers,
Thomas.

Moderator der deutschen The Bat! Beginner Liste. Anmeldung unter:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  

Message reply created with The Bat! 1.53t
under Chinese Windows 98 4.10 Build 1998  
on a Pentium II/350 MHz.


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Re: more on screwed up adiminstration

2001-11-25 Thread Rick Reumann




On 26 Nov 2001 at 11:17, Thomas F wrote:

 Hi Rick,
 
 On Sun, 25 Nov 2001 21:24:38 -0500GMT (26/11/2001, 10:24 +0800GMT),
 Rick Reumann wrote:
 
 RR When I type in rick who is supposed to be the admin (me) and no
 password I don't get RR an error message or anything ..it just sort
 of hangs on that log in window. I have to RR ctrl-alt-delete end
 task. Any of the passwords I try to get in don't work either (and RR
 I know which password I would have used).
 
 I don't really know this, but it sounds to me like TB requires a
 password for the admin account. You created the admin log-on without
 password, right? Could me a bug.
 
 RR I'm still stumped. Should I do what someone on another thread
 mentioned and delete the RR user info key in the registry and then
 the users.ini file under mail?
 
 I would have no other idea, but wait until the day shift wakes up. ;-)
 
 RR Maybe there is something else I could try?

I managed to get in. I'll have to really learn more about how 
to set up this account/groups stuff. Is there some good 
documentation on how do it correctly? I thought I could set up 
an admin group called rick but for somereason in order for 
me to get in I had to try [EMAIL PROTECTED] and then use the 
password I associated with this account. Maybe that's the way 
it's supposed to work.

Now the question is  in the meantime until I can learn how 
to use this group set up, how do I turn it off so that I do 
not have to log in?

(In case anyone cares all I want to have done is have a 
seperate log in for me, my wife, and my brother. When the log 
in I only want them to see their accounts and not the others. 
Is this easy to do? I was close to figuring it out but I must 
be screwing something up. Somehow when I set up my wife's 
account it didn't have a password for her group access. She 
just typed rachel and she was able to get in with no 
password. It's actually ok if their is no password for them. I 
just want them all to be able to use the Bat but only see 
their account mailboxes).

Thanks for eveyone's patience:)
Rick





 
 Johnny Walker Black Label usually helps to bridge the time.
 
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 Cheers,
 Thomas.
 
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Re[2]: more on screwed up adiminstration

2001-11-25 Thread Rick Reumann


 Ok, I think I have 'most' of this admistration stuff figured out
 but I still have a couple questions:

 1) Is there a way I can set up users such that they can change
 the options of how they receive mail and yet I (the admin) could
 have different options set up for their accounts? In other words
 I want be able to have control over the rest of my family's
 accounts that reside at [EMAIL PROTECTED] but when I log in and see
 all their accounts I don't want to have their accounts being
 checked for mail all the time while I am logged on. However, when
 they log on I want them to be able to have their accounts check
 for mail at start up and get mail every so-many minutes.
 Whatever account I am under, whether my admin account or their
 user account, changing the options for that account changes the
 settings for both the admin and the user.

 2) My default account is [EMAIL PROTECTED] Is there a way I can
 log in as simply rick with a password vs having to type in
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Not a big deal, but thought I'd ask.

 Thanks again,
 Rick

 


On Sunday, November 25, 2001, 10:52:52 PM, you wrote:




RR On 26 Nov 2001 at 11:17, Thomas F wrote:

 Hi Rick,
 
 On Sun, 25 Nov 2001 21:24:38 -0500GMT (26/11/2001, 10:24 +0800GMT),
 Rick Reumann wrote:
 
 RR When I type in rick who is supposed to be the admin (me) and no
 password I don't get RR an error message or anything ..it just sort
 of hangs on that log in window. I have to RR ctrl-alt-delete end
 task. Any of the passwords I try to get in don't work either (and RR
 I know which password I would have used).
 
 I don't really know this, but it sounds to me like TB requires a
 password for the admin account. You created the admin log-on without
 password, right? Could me a bug.
 
 RR I'm still stumped. Should I do what someone on another thread
 mentioned and delete the RR user info key in the registry and then
 the users.ini file under mail?
 
 I would have no other idea, but wait until the day shift wakes up. ;-)
 
 RR Maybe there is something else I could try?

RR I managed to get in. I'll have to really learn more about how 
RR to set up this account/groups stuff. Is there some good 
RR documentation on how do it correctly? I thought I could set up 
RR an admin group called rick but for somereason in order for 
RR me to get in I had to try [EMAIL PROTECTED] and then use the 
RR password I associated with this account. Maybe that's the way 
RR it's supposed to work.

RR Now the question is  in the meantime until I can learn how 
RR to use this group set up, how do I turn it off so that I do 
RR not have to log in?

RR (In case anyone cares all I want to have done is have a 
RR seperate log in for me, my wife, and my brother. When the log 
RR in I only want them to see their accounts and not the others. 
RR Is this easy to do? I was close to figuring it out but I must 
RR be screwing something up. Somehow when I set up my wife's 
RR account it didn't have a password for her group access. She 
RR just typed rachel and she was able to get in with no 
RR password. It's actually ok if their is no password for them. I 
RR just want them all to be able to use the Bat but only see 
RR their account mailboxes).

RR Thanks for eveyone's patience:)
RR Rick





 
 Johnny Walker Black Label usually helps to bridge the time.
 
 -- 
 
 Cheers,
 Thomas.
 
 Moderator der deutschen The Bat! Beginner Liste. Anmeldung unter:
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
 
 Message reply created with The Bat! 1.53t
 under Chinese Windows 98 4.10 Build 1998  
 on a Pentium II/350 MHz.
 
 
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Rick

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When you go in for a job interview, I think a good thing to ask is if
they ever press charges.


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Re: Hotmail and the Bat?

2001-11-25 Thread Angel

Hi there ,

 I can't see one, but is there a way as in Outlook Express to
 download mail from a Hotmail account into The Bat?

P If Hotmail gives you a POP server that you can log onto, then you can.
Hotmail does not offer POP3 email checking from your favorite email
program such as TB!. In essence, if you do not utilize a 3rd party
program such as Web2Pop to access Hotmail's web-based email via POP3
from your email program, you must access your email via the Web.
Hotmail does, however, have the option for you to POP3 check your OTHER
email accounts, if you wish it to do so. But: you must still access
the mail via the Web.

P I have Yahoo accounts with which I both receive and send email with
P TB, but Yahoo is more open about such things than MSFT.
Yahoo is one of a few good email services which DOES allow for POP3
checking with your favorite email program. In TB! Archives, there are
several email threads discussing this in which quite a few web-based
email programs offer POP3 accessibility.

Ciao for now,
~~~Angel

-- 

Sunday, November 25, 2001 9:21:17 PM


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Beta testers page

2001-11-25 Thread Rémi Pach


What happened to the beta testers only page? It has disappeared. One
can't access betas any more.

The link to the TBBeta mailing list and mailing list archive is also
gone. Can someone explain?

Rémi Pach


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Re: Beta testers page

2001-11-25 Thread Thomas F

Hi Rémi,

On Mon, 26 Nov 2001 07:35:52 +0200GMT (26/11/2001, 13:35 +0800GMT),
Rémi Pach wrote:

RP What happened to the beta testers only page? It has disappeared. One
RP can't access betas any more.

Correct.

RP The link to the TBBeta mailing list and mailing list archive is also
RP gone. Can someone explain?

If you are a beta tester, you will be subscribed to TBBETA where this
was explained. If not, you don't need the beta page anyway. ;-)

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Re[2]: Beta testers page

2001-11-25 Thread Rémi Pach

Thomas F wrote:

 If you are a beta tester, you will be subscribed to TBBETA

Not necessarily. I just like to try out betas. I don't like to
subscribe to too many lists.

I just wanted to know what's happening to the beta policy and how one
can get hold of future betas. It may have been discussed there but I
can't see anything in the list archives on that topic. Can someone
explain in a few words?

Thanks in advance,

Rémi Pach


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Re: Beta testers page

2001-11-25 Thread Thomas F

Hi Rémi,

On Mon, 26 Nov 2001 09:25:12 +0200GMT (26/11/2001, 15:25 +0800GMT),
Rémi Pach wrote:

 If you are a beta tester, you will be subscribed to TBBETA

RP Not necessarily. I just like to try out betas. I don't like to
RP subscribe to too many lists.

Excuse me, how do you test betas if you don't get the changelog (it's
posted only on TBBETA)? How do you confirm bugs that have been
discovered by others (or not)? How do you give feedback to the
developers (the whole point of beta testing)?

RP I just wanted to know what's happening to the beta policy and how
RP one can get hold of future betas.

Beta versions are not public any more, but only for TBBETA list
subscribers. For good reason. However, you are welcome to subscribe,
and to contribute your findings with the betas you download.

-- 

Cheers,
Thomas.

Moderator der deutschen The Bat! Beginner Liste. Anmeldung unter:
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