Ulrich Bangert wrote:
Jim,
pardon if I correct you: The reciprocal counters were an intermediate thing
between the counting only and the subclock interpolating ones. A reciprocal
counter would notice when a frequency measurement would be too imprecise due
to an arkward relationship between that
Hi Bob,
I took a look at the 10MHz output. The unit had been unpowered on my
bench for an hour or so. It took about 10 minutes to stabilize at 1.9Hz
on the high side of 10MHz as measured on a GPS-referenced counter.
Oscilloscope indicates a level of about +12dBm and a clean looking sine
wave.
Hi
I suspect that the unit puts out an ok 10 MHz signal. That would suggest that
the +12 and likely the +5 supplies are ok. If the monitor software can talk to
it, that's another indication that the +/-12 and +5 are fairly close to
working.
I think that a problem with the GPS front end / ante
The voltages I measure are 11.8, -12.3 and 4.9VDC. Those measurements
are with the unit operating and the power supplies under normal load.
There is 4.7VDC on the feed to the antenna, that is with the coax
attached to the Thunderbolt.
Arthur's suggestion that something is amiss in the RF sect
The TB has an error flag if there is no antenna connected (open) or if it is
shorted. The tboltmon PC software reports these flags, and so does my GPSMon
firmware in the fluke.l monitor.
It is possible but unlikely that there would be something wrong with the bias
circuit that would not be repo
> Warren, can you please clarify. From what I can see it actually
> uses a Minicircuits phase detector, right? That suggests what is
> being observed is a phase difference between the DUT and the
> REF, not a frequency difference.
>
> That analog phase measurement is then filtered and amplified
>
Where does the "1e-15" figure come from? Is that phase and
are the units seconds or radians? Or is that relative frequency
at the mixer, if so over what tau does it refer to?
I'm curious how you measured or calculated the 1e-15 number.
Saying "very nearly zero" doesn't mean much to me. In science
My understanding is that you have the older red box. Manual for the red box
is there:
http://www.ko4bb.com/Manuals/05%29_GPS_Timing/Trimble/Trimble_-_Thunderbolt/
ThunderBolt_Datasheet_%28red_box%29.pdf
The power spec is 24V nominal, 18V min to 36V max
Mine has been running off a small open fram
Hi
Yup, 10 neons in a column for readout of each decade. Lots of mercury vapor
triodes in each decade. Even back 40 years ago the triodes weren't all that
common. Today .. who knows.
Bob
On Jun 10, 2010, at 7:32 PM, Leigh L. Klotz, Jr. WA5ZNU wrote:
> There will likely be one of these at the
There will likely be one of these at the Electronics Flea Market in
Cupertino, CA this Saturday. I saw it last month with a $20 price tag,
but my guess is that if you can lift it it's yours. it's the one with the
stack of neon blubs for each digit. (Somewhere I have one in a garage as
well...)
L
In a message dated 10/06/2010 20:14:40 GMT Daylight Time,
stev...@suddenlink.net writes:
Input voltage to the poor performing unit is about 28VDC. I did the
tboltmon.exe Factory Reset with no discernible difference in
performance. It is the Thunderbolt model in the aluminum housing with
It may or may not tell you what's wrong but a quick check of the
Thunderbolt would be to put a tee in series with the antenna and
see if the unit is supplying +5 volts under load to the antenna.You
have verified that the antenna works with a second unit so you can
rule that out. Where you are
Hi
I would certainly check the solder connections to the RF and power connectors
on the PC board. Some of them apparently didn't get a real good solder job when
they were new.
Bob
On Jun 10, 2010, at 3:09 PM, Steve wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I have used a Trimble Thunderbolt for several years as
Hi
Any idea what the phase noise floor is on them?
Bob
On Jun 10, 2010, at 2:25 PM, Corby Dawson wrote:
> I have purchased a few of the Z1B base kits from Clifton Labs, Jack
> Smith and am very impressed by them.
>
> I am using them as isolation amps in a DMTD unit.
>
> At 5Mhz the rever
Hi all,
I have used a Trimble Thunderbolt for several years as a source for
accurate 10MHz signals for counters and signal generators. I have
occasionally looked at the Thunderbolt with a laptop and Lady Heather,
but have largely treated the Thunderbolt as a
plug-and-play-and-forget-about-it
Tom
The ADC is measuring the EFC averaged voltage signal.
I think all understand that the EFC controls the Frequency of the Ref OSC.
This EFC voltage (freq) is what the external S/W uses to convert the two
oscillator differences into ADEV.
The Phase difference at the phase detector output is h
Ulrich posted:
"I know you like my software"
an understatment, I love your "PLOTTER" software,
without it I could of not, or at least would not, of done much of this.
Thanks for you comments.
I hope you do not take my poor communication skills and direct ways, wrong
or personal.
Hopeful we ca
Hi Steve,
I don't know what the issue is, but my experience was very similar. My Tbolt
is the same (or very similar) to yours and worked fine for a few years off and
on. When Lady Heather became available, I took it out again. It worked great
with the antenna indoors in my lab for about
Magnus,
The Agilent Z3815A is a very nice unit, and fairly easy to get going.
The main problem is software, which we had to specially write, although
some versions of Ulrich's Z38XX work with it quite well. (The problem is
subtle differences in the SCPI syntax).
Yes, the backplane carries all th
In a message dated 10/06/2010 23:34:05 GMT Daylight Time,
hol...@hotmail.com writes:
I'm not sure of the required power spec, but 28V may be too low. These
were meant to run off a telco power bus (nominal 48V).
I run mine at 40V (from a Tek PS503A mounted in a TM501 mainframe, unit
con
I'm not sure of the required power spec, but 28V may be too low. These were
meant to run off a telco power bus (nominal 48V).
I run mine at 40V (from a Tek PS503A mounted in a TM501 mainframe, unit
connected across the + and - supply terminals, outputs set to +/- 20V). It
won't run at 2
Fact #1) the TPLL uses Freq not phase,
Warren, can you please clarify. From what I can see it actually
uses a Minicircuits phase detector, right? That suggests what is
being observed is a phase difference between the DUT and the
REF, not a frequency difference.
That analog phase measurement is
I have purchased a few of the Z1B base kits from Clifton Labs, Jack
Smith and am very impressed by them.
I am using them as isolation amps in a DMTD unit.
At 5Mhz the reverse isolation is -110db and at 10Mhz it's better than
-100.
Stringing two in series would be overkill but would give you
Hi
+/- 300 ns is doing quite well with a 2000C. How far are you from the
SOUSTONS station?
At least here in the US, they sometimes would do odd things to the slaves on
a given chain. Chain masters always *seemed* to less likely to have strange
jumps in them.
Bob
-Original Message-
From
Hello!
Thanks to a smart member of this group, I am being able to receive
consistently the SOUSTONS X-Ray slave of the European LESSAY (6731)
chain with my Austron 2000C.
After more than a week of continuous 1PPS phase comparaison between
my TBolt and Soustons, with an absolute maximum deviation
Hi
You could always set up a Beckman EPUT meter to do period and get
effectively the same sort of result. No solid state in them at all. Full of
warm glowing stuff (some of it glowed yellow, some of it glowed purple).
Bob
-Original Message-
From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-n
Hi Jim,
You're showing your age (you young whippersnapper!).
?? "They've been around at least since the 80s,..."
Well, my General Radio 1159 Recipromatic Counters are from 1968 - built using
those new transistor thingies and with the warm glow of Nixie tube readout.
Best,
Jerry
Message: 2
Jim,
pardon if I correct you: The reciprocal counters were an intermediate thing
between the counting only and the subclock interpolating ones. A reciprocal
counter would notice when a frequency measurement would be too imprecise due
to an arkward relationship between that gate time and the freque
Steve,
I do not want to comment the whole of your posting because I am tired of the
discussion myself too.
But if I read things like:
> The measurement of phase data is
> taken over the current period of each waveform and therefore,
> assuming the waveform contains noise, each measurement will
Ulrich Bangert wrote:
The next improvement to the old fashioned pure counter was the invention of
subclock interpolation schemes. A counter using this works so: After the
beginning of the gate time it waits of the next zero crossing and then
measures the time up to the last zero crossing wi
Ulrich,
May I please tackle some points here please. Regarding Warren's
implementation of the TPLL, these points have been covered before,
several times, but there is obviously an inability for either Warren
or myself to communicate effectively on these matters.
On 10 June 2010 22:36, Ulrich Bang
Warren,
I know you like my software and therefore please allow me to put my 50 cts.
into the discussion:
> The reason that the simple TPLL works so good
> but is hard for some "experts" to accept, seems
> to come down to the fact that this method uses
> Frequency and not Phase to make the raw
Hi!
I just got a HP Z3815A but it seems like it is a bit of a challenge to
hook it up. I see one large connector for some bus-structure, but don't
know the pinning. There is also an 8 coax connector, where I suspect the
antenna, 10 MHz, PPS and other generated frequencies pop out. The RS-232
Bill,
I think I have already shown my position on this whole matter from my
previous posts and understand what Warren is alluding to but I'm just
trying to assist him make his case in a way that is acceptable to
other members on this list.
On 10 June 2010 17:35, WB6BNQ wrote:
> Steve,
>
> I have
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