Re: [time-nuts] Ublox neo-7M GPS

2014-08-21 Thread SAIDJACK
Hal, Except for a few magic target frequencies, the output will have occasional (or frequent) missing or extra cycles. The output will be clean if you are dividing by a power of 2. (By switching from 10 MHz to 8 MHz, you have changed from frequent to occasional.) Not true that

Re: [time-nuts] Ublox neo-7M GPS

2014-08-20 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Tony, that's consistent with what I remember. Do you have the capability to count the number of 10MHz pulses per second to see if it is phase-coherent with the UTC 1PPS pulse? I am thinking that the software may be using statistics to approximate 10 million cycles per second, which

Re: [time-nuts] Ublox neo-7M GPS

2014-08-19 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Graham, its not a GPSDO though, not even a simple one :) It does not discipline an oscillator. It generates the output by mathematically calculating how many phases it has to add/drop in a second, then digitally adds/drops/extends/retards the phase of the output clock to achieve an

Re: [time-nuts] Ublox neo-7M GPS

2014-08-19 Thread SAIDJACK
Hal, I guess that depends on your definition of disciplined. The products that I am familiar with don't consider adjusting phase length of an asynchronously running oscillator on a cycle-to-cycle basis thousands of times per second to try to fit 10 million of them (or whatever your

Re: [time-nuts] Ublox neo-7M GPS

2014-08-19 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Tom, last time I looked at these I tried figuring out what they were doing. It is very hard to get measurement data, our TSC did not converge on their signal, and looking at the output on a scope revealed only a bunch of crazy random phase jumps. I guess one could use a counter to

Re: [time-nuts] CW12-TIM

2014-07-14 Thread SAIDJACK
Good point. I am a sucker for great surplus equipment too, in fact I have two rooms full of stuff most of which is used from time to time.. I envy Tom's collection. I think we need to have a Time Nuts For Dummies article written that takes J. Vig's writing and puts it into much less of a

Re: [time-nuts] CW12-TIM

2014-07-12 Thread SAIDJACK
Graham, I think that is the real challenge here: most folks don't know what precise means for them. Timing is such a novel technology that most folks are amazed that we are trying to get parts per trillion (or better) accuracy and stability! We get customers all the time that want very

Re: [time-nuts] Sad news Ulrich Bangert

2014-06-26 Thread SAIDJACK
So does anyone know how/why he died? Does anyone have the actual sources for his tools? All I know is that he told me he used a very old database program to write them under Borland or something like that.. Bye, Said In a message dated 6/26/2014 12:16:18 Pacific Daylight Time,

Re: [time-nuts] GPSDO standard interface?

2014-06-26 Thread SAIDJACK
I dislike TSIP quite a bit. It's a disaster in my opinion if you are not intimately familiar already with the Trimble binary commands, and exists in a number of inconsistent and non-compatible dialects as far as I know. No way for a human to enter a simple command in a simple text terminal,

Re: [time-nuts] FE5680 GPS Disciplined Controller Update

2014-06-24 Thread SAIDJACK
Tom, airflow, or changes in airflow are typically much worse for ADEV than actual ambient temperature changes in still air. In still air for example a typical Eurocan DOCXO will have a case temp of about 55C to 60C at 25C ambient. Turn on any kind of significant airflow over that part and

Re: [time-nuts] Sad news Ulrich Bangert

2014-06-20 Thread SAIDJACK
Wow, that's a shock. He was such a nice guy, always supporting requests for changes etc. Very sad. He was quite young as well! Our condolences to his wife and family. Said In a message dated 6/20/2014 13:58:36 Pacific Daylight Time, timen...@paesler.de writes: Dear group,

Re: [time-nuts] Fwd: CGSIC: Known Problem With Certain GPS Devices

2014-05-15 Thread SAIDJACK
It would be good to understand which receivers are adversely affected by this.. the USCG did not list affected vendors/devices.. In a message dated 5/15/2014 15:19:51 Pacific Daylight Time, mag...@rubidium.dyndns.org writes: Hi fellow time-nuts, I think this message is interesting. It

Re: [time-nuts] Rb vs.Crystal OCXO

2014-04-28 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Hans, in order not to chase the tempco and aging algorithm (it will reset the values by itself every 10 minutes while locked to GPS as you have noted) you may simply turn tempco and aging compensation off manually during your test period. This can be done by the serv:tas x, yy...

Re: [time-nuts] Symmetricom chip scale atomic clock

2014-04-24 Thread SAIDJACK
Hello everyone, let me address the below claims and commentary which was posted without first consulting with us. Microsemi has recently seen a slightly higher failure rate of the CSAC oscillators than expected. A small percentage of our customers have been adversely affected by this

[time-nuts] new GPSDO kit

2014-04-04 Thread SAIDJACK
Hello everyone, sorry for the plug, but we just announced a new $568 complete GPSDO reference kit. This unit is a tiny desktop unit with 10m antenna, power supply, cables, CD, and other accessories. It is a low cost addition to our Fury GPSDO line, and contains a really good TCXO, a

Re: [time-nuts] comparing two clocks

2014-02-22 Thread SAIDJACK
Jim, when I did the test on the 53132A, I did the test with the two signals on top of each other with a very small cable offset of 400ps, then I added a 10ns delay line to the B signal just to see if the counter would behave differently. Here are the results, pretty much looks identical

Re: [time-nuts] GPS Antenna - was receivers in the same box.

2014-02-05 Thread SAIDJACK
Guys, on this subject, we put together and qualified a convenient and complete (fairly) low-cost timing-compatible GPS antenna kit that includes all the mounting materials, 150 feet of cable, all the connectors, and down to the last screw, nut, and bolt everything one would need to mount

Re: [time-nuts] housing multiple GPS timing receivers in the same box.

2014-02-04 Thread SAIDJACK
Michael, use a simple BNC T-splitter. Works perfectly for me as long as both GPS carry the same antenna voltage. No loss in signal quality evident from the C/No readings, and dirt-cheap. No need to over-complicate this. bye, Said In a message dated 2/4/2014 14:41:40 Pacific Standard

Re: [time-nuts] Local Solar Time Clock

2014-01-19 Thread SAIDJACK
I hope this thread dies here. In a message dated 1/19/2014 13:22:10 Pacific Standard Time, a...@comcast.net writes: On 14-01-19 03:20 PM, Chris Albertson wrote: My feverish brain now cranks out that all we need is a electromechanical WWVB receiver, thus no active electronic parts. That

Re: [time-nuts] WAAS.....

2014-01-09 Thread SAIDJACK
The latest receivers are surprisingly resilient to GPS jamming. We tried jamming effects on all sorts of different GPS units ourselves, and the M12's go out right away for example, while the uBlox units are tough to jam. The new generation 7 ublox with Glonass etc should be even harder to

Re: [time-nuts] Trimble Thunderbolt 1pps

2014-01-03 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Hal, still pretty impressive results, thanks for sharing the data. bye, Said In a message dated 1/3/2014 17:10:13 Pacific Standard Time, hmur...@megapathdsl.net writes: saidj...@aol.com said: Your plots don't show the wave being reflected by the cable end, and bouncing back and

[time-nuts] video of CSAC GPSDO

2013-11-04 Thread SAIDJACK
Hello, fyi KF5OBS did a nice video review of the CSAC GPSDO (and Lecroy high end scope) that's posted on Youtube now: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CogN630jUSsfeature=c4-overviewlist=UU_XdpUc sSigyf4JrrPtI5eA bye, Said ___ time-nuts mailing

Re: [time-nuts] video of CSAC GPSDO

2013-11-04 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi John, well, I think he must have meant a new car back in 1971 :) That would be about right. It's not quite THAT expensive. Symmetricom seized to exist as an independent company a couple of days ago, they were bought out by MicroSemi.. They do make great products, for sure. Please note

Re: [time-nuts] The 5MHz Sweet Spot

2013-11-03 Thread SAIDJACK
Forgot one comment: the good parts' plot also shows a very nice crystal retrace stabilization in the red EFC trace over about the first 6 days or so. After that the crystal goes into it's long term crystal aging mode. Retrace is one big reason why its best to let crystals run continuously..

Re: [time-nuts] GPS time module

2013-10-29 Thread SAIDJACK
Sorry in advance guys, I could not resist doing a short comparison between our LC_XO module and this new Selig/RF-Suisse 1x1 module. Please excuse this blatantly biased comparison: The Selig module is slightly larger, and consumes about the same amount of power as the LC_XO (TCXO

Re: [time-nuts] Trimble Mini-T

2013-10-29 Thread SAIDJACK
John, have you taken a look at the Mini-JLT? Its compatible, just supports SCPI/NMEA instead of TSIP. bye, Said In a message dated 10/29/2013 17:14:22 Pacific Daylight Time, j...@westmorelandengineering.com writes: Hello Bob, Guess that is a shame - looked like a nice product and

Re: [time-nuts] Splitter for GPS antenna suggestions?

2013-10-25 Thread SAIDJACK
HP/Agilent/Symmetricom 58535A splitter/amplifier works great. Just unfortunate that they always come in N connector variant. Sometimes available dirt-cheap on Ebay.. They have 1-to-2 all the way up to 1-to-8 variants. In a message dated 10/25/2013 15:34:59 Pacific Daylight Time,

Re: [time-nuts] HP 4193A 4815A probe compatibility?

2013-10-16 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Rick, Tom, one little bit of knowledge I learned: I like the HP 54701A FET probes for frequency-domain stuff. Available for $300 on Ebay sometimes. I built a small power supply for one of mine, and use it as a probe for my Spectrum analyzer and scopes. Almost indestructable. It

Re: [time-nuts] NTP REFCLOCK for a Jackson Fury??

2013-10-16 Thread SAIDJACK
Frank, try GPSD on Linux: http://gpsd.berlios.de/hardware.html Bye, Said In a message dated 10/16/2013 14:50:19 Pacific Daylight Time, hp_cisco...@yahoo.com writes: Hi, What NTP REFCLOCK can be used for a Jackson Fury? I know that the Jackson Fury docs suggest using:

Re: [time-nuts] GPSDO choices

2013-10-07 Thread SAIDJACK
Paul, try the Jackson Labs GPSTCXO eval kit. Comes with GPS antenna, USB comm/power cable, and board. You can get a Hammond enclosure for it for less than $20, and have a complete desktop system for less than $400 new. Probably the lowest-cost new way to go other than Ebay-used or

Re: [time-nuts] A readl atomic wristwatch

2013-10-01 Thread SAIDJACK
Guys, there is only one problem: there is just no way they can claim only 1 second error in a 1000 years unless they also have a GPS receiver for calibration in there, which kind of mutes the point as that has been done using wwvb etc. Let's do the math: 1/ (1000 * 365 * 24 *3600) =

Re: [time-nuts] Clock Driver Design

2013-09-27 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Tom, yes, the GPSTCXO has a pretty good typical phase noise above 100Hz or so for being just a TCXO, competitive to or even a bit better than some good SC-cut OCXO's. Compare that to the Trimble Mini-T for example which has a noise floor spec of only -145dBc/Hz according to the Trimble

Re: [time-nuts] Trimble Resolution T - PPS offset and stability

2013-09-04 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Bob, it's not +/-100ns on all receivers. Our Fury GPSDO that uses Motorola designed M12M receivers allow +/-1ns antenna delay phase adjustment resolution. No effect on timing stability. Almost all of our other products using uBlox GPS also allow +/-1ns antenna delay phase adjustment

Re: [time-nuts] B.V.A. 8600 for sale

2013-08-29 Thread SAIDJACK
Here is my experience with trying to get one of these for very low noise ADEV measurements: * waited for some years for one to pop up on Ebay/Time-Nuts/Craigslist etc. I even sent a couple of BVA WANTED emails to time-nuts in the past, no response from anyone. * called the factory, they

Re: [time-nuts] Neat little cesium box

2013-06-14 Thread SAIDJACK
Greg, the only power source I am aware off that can provide the ~5W power required by that Novus box for 10-12 years with 20lbs weight limit without any external power sources or maintenance is a radioisotope thermoelectric generator (RTG) such as those used on Spacecraft. The Russians

Re: [time-nuts] HP53132A vs SR625

2013-03-17 Thread SAIDJACK
Ed, the calculation is the same, however the numbers are 100ps for 53132A versus 350ps, and I have not seen an average systemic offset being displayed on any of the 3x 53132A units I use, and I see one on the SR-620. That's why I sent it into SRS for calibration, paid the $$$ and got it

Re: [time-nuts] HP53132A vs SR625

2013-03-17 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Volker, there are some issues here, first the worst case frequency systematic uncertainty is 100ps for the 53132A, not 350ps as on the SRS unit or 500ps as you stated. So they are not the same, they are 3.5x different. From the Agilent manual: Systematic Uncertainty: Agilent 53131A

Re: [time-nuts] Z3805A/58503A time receiver : 2 questions

2013-02-27 Thread SAIDJACK
Hello Claude, that gap is a classic crystal jump. It could be caused by the crystal changing frequency by itself, or by being hit with e.g. gamma particles etc. Could also have been instigated by vibration or shock to the unit. You should be seeing 6+ sats at all times though, your plot

Re: [time-nuts] HP53132A vs SR625

2013-02-07 Thread SAIDJACK
Hui, rent one of each if you can before you make your choice. I have both, and the HP unit is much easier to use once you know which button sequence to push to get more than just Frequency/Time-Interval type measurements - these can be single-button events on the HP unit. Even offsetting

Re: [time-nuts] Low noise power supplies?

2013-01-31 Thread SAIDJACK
Not sure if anyone posted this here yet, but Abracom has a very low noise (7nV/RtHz at 1KHz) power source for VCO's etc, with various outputs. It's sold on DIgikey or Mouser I think. Here is a review of that unit: _http://jaunty-electronics.com/blog/category/reviews/_

Re: [time-nuts] GPS at 60,000 feet

2013-01-31 Thread SAIDJACK
I think it's supposed to work up there. Cocom limits used to be 50,000 feet and 1000 knots if I am not mistaken. Most GPS will likely support those Cocom limits even if they state something like 2000 meters max altitude etc. A commercial flight should certainly work, besides the problem of

Re: [time-nuts] Low noise power supplies?

2013-01-31 Thread SAIDJACK
Or a good battery as a source for the regulators as discussed in this thread already. It's quite nice to have all the different Voltages available at the same time, with up to 200mA. bye, Said In a message dated 1/31/2013 13:12:33 Pacific Standard Time, li...@rtty.us writes: Hi For

[time-nuts] GPS at 60,000 feet

2013-01-29 Thread SAIDJACK
How to check if a GPS works at 60,000 feet: send up a balloon: The good folks at Duke University sent a uBlox based GPSTCXO up there, and it worked at max balloon altitude which was about 60,000 feet. The ambient temperature must have been around -50C up there, and maybe down to -67C

Re: [time-nuts] NMEA Software

2012-12-20 Thread SAIDJACK
Not sure if these were properly answered yet, but the ublox Windows application is a great way to dissect most any NMEA sentence into all it's components, check for consistency, graph stuff, and check for PVT info. We use it with anything that generates NMEA sentences, it works great. Of

Re: [time-nuts] Z3805A cooling requirements?

2012-12-20 Thread SAIDJACK
Wish I had more time to play with this setup. How about fellow time nuts spend some time and present similar test data on their OCXO's to compare? I was interested in the 1s to 100s ADEV, and my runs were from 8 minutes to 20 minutes, certainly enough time to capture data for 1s to 100s

Re: [time-nuts] Z3805A cooling requirements?

2012-12-19 Thread SAIDJACK
Not sure about that, if you look at the frequency plot after ~20 minutes in moving air the frequency was still extremely close to 10.00MHz.. to within 1E-011 of 10MHz. This is a free-running 10811. Compare that to the plot of the OCXO I had sent out some hours ago when it was running

Re: [time-nuts] Comparing PPS from 2 GPS units

2012-12-14 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Tom, but they could have achieved the same exact result by using scientific notation such as: 2.3E-010 or: 2.30E-010 or: 23E-011 to note the higher internal resolution in the later case. I realize that one can easily parse these raw outputs, if one can write python or C etc

Re: [time-nuts] Comparing PPS from 2 GPS units

2012-12-13 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi anonymous, the 53132A only does that for a couple of nanoseconds. Then it jumps to a stupid value such as: 0.004 us -0.002 us 0.999,999,993 s It get's even better when the counter decides it doesn't have enough resolution in frequency mode: 2,3** u Absolutely horrible to parse,

Re: [time-nuts] Z3805A cooling requirements?

2012-12-11 Thread SAIDJACK
Stu, a fan is about the worst thing you can do for your Z3805 it will significantly worsen the stability of the output frequency. The oven inside does get warm, that's why it is an oven :) The power consumption will go down once it heats itself up, the unit is designed to work without a

Re: [time-nuts] Thunderbolt oven / non-stable operating temperature

2012-12-11 Thread SAIDJACK
Hello Tom, the GPS noise dominates for typical double oven OCXO's where the tempcos are very small (say below 5E-012 per degree C). On single oven units, the tempcos are typically 50 to 200 times larger, and thus the required EFC change over temperature is also that much larger. If I am

Re: [time-nuts] GPSDO Alternatives

2012-12-06 Thread SAIDJACK
David, The NXP LPC932 processor series are very cheap and small, and we got very excited to see timers running at up to 32MHz internally if I remember correctly. Then setting up a test system we noted that the timer can capture with 32MHz resolution which is good enough for a low-cost

Re: [time-nuts] GPSDO Alternatives

2012-12-06 Thread SAIDJACK
Hello, metastability is not an issue in this type of application, nor can it be avoided since we have two different clock domains. It would only shift the capture point by one counter clock cycle back or forth if the edge happens right on the transition point. At that point we have 50%

Re: [time-nuts] GPSDO Alternatives

2012-12-05 Thread SAIDJACK
Good list Bob, many people underestimate what it takes to make a working, commercial GPSDO, especially one that has to perform in volume and beyond a single well taken care of unit in a Ham shack. Once you have taken care of items 1) and 2), the real work begins. This is where our

Re: [time-nuts] Very challenging phase noise measurement, does anyone have an...

2012-12-05 Thread SAIDJACK
Hans, would mixing your 125KHz with a 2.5MHz or 5MHz low noise reference to get it into a range that the analyzer can read work? You could use a system like the Miles timepod phase noise analyzer, a mixer, a 5MHz low-noise reference, and a low-pass filter to make use of the 500KHz lower

Re: [time-nuts] PTTI 2012

2012-12-01 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Tom, there are two that sound very interesting: the M12/uBlox one and the Time-Nuts one :) Do you have any other info, or could you give us a 1 minute overview of what was shown please? I also heard that there were scheduled to be more CSAC type papers, but they did not get DARPA

Re: [time-nuts] pulse height

2012-11-26 Thread SAIDJACK
Didier, Oh, ok that makes sense, but that is a non-standard output, so not sure that you want to use such an output as a sample case for generic applications. Alternatively maybe rename the page to Trimble CMOS-output Coax Cable Impedance Matching to make that clear. It would be better

Re: [time-nuts] pulse height

2012-11-26 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Didier, yes, if you put a 50 Ohm termination at the far end all looks good, but you are still driving a 91mA DC current through the cable during the high times, and that will have rippling effects on the driver board by loading the 5V power supply down with a 1Hz period. And if you

Re: [time-nuts] Wavecrest DTS 2077 Service Manual?

2012-11-19 Thread SAIDJACK
There is one calibration that can only be started by a GPIB command. I ran into that, my unit constantly said something like xxx calibration required or similar during power on. No way to do it with the front panel buttons. It is easy to start that cal using Visi, or via sending a GPIB

Re: [time-nuts] GPS receiver testing

2012-10-31 Thread SAIDJACK
John, thanks for your email, I am replying to Time Nuts as well as there is a lot of knowledgeable folks here that can help. In terms of a GPSDO tutorial, take a look at the HP papers linked on the JLT website under the Links Of Interest and Related Whitepaper sections:

Re: [time-nuts] Hp 58503A

2012-10-16 Thread SAIDJACK
No problem, happens to me too some times, usually the 10MHz Sine should be loaded with 50 Ohms, and the CMOS/TTL 1PPS pulses should be run open-ended (1M or higher).. I say usually.. because there are cases where proper termination is critical such as LVDS 1PPS outputs.. and where the

Re: [time-nuts] HP Z3805A com port and monitoring questions

2012-10-14 Thread SAIDJACK
I think the Z3801A has the 6 channel receiver, the Z3805A seems to have the 16 channel GPS. Otherwise very similar I think.. both have the 10811 DOCXO, and very similar looking PCB's.. Rick, do you know of any other differences by any chance? Said In a message dated 10/14/2012

Re: [time-nuts] HP Z3805A com port and monitoring questions

2012-10-14 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Edgardo, I think the Z3805A and 58503A are identical, except in the rubber bumpers, maybe the power supply voltage setting, and the ID string.. I don't really care, the three units I have perform much better than anything else I have, so that satisfies my requirements.. In fact one of

Re: [time-nuts] Best counter setting for ADEV?

2012-10-03 Thread SAIDJACK
Very nice plot Tom! Did you thermally insulate the CSAC to get this kind of performance? bye, Said In a message dated 10/3/2012 09:24:54 Pacific Daylight Time, t...@leapsecond.com writes: Many thanks and for all of your help thoughts over the years. I'll look forward to the day and

Re: [time-nuts] Best counter setting for ADEV?

2012-10-02 Thread SAIDJACK
Yes, very easy: 1) calibrate the internal 100MHz vectron OCXO using a small screwdriver, this is not really critical though as the unit does not really function as a frequency counter. 2) Calibrate the power supplies for proper voltages if necessary with same screwdriver, I found that is

Re: [time-nuts] RFX GPSDO - Anybody played with one of these?

2012-10-02 Thread SAIDJACK
Thanks much Didier! Those are kind words for the JLT team :) bye, Said In a message dated 10/2/2012 14:28:13 Pacific Daylight Time, shali...@gmail.com writes: Well Said, it looks like you have been busy! Congrats for an amazing product. Didier Sent from my Droid Razr 4G LTE

Re: [time-nuts] RFX GPSDO - Anybody played with one of these?

2012-10-02 Thread SAIDJACK
Hello Paul, thanks much for the feedback! Yes, we think we have identified a nice combination of oscillators, GPS, and firmware that seems to work pretty well. The GPSTCXO units cannot be compared to a lower cost $150 Thunderbolt in terms of phase noise or stability of course, and they

Re: [time-nuts] Hi Power LED --- Thread Overload

2012-09-18 Thread SAIDJACK
Fellow Time Nuts, in the last week we had more than 50 emails concerning Fedex versus UPS shipping and how to package something, now we have a similar number of emails about LED lighting. I hope we can end this thread soon, or move it to another discussion group. I for one am getting

Re: [time-nuts] GPSDO control loops and correcting quantization error

2012-09-14 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi M. welcome to the world of GPSDO optimization, one thing you will find is that there never is a time when there is no chance to improve something :) On the 1PPS sawtooth correction, the usual convention is for the following 1PPS. The easiest thing to do rather than trying to guess

Re: [time-nuts] HP Z3805A

2012-09-14 Thread SAIDJACK
Hello Edgardo, glad you received them well, and within 48 hours from China! Hopefully they will work as well for you as for me. I noticed that some of the 60Hz/120Hz artifacts can come through the power supply into the 10MHz, so pick a power supply that has a case-ground connection, not

Re: [time-nuts] Recommendations for a newbie?

2012-09-09 Thread SAIDJACK
Charles, maybe I did read your email wrong, I apologize for that. To me it came across as negative toward the seller and the listings, and it seems this is not how it was meant, my appologies. Bye, Said In a message dated 9/8/2012 23:05:30 Pacific Daylight Time,

Re: [time-nuts] Recommendations for a newbie?

2012-09-07 Thread SAIDJACK
Hello Robert, your question is like asking which car you should buy, or which airline you should fly :) Everyone will have a different answer. But I do not recommend the Thunderbolts, it's a crab-shoot with them (different versions have different performance, the new ones are actually

Re: [time-nuts] Recommendations for a newbie?

2012-09-07 Thread SAIDJACK
Robert, my bad, that seller offers 58503A units based on both Z3801A and Z3805A. The latter has a 16 channel GPS receiver, so seems to me much more desirable than the Z3801A. $50 difference. I have been testing the latter, not the former. bye, Said In a message dated 9/7/2012

Re: [time-nuts] Recommendations for a newbie?

2012-09-07 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Edgardo, they work well for me, look brand-new, and came with power supply, rs-232 cable, and antenna. I think it's a 5V antenna. The unit had about 37000 on the lifetime. The seller has close up photos, that's what the units look like. I plugged in the power, ran GPSCon to start an

Re: [time-nuts] Recommendations for a newbie?

2012-09-07 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Jerry, I am not familiar with those, sorry. The only complaint I would have about the 58503A units I have is that they have a bit of power supply spurs at about -130dBc. Running them from batteries would probably take care of that. Otherwise they work great for me and provide both

Re: [time-nuts] ublox chip sets - what GPS device should I buy?

2012-08-31 Thread SAIDJACK
Dave, that depends on which uBlox the unit supports. There are basically three different sizes: AMY, LEA, and NEO. They also sell chip-sets, but only to very large volume customers. Any of the uBlox-6 will be excellent, the choice will depend on form-factor, and also if you need a

Re: [time-nuts] oscillators

2012-08-30 Thread SAIDJACK
There are some drawbacks to this type of SC-cut MCXO I would think, and it could possibly be replaced by a much higher performance Symmetricom CSAC, probably at a lower cost and higher availability: * Q-tech MCXO is ITAR controlled, CSAC is not * MCXO has 20ppb over temp stability, CSAC has

[time-nuts] Trimble Mini-T end of life

2012-07-19 Thread SAIDJACK
Hello everyone, please send suggestions for the following new product we are working on: Trimble recently announced that the Mini-T is end of life, and is giving a last time buy of August 1st 2012. It does not seem that Trimble plans to offer a replacement unit. The Mini-t enjoyed a

Re: [time-nuts] Trimble Mini-T end of life

2012-07-19 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi guys, thanks so much for all the great suggestions on how to make this product better! Yes, cost targets are a very important goal here, and we are looking into adding options that make sense for most customers and don't add excessive cost or delay to the schedule. We definitely will

Re: [time-nuts] FTS125 GPS Module

2012-06-28 Thread SAIDJACK
Yes, I am sure, depends on the firmware revision and configuration settings. Don't want to name any names here though. Secondary firmware can detect, and prevent this behavior once you know it exists, and what makes it happen. That's part of what makes the difference between an NCO and a

Re: [time-nuts] Morion MV89A pics

2012-06-10 Thread SAIDJACK
FEI did not own Morion, they owned a number of shares. Some time ago the Russian government forced them to sell all, or almost all of their shares to keep Morion fully Russian-owned. Unfortunately they are not easy to deal with on a commercial level (to put it into objective terms), and

[time-nuts] GPS and Rubidium frequency standards and noise question (new...

2012-06-03 Thread SAIDJACK
Jerry, Chris, it's all relative, while the Lpro may be a good Rb standard, it's phase noise is not that good really. You list: -96dBc/Hz @ 10Hz, -138dBc/Hz @ 100Hz, -152dBc/Hz @ 1KHz offsets For the Lpro. The new Jackson Labs Technologies LN CSAC GPSDO with SC-cut phase noise and

Re: [time-nuts] Why are 1PPS signals so skinny?

2012-05-15 Thread SAIDJACK
Yes, but the point is to not use end-termination for all the reasons mentioned by others in this thread, such as massive spike in power consumption once per second, over-voltage spikes if the termination is faulty or missing, higher ADEV due to power supply modulation, etc etc.. Your test

Re: [time-nuts] Why are 1PPS signals so skinny?

2012-05-15 Thread SAIDJACK
Not really, your setup requires all inputs except the very last one to be high-impedance to work, and to have a trigger point of 1.25V as well to work properly (when used with a proper 50 Ohms source). So no difference there. So it doesn't make any difference, since the same exact inputs

Re: [time-nuts] Why are 1PPS signals so skinny?

2012-05-15 Thread SAIDJACK
Mike, Attila is trying to explain that the leading edge is not what we are concerned about in this thread (its subject to discussion in other email threads), it is the effect of what follows after that leading edge, and propagates down the power supplies to cause side effects that is

Re: [time-nuts] Why are 1PPS signals so skinny?

2012-05-15 Thread SAIDJACK
QED: here is a phase noise plot of a 200ms 1PPS pulse showing up in the phase noise spectrum of a 10MHz source (at 1Hz to 10Hz offsets) because the unit was providing a 100mA current pulses into the cable, and power supply modulation of the 10MHz output happened inside the unit. The pulses

Re: [time-nuts] Why are 1PPS signals so skinny?

2012-05-15 Thread SAIDJACK
Forgot to mention, on this list we are often concerned with noise floors of -170dBc or lower, and stabilities of 1E-013 or lower. At that level, your scenario of stepping into the room and turning on the light will likely cause a measurable effect just because of the mechanical vibration

Re: [time-nuts] Why are 1PPS signals so skinny?

2012-05-15 Thread SAIDJACK
Yes, you are right of course. My bad. This should have been written as: The Thunderbolt has less than 5 Ohms output impedance, so if you get a reflection coming from the cable stubs or non-end-terminated cable back into the Thunderbolt, then you get ringing on the cable because the

Re: [time-nuts] Why are 1PPS signals so skinny?

2012-05-15 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Rick, one reason why we happy blink at 1/2Hz :) There are other offendors as well, such as the processor and GPS going through the hoops once per second, but the 100mA surge from the 1PPS output driver trumps all else. bye, Said In a message dated 5/15/2012 16:44:08 Pacific

Re: [time-nuts] Why are 1PPS signals so skinny?

2012-05-15 Thread SAIDJACK
I met Jenny in 1987 - not that skinny at the time :) That was after she sold the company already. In a message dated 5/15/2012 16:41:34 Pacific Daylight Time, b...@iaxs.net writes: Jenny Craig? ___ time-nuts mailing list --

Re: [time-nuts] Calculating phase jitter from phase noise - appnote by silabs

2012-05-11 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi, here is a very nice and easy to use online calculator for doing exactly this: _http://jittertime.com/resources/pncalc.shtml_ (http://jittertime.com/resources/pncalc.shtml) bye, Said In a message dated 5/11/2012 09:17:30 Pacific Daylight Time, li...@rtty.us writes: Hi Be very

[time-nuts] Improved timing through simple dish

2012-05-11 Thread SAIDJACK
Hugo's idea of using a Sat dish to zoom in on a WAAS Sat as discussed in the below paper is quite brilliant I think, and it seems one should be able to make use of it by disabling the GPS sats (via mask angle for example) in receivers that support WAAS, and that are used in position hold

Re: [time-nuts] Trimble Resolution SMT - good/bad/indifferent?

2012-05-10 Thread SAIDJACK
Hi Holrum, how do you re-configure the SMT unit? Using Trimble GPS studio? Thanks, Said In a message dated 5/9/2012 15:17:21 Pacific Daylight Time, hol...@hotmail.com writes: I have it running now. It turns out that the units from fluke.l come shipped with TEP format messages

Re: [time-nuts] Trimble Resolution SMT - good/bad/indifferent?

2012-05-10 Thread SAIDJACK
Ok, I figured out that the unit fluke.l sells is running firmware to emulate the Motrola M12+ receiver or similar. So WinOncore 12 does work, and I can get the following receiver ID: COPYRIGHT 2008 Trimble Navigation Ltd. SFTW P/N # SOFTWARE VER # 0.03.0 SOFTWARE REV # 00 SOFTWARE

Re: [time-nuts] Trimble Resolution SMT - good/bad/indifferent?

2012-05-10 Thread SAIDJACK
The first problem is, I didn't even know that was the command set the unit had, the @@Cf looked familiar though. I wasted an hour trying to get the Trimble application to work, until I tried WinOncore12 and the unit responded. Can't use TeraTerm to send commands, and the user manual

Re: [time-nuts] Trimble Resolution SMT - good/bad/indifferent?

2012-05-10 Thread SAIDJACK
There is the problem: I used the Trimble GPS Studio application that was posted here yesterday, that does not support the TEP protocol.. Will try with GPS Monitor.. Is the TrimbleMon available somewhere safe on the web? Can't seem to find it with Google. I got it working with Oncore12,

Re: [time-nuts] Oh dear - can we please close this thread

2012-05-07 Thread SAIDJACK
Guys, this thread and the un-countable emails it has generated so far is the exact type of discussion that TVB just sent out an email about that should not be on time nuts. bye, Said In a message dated 5/7/2012 16:00:54 Pacific Daylight Time, mbla...@satx.rr.com writes: Wow! $1260

Re: [time-nuts] 5370B and 10544 OCXO

2012-05-04 Thread SAIDJACK
No necessarily. It could also mean the 5370B likes the output signal of the 10544 fed internally better than the other two, maybe due to a higher signal level or less noise in the internal PLL bandwidth? You could verify this by feeding in the 10544 into the front jack while the 10811

Re: [time-nuts] thunderbolt no UTC offset

2012-05-01 Thread SAIDJACK
Incorrect, the UTC offset should be sent in the Almanac, the Almanac having a period of 12.5 minutes max. Not one hour. It should take no more than 12.5 minutes to get the UTC offset when sats are properly being received. bye, Said In a message dated 5/1/2012 11:45:06 Pacific Daylight

Re: [time-nuts] Symmetricom TimeSource 2700

2012-05-01 Thread SAIDJACK
Hello Mark, you could connect the Fury 1PPS output to the 1PPS external sync input of the PRS-10 Rb and let is self-discipline to GPS. Set the Fury 1PPS jumper JP4 to raw-1PPS (pins 2 and 3), and that will make the Fury GPSDO generate the raw 1PPS signal from the Motorola GPS receiver

Re: [time-nuts] Trimble recommends RG-59 Antenna Cable.

2012-04-30 Thread SAIDJACK
Make sure to buy the quadrouple shielded 75 Ohms RG-6 cable from Home Depot etc, it's much better than the standard single or double shielded RG-6 and works wonders for GPS signals, and it's quite inexpensive. Impedance mismatch loss can be neglected, and long cable runs can be made. bye,

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