The other is what one can buy on the market that is
better than the HP 5328?
The first step up IMHO is the HP 5335. I have two.
AFAIK it is the first of the series that will do TIC. The TIC
specification is 100 pico-seconds.
For reference the HP 5370A/B TIC spec is 10 pico-seconds.
The
On 12/23/2010 04:29 PM, Bob Bownes wrote:
The other is what one can buy on the market that is
better than the HP 5328?
The first step up IMHO is the HP 5335. I have two.
AFAIK it is the first of the series that will do TIC. The TIC
specification is 100 pico-seconds.
For reference the HP
The 5328 will also take a 10881. Plugs right into the motherboard.
You go via a separate board to have a 10811 oscillator. It is not uncommon
for 10811s to be delivered with this board since some figure they get more
by selling the 5328 separate from the 10811. Ah well. I use that board
List,
The opinions given have been fascinating. However I see this discussion going
in two
directions. One is making a
counter. This is fine. Go for it if you have all the resources and
time it will require. The Achilles heel
that I see to this project is being able to duplicate the
Bob Bownes wrote:
Comments inline.
On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 11:17 PM, Chris Albertsonalbertson.ch...@gmail.com
wrote:
I looked. I think we should keep the design goals modest for a first
revision. Shoot for a spec that can be hand built on perf board. So
I'd relax those
I'd like to input a few suggestions regarding layout and construction,
namely, the PCB material and the form factor.
I suggest that any circuitry processing signals over about 2-3 GHz be
constructed on a PTFE or PTFE/ceramic PCB material, such as Rogers RT/Duroid
(www.rogerscorp.com/). Arlon
I'm shopping for a solution right now. I had several ideas both
discussed on this thread: Using an old notebook and an ARM based
appliance re-flashed to run Linux but neither would work well. So I'm
buying this tiny new motherboard from Intel with an Atom CPU on it.
Sells for $70 with the
interested over here.
Paul Reeves G8GJA
-Original Message-
From: jimlux [mailto:jim...@earthlink.net]
Sent: 19 December 2010 04:08
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Bob Camp wrote:
Hi
If you are going
I don't believe anybody is speaking to perceived value as much as
historical market cost at various times over the years. I paid $200
for my 5370B last year and it's in superb condition and well inside
factory specs. There is no way I'd sell it though.
My guess is Bob C and most of us
Sent: Mon, December 20, 2010 2:51:37 PM
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
I don't believe anybody is speaking to perceived value as much as
historical market cost at various times over the years. I paid $200
for my 5370B last year and it's in superb condition and well
On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 2:51 PM, Dave M dgmin...@mediacombb.net wrote:
.. never got off the launchpad because of their inability to come to
consensus on a set of features. I had to conclude that too many cooks
spoiled the broth. Everyone that had input to the project was unwilling to
yield on
*
*Interesting. There are some Hittite D type flip flips that spec out at
13Ghz and 18-22ps rise/fall times with 'deterministic jitter' of 2ps, and a
T type that tops out @26Ghz. Not cheap I'm sure, but we shall see.
I've posted a preliminary specification on the Open Counter google group.
The
Well said Chris. Take a look at the initial spec in the OpenCounter Gogle
group and tell me what you think with respect to your item #1. I think the
core counter is going to be the really difficult part of the module list.
Item #2 is going to be a tough one methinks. I love Eurocard, but, as you
Hi benevolent dictator. Please not the @#$%^ Eurocard. As you say, the
connectors and backplane cost more than the stuff on the cards (except
maybe the stuff from Hittite :-). Rather a stack of cards with .1 in.
spacing .025 pins? That way, we can put the stack in any housing we want.
If a
Lol. Ok. You're added to the group.
I've started a topic on form factor.
Bob
On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 10:45 PM, Don Latham d...@montana.com wrote:
Hi benevolent dictator. Please not the @#$%^ Eurocard. As you say, the
connectors and backplane cost more than the stuff on the cards (except
I looked. I think we should keep the design goals modest for a first
revision. Shoot for a spec that can be hand built on perf board. So
I'd relax those numbers by a factor of 1000. The top frequency is in
Mhz, not Ghz and the time resolution closer to ns than ps. It's good
to have a cheap
Comments inline.
On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 11:17 PM, Chris Albertson albertson.ch...@gmail.com
wrote:
I looked. I think we should keep the design goals modest for a first
revision. Shoot for a spec that can be hand built on perf board. So
I'd relax those numbers by a factor of 1000. The
On 12/19/2010 05:13 AM, Bob Camp wrote:
Hi
In the case of a $200 5370, you have to wait a while to find one. When you get
it, you likely have to do some work to get it running. At the very least you
will need to do a cal.
My guess is that a counter project would be very similar. There is an
On 12/19/2010 09:57 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote:
In message28e8c13c-3227-4cd6-bbea-902f03c81...@gmail.com, bownes writes:
One of the big problems with PC-instruments is isolation: most of them
havn't any.
If you are going to design one such, remember to isolate the USB
port galvanically from
Hello
El 19/12/2010 11:13, Magnus Danielson escribió:
To achieve meaningful isolation, it should be optical. Transformer
isolation has a few issues to get right...
What about digital isolators, lile ISO7220, ADuM1200 and so?
Regards,
Javier
--
On 12/19/2010 11:47 AM, Javier Herrero wrote:
Hello
El 19/12/2010 11:13, Magnus Danielson escribió:
To achieve meaningful isolation, it should be optical. Transformer
isolation has a few issues to get right...
What about digital isolators, lile ISO7220, ADuM1200 and so?
Need to look at
El 19/12/2010 12:34, Magnus Danielson escribió:
Need to look at it. But essentially, during normal operation common
mode isolation isn't all that hard. The problem is that during failure
mode can what should be a common mode voltage and current become
diffrential mode, which jumps straight
Magnus Danielson wrote:
On 12/19/2010 05:13 AM, Bob Camp wrote:
Hi
In the case of a $200 5370, you have to wait a while to find one. When
you get it, you likely have to do some work to get it running. At the
very least you will need to do a cal.
My guess is that a counter project would be
Gerhard Hoffmann wrote:
Am 19.12.2010 05:52, schrieb Bob Camp:
The real thing you would learn about is writing code that runs an FPGA.
Yes. A good starting point would be a Xilinx SP605 kit.
It's about the $750 for a decent 5370 and includes
many points from Bobs option list.
The other
Bob Camp wrote:
Hi
Which is why a simple / cheap opto isolated RS-232 connected to a USB dongle
makes a lot of sense.
Bob
There are some nice solutions, though, using USB directly, which has the
advantage of providing a few watts of power. Isolated DC/DC converters
are readily
In message 4d0e3080.1060...@earthlink.net, jimlux writes:
Bob Camp wrote:
There are some nice solutions, though, using USB directly, which has the
advantage of providing a few watts of power. Isolated DC/DC converters
are readily available. you might be able to do transformer isolation of
Yes. It can if done wrong.
The correct way to use USB is to make your USB device class
compliant for some class. Then most OSes (and with recent releases
even MS Windows) will have built-in drivers for each class of USB
device. Never buy or design a USB device that requires the user to
instal
Hi
My bag full of useless adapters were indeed class compliant back in the day.
Not so any more under the new approach to signed drivers.
Bob
On Dec 19, 2010, at 3:09 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:
Yes. It can if done wrong.
The correct way to use USB is to make your USB device class
That's kinda my point about using rs232. Serial to USB, serial to Ethernet
adaptors will be available for a good long while.
Also why I like the idea of a standalone instrument that also has a pc
interface of some sort. Or a slot for a pc interface of whatever source I
want.
So how does
On Sun, Dec 19, 2010 at 12:45 PM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote:
Hi
My bag full of useless adapters were indeed class compliant back in the
day. Not so any more under the new approach to signed drivers.
Bob
On Dec 19, 2010, at 3:09 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:
Yes. It can if done wrong.
On Sun, Dec 19, 2010 at 12:45 PM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote:
Hi
My bag full of useless adapters were indeed class compliant back in the
day. Not so any more under the new approach to signed drivers.
If they were Class Compliant they do not need drivers.
=
Chris Albertson
Redondo
From: Chris Albertson albertson.ch...@gmail.com
Yes. It can if done wrong.
The correct way to use USB is to make your USB device class
compliant for some class. Then most OSes (and with recent releases
even MS Windows) will have built-in drivers for each class of USB
device. Never buy
A much simpler solution is to dedicate a $20 obsolete laptop to the Tbolt. I
use a 200 MHz Compaq Armada with 1024x768 screen. I have also run Heather on a
90 MHz Fujitsu Milan with a 640x480 passive matrix screen.
For bonus points, tap off the internal laptop CDROM power connections (and
Ho Ho Ho,
Tis the season once again for giving and I wrote this up to give some
suggestions to the discussion. The PICTIC II was a spin-off of a GPSDO
front end designed specifically for low cost, low parts count, amateur
construction, and 1ns resolution to equal the performance of a modern
GPS
Mark,
You might look at this hardware:
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Insignia%26%23153%3B+-+Infocast+3.5%22+Internet+Media+Display/1152881.p?skuId=1152881ci_src=14110944ci_sku=1152881ref=06cmp=RMXloc=01id=1218226456157
It is based on the Chumby One design and Best Buy has had it on sale
for $50
One more link that shows the teardown of a Chumby One:
http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/chumby-one-Teardown/1614/1
As I mentioned, the Insignia circuit board is slightly different. The
overall configuration of the unit is very similar. The Insignia is
actually easier to open than the Chumby.
Joe
On Sun, December 19, 2010 3:36 pm, Bob Camp wrote:
My bag full of useless adapters were indeed class compliant back in the
day. Not so any more under the new approach to signed drivers.
The problem with USB-RS232 adapters is that there is no class compliant
device, because there is no USB class
From: Mark Sims:
A much simpler solution is to dedicate a $20 obsolete laptop to the
Tbolt. I use a 200 MHz Compaq Armada with 1024x768 screen. I have also run
Heather on a 90 MHz Fujitsu Milan with a 640x480 passive matrix screen.
For bonus points, tap off the internal laptop CDROM power
From: Chris Caudle
The problem with USB-RS232 adapters is that there is no class compliant
device, because there is no USB class for RS232 emulators. Doesn't exist,
so every device you've ever seen or used is a custom USB device. The
drivers for the FTDI devices ship with modern variants
Sent: 16 December 2010 19:20
To: 'Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement'
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Hi
Yes indeed, been there done that. Not very hard at all.
All you need is the six layer pc board (can be bought), the FPGA (Digikey has
them
Hi
If you are going to do a full boat implementation and work out all the
isolation issues and packaging, the question becomes:
Will it be better bang for the buck than a ~ $200 HP 5370?
Bob
On Dec 17, 2010, at 9:29 AM, jimlux wrote:
Interesting discussion..
comments interspersed
Chris
Bob Camp wrote:
Hi
If you are going to do a full boat implementation and work out all the
isolation issues and packaging, the question becomes:
Will it be better bang for the buck than a ~ $200 HP 5370?
Isn't that the classic New vs Used discussion, though? Those 5370s
won't be available
Hi
In the case of a $200 5370, you have to wait a while to find one. When you get
it, you likely have to do some work to get it running. At the very least you
will need to do a cal.
My guess is that a counter project would be very similar. There is an order and
build process that happens
Bob Camp wrote:
Hi
In the case of a $200 5370, you have to wait a while to find one. When you get it, you likely have to do some work to get it running. At the very least you will need to do a cal.
My guess is that a counter project would be very similar. There is an order and
build process
It all depends on the goal. Is it to have a working instrument or to
learn how they work and maybe to push the state of the art ahead a
little
One might ask the same question about ham radio: Why bother with all
that work? If you want to talk to some one just buy a cell phone and
be done with
Hi
The real thing you would learn about is writing code that runs an FPGA.
The other gotcha here is that the feature list can get pretty large:
1) WiFi interface
2) Bluetooth interface
3) USB 2.0 interface
4) RS-232 interface
5) HPIB emulation of an HP box
6)Ethernet interface
- combined
For me, at least, the purpose is twofold, to learn, and to get a better
instrument. The idea of being able to discriminate between two inputs a few ps
apart is fascinating and something I'd like to learn how it is done.
The VNA is a good comparison. I have a nice scalar nw but would like a
:36 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Here is an example of doing something like this as a open source
design by a group of HAMs
http://www.tapr.org/kits_janus.html
This is a software defined radio
Camp
Sent: 16 December 2010 19:20
To: 'Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement'
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Hi
Yes indeed, been there done that. Not very hard at all.
All you need is the six layer pc board (can be bought), the FPGA (Digikey has
them
Sent: 16 December 2010 19:20
To: 'Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement'
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Hi
Yes indeed, been there done that. Not very hard at all.
All you need is the six layer pc board (can be bought), the FPGA (Digikey has
them), a few
Interesting discussion..
comments interspersed
Chris Albertson wrote:
Jumping ahead to design. No one wants a serial RS232 interface. they
don't even make computers with RS232 ports much any more. Those guys
that designed equipment that forced people to load costom USB drivers
just did not
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
OK, time-nuts, here's the gauntlet. can't we generate a design for a
PC-based FPGA or chip setup that would be generally useful as a counter?
We've seen thorough discussions about trigger
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
OK, time-nuts, here's the gauntlet. can't we generate a design for a
PC-based FPGA or chip setup that would be generally useful as a counter?
We've seen thorough discussions about
.
From: Bob Camp li...@rtty.us
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com
Sent: Thu, December 16, 2010 2:20:12 PM
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Hi
Yes indeed, been there done that. Not very hard at all.
All you
-Original Message-
From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On
Behalf Of K. Szeker
Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 2:36 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Hi Bob,
If a 256 ball
-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On
Behalf Of K. Szeker
Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 2:36 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Hi Bob,
If a 256 ball package is the solution for these FPGA
-Original Message-
From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On
Behalf Of K. Szeker
Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 3:16 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Hi Bob,
Clear, itsn`t
of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Hi Bob,
If a 256 ball package is the solution for these FPGA, I would prefer it in
256 QFP-package version-if exists.
These will be solderable for the good home-specialists, bat a BGA (even
with only 256
measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
OK, time-nuts, here's the gauntlet. can't we generate a design for a
PC-based FPGA or chip setup that would be generally useful as a counter?
We've seen thorough discussions about trigger jitter, which IMHO is the
fundamental
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
OK, time-nuts, here's the gauntlet. can't we generate a design for a
PC-based FPGA or chip setup that would be generally useful as a counter?
We've seen thorough discussions about
...@febo.com] On
Behalf Of Chris Albertson
Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 3:36 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Here is an example of doing something like this as a open source
design by a group of HAMs
http
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Here is an example of doing something like this as a open source
design by a group of HAMs
http://www.tapr.org/kits_janus.html
This is a software defined radio but is close
: Thursday, December 16, 2010 3:36 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Here is an example of doing something like this as a open source
design by a group of HAMs
http://www.tapr.org/kits_janus.html
This is a software defined
Albertson
Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 3:36 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Here is an example of doing something like this as a open source
design by a group of HAMs
http://www.tapr.org/kits_janus.html
-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On
Behalf Of Chris Albertson
Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 3:36 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Here is an example of doing something like
-boun...@febo.com] On
Behalf Of Chris Albertson
Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 3:36 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Here is an example of doing something like this as a open source
design by a group of HAMs
I'm a retired electronics tech and computer programmer. I have a pretty
decently equipped shop for almost all of my projects and experiments.
However, my time and frequency equipment is a bit long in the tooth. I have
a couple old HP 5328A counters (commercial version; not the military
, December 15, 2010 1:55 PM
To: TimeNuts
Subject: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
I'm a retired electronics tech and computer programmer. I have a pretty
decently equipped shop for almost all of my projects and experiments.
However, my time and frequency equipment is a bit long in the tooth
consider an HP
5370B.
Joe
-Original Message-
From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com]on
Behalf Of Dave M
Sent: Wednesday, December 15, 2010 1:55 PM
To: TimeNuts
Subject: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
I'm a retired electronics tech
Hello Dave,
Others will have better suggestions for the time interval measurement
equipment.
My suggestion is to consider the Prologix GPIB to USB adapter for ~150$
brand new stock.
I wasted some time with a NI controller and an older HP adapter before I
got the Prologix.
I never looked
Hi Dave,
On 12/15/2010 08:55 PM, Dave M wrote:
I'm a retired electronics tech and computer programmer. I have a pretty
decently equipped shop for almost all of my projects and experiments.
However, my time and frequency equipment is a bit long in the tooth. I have
a couple old HP 5328A
1:14:45 PM
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency counter recommendation
Hi Dave,
On 12/15/2010 08:55 PM, Dave M wrote:
I'm a retired electronics tech and computer programmer. I have a pretty
decently equipped shop for almost all of my projects and experiments.
However, my time and frequency
I've seen several posts that mention the 5370 counter. Certainly looks
like a capable instrument. I'll be on the lookout for one that is in
reasonably good condition and WORKS. I downloaded the NIST pub that you
mentioned, and with the cold days and colder nights, I'll have lots of time
to
I asked the same question of this list a number of years back, took a few
different routes and ended up with precisely what has been suggested here:
HP 5370B
Prologix GPIB-USB
And an HP 3325B function generator to round it all out nicely.
Also, if ever asked by the financial controller *why* you
Dave: the Prologix interface can be used as an rs232 device. In that way,
a robot basic program can be written to control GPIB devices. I like Robot
Basic because it is has no connections to .net or any of the other
microsoft stuff, AFIK uses no Registry either.. I put the whole package in
a
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