Thank you Raymond, please see the following:
pactl list sinks
http://pastebin.com/8ypDq0vr
pulseverbose.log
http://pastebin.com/ThJQ7372
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--- /home/kingfisher/alsa-info.txt.yCKDtvMxUL
+++ /home/kingfisher/alsa-info.txt.3NDI7H9Nbu
@@ -3,7 +3,7 @@
!!ALSA Information Script v 0.4.64
!!
-!!Script ran on: Sat Sep 12 20:05:02 UTC 2015
+!!Script ran on: Sat Sep 12 20:08:12 UTC 2015
!!Linux
post #35 relates to 14.04.3
This post relates to 12.04.05
--- /media/kingfisher/FLASH DRIVE/alsa-info1
+++ /media/kingfisher/FLASH DRIVE/alsa-info2
@@ -3,7 +3,7 @@
!!ALSA Information Script v 0.4.64
!!
-!!Script ran on: Sat Sep 12 20:38:39 UTC 2015
+!!Script
so how can I get pactl list sinks to include:
analog-output-lfe-on-mono;output-amplifier-on: LFE on Separate Mono Output /
Amplifier (priority: 4010)
analog-output-lfe-on-mono;output-amplifier-off: LFE on Separate Mono Output /
No Amplifier (priority: 4000)
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I don't know Raymond. I just booted from ubuntu-12.04.5-desktop-
amd64.iso, played a music file, opened alsamixer, and discovered that;
changing Master M volume independently changed the internal speaker
volume. In 14.04 Master M is muted by default, unmuting and raising the
volume has no effect.
changed analog-output-headphones.conf
[Element Master Mono]
switch = on
volume = on
No effect
turned off headphone jack sense and line jack sense control
no effect, and were re-enabled by rebooting
Do not know how to implement the details in your post #43
just as an experiment I temporarily
you have to add element master mono to speaker.conf
there appears not to be a speaker.conf
there is;
/usr/share/alsa/cards/PC-Speaker.conf
/usr/share/pulseaudio/alsa-mixer/paths/analog-output-desktop-speaker.conf
/usr/share/pulseaudio/alsa-mixer/paths/analog-output-speaker.conf
no sorry, still trying to figure out what goes where!
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https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/893210
Title:
[Dell OptiPlex GX620 - AD1981b, playback] No sound
Thank you for your reply Raymond, i am uncertain what you are asking me
do.
14.04, 14.10 and 15.04 sound settings output look like this:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/h38d1w4n16...%3A50.png?dl=0
and the associated alsa mixer controls e.g. speaker are missing
this is what 12.04 looked like and
3rd time lucky
12.04
https://www.dropbox.com/s/0k376713gb0ptod/Screenshot%20from%202014-12-02%2013%3A34%3A05.png?dl=0
14.04
https://www.dropbox.com/s/h38d1w4n16etdyh/Screenshot%20from%202014-12-02%2013%3A40%3A50.png?dl=0
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alsa-info.txt
http://pastebin.com/pefj0dfq
differences with and without headphone socket occupied
alsa-info.patch.txt
http://pastebin.com/jzJBNd8e
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booted from ubuntu-12.04.5-desktop-amd64.iso
12.04.5 alsa-info.txt
http://pastebin.com/uUkhy9H5
12.04.5 pactl list sinks
http://pastebin.com/zatgyeE7
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pactl list sinks
Sink #0
State: SUSPENDED
Name: alsa_output.pci-_00_1e.2.analog-stereo
Description: Built-in Audio Analogue Stereo
Driver: module-alsa-card.c
Sample Specification: s16le 2ch 48000Hz
Channel Map: front-left,front-right
are these correct so far?
analog-output-headphones.conf.patch
http://pastebin.com/cSZEpc10
analog-output-speaker.conf.patch
http://pastebin.com/0fXR5gmZ
ac97_codec.h.patch
http://pastebin.com/mkj5tmzN
I need your help with the following section, i'm guessing goes in ac97_codec.h
but i dont
apologies:
12.04
https://www.dropbox.com/s/0k376713gb0ptod/Screenshot%20from%202014-12-02%2013%3A34%3A05.png?dl=0
14.04
https://www.dropbox.com/s/0k376713gb0ptod/Screenshot%20from%202014-12-02%2013%3A34%3A05.png?dl=0
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Its the same with 14.04, 14.10 and 15.04, is support discontinued for
Dell GX600, It would be nice if someone with expert knowledge would
explain how the internal speaker can be correctly detected, after all it
all worked perfectly in 12.04
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cat /proc/asound/card0/intel8x0
Intel8x0
Global control: 0xc002
Global status : 0x00700100
SDM : 0x0008
AC'97 codecs ready: primary
AC'97 codecs SDIN : 0 0 0
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code from
https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/systemd/229-4ubuntu21,
build with `dpkg-buildpackage` on aarch64, and build break with the following
messages:
```
+ test /tmp/test-exec_workingdirectory = /tmp/test-exec_workingdirectory
2
[/root/neil/systemd/test/systemd-229.orig/test/te
2
[/root/neil/systemd/test/systemd-229.orig/test/test-execute/exec-personality-x86.service:7]
Failed to parse personality, ignoring: x86
3 + uname -m
4 + c=aarch64
5 + test aarch64 = i686
6 exec-personality-x86.service: Main process exited, code=exited,
status=1/FAILURE
7 exe
Public bug reported:
download source code from
https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/systemd/229-4ubuntu21,
build with `dpkg-buildpackage` on aarch64, and build break with the following
messages:
```
+ test /tmp/test-exec_workingdirectory = /tmp/test-exec_workingdirectory
2
[/root/neil
uild break with the following
messages:
```
+ test /tmp/test-exec_workingdirectory = /tmp/test-exec_workingdirectory
2
[/root/neil/systemd/test/systemd-229.orig/test/test-execute/exec-personality-x86.service:7]
Failed to parse personality, ignoring: x86
3 + uname -m
4 + c=aarch64
5 + te
It's now 2021 - I'm on Ubuntu 20.04.2 LTS and I'm still being annoyed
by this bug!
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Title:
bash completion now quotes
+1, can I simply remove ifupdown (e.g. apt remove ifupdown), do I still
need it with 22.04.1?
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https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1981103
Title:
System with
#92 seems to have solved this bug for me. Thanks nknico. My Dad has
the same bug on OSX...
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https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1286552
Title:
No wifi
Sorry spoke too soon, it worked with a brief period of suspend (screen
did go blank) but is not working again. Tried #93 for what I thought
might be the equivalent file no joy.
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Seems to be working intermittently...
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Title:
No wifi after suspend
Status in “linux” package in Ubuntu:
Wouldn't recommend the course of action in 92, I've broken wifi after
reboot it won't connect, I'm going to have to reinstall the operating
system.
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Any manual workarounds for this? The number of users that shows up in
the lighdm login window keeps growing with each person that logs in. I'm
going to have to remove the picker if I can't delete these AD (LDAP)
based users from our laptop fleet.
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Public bug reported:
I was upgrading from raring to saucy and ran into this error.
ProblemType: Package
DistroRelease: Ubuntu 13.10
Package: openssh-server 1:6.1p1-4 [modified: usr/sbin/sshd]
ProcVersionSignature: Ubuntu 3.8.0-35.50-generic 3.8.13.13
Uname: Linux 3.8.0-35-generic x86_64
Can confirm that #7 works on Ubuntu 14.04 LTS 64-bit which is also
affected by this bug.
However, obviously this is pretty weak, since in many cases, the PEAP
password is your AD/LDAP credential, so when you store it in the
/etc/NetworkManager/system-connections file that represents your SSID,
Having same issue on upstream kernel.
have tried multiple solutions regarding alsa-base configurations.
Please see attached alsa-report.txt generated by alsa-info.sh from alsa
site.
** Attachment added: alsa-info.sh output
Public bug reported:
Sometimes clicking the Nautilus icon in the launcher opens Nautilus with
a seperate additional Nautilus icon in the launcher below the original
'locked' icon.
ProblemType: Bug
DistroRelease: Ubuntu 15.04
Package: unity 7.3.1+15.04.20150219.2-0ubuntu1
ProcVersionSignature:
Public bug reported:
I was building and running a simple qml app in Ubuntu-SDK when
confronted by the crash dialog. I didn't notice any problem myself. The
messages in the General Messages pane of qt creator were:
[21:12:22] ii click-reviewers-tools 0.24-0~407~ubuntu15.04.1
Warnings while
Public bug reported:
Using the DatePicker is more difficult than it needs to be.
OS: 14.09-RTM Ubuntu-Touch on bq aquaris
Example: When adding a new event in the Calendar app, I am presented
with 2 DatePicker widgets (one for date and one for time).
Expected behaviour: I expect to be able to
I'm adding a comment to keep this alive. I have had this bug on occasion
on krillin rtm v20. I haven't had an episode since upgrading to v21 a
couple of days ago but can't see anything in the changelogs which
suggest it has been fixed. If it has been fixed in the meantime, sorry
for the spam but
I'm not sure I agree this should only be in developer versions. I need a
phone which works (hence stable channel), but also like to develop and
debug apps. The 2 use cases are not mutually exclusive.
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Public bug reported:
The supplied ringtones are pretty, but not suitable for use in a
professional environment. It is not possible to add ringtones without
remounting rw, so a ring-ring type ringtone should be supplied by
default. I have supplied a bland/loud office-style ringtone which may
serve
I'm getting this behaviour. Running top shown dbus-daemon consuming
33% of CPU time. Is that normal?
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https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1466741
Title:
system
Begin a right-left swipe and the picture clears
** Attachment added: screenshot20151325_201339233.png
https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bug/1460149/+attachment/4420170/+files/screenshot20151325_201339233.png
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I get similar corruption running Baldur's Gate (via GemRB and SDL2) on
krillin. The intro videos play well, but when the main menu appears the
shell bleeds into it. The picture clears when you begin to swipe. I'll
attach some pics as it is hard to explain.
** Attachment added: Corruption of menu
Thanks for the log - if pulse is being used, there must be some reason
the volume control doesn't work.
I have realised the reason the sound continues playing in the background
is due to an unrelated bug: apps continue running in background (or
screen-off) when they do not spawn a gui. Thus, this
Public bug reported:
I have been building some apps for the phone which use OpenAL. They will
play audio if running under the audio policy group. However, the
volume of audio is not controlled by the volume slider or Silent mode
switch and audio can continue to play if the app is backgrounded or
As far as I know, it _can_ use pulseaudio but don't know if that is what
is happening here. I had been told on the IRC channel that the reason it
was not responding to the volume control was because it was not using
pulse, and suggested it was directly accessing the hardware. I have no
idea how to
Public bug reported:
From
https://developer.ubuntu.com/api/apps/qml/sdk-15.04/Ubuntu.Content.index/
as accessed on 2015-08-12:
Under Definitions, the definition of Content types is confusingly
recursive (Content types: A set of well-known content types).
Under Reporting Bugs, there is a typo in
Public bug reported:
See also https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity8/+bug/1478637
which is probably the same issue, but for natively landscape orientated
devices.
When an app sets a forced-landscape mode, the phone must be rotated
clockwise from portrait mode to display it properly.
A quick drawing to illustrate...
** Attachment added: rotate.png
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity8/+bug/1482613/+attachment/4441037/+files/rotate.png
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I have found a similar rendering bug which may be the same problem,
running OTA5 on krillin:
- Open browser in portrait mode
- rotate to landscape then back to portrait
- The location text field outline will become corrupted as per the attached
screenshot.
** Attachment added:
While I've been watching videos online, they haven't flickered, but they
have had tears in them.
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https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1515995
Title:
Screen
Status
Hi Christopher, there is no change in using the nouveau default driver.
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Title:
Screen
Status in xorg package in
This seems to be fixed with OTA-7
** Changed in: ubuntu-ui-toolkit (Ubuntu)
Status: New => Fix Released
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Since pulling in mediascanner2.0 on wily with the ubuntu-sdk package, I
have mediascanner-service consuming a minimum of 10% of CPU at all
times, with frequent spikes to nearly 200%. My CPU is cooking nicely.
To put things in perspective, firefox with 15 open tabs is currently
consuming 3.3% of
I wonder if this is related to
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mediascanner2/+bug/1398614
which affects me on the desktop?
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Public bug reported:
I am trying out Kubuntu at the moment and I have noticed that when watching
videos they flicker. I have tried the different options in the 'Compositor
Settings for Desktop Effects' Tearing Prevention and none seem to make a
difference other than that if I put it on
This may be a duplicate of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source
/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1486008 , but I am not sure if it is the same
problem.
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Public bug reported:
I _think_ this is a bug in the ListItem leadingActions implementation,
but please move this if it is another component.
Krillin running default channel (Ubuntu 15.04 r25 as per most recent OTA
update).
In the browser app "bookmarks" page and the clock app "alarms" page, the
Alternatively, a mechanism to alter /etc/hosts without having to remount
'/' would be welcome. This would permit advert blocking in all network
apps.
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Sorry, I'm unable to do this; 15.10 was too unstable for me keep it on
my laptop, so I've removed it now.
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And the syslog...
** Attachment added: "bluetooth_syslog"
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bluez/+bug/1435040/+attachment/4527538/+files/bluetooth_syslog
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I cannot connect to the unit in my Hyundai i40, and switching to the
latest rc-proposed with bluez5 hasn't changed anything.
Symptoms:
(1) When car unit is asked to search for devices, the phone is not seen at all.
My other bluetooth devices get picked up by this search. I have checked, and
the
Behaviour is not correct, nor was anything in my post #52 intended to
suggest that it is.
See the next couple of posts by Sebastian Bacher and myself for a full
and accurate description of the problem.
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Public bug reported:
BQ E4.5 (krillin) running OTA9.1
I have 2 recurring alarms set for 0730 and 0800. If I pull down the
clock indicator bar after midnight, the 0730 alarm is listed as
"Tomorrow". The Clock app lists the alarm correctly (although, if I
rememebr correctly, there was previously a
** Attachment added: "Clock app show the alarm correctly"
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-datetime/+bug/1549783/+attachment/4580806/+files/screenshot20160224_012320048.png
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I have the same issue, with dbus installed.
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https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1477130
Title:
timedatectl fails inside container
Status in systemd package in
Ok.
Commented out the HandleLidSwitchDocked=suspend line and restarted
systemd-logind.
Closed lid, waited a minute, the bug showed itself, the system did not
suspend.
neilw@NWPS-LAP:/etc/systemd$ systemd-inhibit
Who: Unity (UID 1000/neilw, PID 1463/compiz)
What: sleep
Why: Unity
I've reinstated the workaround and run the requested commands again.
As far as I can see, the output of all three is exactly the same as in
the bug condition, apart from the items in the inhibitors list being
shown in a different order.
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neilw@NWPS-LAP:/etc/systemd$ sleep 10; systemd-inhibit
//Lid closed, count to ten and open again to find...
Who: Telepathy (UID 1000/neilw, PID 1729/mission-control)
What: shutdown:sleep
Why: Disconnecting IM accounts before suspend/shutdown...
Mode: delay
Who: neilw (UID
System left in buggy state, debug enabled in system.conf, system
rebooted.
neilw@NWPS-LAP:~$ ls /sys/class/drm/
card0 card0-LVDS-1 controlD64 ttm
card0-HDMI-A-1 card0-VGA-1 renderD128 version
neilw@NWPS-LAP:~$ cat /sys/class/drm/*/enabled
disabled
enabled
disabled
Ok, I tried;
journalctl |grep systemd > somekindoflog.log
The result is attached.
** Attachment added: "Result of "journalctl |grep systemd > somekindoflog.log""
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/systemd/+bug/1574120/+attachment/4660832/+files/somekindoflog.log
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@seb128
"You have a laptop not connected to an external display and configured
in settings to suspend on lid close (battery/ac) but it doesn't suspend
when you close the lid? Suspending through the menu works though and
settings HandleLidSwitchDocked=suspend makes it suspend on lid close"
Yes,
@seb128
Yes, the bug is present with the default configuration file, but lid
close to suspend (from unity) works fine if I change the configuration.
In both the bug and functioning conditions the backlight turns off when
the lid is closed.
I will test behaviour from a console log-in later
@pitti
neilw@NWPS-LAP:~$ ls /sys/class/drm/
card0 card0-LVDS-1 controlD64 ttm
card0-HDMI-A-1 card0-VGA-1 renderD128 version
neilw@NWPS-LAP:~$ grep -r . /sys/class/drm/*/enabled
/sys/class/drm/card0-HDMI-A-1/enabled:disabled
/sys/class/drm/card0-LVDS-1/enabled:enabled
On my HP255G1 I have six inhibitors listed, the two blocks being;
Who: neilw (UID 1000/neilw, PID 1669/unity-settings-)
What: handle-power-key:handle-suspend-key:handle-hibernate-key
Why: GNOME handling keypresses
Mode: block
Who: neilw (UID 1000/neilw, PID
The problem persists after sorting the oddity with the unity-settings-
daemon, which appears to have been a one-off problem. (See bug #1577906
for more detail.)
Now I find that suspend only works if "HandleLidSwitchDocked=suspend" is
in logind.conf.
Without that I return to the bug condition.
I eventually got the updates to install by removing the WICID and WIFI Radar
network scanners one of which I *think* was employing the runmbbservice
(because the "mmb" bit seems to stand for "mobile broadband") Then I ran "sudo
apt update && sudo apt upgrade" which then gave the following
Public bug reported:
Terminal log follows
neil@neil-Latitude-D630:~$ lsmod | grep usb
usbhid 49152 0
hid 118784 2 hid_generic,usbhid
neil@neil-Latitude-D630:~$ tail -f /var/log/syslog
Feb 10 15:02:17 neil-Latitude-D630 avahi-daemon[960]: Registering new
I can confirm that /sys/device/platform/dock.0 does not exist on my
system.
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Title:
Notebook doesn't suspend when
: [pulseaudio] main.c: Session ID is c2.
I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Using runtime directory /run/user/500/pulse.
I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Using state directory /home/neil/.config/pulse.
I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Using modules directory /usr/lib/pulse-8.0/modules.
I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Running in system mode
That seems like a good approach. Thanks for looking at this.
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https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1620139
Title:
factor buffers output when run interactively
Public bug reported:
When the "factor" utility is run without any arguments, it reads numbers
from stdin and writes the factors to stdout. One use case for this mode
is to run factor in a terminal window and enter numbers manually. This
worked well in coreutils 8.23 and earlier. However, in
Added both cloud-ini t and init-system-helpers from proposed to the
standard Xenial cloud image
(com.ubuntu.cloud:released:download/com.ubuntu.cloud:server:16.04:amd64/20160907.1/disk1.img)
on a suitably sized server.
Reset the cloud init with rm -rf /var/lib/cloud/instances/*, shutdown
the
Have we back ported the init-system-helpers changes to Xenial?
I'm only seeing 1.29ubuntu2 this morning.
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https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1576692
Has anyone had a chance to look into this yet? It's been affecting me
for months - ever since I upgraded to Xenial, in fact.
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What is runmbbservice and should I get rid of it?
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https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1590892
Title:
package util-linux 2.27.1-6ubuntu3.1 failed to
Public bug reported:
ping to a mapped address
ping :::216.58.213.68
sends an ICMPv6 packet out onto the Internet with the mapped address in
the destination packet and the IPv6 address as the source. Mapped
addresses shouldn't appear on the public internet according to the RFC.
I would
ProcVersionSignature: Ubuntu 4.13.0-16.19-generic 4.13.4
Uname: Linux 4.13.0-16-generic x86_64
NonfreeKernelModules: nvidia_uvm nvidia_drm nvidia_modeset nvidia
ApportVersion: 2.20.7-0ubuntu3
Architecture: amd64
AudioDevicesInUse:
USERPID ACCESS COMMAND
/dev/snd/controlC1: neil 1443 F pulseaudio
I found that the brightness controls (via function key or sliders in power
management) were changing the values in
/sys/class/backlight/acpi_videos0/brightness, but nothing changed in
/sys/class/backlight/intel_backlight/brightness.
When I edited the value in
Public bug reported:
unable to update software
ProblemType: Bug
DistroRelease: Ubuntu 17.04
Package: xorg 1:7.7+16ubuntu3
ProcVersionSignature: Ubuntu 4.10.0-40.44-generic 4.10.17
Uname: Linux 4.10.0-40-generic x86_64
.tmp.unity_support_test.0:
ApportVersion: 2.20.4-0ubuntu4.8
Architecture:
This appears to be quite an old issue with Optimus graphics. For me the
workaround was to pass specific kernel parameters at boot time to inhibit acpi
control of the backlight but allow intel_backlight control
I followed the instructions at
Public bug reported:
When the spooldir mtime=0, cron refuses to update its "database". This
happens because the "old database" mtime is initialized to 0.
```
61: /* if spooldir's mtime has not changed, we don't need to fiddle with
62- * the database.
63- *
64- * Note that
I have the same problem as William Jojo (w-jojo) reported in #54.
The Shibboleth authentication package (libapache2-mod-shib2) in Bionic
Universe depends on libcurl3 (via libxmltooling7). I'm told in bug
#1776489 that this is because upstream Shibboleth hasn't yet released a
version that works
ProcVersionSignature: Ubuntu 4.13.0-16.19-generic 4.13.4
Uname: Linux 4.13.0-16-generic x86_64
ApportVersion: 2.20.7-0ubuntu3.1
Architecture: amd64
AudioDevicesInUse:
USERPID ACCESS COMMAND
/dev/snd/controlC0: neil 1212 F pulseaudio
CurrentDesktop: ubuntu:GNOME
Date: Fri Oct 27 23:16
affects me too
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https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/972077
Title:
apt repository disk format has race conditions
Status in APT:
Fix Released
Status in apt
Thanks for providing the proper coding process to resolve WiFi issue,
this bugs process really help me a lot to get my solution as i am unable
to access WiFi connection in my Apple iPhone Device. But still anyone
want some more information apart from coding then i suggest to read this
blog once
lModules: nvidia_uvm nvidia_drm nvidia_modeset nvidia
ApportVersion: 2.20.7-0ubuntu3
Architecture: amd64
AudioDevicesInUse:
USERPID ACCESS COMMAND
/dev/snd/controlC1: neil 1443 F pulseaudio
/dev/snd/pcmC0D0c: neil 1443 F...m pulseaudio
/dev/snd/controlC0
ACCESS COMMAND
/dev/snd/controlC1: neil 1443 F pulseaudio
/dev/snd/pcmC0D0c: neil 1443 F...m pulseaudio
/dev/snd/controlC0: neil 1443 F pulseaudio
CurrentDesktop: ubuntu:GNOME
Date: Thu Oct 19 19:12:59 2017
InstallationDate: Installed on 2017-10-19 (0 days ago
I think just a delta change process would be fine. It's restarting when
there is no change in lease details, and just clogging up the logs.
btw I am not suggesting leaving dhclient there is a bug - hence the
title of the bug.
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LGTM on bionic
ubuntu@srv-ywz63:~$ dpkg -l systemd | grep ii
ii systemd237-3ubuntu10.32 i386 system and service manager
ubuntu@srv-ywz63:~$ journalctl -b -u systemd-resolved | grep Started
Nov 14 17:05:43 srv-ywz63 systemd[1]: Started Network Name Resolution.
Nov 14 17:05:44
"I think you're trying to start dhclient on an interface that's already
setup."
It just triggers a lease refresh on the existing interface, which has
the same issue.
Nov 15 14:17:10 srv-ywz63 systemd-logind[981]: New session 27 of user ubuntu.
Nov 15 14:17:10 srv-ywz63 systemd[1]: Started
Indeed. It offers python3 version 3.7.5-1ubuntu1 as a solution which is
not appropriate as python3 version 3.8.0-3 is already installed and does
not provide a `python` command.
The python-is-python3 solution sounds like a sensible way forward. There
be dragons, I suspect.
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Indeed. It offers python3 version 3.7.5-1ubuntu1 as a solution which is
not appropriate as python3 version 3.8.0-3 is already installed and does
not provide a `python` command.
The python-is-python3 solution sounds like a sensible way forward. There
be dragons, I suspect.
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