[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Well that's up to you fellows, I thought
it might clear the air orclear some things up
DAVEH: There is little I
can say that will clear the air as long as there are those in TT who do
not want to discuss some of these things in seriousness.
- whatever you want to call
Charles Perry Locke wrote:
DavidH,
Thanks for the response, although you really didn't answer
any of the
questions, but that is your choice, which I respect.
DAVEH: Thanx Perry..Seems I don't get a lot of respect on TT.
(AndI do know there are some TTers who do afford me a fair measure
"And God said, let US make man in OUR image, after OUR likeness . . ."
So according to LDS theology God should have made man after the gods images.
Gen 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him
A plural image (OUR image - TRINITARIAN Formula; Father, Son, Holy
Kevin Deegan wrote:
They do not claim it happens in the normal sealing
rooms. What woman goes around claiming "hey I have been raped" I want the
world to know.
DAVEH: Those who expect to
be believed and helped
--
~~~
Dave Hansen
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.langlitz.com
DAVEH: Kevin, I find it rather
interesting that you addressed everything EXCEPT the question I put to
Dean!..
++
Dean wrote:
Is this related to the fact that
SLC has a much higher
> average than the nation in teen
pregnancy and drug abuse?
DAVEH: Really? I hadn't
Kevin Deegan wrote:
LDS: How did god work out his own salvation?
DAVEH: IMO.it was the same way as Jesus. (Jn 5:19)
You know the others that you WILL not answer...
DAVEH: Really?!?!?! Kevin, perhaps it is because you are asking
--
~~~
Dave Hansen
[EMAIL
DAVEH: So Kevin..Do you commit
sins???
Kevin Deegan wrote:
Guilty conscience?Titus 1:15 Unto the pure all things
are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving
is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.Hebrews
9:14 How much more shall the blood of Christ,
who
DAVEH: OK Kevin, if you don't
think being one with God means purpose...Just what does
oneness mean to you??? And, how can you become one
with God if not in purpose???
Kevin Deegan wrote:
DAVEH: I don't understand why that is so,
DavidM. It is quite obvious
there are 3 persons/entities in the
From: Blaine Borrowman [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Blaine:
I started this, I think--Judy seems to be having a difficult time
accepting that there is a difference between the potential for sin and
accomplished sin. Jesus had the potential for sin--otherwise the devil
would not have taken him up on the
No DAVEH
As it turns out yesterday a.m. was just alull - Do you ever feel like
you
are the recipient of'information overload'?
Grace and Peace,
Judy
From: Dave [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Well that's up to you fellows, I thought
it might clear the air orclear some things
Dean Moore
Fear God and keep His commandments/ trust Jesus
.
Blaine: The anointing with water first--a cleansing ordinance--and then oil afterwards does happen. But it is done on the head, neck, face, arms, hands, lower legs and feet. And it is not done in the circular room, or even
Dean Moore
Fear God and keep His commandments/ trust Jesus
DAVEH: I respectfully disagree. If we use your (Protestant derived) definitions of heaven and hell, it will be easy to explain. I do not believe non-Mormons will be cast into a literal lake of fire and brimstone. Now, to you does
DAVEH: I respectfully disagree. If we use your (Protestant derived) definitions of heaven and hell, it will be easy to explain. I do not believe non-Mormons will be cast into a literal lake of fire and brimstone.
Well that settles it then.
There can't be a literal Hell, Dave doesn't believe it.
Just show me ONE verse that says "ONE in Purpose"
BoM, DC, JoD, Bible
Is this not what you do with John 17 INSERT "IN PURPOSE" in your mind everytime you read ONE?
John 10:30 I and my Father are one.
The Jews understood full well was Jesus meant, they took up stones, because he "makest thyself
Perhaps it is BECAUSE you have NO ANSWERS!
Dave [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Kevin Deegan wrote: LDS: How did god work out his own salvation?DAVEH: IMO.it was the same way as Jesus. (Jn 5:19) You know the others that you WILL not answer...DAVEH: Really?!?!?! Kevin, perhaps it is because you
Nope I was just stating the Facts
If indeed the LDS church is the one true religion on earth, despite all the imperfections of the mortals that run it, and the members who attempt to follow its teachings, it is fair to assume that the practices and doctrines in it would produce people who are
DAVEH: My latest comment is in RED..
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
No DAVEHAs it turns out yesterday a.m. was
just a lull - Do you ever feel like youare the recipient of 'information
overload'?
DAVEH: LOL..You only are battling a
couple tired old Mormon boys who are way past their prime. We
DAVEH: Kevin..If you want
to have a relatively serious discussion about hell and oneness, I will
be willing to share my thoughts with you in a respectful exchange of ideas.
If on the other hand you wish merely to bloody my nose and overload me
with a lot of nonsense, then I will refrain from
Go ahead, I did not think you wanted to talk to me, or answer questions.Dave [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
DAVEH: Kevin..If you want to have a relatively serious discussion about hell and oneness, I will be willing to share my thoughts with you in a respectful exchange of ideas. If on the other
David Miller wrote:
Even Paul, in his letter to the Romans, speaks about
how God's grace manifests itself even greater in the
presence of sin (Romans 5:20). This at first seems
contrary to how many people think about God's grace.
We generally think that God is favorable toward those
who
Dean wrote:
Your claim is that Daveh has grace-are you saying his is saved-
No.
Dean wrote:
Earlier you declared him to be a Christian-How is he saved?
He is not saved. Many Christians are not saved. Statistics are that
85% of U.S. citizens are Christians. The majority of these are not
Judy wrote:
I just responded to the quote you posted from Holy Hubert
David. Yes it was cute as a 'one liner' but not God's heart
on the matter.
I disagree. I think it does capture God's heart on the matter, given
the context in which it was spoken.
Judy wrote:
When Paul wrote thus sayeth
DaveH,
Why do you consdier a lot of nonsense the plethora of contradicting and
indicting statements coming directly from the LDS standard works and other
authoritaive momron lilterature which Kevin has cited? Does that mean you do
not have to deal with them if you ignore them? Well, they are
DaveH wrote:
Do other TTers feel I've coaxed Blaine as to what to say?
No, certainly not nearly as much as Dean has coaxed Kevin. :-)
Peace be with you.
David Miller, Beverly Hills, Florida.
--
Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you
ought
DAVEH wrote:
H..IF that (understanding) is correct, then I
would say there are more than a few TTers who are
squirming on their seats right now
Probably so... :-)
DaveH wrote:
I feel that if I were to claim I don't sin,
it would be hypocritical.
I agree. I'm not
David Miller wrote:
My personal understanding is that all authority comes through Jesus
Christ, and each believer comes to understand his role in the body of
Christ through the Holy Spirit. I consider it to be sin for
believers
to be waiting on some priesthood to ordain them into ministry.
Kevin wrote:
Jesus could not have a Carnal Mind
The carnal mind is the brain. Are you trying to argue that Jesus did
not have a brain? !!
Nevertheless, Jesus was not carnally minded meaning that he followed
the spirit rather than the impulses of his physical brain.
Peace be with you.
David
Kevin wrote:
Ps 51:5 in sin did my mother conceive me.
This is the purpose of the Virgin Birth that
Jesus would not inherit a sin nature.
He was not concieved in SIN you were!
Your teaching here comes from Roman Catholicism. The Bible teaches the
opposite, that Christ became flesh (1 John
Kevin wrote:
Just for those that BLASPHEMOUSLY attribute
a SIN nature to Jesus
The real blasphemy is denying the incarnation of Christ.
Jesus was made sin for us, and those who deny this are the ones who
blaspheme the truth of Christ.
Peace be with you.
David Miller, Beverly Hills, Florida.
Judy wrote:
What I don't accept is Jesus being born with the spiritual
inheritance left to the rest of us by the first Adam after
his fall.
Spiritual inheritance? What is spiritual inheritance? How is it
transferred to us? Where does the Bible teach spiritual inheritance?
Judy wrote:
It is Blasphemous to deny the incarnation
and since Jesus was God manifest in the flesh to attribute the ability to sin and a sin nature to Jesus is to attribute the same to God.
David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Kevin wrote: Just for those that BLASPHEMOUSLY attribute a SIN nature to
Was he born of Spirit or born of flesh?David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Judy wrote: What I don't accept is Jesus being born with the spiritual inheritance left to the rest of us by the first Adam after his fall. Spiritual inheritance? What is spiritual inheritance? How is ittransferred to
RCC?
ROTFL
Ok I'm back, the RCC did not write Ps 51
God became flesh He was is still God.David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Kevin wrote: Ps 51:5 "in sin did my mother conceive me." This is the purpose of the Virgin Birth that Jesus would not inherit a sin nature. He was not concieved in SIN
What verse was that?
I seemed to have missed it.
Or what Philosophy?
Col 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Kevin wrote: Jesus could not
I'm just a ghost writerDavid Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
DaveH wrote: Do other TTers feel I've coaxed Blaine as to what to say?No, certainly not nearly as much as Dean has coaxed Kevin. :-)Peace be with you.David Miller, Beverly Hills, Florida.--"Let your speech be always with grace,
Karen wrote: " The ceremonies, word for word, were! exactly the same as the
Masonic rituals."
Blaine writes: I keep seeing this sort of
statement, but never have I actually seen anyone postactual Masonic
rituals, handshakes, etc. I have looked and looked through Masonic
literature, and
From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Judy wrote:
I just responded to the quote you posted from Holy Hubert
David. Yes it was cute as a 'one liner' but not God's heart
on the matter.
DavidM:
I disagree. I think it does capture God's heart on the matter, given
the context in which it was
From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Kevin wrote:
Ps 51:5 in sin did my mother conceive me.
This is the purpose of the Virgin Birth that
Jesus would not inherit a sin nature.
He was not concieved in SIN you were!
DavidM:
Your teaching here comes from Roman Catholicism.
Judy:
No the above
From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Kevin wrote: Jesus could not have a Carnal Mind
DavidM writes:
The carnal mind is the brain. Are you trying to argue that Jesus did
not have a brain? !!
Judy:
The carnal mind is not a physical organ called the brain because to be
carnally minded is death and
Kevin wrote:
It is Blasphemous to deny the incarnation and
since Jesus was God manifest in the flesh to
attribute the ability to sin and a sin nature
to Jesus is to attribute the same to God.
The incarnation means that Jesus had qualities of both man and God.
Therefore, Jesus had
- Original Message -
From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2004 6:44
AM
Subject: [TruthTalk] Mormons and
Women
Here is another unhappy Mormon woman
who is saying the same thing
about having to be sealed to a man in a
From: "David Miller" [EMAIL PROTECTED]Judy
wrote: What I don't accept is Jesus being born with the
spiritual inheritance left to the rest of us by the first Adam after
his fall.
DavidM:
Spiritual inheritance? What is spiritual inheritance? How is
ittransferred to us? Where does the Bible
From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Kevin wrote:
It is Blasphemous to deny the incarnation and
since Jesus was God manifest in the flesh to
attribute the ability to sin and a sin nature
to Jesus is to attribute the same to God.
DavidM:
The incarnation means that Jesus had qualities of
- Original Message -
From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2004 6:51
AM
Subject: [TruthTalk] Mormon Rituals
Is this right DAVEH and
Blaine?
This is a mixture of truth and what
appears to be deliberate
I am not here to debate the IMPECCABILITY of ChristDavid Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Kevin wrote: It is Blasphemous to deny the incarnation and since Jesus was God manifest in the flesh to attribute the ability to sin and a sin nature to Jesus is to attribute the same to God.The incarnation
DavidM wrote:
We addressed this already in the past and it is discouraging
to have to repeat it yet again. The Mishnah was not written
until hundreds of years later.
Judy wrote:
I can empathize after a fashion DavidM because it discourages
me to read such legalism coming from a man with
HANDSHAKES
http://www.ephesians5-11.org/handshakes.htm
Look FAMILIAR?
THE FIVE POINTS OF FELLOWSHIP?
http://www.geocities.com/masonicsecrets/masonsigns.htm
Doctrine Covenants 129:1 There are two kinds of beings in heaven, namely: Angels, who are resurrected personages, having bodies of flesh and
Kevin wrote:
I am not here to debate the IMPECCABILITY of Christ
If you do not care to discuss what we mean when we describe Christ as
impeccable, that is your choice. However, if you do not believe that
Jesus Christ was human, that might create some problems. My Jesus was
human, and is now a
First you imply thatI do not believe in the Incarnation, now youimply I believe in an Alien god
Why do you keep making up such drivel?
Do you need a debate that bad?
David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Kevin wrote: I am not here to debate the IMPECCABILITY of ChristIf you do not care to discuss
Kevin wrote:
First you imply that I do not believe in the
Incarnation, now you imply I believe in an
Alien god Why do you keep making up such drivel?
Do you need a debate that bad?
I'm not looking for a debate. I'm looking for some kind of agreement
that Jesus was a human being. If Jesus
Judy wrote:
The carnal mind is not a physical organ called the brain
because to be carnally minded is death
If you think about it, that is exactly why the carnal mind leads to
death. The physical body is under a curse, so whoever sows to the flesh
reaps of the flesh corruption. The physical
Kevin wrote:
Ps 51:5 in sin did my mother conceive me.
This is the purpose of the Virgin Birth that
Jesus would not inherit a sin nature.
He was not concieved in SIN you were!
DavidM:
Your teaching here comes from Roman Catholicism.
Judy wrote:
No the above isn't Roman Catholicism; they
I am not so sure you are looking for agreement.
It seems to me you create a definition and then stick me in it.
I can tell you we do not agree on this,I think you already know that.
Would you describe yourself as Pelagian or Semi-Pelagian?
I think the latter, but this I surmise from reading your
Kevin wrote:
Would you describe yourself as Pelagian or Semi-Pelagian?
I think the latter, but this I surmise from reading your
posts on other subjects.
I'm not Pelagian in the least. I consider Pelagianism to be a false
teaching. Pelagianism denies original sin and gives too much credit
From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Kevin wrote:
Ps 51:5 in sin did my mother conceive me.
This is the purpose of the Virgin Birth that
Jesus would not inherit a sin nature.
He was not concieved in SIN you were!
DavidM:
Your teaching here comes from Roman Catholicism.
Judy wrote:
No the
From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Judy wrote:
The carnal mind is not a physical organ called the brain
because to be carnally minded is death
DavidM:
If you think about it, that is exactly why the carnal mind leads
to death.
Judy:
Scripture says that 'IT IS DEATH'; I think our problem
From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I'm not looking for a debate. I'm looking for some kind of agreement
that Jesus was a human being. If Jesus was not human, then the logical
inference from that is that you do not believe in the Incarnation (God
clothed in humanity). If Jesus was not of the
From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I see no contradictions in Scripture if taken at face value.
Judy:
How can you not, I find this incredulous
DavidM:
Let me quote 1 Timothy 2 for you and then quote some Torah portions that
correspond to it. This is pretty basic, but for some reason you
"FULL" HISTORY IS INCOMPLETE!The full history in the Messenger in Advocate 1834 Jo Smith History p 59 does not contain any of these important details, even though they were supposedly historical events that occurred five years earlier. Why does it take till 1842 to get it all together? And why do
Dean Moore
Fear God and keep His commandments/ trust Jesus
[Original Message]
From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 1/19/2004 11:11:29 AM
Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] False Teachers
David Miller wrote:
Even Paul, in his letter to the Romans, speaks about
how
http://devel.harktheherald.com/modules.php?op=modloadname=Newsfile=articlesid=7604
http://devel.harktheherald.com/index.php?name=PNphpBB2file=viewtopict=4898Escalation likely at next LDS Conference"Violence is virtually assured" against SP'sSeeing as they know this people, are most assuredly
Dean Moore
Fear God and keep His commandments/ trust Jesus
Dean wrote:
Your claim is that Daveh has grace-are you saying his is saved-
No.
Dean wrote:
Earlier you declared him to be a Christian-How is he saved?
He is not saved. Many Christians are not saved. Statistics are that
Dean Moore
Fear God and keep His commandments/ trust Jesus
DaveH wrote:
Do other TTers feel I've coaxed Blaine as to what to say?
No, certainly not nearly as much as Dean has coaxed Kevin. :-)
Dean writes:
David-If it is to teach truth then there is no fault in helping anyone-I
doubt
Kevin Deegan wrote:
DAVEH: I respectfully disagree. If
we use your (Protestant derived) definitions of heaven and hell, it will
be easy to explain. I do not believe non-Mormons will be cast into
a literal lake of fire and brimstone.Well that settles it then.There
can't be a literal Hell, Dave
- Original Message -
From: "Charles Perry Locke" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2004 2:40 PM
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] TruthTalk False
Teachers-Ad. Hom attack David.
Perry wrote:
In fact, the heaven you describe is nowhere
described in the Bible.
Blaine: That's the kettle calling the pot
black, for sure! LOL
- Original Message -
From:
Kevin
Deegan
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2004 9:17
PM
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Dean
Ruben
You Wrest tyhe scriptures Blaine, you are so
Blaine" I was wondering about that marriage
to a 16 yr old, and I said, "Why, he ought to be hung!! Someone standing
nearbye overheard me say that, and replied, "Oh, he must be for
sure!" LOL
- Original Message -
From:
Kevin
Deegan
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent:
Blaine: I can't believe how you are
continually taking the words right out of my mouth, Kevin.
- Original Message -
From:
Kevin
Deegan
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2004 9:30
PM
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Jesus had the
same sinful flesh
Charles Perry Locke wrote:
DaveH,
Why do you consdier "a lot of nonsense" the plethora of
contradicting and
indicting statements coming directly from the LDS standard works and
other
authoritaive momron lilterature which Kevin has cited?
DAVEH: Perry, as I have repeatedly said before, I'm not
Kevin wrote:
The BoM is a work of FICTION:
Blaine writes:
There is so much about the book of Mormon that tells us it is true, we don't
need to know exactly where everything was, but we believe and have faith it will
be revealed in the Lord's own due time anyway--He has not failed us yet.
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