Re: read larger data streams over sockets - broken?

[Phil Davis via use-livecode]

On 12/6/17 6:12 PM, Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami via use-livecode wrote:

May not mean anything for your use case, but I have built an in-house revision 
control system for InDesign documents… it's been in use for several years after 
the death of Adobe VersionCue (which was a night mare anyway) our team loves 
it: super simple, never fails, we never lose data, ever.

I use shell commands for everything.  not sure why you need sockets if you are 
just copy files around…from our Macs to the Synology server in the next room…


Right, a NAS device can work very well as it obviously does in your 
situation. Unfortunately this a point of sale (and more) business system 
where we want to control how much access the users have to the data, 
especially regarding things like customer credit card info. So we don't 
want to have the server mounted on each user's desktop (as would be 
required with a NAS) where they can just go in and poke around.


But thanks for your offer!

Phil



my long stack script just manages different

put format "mv \"someFile\", \"newFileName\"  # into cmdRename
and
cp # similar strings

then

get shell cmdRename

and the OS does everything..

If you want to see the stack you are welcome. It's being used (or was) by some 
publication team in Singapore for the same work.

On 12/6/17, 1:52 PM, "use-livecode on behalf of Phil Davis via use-livecode" 
 wrote:

 Is anyone else having problems with moving multi-MB data streams across
 sockets in LC 8?
 
 I support a LAN-based system that relies on sockets to move data between

 server and clients. The server's response to a single client request
 will often consist of several hundred KB to several MB of data. Until LC
 8 the successful approach has been:

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--
Phil Davis


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Re: read larger data streams over sockets - broken?

[Monte Goulding via use-livecode]

Just a guess it sounds like some kind of encoding issue but if you can provide 
demo client and server stacks that demonstrate the issue that will help us 
track down the issue.

Also let us know the previous version it was working on. 

Cheers

Monte
> On 7 Dec 2017, at 10:51 am, Phil Davis via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Is anyone else having problems with moving multi-MB data streams across 
> sockets in LC 8?
> 
> I support a LAN-based system that relies on sockets to move data between 
> server and clients. The server's response to a single client request will 
> often consist of several hundred KB to several MB of data. Until LC 8 the 
> successful approach has been:
> 
> - client sends request to server
> 
> - server returns data to client
> 
> - client reads the returned data:
> 
>   read from socket tMySocket for 1 line -- contains the length of the
>   data that follows
>   put it into tDataLength
>   repeat while length(tData) < tDataLength
>read from socket tMySocket for tDataLength
>wait 1 millisecond with messages
>put it after tData
>   end repeat
> 
> This approach no longer works in LC 8. There are 2 new issues:
> - large time delays
> - wrong final data size
> 
> Here are some actual results from a client that was trying to receive 151k of 
> data - not that big!
> 
>   tDataLength = 151954
> 
>   read #1 got 0 chars in 15.25521 secs
>   read #2 got 131761 chars in 15.001723 secs
>   read #3 got 131761 chars in 0.001813 secs
>   actual received data length = 263522
>   total elapsed time = 30.259262 secs
> 
> I changed the client code to read 'until EOF' and got similar outcomes:
> 
>   tDataLength = 151954
> 
>   read until EOF #1 got 0 chars in 15.254117 secs
>   read until EOF #2 got 131761 chars in 15.004341 secs
>   read until EOF #3 got 131761 chars in 0.001733 secs
>   actual received data length = 263522
>   total elapsed time = 30.260464 secs
> 
> Either 'read' structure works fine as long as the data length doesn't exceed 
> roughly 128k (that's the max in my world at least - YMMV). I'm not sure if 
> the 128k size constraint is coming from LC or from my network (a standard 
> gigabit-Ethernet LAN with router, switches, computers) or from some other 
> source.
> 
> I know this is a bug and plan to file a bug report, but I wanted to see if 
> anyone else has experienced something similar.
> 
> Thanks -
> Phil Davis
> 
> -- 
> Phil Davis
> 
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Re: read larger data streams over sockets - broken?

[Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami via use-livecode]

May not mean anything for your use case, but I have built an in-house revision 
control system for InDesign documents… it's been in use for several years after 
the death of Adobe VersionCue (which was a night mare anyway) our team loves 
it: super simple, never fails, we never lose data, ever. 

I use shell commands for everything.  not sure why you need sockets if you are 
just copy files around…from our Macs to the Synology server in the next room… 

my long stack script just manages different  

put format "mv \"someFile\", \"newFileName\"  # into cmdRename
and
cp # similar strings

then 

get shell cmdRename

and the OS does everything..

If you want to see the stack you are welcome. It's being used (or was) by some 
publication team in Singapore for the same work.

On 12/6/17, 1:52 PM, "use-livecode on behalf of Phil Davis via use-livecode" 
 wrote:

Is anyone else having problems with moving multi-MB data streams across 
sockets in LC 8?

I support a LAN-based system that relies on sockets to move data between 
server and clients. The server's response to a single client request 
will often consist of several hundred KB to several MB of data. Until LC 
8 the successful approach has been:

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Re: Map Widget Futures

[Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami via use-livecode]

Thanks for replying Ali

I wasn't thinking of overlays, though that could be useful and would obviously 
be an early enhancment request.

message path:  Presumably "markers" are in the msg path… i.e. like buttons, and 
would respond to mouseup/down/touch. That would suffice for my V1 vision of use 
cases. Though I guess without overlays we are forced to abrupt changes on the 
screen if we want the map to be a portal to ther data…but… leave that for V2…


Today's question is not about overlays… the question is: "What is the map 
object?"

Where does it come from and can we supply some alt document… for example, if 
one had an artist create 

The WonderFul World of Ali, i.e. a fantasy map…in SynFig Studio… one could 
export to a vector format.

How do we make this the map "object"  Other more prosaic uses could be: complex 
diagrams that cover "hectares/square miles" of space… the map of Oxford 
University campus… Tolkein's Middle Earth etc. engineering diagram with various 
parts of some machine all laid out on one complex, very large "map"  -- giant 
SVG's. giant in the sense of being created on a canvas in your illustration 
software set to 4 feet by 4 feet… which then can export to vector… scale up or 
down, but at that size one can work in areas with a lot of detail… and create a 
"Villiage of Hobbits" off in the corner… 

Here for example is a very simple test SVG export from a small inexpensive 
program that I like called "Diagrammix"

http://dev.himalayanacademy.com/html/info/img/site-map.svg

so what comprises the map "object" and what is the scope of its format, 
properties etc. Obviously the developer has to source the map object from 
somewhere, in some format.


On 12/6/17, 2:03 PM, "use-livecode on behalf of Ali Lloyd via use-livecode" 
 wrote:

I'm not quite sure what you mean by 'a member of the msg path in "proper
standing"' - the map widget just wraps a native view essentially. The map
'object' is only accessible through foreign handlers in LCB, but if it can
be done natively then it can be done.

In the first instance the widget will support annotations/markers and
polylines, but won't support generic overlays.



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Re: Map Widget Futures

[Richard Gaskin via use-livecode]

Ali Lloyd wrote:

> ...make the map widget a lot more flexible on the
> objective-c side...

iOS-only?

--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World Systems
 Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
 
 ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com

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Re: LC Server style survey: co-mingle code w/HTML?

[Richard Gaskin via use-livecode]

Alex Tweedly wrote:

> On 06/12/2017 19:14, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode wrote:
>>
>> There's a difference in terms of the primary execution object, and
>> how that effects the flow of both execution and the workflow.
>>
>> It seems I'm unable to articulate it clearly enough, but no worries.
>> The bottom line is that LC Server scripts are incompatible with LC
>> Script on the desktop, and when used with wrapped HTML there's no
>> need for me to generalize my tools because they can't be used in that
>> context.
>>
> I'm still unclear on what does (can?) and what doesn't (can't) be done
> with LC Server scripts on the desktop.
>
> If I don't use mingled/wrapped HTML (which I certainly don't, afaik) -
> could I use your tools for my LC Server scripts (nb - they do use
> 'include's).
>
> In fact, to be even more specific - assuming "my" scripts are actually
> revIgniter with a controller or two added by me, would it be possible
> to use the tools ?

By what means would you execute those with LC Script on the desktop?

A few examples of incompatibilities between LC Script on the desktop and 
LC Server (designated by letter in case anyone wants to refer to any of 
these):


--
EXAMPLE A

This:

  

...runs great when you pass a file with that to LC Server.  LC Script 
for the desktop won't know what do to with it.


You could run that as data through the merge function and it would work 
well, but that's a different execution sequence than passing a file 
directly to an engine.


--
EXAMPLE B

The implicit merge LC Server uses is more complete than the 
explicitly-called merge function.  For example, the merge function 
doesn't handle conditionals cross non-code parts, e.g.:


  
 Some data that happens to be HTML
  
 Some other data that happens to be HTML
  

That'll work in LC Server, but AFAIK is incompatible with LC Script on 
the desktop.


--
EXAMPLE C

For the first dozen or so years of the desktop engine, you could pass it 
a text file with something like this in it:


  on startup
 put DoSomethingWith($REMOTE_ADDR) into tReply
 put "HTTP/1.x 200 OK" &cr& \
   Content-Length: "& len(tReply) &crlf&crlf& tReply
   end startup

With the introduction of LC Server the ability of the desktop file to 
handle plain text files containing code disappeared.  In its place only 
LC Server could handle those, and only when wrapped within the "" 
tags.


--
EXAMPLE D

Environment variables in the original desktop engine were handled 
directly as defined by Apache.  In LC Server they are copied into vars 
that are similar but not the same, e.g. the env var:


   $REMOTE_ADDR

...is available in LC Server as:

   $_SERVER["REMOTE_ADDR"]

--
EXAMPLE E

A few years ago on of the team members recognized that it would be 
useful to be able to run simple text files containing scripts only with 
a bare engine.  Since LC Server is the only bare engine now executable 
by itself without having to be made into a standalone, and perhaps 
unaware of the long history of having been able to do this before, it 
was added but in an odd way, without any handler declaration, just raw 
statements, e.g.:


  get 1+1
  add 5 to it
  put SomeFunction(it) into tResult

  function SomeFunction p1
 return p1+100
  end SomeFunction

So code outside of a handler is a sort of implied handler, but to 
distinguish that code from anything in an actual handler the other 
handlers look like handlers.


This is unlike anything in any xTalk, and breaks the otherwise 
beautifully learnable consistency of "code lives in handlers".


--
EXAMPLE F

Even more recently it was recognized that script-only stacks can be 
useful, so now you can have something almost like the original text 
files we used to use, but with the addition of one line at the top 
specifying that it's a "stack":


stack "Some Stack Name"

on startup
   DoSomething
end startup

AFAIK this is not compatible with LC Server, at least not in terms of 
expecting the startup handler to fire if you pass that text file to it. 
I don't know if it'll choke on the "stack" declaration, but my 
understanding is that only code outside of any handler is used in the 
role of a startup handler.


You can, however, bring it into use as a library, provided you have some 
other execution object (an HTML file) use "start using".


--
EXAMPLE G

With the LC Script desktop engine, "put" commands output to stdout at 
the time they're called.  With LC Server it appears "put"s are buffered 
and output as a single stream when processing of the page that has been 
completed.


--

There may be other differences; these are just 

Re: What a datagrid "sees"

[Mike Bonner via use-livecode]

As a workaround, you could try a slightly different method..

local sLooping

on mouseleave
put false into sLooping -- stop the loop when outside the dg
end mouseleave

on mouseEnter
if sLooping is empty then put false into sLooping
if not sLooping then
send "startloop" to me in 10 millisec
put true into sLooping
end if
end mouseenter

command startloop
if slooping then
   -- do whatever stuff is needed when pointing at a control here
   -- this just updates the msg box depending on what is being pointed at
   -- since it looks like you're messing with tooltips, you'd probably
   --want to check to see if it has already been set and keep a list of
"set" tooltips
   -- so that you don't reset the same tip every 100 millisec
   -- then in mouseleave one could "unset" based on the list.


  if the mousecontrol is not empty then put the long id of the mousecontrol
/*
 check to see if the mousecontrol is empty in case the mouseleaves while a
loop is still queued. Avoids a potential error.
 would probably need to filter any controls NOT part of the grid for the
same reason.  wouldn't want to change things for a non-grid control
 due to a fast mouse movement.
*/
   send "startloop" to me in 100 millisec
end if
end startloop


Another potential issue I can see happening would be a quick out and in
mouse movement causing dual loops (maybe more?) to run.  So judicious use
of the pendingmessages would likely help.

On Wed, Dec 6, 2017 at 4:25 PM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

> Posted http://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=20747. This may be a
> regression from way back in the 2.9 days.
>
> Bob S
>
>
> > On Dec 6, 2017, at 15:04 , Bob Sneidar via use-livecode <
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
> >
> > Okay I have figured out what this is. the mouseControl is sometimes
> returning the LAST object that was being pointed to, and NOT the CURRENT
> object being pointed to. I think this is a bug. I will try to come up with
> a sample stack and post it on QC.
> >
> > Bob S
>
>
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Re: Map Widget Futures

[Ali Lloyd via use-livecode]

I'm not quite sure what you mean by 'a member of the msg path in "proper
standing"' - the map widget just wraps a native view essentially. The map
'object' is only accessible through foreign handlers in LCB, but if it can
be done natively then it can be done.

In the first instance the widget will support annotations/markers and
polylines, but won't support generic overlays.

Just thinking aloud for a second, one way we could potentially make that
work, and make the map widget a lot more flexible on the objective-c side
is to allow custom implementations of the map delegate in LCB. This would
enable you to write the appropriate callbacks to do custom overlays. I
can't think of a particularly nice way to support overlays as a basic
property, but that might just be because I haven't thought about it enough.


On Wed, Dec 6, 2017 at 3:07 PM Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

> I'm not sure if the news from LiveCode Global is under any kind of NDA…
> Since I have a business license, we could pose this directly to HQ, but
> seems useful to share.. hope that is OK and I have this quesiton
>
> What is the binary format of the map "object" that the engine or map
> widget can now pan and zoom?
>
> Put another way: could we create our own giant SVG maps, with tools, for
> example like OmniGraffle or Diagrammix and then run these as "maps" inside
> the new widget. Or is this tech somehow locked into conventional
> geographical map formats of some kind?
>
> Of course we can build those and show them inside a browser widget, but
> dealing with hotspots requires messing with JS and the chasm/issues between
> the JS in the browser widget and the stack-LC engine message path is still
> huge and problematic (discussed at length elsewhere) So if the new map
> widget is a member of the msg path in "proper standing" that will be
> excellent.
>
> BR
>
>
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Re: sorting with number late in name

[Tore Nilsen via use-livecode]

Ascending is implied when you sort numeric. 

If you want to sort it the other way round use: sort lines of fld 1 numeric 
descending by item 2 of each

Tore

> 7. des. 2017 kl. 00:47 skrev Dr. Hawkins via use-livecode 
> :
> 
> Yes, that did it.  I had the item del, but had used "ascending" in the
> second line (probably from a prior misread of the dictionary years ago
> :)  )

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read larger data streams over sockets - broken?

[Phil Davis via use-livecode]

Is anyone else having problems with moving multi-MB data streams across 
sockets in LC 8?


I support a LAN-based system that relies on sockets to move data between 
server and clients. The server's response to a single client request 
will often consist of several hundred KB to several MB of data. Until LC 
8 the successful approach has been:


- client sends request to server

- server returns data to client

- client reads the returned data:

   read from socket tMySocket for 1 line -- contains the length of the
   data that follows
   put it into tDataLength
   repeat while length(tData) < tDataLength
    read from socket tMySocket for tDataLength
    wait 1 millisecond with messages
    put it after tData
   end repeat

This approach no longer works in LC 8. There are 2 new issues:
    - large time delays
    - wrong final data size

Here are some actual results from a client that was trying to receive 
151k of data - not that big!


   tDataLength = 151954

   read #1 got 0 chars in 15.25521 secs
   read #2 got 131761 chars in 15.001723 secs
   read #3 got 131761 chars in 0.001813 secs
   actual received data length = 263522
   total elapsed time = 30.259262 secs

I changed the client code to read 'until EOF' and got similar outcomes:

   tDataLength = 151954

   read until EOF #1 got 0 chars in 15.254117 secs
   read until EOF #2 got 131761 chars in 15.004341 secs
   read until EOF #3 got 131761 chars in 0.001733 secs
   actual received data length = 263522
   total elapsed time = 30.260464 secs

Either 'read' structure works fine as long as the data length doesn't 
exceed roughly 128k (that's the max in my world at least - YMMV). I'm 
not sure if the 128k size constraint is coming from LC or from my 
network (a standard gigabit-Ethernet LAN with router, switches, 
computers) or from some other source.


I know this is a bug and plan to file a bug report, but I wanted to see 
if anyone else has experienced something similar.


Thanks -
Phil Davis

--
Phil Davis

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Re: sorting with number late in name

[Dr. Hawkins via use-livecode]

On Wed, Dec 6, 2017 at 3:34 PM, Klaus major-k via use-livecode
 wrote:

> set itemdel to "_"
> sort lines of fld 1 numeric by item 2 of each


I *thought* that that was in there somewhere, but I didn't see it when
I  pulled the dictionary page :(  For that matter, the one I just
pulled didn't look a lot like what I was reading earlier.

Yes, that did it.  I had the item del, but had used "ascending" in the
second line (probably from a prior misread of the dictionary years ago
:)  )

thanks

-- 
Dr. Richard E. Hawkins, Esq.
(702) 508-8462

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Re: sorting with number late in name

[Klaus major-k via use-livecode]

Hi Richard,

> Am 07.12.2017 um 00:29 schrieb Dr. Hawkins via use-livecode 
> :
> 
> Now that I've hit ten numbered items, I'm having an issue with
> maintenance routines.
> 
> If I have the items
> 
>  p13_1.07
>  p13_1.08
>  p13_2.04
>  p13_10.01
> 
> I want them to sort in that order.  However, the 10 will sort between
> the 1s and 2s.

"numeric" is the magic word! :-)

> Is there a "decent" way to do this without a custom function?
> 
> All I'm coming up with so far is a script that looks for a single
> digit number and renames to put a 0 in front of it . . .

...
set itemdel to "_"
sort lines of fld 1 numeric by item 2 of each
...
> 
> -- 
> Dr. Richard E. Hawkins, Esq.
> (702) 508-8462

Best

Klaus

--
Klaus Major
http://www.major-k.de
kl...@major-k.de


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Re: sorting with number late in name

[Tore Nilsen via use-livecode]

You could always try to set the itemDelimiter to _ and then sort the lines 
numeric by last item of each.

Tore Nilsen

> 7. des. 2017 kl. 00:29 skrev Dr. Hawkins via use-livecode 
> :
> 
> Now that I've hit ten numbered items, I'm having an issue with
> maintenance routines.
> 
> If I have the items
> 
>  p13_1.07
>  p13_1.08
>  p13_2.04
>  p13_10.01
> 
> I want them to sort in that order.  However, the 10 will sort between
> the 1s and 2s.
> 
> Is there a "decent" way to do this without a custom function?
> 
> All I'm coming up with so far is a script that looks for a single
> digit number and renames to put a 0 in front of it . . .
> 
> -- 
> Dr. Richard E. Hawkins, Esq.
> (702) 508-8462
> 
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crumbly IDE

[Dr. Hawkins via use-livecode]

This is in the 8.2 series, but I think folks have sen it before.

I haven't nailed it down yet, but I seem to permanently lose parts of
the IDE, possibly after toggling messages off and back on from the
toolbar.

The message box still works, and can close stacks, but the stats seem
to completely ignore messages forevermore.

About 5 times today, I think . . .

-- 
Dr. Richard E. Hawkins, Esq.
(702) 508-8462

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sorting with number late in name

[Dr. Hawkins via use-livecode]

Now that I've hit ten numbered items, I'm having an issue with
maintenance routines.

If I have the items

  p13_1.07
  p13_1.08
  p13_2.04
  p13_10.01

I want them to sort in that order.  However, the 10 will sort between
the 1s and 2s.

Is there a "decent" way to do this without a custom function?

All I'm coming up with so far is a script that looks for a single
digit number and renames to put a 0 in front of it . . .

-- 
Dr. Richard E. Hawkins, Esq.
(702) 508-8462

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Re: What a datagrid "sees"

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Posted http://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=20747. This may be a 
regression from way back in the 2.9 days. 

Bob S


> On Dec 6, 2017, at 15:04 , Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Okay I have figured out what this is. the mouseControl is sometimes returning 
> the LAST object that was being pointed to, and NOT the CURRENT object being 
> pointed to. I think this is a bug. I will try to come up with a sample stack 
> and post it on QC. 
> 
> Bob S


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Re: What a datagrid "sees"

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Okay I have figured out what this is. the mouseControl is sometimes returning 
the LAST object that was being pointed to, and NOT the CURRENT object being 
pointed to. I think this is a bug. I will try to come up with a sample stack 
and post it on QC. 

Bob S



> On Dec 6, 2017, at 13:12 , Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi all. I have a mouseEnter handler in a table datagrid which is supposed to 
> get the mouseControl. When I point at one of the populated table fields I 
> trigger the mouseEnter, but then nothing else. I can point at another field 
> and this time it might work. Or not. I am not sure why that is happening. 
> It's as though the mouseControl is not getting updated properly. Here is the 
> handler: 
> 
> on mouseEnter
>   put "saw mouseEnter"
> 
>   -- lock messages
>   wait 1 second
>   -- unlock messages
> 
>   put the mouseControl into tMouseControl
> 
>   put space & tMouseControl after msg
>   put word 2 of tMouseControl into tControlNum
>   if tControlNum is not a number then exit mouseEnter
>   put the name of control tControlNum into tControlName
> 
>   put space & tControlName after msg
> 
>   if word 1 of tControlName is not "field" then exit mouseEnter
>   put the long id of me into tMyID
>   put wordOffset("card", tMyID) into tFirstWord
>   put word tFirstWord to -1 of tMyID into tThisCard
>   put the long id of control tControlNum of tThisCard into tTarget
>   put 
> "servicetype,techname,problemdescription,servicedate,starttime,endtime,partstotal,labortotal"
>  into tKeyList
>   dgToolTip tTarget, tKeyList
> end mouseEnter
> 
> I always get "saw mouseEnter" but often times nothing else. Any idea why the 
> mouseControl would not ALWAYS be the object being pointed to? 
> 
> Bob S


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Re: LC Server style survey: co-mingle code w/HTML?

[Alex Tweedly via use-livecode]

On 06/12/2017 19:14, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode wrote:


There's a difference in terms of the primary execution object, and how 
that effects the flow of both execution and the workflow.


It seems I'm unable to articulate it clearly enough, but no worries. 
The bottom line is that LC Server scripts are incompatible with LC 
Script on the desktop, and when used with wrapped HTML there's no need 
for me to generalize my tools because they can't be used in that context.


I'm still unclear on what does (can?) and what doesn't (can't) be done 
with LC Server scripts on the desktop.


If I don't use mingled/wrapped HTML (which I certainly don't, afaik) - 
could I use your tools for my LC Server scripts (nb - they do use 
'include's).


In fact, to be even more specific - assuming "my" scripts are actually 
revIgniter with a controller or two added by me, would it be possible to 
use the tools ?


Thanks
Alex.

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Re: Naive Player Questions

[Klaus major-k via use-livecode]

Hi Graham,

> Am 06.12.2017 um 14:49 schrieb Graham Samuel via use-livecode 
> :
> 
> Yes, this is just plain nonsense - it may be a leftover from a previous 
> LC/Revolution idea that “play” would have a larger range of possible formats, 
> but in the current versions of LC the IDE should warn one off, no?
> 
> Graham
> 
>> On 6 Dec 2017, at 10:26, Richmond Mathewson via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> However, the fact that "import audio file" allows one to import an mp3 file
>> is a bit misleading.
>> 
>> Richmond.

I already reported this fact in 2014 with very little success:



Best

Klaus

--
Klaus Major
http://www.major-k.de
kl...@major-k.de


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Re: Datagrid 2

[Tom Glod via use-livecode]

Mike, I am a heavy user of DG features.  was just finding out about the
timeframe of new scroll capabilities on mobile and overall dg speed
improvements

Sounds good .. thank you Kevin Miller.

On Tue, Dec 5, 2017 at 4:25 PM, Mike Kerner via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

> Oh I'm an idiot.  It's not mobtablefield, it's modtablefield
> Email: bernd@bernd.niggem...@uni-wh.de to make sure you have the latest
> version.
>
> On Tue, Dec 5, 2017 at 3:44 PM, Matthias Rebbe via use-livecode <
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
>
> > Mike,
> >
> > do you have an url where i can find mobTableField or more information
> > about it?
> >
> > Regards,
> > Matthias
> >
> >
> > > Am 05.12.2017 um 20:52 schrieb Mike Kerner via use-livecode <
> > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com >:
> > >
> > > Tom,
> > > The other option is to use mobTableField (I think Bernd is the author)
> if
> > > you don't need all the bells and whistles of the DG.
> > > I'm using both in different mobile apps.  The original DG works fine
> even
> > > for large DG's with horizontal and vertical scrolling, but MTF is even
> > more
> > > responsive.
> > > ETA - they were talking about "soon" at the last LCG conference, which
> I
> > > would assume means 1Q 18, even though they were talking end of 17.
> > >
> > > On Tue, Dec 5, 2017 at 1:50 PM, Tom Glod via use-livecode <
> > > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com >
> > wrote:
> > >
> > >> Hi folks, I'm bidding on a project and would like to get a sense as to
> > the
> > >> eta of datagrid 2 especially on mobile. I would love to buy a LC Indy
> > >> License and do the job.
> > >>
> > >> During Campaign the eta was oct/november, but i get they are just
> > >> estimates.  Is there a more up to date eta?
> > >>
> > >> Thanks,
> > >>
> > >> Tom
> > >> ___
> > >> use-livecode mailing list
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> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > On the first day, God created the heavens and the Earth
> > > On the second day, God created the oceans.
> > > On the third day, God put the animals on hold for a few hours,
> > >   and did a little diving.
> > > And God said, "This is good."
> > > ___
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>
>
>
> --
> On the first day, God created the heavens and the Earth
> On the second day, God created the oceans.
> On the third day, God put the animals on hold for a few hours,
>and did a little diving.
> And God said, "This is good."
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Re: LC Server style survey: co-mingle code w/HTML?

[Richard Gaskin via use-livecode]

Rick Harrison wrote:

> Hi Richard,
>
>> You use Wordpress.
>
> After exploring Wordpress a couple of years ago I decided not use
> Wordpress.
> I do not use Wordpress.

My bad, though earnestly I must admit I don't understand this thread: 
if we're not talking about Wordpress, what are we talking about and why 
has so much of this thread been about Wordpress?



> No one said Web hosting was an easy business,
> but it needs to be become better.  No company should
> threaten it’s users to do XYZ upgrade or suffer the
> loss of their accounts.  If it is that important, then the
> company should make the upgrade process very
> simple or automatic, or not offer that particular piece
> of software if it is so vulnerable that it threatens the
> security of the entire system.

I'd like that too.  But as with much of life, what I want and what the 
world offers me is often different. ;)


I do see managed services.  But like Simon said, they're not cheap.


> I objected to the fact that Run-Rev hyped Wordpress to
> it’s On-Rev users, and after encouraging them to
> snap it up, then later slapped them.

One man's "slapped" is another man's "please read the Terms and 
Conditions".  I don't use on-rev and haven't seen their ToC so I don't 
have an opinion there.  But from what I've heard their policies don't 
seem unusual, at least compared to the half-dozen or so hosting 
companies I've used over the years.


Maybe the bigger problem is with shared hosting in general.  Like you 
say, it's useful for certain types of low-traffic sites with limited 
config needs.  But once you get a large enough audience or want the 
freedom to add persistent services, VPSes are hard to beat.  It means 
more responsibility, but also more freedom.


--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World Systems
 Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
 
 ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com

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Re: Sending a message to users that floats above everything

[J. Landman Gay via use-livecode]

On 12/3/17 5:09 PM, Monte Goulding via use-livecode wrote:



On 4 Dec 2017, at 10:01 am, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode 
 wrote:

Bump.

I think the team has forgotten about the PR for the Android toast. Anyone want 
to try their hand at making it in LCB?


Actually Mark already did it in LCB but the PR is waiting for him to add some 
docs and notes:

https://github.com/livecode/livecode/pull/5860 


If you are keen you can download the file and compile it locally.


Okay, I tried that. Ran a test stack and got errors on line 3 of the lcb 
file -- something about a wrong variable type. So I guess I'll wait for 
docs unless someone figures it out before then.


Remote debugging came in handy though. :)

--
Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com

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RE: Versions of LC and Xcode

[Ralph DiMola via use-livecode]

#1 below==>The shared prefs is a problem. I see the same thing. Different prefs 
for each version would solve this. When a new version is started for the first 
time the prefs from the last version in the series(if any) should be copied to 
the new version prefs file. But the rub is... if you change some other prefs 
and go to another version the you lose the change.
#2 below==>True... I always keep the Xcode version to build from in the 
applications folder and name it xcode.app. I put the other versions into 
another folder. When I upgrade Xcode I move the most recent version into my 
"OtherXcodeVersions" folder and rename it with the version number. I then 
download and install the new version into the applications folder. Of course I 
have to go into the LC prefs and fix the Xcode versions. The hardwired path to 
/Applications/Xcode.app should come from the prefs. Radio buttons in the Xcode 
prefs to indicate==> "Build using tools in this version would solve this.
#3 below==> I agree the docs need to be updated matrix whenever a new 
Xcode/Mac/LC version is released. Even if LC does not support a particular 
combination it should be documented.

Ralph DiMola
IT Director
Evergreen Information Services
rdim...@evergreeninfo.net


-Original Message-
From: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of 
Ben Rubinstein via use-livecode
Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2017 4:16 PM
To: Use LiveCode
Cc: Ben Rubinstein
Subject: Versions of LC and Xcode

This continues to be a major source of friction.

Once again all my versions of LiveCode seem to have been reset so that they 
can't find a version of Xcode they like. (At any time I am probably switching 
between (or have simultaneously open) four version of LC: LC 6.7.11; the latest 
stable version of 8; the latest 8 RC or sometimes DP; the latest DP of 9. 
Admittedly I'm not building iOS apps from 6.7.11.)

I think that there are two main problems:

1) Because preferences are shared between versions of LiveCode. I believe it is 
the case than when switching between versions of LiveCode, if the mobile 
support preferences are opened in a version of LC which doesn't play nice with 
the selected version of Xcode, that path is deleted; so that next time the 
version of LC which was previously happy is opened, the path to Xcode is gone. 
The behaviour may be a little more subtle than this, but I believe something 
along these lines is correct.

2) Something somewhere along the line of building apps seems to have a 
hardwired path to /Applications/Xcode.app; so that while I may be able to 
maintain a set of different Xcodes in separate folders or separately named, 
LiveCode won't entirely work this way.

So currently I have XCode 8.3.3 as the 'canonical' version, probably because I 
was using LiveCode 9.0 DP-9. Now that I have updated to LC 9.0 DP-10 and LC
8.1.8 stable, nothing can build (except 8.1.6 stable - which unfortunately 
doesn't like the widgets in my stack!).

3) A third problem: I now want to start using LC 8.1.8, the latest stable 
version; what version of Xcode does it use on Mas OS 10.12? According to 
https://livecode.com/resources/support/ask-a-question/ :

> LiveCode 8.1.8 RC-2 – Xcode 7.2 -Mac OS 10.10 – iOS 9.2 LiveCode 8.1.8 
> RC-2 – Xcode 8.2 -Mac OS 10.11 – iOS 10.2 LiveCode 8.1.8 RC-2 – Xcode 
> 9.1 -Mac OS 10.12.6+ – iOS 11.1
> 
> LiveCode 8.2.0 DP-1 – Xcode 7.2 -Mac OS 10.10 – iOS 9.2 LiveCode 8.2.0 
> DP-1 – Xcode 8.2 -Mac OS 10.11 – iOS 10.2 LiveCode 8.2.0 DP-1 – Xcode 
> 8.3 -Mac OS 10.12 – iOS 10.3


Some things that would make this better:

1) When the mobile support preferences were opened, if there is a path to a 
version of Xcode which this version of LC can't use, it would be better if it 
were displayed - but in grey or red or similar to show it's not usable - rather 
than being deleted, this would be better.

2) Ensure that iOS standalones can be built if there is a path to a valid 
version of Xcode, regardless of that path.

3) Change the list on https://livecode.com/resources/support/ask-a-question/
to a table, with LiveCode versions on one axis, MacOS versions on the other, 
and Xcode/iOS versions in each cell.

3b) Update the above to include the current stable 8.1.8!

I'm off for a stiff drink...

Ben

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Re: LC Server style survey: co-mingle code w/HTML?

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Wording is a little harsh. A lot of web based systems seem to be working that 
way these days. We just got notice that we had to upgrade our Compass Sherpa 
software, which uses an embedded browser, to keep using it. Spiceworks dictates 
that the core system be updated by certain dates, or certain features will no 
longer be supported. I do not think this is an issue with On-Rev, but rather 
the general nature of web based apps themselves. 

The self-contained nature of locally hosted apps shielded us from this, as 
company A could upgrade if they wanted, and company B did not have to. This 
sucked for the software vendor because how long were they expected to support a 
release? With web hosted products, regular updating is going to be par for the 
course, and if it's problematic with Wordpress in that it seems that plugins or 
addons may also have to be updated, well that is the nature of the thing. 

Bob S


> On Dec 6, 2017, at 12:18 , Rick Harrison via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I objected to the fact that Run-Rev hyped Wordpress to
> it’s On-Rev users, and after encouraging them to 
> snap it up, then later slapped them. 

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Versions of LC and Xcode

[Ben Rubinstein via use-livecode]

This continues to be a major source of friction.

Once again all my versions of LiveCode seem to have been reset so that they 
can't find a version of Xcode they like. (At any time I am probably switching 
between (or have simultaneously open) four version of LC: LC 6.7.11; the 
latest stable version of 8; the latest 8 RC or sometimes DP; the latest DP of 
9. Admittedly I'm not building iOS apps from 6.7.11.)


I think that there are two main problems:

1) Because preferences are shared between versions of LiveCode. I believe it 
is the case than when switching between versions of LiveCode, if the mobile 
support preferences are opened in a version of LC which doesn't play nice with 
the selected version of Xcode, that path is deleted; so that next time the 
version of LC which was previously happy is opened, the path to Xcode is gone. 
The behaviour may be a little more subtle than this, but I believe something 
along these lines is correct.


2) Something somewhere along the line of building apps seems to have a 
hardwired path to /Applications/Xcode.app; so that while I may be able to 
maintain a set of different Xcodes in separate folders or separately named, 
LiveCode won't entirely work this way.


So currently I have XCode 8.3.3 as the 'canonical' version, probably because I 
was using LiveCode 9.0 DP-9. Now that I have updated to LC 9.0 DP-10 and LC 
8.1.8 stable, nothing can build (except 8.1.6 stable - which unfortunately 
doesn't like the widgets in my stack!).


3) A third problem: I now want to start using LC 8.1.8, the latest stable 
version; what version of Xcode does it use on Mas OS 10.12? According to 
https://livecode.com/resources/support/ask-a-question/ :



LiveCode 8.1.8 RC-2 – Xcode 7.2 -Mac OS 10.10 – iOS 9.2
LiveCode 8.1.8 RC-2 – Xcode 8.2 -Mac OS 10.11 – iOS 10.2
LiveCode 8.1.8 RC-2 – Xcode 9.1 -Mac OS 10.12.6+ – iOS 11.1

LiveCode 8.2.0 DP-1 – Xcode 7.2 -Mac OS 10.10 – iOS 9.2
LiveCode 8.2.0 DP-1 – Xcode 8.2 -Mac OS 10.11 – iOS 10.2
LiveCode 8.2.0 DP-1 – Xcode 8.3 -Mac OS 10.12 – iOS 10.3



Some things that would make this better:

1) When the mobile support preferences were opened, if there is a path to a 
version of Xcode which this version of LC can't use, it would be better if it 
were displayed - but in grey or red or similar to show it's not usable - 
rather than being deleted, this would be better.


2) Ensure that iOS standalones can be built if there is a path to a valid 
version of Xcode, regardless of that path.


3) Change the list on https://livecode.com/resources/support/ask-a-question/ 
to a table, with LiveCode versions on one axis, MacOS versions on the other, 
and Xcode/iOS versions in each cell.


3b) Update the above to include the current stable 8.1.8!

I'm off for a stiff drink...

Ben

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Re: IDE breaks down over time

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Yes. I had an issue where ANY notification in the built in Notifications 
process in OS X 10.11 would max one of the cores. It was a known issue. I 
haven't seen it in 10.12 or 10.13. 

Bob S

> On Dec 1, 2017, at 11:52 , Dr. Hawkins  wrote:
> 
> On Fri, Dec 1, 2017 at 10:24 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
>  wrote:
>> You are saying the IDE process is maxing out? There was a known issue with 
>> notifications doing this in
>> MacOS 10.11. Are you creating alerts in your apps?
> 
> 
> Was this to me?
> 
> I don't create alerts, but there's the occasional dialog box.
> 
> Haven't looked to see which process has gone nuts; it's just that
> sometimes things go non responsive and/or
> the message box cannot be brought up.  I think the rest of the menu is
> active but does nothing when this happens,
> but it hasn't bitten me enough to make sure.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Dr. Richard E. Hawkins, Esq.
> (702) 508-8462


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What a datagrid "sees"

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hi all. I have a mouseEnter handler in a table datagrid which is supposed to 
get the mouseControl. When I point at one of the populated table fields I 
trigger the mouseEnter, but then nothing else. I can point at another field and 
this time it might work. Or not. I am not sure why that is happening. It's as 
though the mouseControl is not getting updated properly. Here is the handler: 

on mouseEnter
   put "saw mouseEnter"

   -- lock messages
   wait 1 second
   -- unlock messages

   put the mouseControl into tMouseControl

   put space & tMouseControl after msg
   put word 2 of tMouseControl into tControlNum
   if tControlNum is not a number then exit mouseEnter
   put the name of control tControlNum into tControlName

   put space & tControlName after msg

   if word 1 of tControlName is not "field" then exit mouseEnter
   put the long id of me into tMyID
   put wordOffset("card", tMyID) into tFirstWord
   put word tFirstWord to -1 of tMyID into tThisCard
   put the long id of control tControlNum of tThisCard into tTarget
   put 
"servicetype,techname,problemdescription,servicedate,starttime,endtime,partstotal,labortotal"
 into tKeyList
   dgToolTip tTarget, tKeyList
end mouseEnter

I always get "saw mouseEnter" but often times nothing else. Any idea why the 
mouseControl would not ALWAYS be the object being pointed to? 

Bob S


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Re: LC Server style survey: co-mingle code w/HTML?

[Rick Harrison via use-livecode]

Hi Richard,

> You use Wordpress. 

After exploring Wordpress a couple of years ago I decided not use Wordpress.
I do not use Wordpress.

> I use Drupal.  Someone else uses Joomla.  Then there's the vast range of 
> other things people can add to their account.


Yes, many people use different tools as we all do.

> Web hosting is a very difficult business, which is why we've seen so much 
> consolidation over the years.


No one said Web hosting was an easy business,
but it needs to be become better.  No company should
threaten it’s users to do XYZ upgrade or suffer the
loss of their accounts.  If it is that important, then the
company should make the upgrade process very
simple or automatic, or not offer that particular piece
of software if it is so vulnerable that it threatens the
security of the entire system.

I objected to the fact that Run-Rev hyped Wordpress to
it’s On-Rev users, and after encouraging them to 
snap it up, then later slapped them. If you
don’t monitor Wordpress closely to be sure it is
always up to date, then you lose your account!
(That’s just not a good way to conduct business,
and I’m glad that I personally didn’t fall into that trap.)

When On-Rev was first introduced, the impression given
about the service to users was that it was indeed going to 
be a highly managed service.  That has not turned out to
be the case clearly as you and Simon have pointed out.
(I think a bunch of people may have been disappointed to learn
the truth of that matter as it has played out over the years.)

The result for me as a user of On-Rev is that I only use it
for small websites that I don’t have a large investment of
money, time or energy in.  It has proven to be an
undependable platform for me. Now I run all of my
own important servers, which are dependable. 
I upgrade them, and keep them secure at all times.

Thanks for the lively discussion!

Cheers,

Rick








> On Dec 6, 2017, at 2:32 PM, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> You use Wordpress.  I use Drupal.  Someone else uses Joomla.  Then there's 
> the vast range of other things people can add to their account.
> 
> Where does a hosting company draw the line with what they can afford to 
> directly support by managing what goes on inside of 200 accounts per machine?
> 
> Or do they take the safest option and disallow everything other than a small 
> subset of packages they directly manage?
> 
> Web hosting is a very difficult business, which is why we've seen so much 
> consolidation over the years.
> 
> The most successful companies (the ones that survived the shakeout of the 
> last decade and are still around to grow) tend to work as Simon described: 
> unmanaged services require a responsibility from the user, managed services 
> take care of those things but at a much higher price.

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Re: Naive Player Questions

[J. Landman Gay via use-livecode]

On 12/6/17 7:49 AM, Graham Samuel via use-livecode wrote:

Yes, this is just plain nonsense - it may be a leftover from a previous 
LC/Revolution idea that “play” would have a larger range of possible formats, 
but in the current versions of LC the IDE should warn one off, no?


Probably.

There is discussion of audio playback in the user manual. Page 94 
discusses the differences between embedded and external audio files. 
Page 477 begins a more in-depth discussion of audio/video (I didn't read 
it all.)


I found more references in the user guide by searching for "audio" in 
the find box.


--
Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com


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Re: LC Server style survey: co-mingle code w/HTML?

[Richard Gaskin via use-livecode]

Rick Harrison wrote:

> If it were up to me to run On-Rev, I would make
> sure that it was always up to date, or offered
> easy ways to keep everything up to date.  You’d
> never hear me threaten anyone to take away their
> account if they didn’t keep some piece of software
> up to date.  If that software poses a security risk,
> as a good steward, I would take care of that issue
> for my clients so they wouldn’t be at risk.

You use Wordpress.  I use Drupal.  Someone else uses Joomla.  Then 
there's the vast range of other things people can add to their account.


Where does a hosting company draw the line with what they can afford to 
directly support by managing what goes on inside of 200 accounts per 
machine?


Or do they take the safest option and disallow everything other than a 
small subset of packages they directly manage?


Web hosting is a very difficult business, which is why we've seen so 
much consolidation over the years.


The most successful companies (the ones that survived the shakeout of 
the last decade and are still around to grow) tend to work as Simon 
described: unmanaged services require a responsibility from the user, 
managed services take care of those things but at a much higher price.


--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World Systems
 Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
 
 ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com


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Re: Naive Player Questions

[Richmond Mathewson via use-livecode]

I have already admitted to making a complete foll of myself re that
in an earlier post.

Richmond.

On 6/12/17 9:11 pm, Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami via use-livecode wrote:

Richmond wrote:

 NO: a player does not "demand" an external file as my example stack
 demonstrates:
 
 https://www.dropbox.com/s/9v2juqqu7ojb83v/Carrot%20Player.livecode.zip?dl=0
 
The player in that stack plays an embedded mp3 file.



Does not play here (Mac OS X)

of course this works for your embedded audioClips: wav and aifff

on mouseup
play audioClip "carrot.wav"
end mouseup

but not the player… are you sure you don’t have a copy of the file resident on 
disk in the same folder as your stack?

BR
 
 


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Re: LC Server style survey: co-mingle code w/HTML?

[Richard Gaskin via use-livecode]

Simon Smith wrote:
> PHP is definitely the most popular language for letting you code this
> way, but then it is pretty much only for the web unlike most other
> languages.
>
> Other languages can work this way too - e.g. Python has PSP, Java has
> JSP as does Ruby, Lua etc. but not as popular as PHP.

There's a difference in terms of the primary execution object, and how 
that effects the flow of both execution and the workflow.


It seems I'm unable to articulate it clearly enough, but no worries. 
The bottom line is that LC Server scripts are incompatible with LC 
Script on the desktop, and when used with wrapped HTML there's no need 
for me to generalize my tools because they can't be used in that context.


--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World Systems
 Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
 
 ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com

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Re: Naive Player Questions

[Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami via use-livecode]

Richmond wrote:

NO: a player does not "demand" an external file as my example stack 
demonstrates:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/9v2juqqu7ojb83v/Carrot%20Player.livecode.zip?dl=0

The player in that stack plays an embedded mp3 file.


Does not play here (Mac OS X)

of course this works for your embedded audioClips: wav and aifff

on mouseup
   play audioClip "carrot.wav"
end mouseup

but not the player… are you sure you don’t have a copy of the file resident on 
disk in the same folder as your stack?

BR



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Re: libUrl tsNet and socketTimeoutInterval

[Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami via use-livecode]

Matthias Rebbe wrote:

The connection ID is only used/needed when you use the asynchronous 
commands of tsNet.   The synchronous commands like tsNetUploadSync or 
tsNetFileUploadSync or others (they are ending with Sync) do not use 
connectionIDs. And i assume that put URL and get URL are using the synchronous 
commands.
Matthias
---
OK then…. if we do this:

1) tsNetSetTimeouts 60, 3000, 3000 , , 3, 12000

2) get url….

3) how do we trap the SocketTimeOut  whose syntax requires a socketID

from dictionary: 

Syntax:

socketTimeout pSocketID

?



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Re: LC Server style survey: co-mingle code w/HTML?

[Simon Smith via use-livecode]

It's impracticable for most hosting companies to keep a clients WordPress
installation up to date. All the plugins and themes need to be kept up to
date at the same time and sometimes need to be manually uploaded. There is
then a problem that if a host updates something and something breaks - who
would pick this up and who would be responsible for fixing the problem.
Then there are also updates that require manual intervention, like changes
to the database etc, and sometimes you may not want something updated
either.

There are a couple of hosting companies that offer this as a managed
service - but it comes at quiet a cost and you will face a limit as to what
plugins etc you can use.

While WordPress is considered secure and actively audited, most themes and
plugins are not, and problems do creep in. A website (not just WordPress)
that gets hacked can do a fair amount of damage, it affect other sites on
the server and when things like IP addresses get black listed, it's a bit
of nightmare for the host. Most hosts are pretty understanding (despite
what their terms and conditions may say) and if they discover a problem
they will notify you, or in serve situations take the site offline and ask
you to fix the problem, before putting the site live again.

While WordPress is a fantastic platform, it does require regular upkeep -
it's not something you can setup and just leave. There are dashboards you
can use (e.g. JetPack, WP Remote etc) that let you manage single or
multiple sites from a single location offering convenient way for keeping
an eye on what needs to be updated.

Simon






Carpe diem

*Simon Smith*
m. +27 83 306 7862

On Wed, Dec 6, 2017 at 7:34 PM, Rick Harrison via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

> Hi Matthias,
>
> When support tells one that he/she is now responsible
> for keeping Wordpress up to date or face the loss of
> one’s account, they should at least point out what you
> have shared with us.
>
> > And you if install Wordpress through Softacoulus (which is included in
> On-Rev), you can enable auto upgrade in Softacoulus in  the config area for
> your WP installation.
> >
> > So regardless how you have installed Wordpress, you can enable auto
> upgrade.
>
> No one who has not yet installed Wordpress would know
> about the automatic upgrade capability.  It is also highly
> unlikely that any user would be willing to log into his/her
> account every hour of every day just to make sure that
> Wordpress is up to date so they don’t lose their account.
>
> What version of LC is currently installed on On-Rev?
> It was pretty old the last time I checked.  Perhaps an
> option to easily upgrade to the newest version of LC
> on On-Rev should be offered?
>
> A lot of people paid a bunch of money for On-Rev,
> and then when support at Run-Rev discovered it
> was more work than they bargained for, they
> outsourced it to other companies.  The first time
> it was outsourced, the result wasn’t good.  Things
> are better than they were, but there is still room
> for improvement.  Whenever a company accepts
> people’s money, that company has an obligation to
> provide better than average service if they want
> to stay in business.
>
> If it were up to me to run On-Rev, I would make
> sure that it was always up to date, or offered
> easy ways to keep everything up to date.  You’d
> never hear me threaten anyone to take away their
> account if they didn’t keep some piece of software
> up to date.  If that software poses a security risk,
> as a good steward, I would take care of that issue
> for my clients so they wouldn’t be at risk.
>
> Just my 2 cents for the day.
>
> Thank you for your helpful information about
> Wordpress etc.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Rick
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Dec 6, 2017, at 6:33 AM, Matthias Rebbe via use-livecode <
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >> Am 06.12.2017 um 07:14 schrieb Rick Harrison via use-livecode <
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com >:
> >> Then On-Rev wrote us that note saying that we were
> >> the ones that would be held responsible for
> >> ensuring that Wordpress was always up to
> >> date on our accounts or we could lose our
> >> accounts.  (I thought maintaining up to date
> >> versions was supposed to be the job of
> >> On-Rev as good care takers.)
> >
> > If you install Wordpress manually from a Zip file then you are
> responsible for keeping that version up to date. Either by manually updates
> or by automatic updates.
> > You can enable that in wp-config.php
> >
> > And you if install Wordpress through Softacoulus (which is included in
> On-Rev), you can enable auto upgrade in Softacoulus in  the config area for
> your WP installation.
> >
> > So regardless how you have installed Wordpress, you can enable auto
> upgrade.
> >
> > Why should On-Rev support do this for you?
> >
> >
> > Matthias Rebbe
> > Tel +49 5741 31
> > ‌https://matthiasrebbe.eu ‌
> > ___

Re: LC Server style survey: co-mingle code w/HTML?

[Rick Harrison via use-livecode]

Hi Matthias,

When support tells one that he/she is now responsible
for keeping Wordpress up to date or face the loss of
one’s account, they should at least point out what you
have shared with us.

> And you if install Wordpress through Softacoulus (which is included in 
> On-Rev), you can enable auto upgrade in Softacoulus in  the config area for 
> your WP installation.
> 
> So regardless how you have installed Wordpress, you can enable auto upgrade.

No one who has not yet installed Wordpress would know
about the automatic upgrade capability.  It is also highly
unlikely that any user would be willing to log into his/her
account every hour of every day just to make sure that
Wordpress is up to date so they don’t lose their account.

What version of LC is currently installed on On-Rev?
It was pretty old the last time I checked.  Perhaps an
option to easily upgrade to the newest version of LC
on On-Rev should be offered?

A lot of people paid a bunch of money for On-Rev,
and then when support at Run-Rev discovered it
was more work than they bargained for, they
outsourced it to other companies.  The first time
it was outsourced, the result wasn’t good.  Things
are better than they were, but there is still room
for improvement.  Whenever a company accepts 
people’s money, that company has an obligation to 
provide better than average service if they want
to stay in business.

If it were up to me to run On-Rev, I would make 
sure that it was always up to date, or offered
easy ways to keep everything up to date.  You’d
never hear me threaten anyone to take away their
account if they didn’t keep some piece of software
up to date.  If that software poses a security risk,
as a good steward, I would take care of that issue
for my clients so they wouldn’t be at risk.

Just my 2 cents for the day.

Thank you for your helpful information about
Wordpress etc.

Cheers,

Rick





> On Dec 6, 2017, at 6:33 AM, Matthias Rebbe via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
>> Am 06.12.2017 um 07:14 schrieb Rick Harrison via use-livecode 
>> mailto:use-livecode@lists.runrev.com>>:
>> Then On-Rev wrote us that note saying that we were
>> the ones that would be held responsible for
>> ensuring that Wordpress was always up to 
>> date on our accounts or we could lose our
>> accounts.  (I thought maintaining up to date
>> versions was supposed to be the job of
>> On-Rev as good care takers.)  
> 
> If you install Wordpress manually from a Zip file then you are responsible 
> for keeping that version up to date. Either by manually updates or by 
> automatic updates.
> You can enable that in wp-config.php
> 
> And you if install Wordpress through Softacoulus (which is included in 
> On-Rev), you can enable auto upgrade in Softacoulus in  the config area for 
> your WP installation.
> 
> So regardless how you have installed Wordpress, you can enable auto upgrade.
> 
> Why should On-Rev support do this for you?
> 
> 
> Matthias Rebbe
> Tel +49 5741 31
> ‌https://matthiasrebbe.eu ‌
> ___
> use-livecode mailing list
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
> preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode


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Re: libUrl tsNet and socketTimeoutInterval

[Matthias Rebbe via use-livecode]

The connection ID is only used/needed when you use the asynchronous commands of 
tsNet.

The synchronous commands like tsNetUploadSync or tsNetFileUploadSync or others 
(they are ending with Sync) do not use connectionIDs. And i assume that put URL 
and get URL are using the synchronous commands.

Matthias

> Am 06.12.2017 um 17:08 schrieb Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami via use-livecode 
> mailto:use-livecode@lists.runrev.com>>:
> 
> Still searching… let's break this down a bit
> 
> Almost TSNet functions and commands require a connectionID. In some instances 
> these are aribitrary strings assigned by the dev on the initial call, then 
> used later.
> 
> but what if we use the simple libURL commands?
> 
> get url "https://www.domain.com/ping.txt "
> 
> OR
> 
> set a  mobile player to a URL and start the player
> 
> OR
> 
> use "load"
> 
> how do we extract a connectionID?
> 
> use case is to check the socketTimeout pSocketID (which may not be the same 
> as a "connectionID" .
> 
> I am still searching the dictionary for clues on how it all works. Not clear 
> on using plain libURL commands with TSNet… 
> Or if best practice is to switch over entirely to TSnet "vocabulary"  for all 
> URL calls. will check for lessons on this later..
> 
> Goal is preloading images or pages in books (aka "load") and monitoring 
> bandwidth and triggering notifications in low bandwidth conditions.
> 
> BR
> 
> 
> 
>FYI the dictionary does not declare units for the pLowSpeedTime, it 
> should… I've assumed integers = seconds and not milliseconds for param 5.
> 
>Second  (dumb) question: how do we trap for the timeout? we keep checking 
> the tsNetStatusCallback on a loop? and if and when we see timeout we inform 
> the user? But we need a connectionID, so how do we extract a connectionID 
> from put/get/set/ http urls? where we are targeting  browser widget on a 
> card. Or a mobilePlayer?
> 
> ___
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> preferences:
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Re: libUrl tsNet and socketTimeoutInterval

[Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami via use-livecode]

Still searching… let's break this down a bit

Almost TSNet functions and commands require a connectionID. In some instances 
these are aribitrary strings assigned by the dev on the initial call, then used 
later.

but what if we use the simple libURL commands?

get url "https://www.domain.com/ping.txt";

OR

 set a  mobile player to a URL and start the player

OR

use "load"

how do we extract a connectionID?

use case is to check the socketTimeout pSocketID (which may not be the same as 
a "connectionID" .

I am still searching the dictionary for clues on how it all works. Not clear on 
using plain libURL commands with TSNet… 
Or if best practice is to switch over entirely to TSnet "vocabulary"  for all 
URL calls. will check for lessons on this later..

Goal is preloading images or pages in books (aka "load") and monitoring 
bandwidth and triggering notifications in low bandwidth conditions.

BR



FYI the dictionary does not declare units for the pLowSpeedTime, it should… 
I've assumed integers = seconds and not milliseconds for param 5.

Second  (dumb) question: how do we trap for the timeout? we keep checking 
the tsNetStatusCallback on a loop? and if and when we see timeout we inform the 
user? But we need a connectionID, so how do we extract a connectionID from 
put/get/set/ http urls? where we are targeting  browser widget on a card. Or a 
mobilePlayer?

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Map Widget Futures

[Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami via use-livecode]

I'm not sure if the news from LiveCode Global is under any kind of NDA… Since I 
have a business license, we could pose this directly to HQ, but seems useful to 
share.. hope that is OK and I have this quesiton

What is the binary format of the map "object" that the engine or map widget can 
now pan and zoom?

Put another way: could we create our own giant SVG maps, with tools, for 
example like OmniGraffle or Diagrammix and then run these as "maps" inside the 
new widget. Or is this tech somehow locked into conventional geographical map 
formats of some kind?

Of course we can build those and show them inside a browser widget, but dealing 
with hotspots requires messing with JS and the chasm/issues between the JS in 
the browser widget and the stack-LC engine message path is still huge and 
problematic (discussed at length elsewhere) So if the new map widget is a 
member of the msg path in "proper standing" that will be excellent.

BR


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Re: Naive Player Questions

[Graham Samuel via use-livecode]

Yes, this is just plain nonsense - it may be a leftover from a previous 
LC/Revolution idea that “play” would have a larger range of possible formats, 
but in the current versions of LC the IDE should warn one off, no?

Graham

> On 6 Dec 2017, at 10:26, Richmond Mathewson via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> However, the fact that "import audio file" allows one to import an mp3 file
> is a bit misleading.
> 
> Richmond.
> 


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Re: LC Server style survey: co-mingle code w/HTML?

[Matthias Rebbe via use-livecode]

> Am 06.12.2017 um 07:14 schrieb Rick Harrison via use-livecode 
> mailto:use-livecode@lists.runrev.com>>:
>  Then On-Rev wrote us that note saying that we were
> the ones that would be held responsible for
> ensuring that Wordpress was always up to 
> date on our accounts or we could lose our
> accounts.  (I thought maintaining up to date
> versions was supposed to be the job of
> On-Rev as good care takers.)  

If you install Wordpress manually from a Zip file then you are responsible for 
keeping that version up to date. Either by manually updates or by automatic 
updates.
You can enable that in wp-config.php

And you if install Wordpress through Softacoulus (which is included in On-Rev), 
you can enable auto upgrade in Softacoulus in  the config area for your WP 
installation.

So regardless how you have installed Wordpress, you can enable auto upgrade.

Why should On-Rev support do this for you?


Matthias Rebbe
Tel +49 5741 31
‌https://matthiasrebbe.eu ‌
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Re: Naive Player Questions

[Richmond Mathewson via use-livecode]

However, the fact that "import audio file" allows one to import an mp3 file
is a bit misleading.

Richmond.

On 5/12/17 9:17 pm, Richmond Mathewson wrote:

I stand corrected!

You are indeed right: I moved my "carrot.mp3" file out of the same 
folder as the stack
and, no, no sound despite their being an embedded "carrot.mp3" file in 
the stack.


What a bu**er.

Richmond.

On 5/12/17 8:45 pm, Klaus major-k via use-livecode wrote:

Hi Richmond,


Am 05.12.2017 um 19:38 schrieb Richmond Mathewson via 
use-livecode:

NO: a player does not "demand" an external file as my example stack 
demonstrates:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/9v2juqqu7ojb83v/Carrot%20Player.livecode.zip?dl=0
[ and I would be VERY interested to know, Graham, what that did to your DropBox 
]
The player in that stack plays an embedded mp3 file.

It does NOT on a Mac, nor will it on Windows or wherever!

I suspect you have the MP3 in the same folder as the stack, so it might work 
for you
on your machine but not as you think. :-)


Richmond.

Best

Klaus

--
Klaus Major
http://www.major-k.de
kl...@major-k.de


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