Re: [vdr] More features for Livebuffer
Tony Houghton schrieb: > On Mon, 02 Mar 2009 19:32:02 + > Gavin Hamill wrote: > > >> On Mon, 2009-03-02 at 19:15 +, Tony Houghton wrote: >> >>> On Mon, 02 Mar 2009 19:30:55 +0200 >>> Rene Hertell wrote: >>> >>> Tony Houghton wrote: > On Mon, 2 Mar 2009 08:50:42 -0800 > But I wonder, does writing to the HD really shorten its life > significantly compared to constant spinning or frequently being spun up > and down? > Yes, i guess it does, cause it writes to the hdd:s surface constantly in large amounts... >>> But there's no physical contact, the surface just has its magnetic >>> polarity changed (or something like that). Is there a limit to how many >>> times it can survive those changes? Or perhaps the head moving mechanism >>> can wear out? >>> >> I thought the driving force for having HDs power down was to reduce >> power, noise and heat? >> > > Yes, avoiding disc access to keep it spun down is a good idea, but it's > difficult to keep one spun down in Linux because of logging activity > etc. Even if you manage to solve that problem I think the drive would > still need to be used often enough to make it a good idea only if it's > something like a laptop drive, designed to be spun up and down more > frequently than a desktop one. > Well there are more things in the world then you think ;) - Some people use CF card , some people Microdrives, some Notebookdrives. The video directory is on a couple of harddisks. Thats possible if you layout the directory structure correct with vdr. My machine ist running from a microdrive since more then a year now. Livebuffer would sure be interesting but not if: 1) it constantly keeps the disks spinning 2) it consumes a fixed amount of memory. Is there some tmpfs which allocates a certain percentage of given memory ? Would livebuffer be able to cope with that ? Then i would for sure pick a bit RAM and try it out. Again: Livebuffer might be nice - but not for the price to pay ... Kind Regards Steffen ___ vdr mailing list vdr@linuxtv.org http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/vdr
Re: [vdr] More features for Livebuffer
On Mon, 02 Mar 2009 19:32:02 + Gavin Hamill wrote: > On Mon, 2009-03-02 at 19:15 +, Tony Houghton wrote: > > On Mon, 02 Mar 2009 19:30:55 +0200 > > Rene Hertell wrote: > > > > > Tony Houghton wrote: > > > > On Mon, 2 Mar 2009 08:50:42 -0800 > > > > But I wonder, does writing to the HD really shorten its life > > > > significantly compared to constant spinning or frequently being spun up > > > > and down? > > > > > > Yes, i guess it does, cause it writes to the hdd:s surface constantly in > > > large amounts... > > > > But there's no physical contact, the surface just has its magnetic > > polarity changed (or something like that). Is there a limit to how many > > times it can survive those changes? Or perhaps the head moving mechanism > > can wear out? > > I thought the driving force for having HDs power down was to reduce > power, noise and heat? Yes, avoiding disc access to keep it spun down is a good idea, but it's difficult to keep one spun down in Linux because of logging activity etc. Even if you manage to solve that problem I think the drive would still need to be used often enough to make it a good idea only if it's something like a laptop drive, designed to be spun up and down more frequently than a desktop one. -- TH * http://www.realh.co.uk ___ vdr mailing list vdr@linuxtv.org http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/vdr
Re: [vdr] More features for Livebuffer
On Mon, 2009-03-02 at 19:15 +, Tony Houghton wrote: > On Mon, 02 Mar 2009 19:30:55 +0200 > Rene Hertell wrote: > > > Tony Houghton wrote: > > > On Mon, 2 Mar 2009 08:50:42 -0800 > > > But I wonder, does writing to the HD really shorten its life > > > significantly compared to constant spinning or frequently being spun up > > > and down? > > > > Yes, i guess it does, cause it writes to the hdd:s surface constantly in > > large amounts... > > But there's no physical contact, the surface just has its magnetic > polarity changed (or something like that). Is there a limit to how many > times it can survive those changes? Or perhaps the head moving mechanism > can wear out? > I thought the driving force for having HDs power down was to reduce power, noise and heat? Disk and RAM are both cheap. Take a backup to a giant slow USB disk once a month, etc. :) Cheers, Gavin. ___ vdr mailing list vdr@linuxtv.org http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/vdr
Re: [vdr] More features for Livebuffer
On Mon, 02 Mar 2009 19:30:55 +0200 Rene Hertell wrote: > Tony Houghton wrote: > > On Mon, 2 Mar 2009 08:50:42 -0800 > > But I wonder, does writing to the HD really shorten its life > > significantly compared to constant spinning or frequently being spun up > > and down? > > Yes, i guess it does, cause it writes to the hdd:s surface constantly in > large amounts... But there's no physical contact, the surface just has its magnetic polarity changed (or something like that). Is there a limit to how many times it can survive those changes? Or perhaps the head moving mechanism can wear out? -- TH * http://www.realh.co.uk ___ vdr mailing list vdr@linuxtv.org http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/vdr
Re: [vdr] More features for Livebuffer
Tony Houghton wrote: > On Mon, 2 Mar 2009 08:50:42 -0800 > But I wonder, does writing to the HD really shorten its life > significantly compared to constant spinning or frequently being spun up > and down? > Yes, i guess it does, cause it writes to the hdd:s surface constantly in large amounts... But back to my original question. Could someone who is more familiar to c-programming and knows how VDR works check out the LiveBUffer patch and add a these few new features to it? I would love to get warned if i change the channel in the middle of watching a program from the buffer...! :-) This would be more important feature if the buffer is in RAM, and not on the HDD. If i really missed something important, then I just check it with eg. VLC over a a samba-export.. Regards, René -=-=- ... ASCII a stupid question, get a stupid ANSI! ___ vdr mailing list vdr@linuxtv.org http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/vdr
Re: [vdr] More features for Livebuffer
On Mon, 2 Mar 2009 08:50:42 -0800 VDR User wrote: > On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 8:39 AM, Gavin Hamill wrote: > > My 2c... > > > > RAM is cheap - just add some RAM and use a memory-based filesystem like > > tmpfs? Then there would be no special handling required from VDR since > > the 'livebuffer' file is part of the directory tree like any other file. > > Not a bad idea really as long as nothing else needs ram. I recorded > 70mins worth of 1080i HDTV the other day and total size was about > 3.5G. 4GB is about $35-$40 for DDR2-800 so it's not too expensive. I > usually take advantage of mail-in-rebates so I've actually got a few > 2x2GB kits here that I haven't paid more then $20 for each and all my > boxes have at least 4GB in them already. > > Is it possible to resize the live buffer is another app needs more ram? For boxstar I was thinking of having the live buffer in RAM to save writing to the HD, and even wondered about having it in the player front-end instead of the server. Both approaches have their pros and cons. The beauty of virtual memory is that it works both ways. An application written to use a file can have the file cached in RAM and one written to use RAM can have it swapped to disc if the RAM is needed for something else. But I wonder, does writing to the HD really shorten its life significantly compared to constant spinning or frequently being spun up and down? -- TH * http://www.realh.co.uk ___ vdr mailing list vdr@linuxtv.org http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/vdr
Re: [vdr] More features for Livebuffer
On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 8:39 AM, Gavin Hamill wrote: > My 2c... > > RAM is cheap - just add some RAM and use a memory-based filesystem like > tmpfs? Then there would be no special handling required from VDR since > the 'livebuffer' file is part of the directory tree like any other file. Not a bad idea really as long as nothing else needs ram. I recorded 70mins worth of 1080i HDTV the other day and total size was about 3.5G. 4GB is about $35-$40 for DDR2-800 so it's not too expensive. I usually take advantage of mail-in-rebates so I've actually got a few 2x2GB kits here that I haven't paid more then $20 for each and all my boxes have at least 4GB in them already. Is it possible to resize the live buffer is another app needs more ram? ___ vdr mailing list vdr@linuxtv.org http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/vdr
Re: [vdr] More features for Livebuffer
On Mon, 2009-03-02 at 08:18 -0800, VDR User wrote: > On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 7:49 AM, Jörg Knitter wrote: > > What about using RAM oder some kind of flash media? > > > > I would really appreciate such a function - as long I can choose where I > > want the buffer to be written... I also would prefer not to have a HD > > recording 24/7... > > Since flash media has a limited amount of writes, I wouldn't recommend > using that as a place to do massive recording. > > I think at the very least the user should have the option to turn > constant hdd recording on/off. I think it's ridiculous MythTV doesn't > allow the user to decide if he wants it and just forces it. Not only > does it create a lot more wear on your hdd, it also keeps your power > usage high and thus your electric bill bigger each month. All that > just so I can rewind live tv any time? Umm, no thanks. There's > nothing that important on tv that I can't find on the net or see again > later when it repeats. ;) My 2c... RAM is cheap - just add some RAM and use a memory-based filesystem like tmpfs? Then there would be no special handling required from VDR since the 'livebuffer' file is part of the directory tree like any other file. Cheers, Gavin. ___ vdr mailing list vdr@linuxtv.org http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/vdr
Re: [vdr] More features for Livebuffer
On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 7:49 AM, Jörg Knitter wrote: > What about using RAM oder some kind of flash media? > > I would really appreciate such a function - as long I can choose where I > want the buffer to be written... I also would prefer not to have a HD > recording 24/7... Since flash media has a limited amount of writes, I wouldn't recommend using that as a place to do massive recording. I think at the very least the user should have the option to turn constant hdd recording on/off. I think it's ridiculous MythTV doesn't allow the user to decide if he wants it and just forces it. Not only does it create a lot more wear on your hdd, it also keeps your power usage high and thus your electric bill bigger each month. All that just so I can rewind live tv any time? Umm, no thanks. There's nothing that important on tv that I can't find on the net or see again later when it repeats. ;) ___ vdr mailing list vdr@linuxtv.org http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/vdr
Re: [vdr] More features for Livebuffer
VDR User wrote: > On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 2:28 AM, Rene wrote: > >> Also a nice thing to have is a way of watching the saved >> livebuffer-files. Now it get´s saved into /video/LiveBuffer, and vdr >> does not see this. Maybe it could be saved into a subdirectory like >> /video/LiveBuffer/2100-01-01.00.01.50.99.rec, then vdr would always have >> it as the last recording available in the recordings-list... >> > > You really want to record non-stop 24/7 to your harddrive like MythTV does? > > > What about using RAM oder some kind of flash media? I would really appreciate such a function - as long I can choose where I want the buffer to be written... I also would prefer not to have a HD recording 24/7... With kind regards Joerg ___ vdr mailing list vdr@linuxtv.org http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/vdr
Re: [vdr] More features for Livebuffer
VDR User wrote: > On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 2:28 AM, Rene wrote: >> Also a nice thing to have is a way of watching the saved >> livebuffer-files. Now it get´s saved into /video/LiveBuffer, and vdr >> does not see this. Maybe it could be saved into a subdirectory like >> /video/LiveBuffer/2100-01-01.00.01.50.99.rec, then vdr would always have >> it as the last recording available in the recordings-list... > > You really want to record non-stop 24/7 to your harddrive like MythTV does? Not really. Maybe it could be with somekind on/off feature, cause it wears out the hdd when constantly recording. There could be a timeout-feature that if the remote is not touched for eg 2h, the LiveBuffer would be disabled.. René ___ vdr mailing list vdr@linuxtv.org http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/vdr
Re: [vdr] More features for Livebuffer
On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 2:28 AM, Rene wrote: > Also a nice thing to have is a way of watching the saved > livebuffer-files. Now it get´s saved into /video/LiveBuffer, and vdr > does not see this. Maybe it could be saved into a subdirectory like > /video/LiveBuffer/2100-01-01.00.01.50.99.rec, then vdr would always have > it as the last recording available in the recordings-list... You really want to record non-stop 24/7 to your harddrive like MythTV does? ___ vdr mailing list vdr@linuxtv.org http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/vdr
