I think I agree with this.
Cheers,
Peter
-Original Message-
From: Wikimedia-l [mailto:wikimedia-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of
Gerard Meijssen
Sent: 21 February 2020 15:50
To: Wikimedia Mailing List
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Next steps on Wikimedia Space
Hoi,
There are too
Hoi,
There are too many places where all kinds of conversations are held.
Everyone expects that others make use of their preferred platform. I can
use wikis and I am not able to cover all the Wikis where all kinds of
conversations are held that may be or may not be of interest to me.
As chaos
When we decide to use something other than wikis to help those who
don't use wikis, instead of helping those who don't use wikis to use
them, how is that not turning our backs on project editor recruitment?
Is the problem that people can't use wikis or that they don't yet know
how? It just seems
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Next steps on Wikimedia Space
Thank you, Quim Gil and your team all the effort that went into
discuss-space. We've seen a great platform being developed.
It was far from ready, however, and my impression was we were in a
pre-release phase. To add to the lessons learned, let me
Thank you, Quim Gil and your team all the effort that went into
discuss-space. We've seen a great platform being developed.
It was far from ready, however, and my impression was we were in a
pre-release phase. To add to the lessons learned, let me share my thoughts
on this.
From the recurring
Also +1 to Guillaume's comment, I couldn't have said better. A
user-friendly forum, like discuss-space is most needed by those, who want
to join the movement, whom the WMF wants to attract, not to those who are
comfortable with the current solutions.
And IRC being an appropriate real-time
+1 to Guillaume’s comment.
Best,
Victoria Coleman
> On Feb 19, 2020, at 2:31 PM, Guillaume Paumier wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> Le mer. 19 févr. 2020 à 10:31, Todd Allen a écrit :
>
>> I don't think anyone had bad intentions. It was just redundant.
>>
>> Real time communication is on IRC.
Am 19.02.20 um 22:52 Uhr schrieb Yaroslav Blanter:
>> Quit trying to make us TwitFaceTube. The tools we already have work just
>> fine.
>>
> Apparently not if people go there en masse instead of using on-wiki
> channels.
Most people do not go to TwitFaceTube in order to publish something
about
I do think that there are benefits in continuing to explore
WMF/movement-managed communication tools outside of the onwiki/IRC/mailing
list paradigm; we have long known that a lot of voices are excluded from
using these channels, and that is not helpful in growing a large,
international,
I've been involved in the movement for ~7 years, took one look at IRC and
walked very quickly the other way, having used it 15+ years ago. I'm all
for retro, but that was taking it too far.
Relying on a tool that has been been haemorrhaging users for years, and
golden years are seen as around 20
Then, they're welcome to pop on in any time. If they choose not to, well,
no one can make them. Anyone is able to use those tools.
Todd
On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 3:32 PM Guillaume Paumier
wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Le mer. 19 févr. 2020 à 10:31, Todd Allen a écrit :
>
> > I don't think anyone had bad
Hi,
Le mer. 19 févr. 2020 à 10:31, Todd Allen a écrit :
> I don't think anyone had bad intentions. It was just redundant.
>
> Real time communication is on IRC. Asynchronous communication is either on
> the wiki, preferably, or on the mailing list.
>
> Quit trying to make us TwitFaceTube. The
On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 7:31 PM Todd Allen wrote:
>
> Quit trying to make us TwitFaceTube. The tools we already have work just
> fine.
>
Apparently not if people go there en masse instead of using on-wiki
channels.
Yaroslav
>
> Todd
>
> On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 10:41 AM Yaroslav Blanter wrote:
I don't think anyone had bad intentions. It was just redundant.
Real time communication is on IRC. Asynchronous communication is either on
the wiki, preferably, or on the mailing list.
Quit trying to make us TwitFaceTube. The tools we already have work just
fine.
Todd
On Wed, Feb 19, 2020,
I provided feedback previously on Space earlier and I could not find it now
but I assume it was taken into consideration when the decision was taken.
Without repeating it, let me remark that the two main questions, which
remained unsolved, were (i) what is the target audience and (ii) what is
the
Thank you for all the feedback. After scanning different channels, we have
a wide range of opinions which reflect how deep and complex the problem of
cross-wiki collaboration is, and also how differently the Space prototype
and this decision is being perceived. We will process this feedback and
> ... it has been a mistake to keep spinning off new discussion
> platforms, in the hope that the next one will be different and controllable
> and totally replace everything else. This has been an anti-pattern for a
> decade. Far better to make a real investment (including both a social and a
>
Thankyou Pharos for expressing the issue so clearly.
In the last 2 days, purely as part of our Wikimedia projects, I have felt
/obliged/ to contribute to discussions on Telegram, Twitter, Facebook, Zoom
and IRC (and at least 2 other platforms in a passive way). All of these
discussion spaces are
> On 18 Feb 2020, at 19:53, Pharos wrote:
>
> On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 8:49 AM Samuel Klein wrote:
>
>> Phase V confirmed! -- I hope this means related features (a calendar +
>> forum :) are getting included in mediawiki propre...
>>
>>
>>
>
> Indeed, it has been a mistake to keep
On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 8:49 AM Samuel Klein wrote:
> Phase V confirmed! -- I hope this means related features (a calendar +
> forum :) are getting included in mediawiki propre...
>
>
>
Indeed, it has been a mistake to keep spinning off new discussion
platforms, in the hope that the next
Thank you Quim for this unfortunate information.
This is surprise for me, as Wikimedia Space is given too little time to
evolve. I really like this idea and I remembered when people asked me on
conferences what we miss as a movement, I would say that we miss place like
*Space* where you can see
Hello Quim,
Thank you for the information. It was not quite a surprise, as we did not
hear much of Space in the last time, and I must confess myself that I only
used it in the iniatial phase and somewhat later. I feel sorry for those
who invested time and energy in it.
I am interested in a
Phase V confirmed! -- I hope this means related features (a calendar +
forum :) are getting included in mediawiki propre...
On Tue., Feb. 18, 2020, 5:31 a.m. Quim Gil, wrote:
> Last year, the Wikimedia Foundation launched Wikimedia Space to experiment
> with new ways to connect
Hi Quim and Paulo,
Like anything we lose as a movement (see also Wikipedia Zero), I am very
sorry for this decision, for those who worked and for those who were
comfortable with the platform.
I was not, as I am not with Phabricator (despite being a developer). It's a
matter of habits and
Hello Quim,
I knew this was a possibility, but it still is a big surprise for me that
the WMF has not recognized the enormous value and potential of Wikimedia
Space, which was a space incredibly more friendlier and easier to use than
anything I've ever seen onwiki. As we discussed last November
Last year, the Wikimedia Foundation launched Wikimedia Space to experiment
with new ways to connect volunteers, increase movement participation, and
showcase community stories. While we remain committed to this important
goal, based on lessons learned through the Space prototype, the Foundation
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