Re: [Wikimedia-l] SUL finalization update (no, for real this time)

[Dennis During]

Thanks MFWarburg. Almost exactly what I want and certainly good enough for
now.

On Wed, Mar 18, 2015 at 10:43 PM, MF-Warburg 
wrote:

> Special:Log/renameuser
> Am 19.03.2015 00:59 schrieb "Dennis During" :
>
> > So, for the third time: Will there be a report accessible to normal users
> > that has the name changes for the most voluminous contributors who have
> had
> > a name change so that one can transfer one's experience with a user to
> the
> > user's new name?
> >
> > On Wed, Mar 18, 2015 at 7:22 PM, Keegan Peterzell <
> > kpeterz...@wikimedia.org>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Hello,
> > >
> > > On Wed, Mar 18, 2015 at 5:42 PM, Dennis During 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > > I'm a bit confused about implications of SUL for edit history.
> > > >
> > >
> > > Just like renames work now, the user's new name will show up in edit
> > > histories.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Keegan Peterzell
> > > Community Liaison, Product
> > > Wikimedia Foundation
> > > ___
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> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > 
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Dennis C. During
> > ___
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-- 
Dennis C. During
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Announcement: WMF to file suit against the NSA

[Austin Hair]

On Wed, Mar 18, 2015 at 10:26 PM, Steven Walling
 wrote:
> These off topic emails about the same subject Andreas grinds his axe about
> perpetually are pretty annoying. Can moderation do something please?

I'm not sure what forum would be more on-topic, if not this one. I
think this particular discussion should have been forked into a new
thread three or four messages ago, but apart from that, he's remained
civil and hasn't done anything to warrant moderation. (If you've read
his messages, in fact, he's not just repeating himself, and has even
proposed concrete solutions.)

Feel free to add him to your e-mail blacklist, but "one user finds him
'pretty annoying'" has never by itself been a reason to cut someone
off from the list.

Austin

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] SUL finalization update (no, for real this time)

[MF-Warburg]

Special:Log/renameuser
Am 19.03.2015 00:59 schrieb "Dennis During" :

> So, for the third time: Will there be a report accessible to normal users
> that has the name changes for the most voluminous contributors who have had
> a name change so that one can transfer one's experience with a user to the
> user's new name?
>
> On Wed, Mar 18, 2015 at 7:22 PM, Keegan Peterzell <
> kpeterz...@wikimedia.org>
> wrote:
>
> > Hello,
> >
> > On Wed, Mar 18, 2015 at 5:42 PM, Dennis During 
> wrote:
> >
> > > I'm a bit confused about implications of SUL for edit history.
> > >
> >
> > Just like renames work now, the user's new name will show up in edit
> > histories.
> >
> > --
> > Keegan Peterzell
> > Community Liaison, Product
> > Wikimedia Foundation
> > ___
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> > Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > 
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Dennis C. During
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] New financing model for editations

[Richard Symonds]

I worry that running an auction and a raffle for each - or even some -
editathons would be a lot of work, even if you just focus on the admin work
(I'm not sure what the laws around fundraising auctions and lotteries are
but that could be costly too). The FDC and the community in general are
very much against increasing 'back office costs' and this would increase
them by quite a bit for each editathon.

The incentivising volunteers with money issue would also be very very
difficult, even if the community was ok with it. You'd be paying
volunteers, which in this country would make them staff, which means they'd
need a minimum wage, taxes, and even a pension.

Do we need to incentivise volunteers with cash at all? I'm not sure we
do... there's no shortage of volunteers to run editathons in the UK at
least!
On 19 Mar 2015 00:54, "James Salsman"  wrote:

> I really like editathons because of the ease with which they can be
> designed to address systemic bias, but I'm not sure having them supported
> by the Foundation is optimal from the perspective of time and money both.
>
> Therefore, I propose that someone try some editathons where half the
> tickets are auctioned, the other half are raffled, and the Foundation pays
> to support them if and only if the auction fails to pay all of the expenses
> in advance, and then only the difference. This will allow them to become
> more exclusive, but not completely exclusive, and it will incentivize the
> organizing wikipedians by allowing them to pay themselves some contingent
> portion of the proceeds to be negotiated with the Foundation, and which
> could, for example, include an open-ended proportion of auction proceeds.
>
> Please share your thoughts on this proposal. I am also making diagrams for
> nine of the twelve steps listed on
> http://mediawiki.org/wiki/Accuracy_review
> and its talk page, where I will soon be proposing a different alternate
> funding model to avoid relying on Google Summer of Code. I would also be
> most interested in comments on that. Thank you!
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] SUL finalization update (no, for real this time)

[Dennis During]

I'm a bit confused about implications of SUL for edit history.

What name will show up in page history for a contribution made by someone
who, after SUL, has a new name? The new name, if any, of that user? The
name being used at the time, which would now be attributed to someone who
did not make the contribution?  As an active user I often review histories
to find out the source of erroneous, non-standard, or odd, and brilliant
and interesting content in entries/articles.  How will I know about
identity changes?  I suppose the problem has always existed because of
sock-puppetry, usurpation, etc.  I suppose that it was always handled by
checkusers, etc  This just seems like potentially much more pervasive
problem that cannot necessarily be handled the same way.

Will there be reports or query mechanism to help active contributors keep
track of at least these sanctioned name changes?

On Wed, Mar 18, 2015 at 11:44 AM, Fæ  wrote:

> Correction. This link lists backwards from "Fae" but misses out "Fae":
>
> https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:UsersWhoWillBeRenamed&dir=prev&offset=Fae
>
> This link lists forwards from "Fae" but again misses out "Fae"!:
>
> https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:UsersWhoWillBeRenamed&offset=Fae
>
> So yes, you can guess which name might be just before the name you are
> actually searching for, or wait until this special page is debugged. I
> suspect there was not much testing of it before the notices went out.
>
> Fae
>
> On 18 March 2015 at 15:27, Fæ  wrote:
> > If anyone wishes to check a name, they can use "offset". For example
> > this url checks to see if the account "Fae" is going to be affected:
> >
> https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:UsersWhoWillBeRenamed&dir=prev&offset=Fae
> >
> > Just change the name at the end of the link.
> >
> > However I note some issues. If you miss out the "dir" parameter, then
> > the list seems to start *after* your index point, missing out the name
> > searched for:
> >
> https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:UsersWhoWillBeRenamed&offset=Wikilover
> > does not start at "Wikilover" as you might expect, but it is shown by
> >
> https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:UsersWhoWillBeRenamed&offset=Wikilove
> >
> > P.S. the parameter "limit" does not seem to make any difference as it
> > does not change the list from a default of 25 accounts.
> >
> > Fae
> >
> > On 18 March 2015 at 15:11, Dennis During  wrote:
> >> Thanks for moving this close to completion.  I hope finalization goes
> well.
> >>
> >> However, It found Special:UsersWhoWillBeRenamed totally useless at
> >> Wiktionary, as I'm sure it is at any mature project.  Only 25 names
> appear
> >> at time. On Wiktionary the first page only includes names using
> exclusively
> >> exclamation marks.  It takes several pageforwards to get to the first
> "A".
> >> It is not searchable.  There is not even a count of how many there are
> in
> >> total.
> >>
> >> I'm not sure why the list is provided.  What is a use case for it?
> >>
> >> It would be useful for those reviewing entries (articles) to have lists
> of
> >> old and new names for contributors (with unreverted contributions) so
> as to
> >> take advantage of hard-won knowledge about typical user contribution
> >> quality, etc.  Are there plans for this?
> > 
> >
> > --
> > fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae
>
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-- 
Dennis C. During
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia Announcements] Announcing interim COO

[Pine W]

Welcome Terry. Will we have a chance to meet you at the Wikimedia
Conference? Is the COO role temporary for the duration of the strategy
review or does interim mean indefinite pending a more expansive search for
a permanent COO?

Gayle, thanks for your resilience in the HR role. Good luck!

Thanks,
Pine
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[Wikimedia-l] Wikimedia Commons

[Carmen Alcázar]

Hello.
I am Wikipedian in residence and want to upload a high quality tiff archive
and I can't seem to upload more than 100.00 MB. I get this message: "You
can only upload files with a size of up to 100.00 MB". What is happening ?
Do you know what I can do?

-- 

*"Wikipedia es algo especial. Es como una biblioteca o un parque público.
Es como un templo para el pensamiento. Un lugar al que todos podemos ir a
pensar, a aprender, a compartir nuestros conocimientos con otros." JW*


Carmen Alcázar (@metik)
Secretaria, Wikimedia  México A.C.
Coordinadora Hospitalidad Wikimanía
2015 (@Wikimanía2015)
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] 2015 Strategy/Community consultation on the "Wikipedia for children" idea

[Mathias Damour]

Le 18/03/2015 20:41, Marc A. Pelletier a écrit :

On 15-03-18 02:19 PM, Mathias Damour wrote:

[...] the content must be appropriate for children [...]

The problem is exactly that.  What is or is not "appropriate for
children" is an inherently *political* question, the answer to which is
inherently culture- religion- and governement-centric.  What *you*
define as "appropriate" is absolutely different from what *I* would -
illustrated by the very concept of believing that there /is/ such a
thing as "not appropriate for children" to begin with.


It still seems odd to me that those considerations would be some 
prevailing reason NOT to develop such a resource. In the same time, we 
have to take it as a fact and it can be a reason why the WMF may not be 
the appropriate organization to host and promote such wikis, being 
immersed in a certain climate surrounding children.


I quoted above the Convention on the Rights of the Child, which was not 
ratified by the US. One of the reason for that may be a conception of 
the rights of the parents to control what their children can be taught 
or the information they can reach, which would be slightly more extended 
in the US than in the average country. I mean rights of the parents 
against the rights of the government and against the eventual rights of 
the children to "seek, receive and impart information and ideas of all 
kinds", be it very resembling to the "freely share in the sum of all 
knowledge - empower people..."


That would be the ground for a tacit policy I've heard of on en.wp that 
would be "don't tell us you are a minor". The basis of Simple English 
Wikipedia are also resembling it : "don't tell it's for children" (and 
consequently it isn't really for children).


Undoubtedly it doesn't prevent people from the US, among other 
countries, to be involved in and to benefit from such a resource.
And the chapters may be more suited to support such a project/resource. 
Several of them already do.



For instance, would a Russian Kids' Wikipedia carefully avoid "promotion
of homosexuality" as their law now demands (to pick one salient example
amongst thousands).

There is not thousands examples, this kind af question is definitely not
a day-to-day issue on Vikidia in French. There is so much to write on
other subjects.

There /are/ thousand of examples unless Vikidia is a 1:1 map to the
French Wikipedia with no selection or curation.  Every single article
that has not been included is a political statement, and raises a
question about its propriety.

That you think that "this kind of question" is not a day-to-day issue on
Vikidia simply means that you are presuming the answer - otherwise there
would be nothing to curate.


Vikidia is not a selection or curation, it's about writing new articles 
which are independent from their counterpart on Wikipedia in the same 
language. Otherwise we couldn't meet the objective to be more affordable 
for children. However we make it easy by interwiki links to reach the 
Wikipedia article on the same subject if one want to know more about it. 
Some article are even longer on Vikidia than their counterpart on 
Wikipédia, such as :

https://fr.vikidia.org/wiki/%C3%8Atre_vivant


Does it mean that projects like Vikidia are not valid and should not
exist?  No.  It is perfectly allowable for any group (including groups
of volunteers) to pick and curate some fraction of our projects for
their use and according to their criteria.  In fact, we should
*encourage* such reuse.

It *does* mean that it is not apropriate for the projects to create or
endorse such political endeavors, however.


--
Mathias Damour
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Astirmays
https://fr.vikidia.org/wiki/Utilisateur:Astirmays

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] 2015 Strategy/Community consultation on the "Wikipedia for children" idea

[David Gerard]

I'm not dismissing other approaches! I'm noting one approach that did work :-)

On 18 March 2015 at 20:02, Mathias Damour  wrote:
> Le 18/03/2015 16:23, David Gerard a écrit :
>>
>> http://schools-wikipedia.org does most of the job. And teachers LOVE it.
>> We should give this project more love and assistance, it's basically the
>> refutation of all attempts to, er, filter the base product.
>
>
> Teachers love it, what about children?
>
> Le 18/03/2015 16:51, Marc A. Pelletier a écrit :
>>
>> On 15-03-18 11:23 AM, David Gerard wrote:
>>>
>>> We should give this project more love and assistance, it's
>>> basically the refutation of all attempts to, er, filter the base
>>> product.
>>
>> I agree.  Whenever a group of people decide to curate some subset of our
>> projects with an eye towards their needs, then I count it as a win (even
>> in the cases where I would object to the curation choices myself).
>
>
> The fact is it is "just" a set of curated (and choosen) Wikipedia articles.
> What if they are still mostly too complicated ?
>
> Le 18/03/2015 17:33, David Gerard a écrit :
>
>> On 18 March 2015 at 15:51, Marc A. Pelletier  wrote:
>>
>>> What irks me is the idea of giving imprimatur to something "we" curate,
>>> or to do any sort of curation "ourselves" (that is, the movement or the
>>> Foundation).  "All the knowledge" means "All", not "some subset thereof".
>>
>> In the case of Schools Wikipedia, it's worked quite well - the
>> editorial review heavy lifting was substantially done by en:wp
>> volunteers. They specifically approached it as "what would we expect
>> in an English school situation?" though it was intended for use
>> outside the UK (they just used the English National Curriculum as
>> their guide).
>
>
> Should children be only allowed to be interested to their school curriculum?
> There is so much subjects to be interested in and to learn about.
>
> Le 18/03/2015 17:38, David Gerard a écrit :
>
>> On 18 March 2015 at 16:07, Richard Symonds
>>  wrote:
>>
>>> Indeed. http://schools-wikipedia.org is already used around the world -
>>> it's a great example of what can be done if Wikimedians work with (even
>>> passively with) other orgs.
>>
>> Everyone likes it, not many are coming forward to lead the ongoing
>> update cycle since User:Bozmo left SOS Children (the charity who put
>> it together). (And I'm not volunteering.) Not sure what to do about
>> that.
>
>
> Well I suggest to do it on a full new open wiki, to use the Simple English
> Wikipedia content when it fits, to promote the translation of already made
> good work on other languages equivalent of such a wiki, and to allow fully
> new articles to be written and bettered.
>
> Yet even the Simple English Wikipedia article are not always the best
> content to have. You may compare:
> https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_United_States
> https://en.vikidia.org/wiki/History_of_the_USA , written in the last few
> month by a eleven years old "vikidian" (however a quite experienced user)
> and... I can't find it on schools-wikipedia.org, there is just
> http://schools-wikipedia.org/wp/u/United_States.htm
> I wonder how would someone curate the 168,391 bytes
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_United_States to make it fit to
> school children.
> And here is how we can "curate", that's to say rewrite a few parts and add
> some images, an article from Simple English Wikipedia :
> https://en.vikidia.org/w/index.php?title=Roman_house&diff=76306&oldid=28149
>
> --
> Mathias Damour
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Astirmays
> https://fr.vikidia.org/wiki/Utilisateur:Astirmays
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia Announcements] Announcing interim COO

[Gayle Karen Young]

Dear colleagues,

It was a difficult decision to leave the Wikimedia Foundation as its CTCO.
Some of my best memories of my time with the Wikimedia movement include the
privilege of interacting and learning from Wikipedians at the Chapters
Conferences and Wikimanias in D.C., Hong Kong, and London, for which I’m so
grateful. As much as the learnings are the memories -- I have these
beautiful snapshots in my mind of dancing with Wikipedians on the beach in
Hong Kong, singing  “I Will Revise
” off-key at the top of my
lungs, and I’m very clear that one hasn’t ever properly done karaoke if
they’ve not experienced it with the Germans.

Thank you for teaching me what it is to be part of a global movement, to
respect differences in thoughts and opinions when they are in service of
this beautiful mission we have - of moving from imagining to creating a
world where people can freely access the sum of all knowledge through
collaboration. I’ve been very humbled and I have learned so much from the
dedicated volunteers in our movement.

My personal commitment to our mission stands, so if ever anyone seeks
counsel or thought partnership on leadership issues, people, or diversity
issues in the movement, I’ll be a happy volunteer.

The road goes ever on and on. Live long and prosper.

Gayle Karen Young

gayleka...@gmail.com


Gayle Karen Young
gayleka...@gmail.com  |  415.310.8416




On Wed, Mar 18, 2015 at 1:52 PM, Lila Tretikov  wrote:

> Dear Wikimedians,
>
>
>
> At the Wikimedia Foundation, our mission is to empower, support and engage
> people around the world to share in free knowledge. One of our top
> priorities for the WMF in 2015 is improving organizational effectiveness in
> service of this mission. This means we need to strengthen WMF's ability to
> set and deliver on commitments, improve organizational discipline around
> decision making, and mature internal processes and systems.
>
> To ensure we can execute on our vision, mission, forthcoming strategy and
> our Call to Action, we have hired for a new position within our C-level
> team. Terry Gilbey will be joining us as interim Chief Operating Officer,
> responsible for building rigor and discipline around our operational
> processes. Terry’s role will help WMF stabilize our core operations so we
> will be ready and able to adapt and innovate in our changing environment.
> It will also help me find more time to focus on our products and
> communities.
>
> Terry comes from managing his own consulting firm and has been in a
> consulting role at WMF working on a number of projects such as
> goal-setting, financials, and budgeting. He has first-hand experience
> working with the WMF leadership team, and we are all excited to work more
> closely with him. Previously, Terry was the Executive Director of
> Enterprise Operations at Kaiser Permanente, a nationwide healthcare
> organization, and served in various management roles at IBM Global
> Services.
>
> Terry is originally from England and has lived in the U.S., Europe, Asia,
> and Central America. He currently lives in the South Bay, but also spends a
> lot of time in Panama on a rural farm. He spends his spare time pursuing
> unusual hobbies, such as bull riding, surfing, and more recently,
> supporting a women’s flat track roller derby team. He also rides
> motorcycles, does metal work, and has an avid interest in sustainability.
> An early adopter of Tor, Terry believes strongly in the right to privacy
> and the free and open access to knowledge as an equalizer.
>
> With the COO position, we will be organizing our HR and Finance teams to
> report to Terry. Garfield will continue as the CFO for the organization, a
> member of the C-level team, and Treasurer of the Board. His roles and
> responsibilities will remain unchanged, reporting to Terry. Terry and
> Garfield will manage all financial and business planning activities and are
> already making progress together. We’ll introduce Terry properly with a
> short Q&A at the April metrics meeting.
>
> It is with sadness that I report to you that Gayle Karen Young, Chief
> Talent and Culture Officer has decided move onto her next adventure. Gayle
> let me know she has been looking to move on some time ago, and she felt
> this was the right moment in time. In her three and a half years within the
> Foundation, she has made a tremendous impact creating a HR department that
> is fundamentally about caring for the people in the organization and
> offering services that allow people to do their best work, which has
> supported our mission to help our communities thrive and curate knowledge.
> While we will miss her wisdom and warmth, we thank her for her leadership
> and celebrate her future adventures. HR will report directly to Terry at
> this time.
>
> Our purpose is to help Wikimedians around the world make the sum of all
> knowledge available to everyone. We believe these changes, effective
> immediately, will help

[Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia Announcements] Announcing interim COO

[Lila Tretikov]

Dear Wikimedians,



At the Wikimedia Foundation, our mission is to empower, support and engage
people around the world to share in free knowledge. One of our top
priorities for the WMF in 2015 is improving organizational effectiveness in
service of this mission. This means we need to strengthen WMF's ability to
set and deliver on commitments, improve organizational discipline around
decision making, and mature internal processes and systems.

To ensure we can execute on our vision, mission, forthcoming strategy and
our Call to Action, we have hired for a new position within our C-level
team. Terry Gilbey will be joining us as interim Chief Operating Officer,
responsible for building rigor and discipline around our operational
processes. Terry’s role will help WMF stabilize our core operations so we
will be ready and able to adapt and innovate in our changing environment.
It will also help me find more time to focus on our products and
communities.

Terry comes from managing his own consulting firm and has been in a
consulting role at WMF working on a number of projects such as
goal-setting, financials, and budgeting. He has first-hand experience
working with the WMF leadership team, and we are all excited to work more
closely with him. Previously, Terry was the Executive Director of
Enterprise Operations at Kaiser Permanente, a nationwide healthcare
organization, and served in various management roles at IBM Global Services.

Terry is originally from England and has lived in the U.S., Europe, Asia,
and Central America. He currently lives in the South Bay, but also spends a
lot of time in Panama on a rural farm. He spends his spare time pursuing
unusual hobbies, such as bull riding, surfing, and more recently,
supporting a women’s flat track roller derby team. He also rides
motorcycles, does metal work, and has an avid interest in sustainability.
An early adopter of Tor, Terry believes strongly in the right to privacy
and the free and open access to knowledge as an equalizer.

With the COO position, we will be organizing our HR and Finance teams to
report to Terry. Garfield will continue as the CFO for the organization, a
member of the C-level team, and Treasurer of the Board. His roles and
responsibilities will remain unchanged, reporting to Terry. Terry and
Garfield will manage all financial and business planning activities and are
already making progress together. We’ll introduce Terry properly with a
short Q&A at the April metrics meeting.

It is with sadness that I report to you that Gayle Karen Young, Chief
Talent and Culture Officer has decided move onto her next adventure. Gayle
let me know she has been looking to move on some time ago, and she felt
this was the right moment in time. In her three and a half years within the
Foundation, she has made a tremendous impact creating a HR department that
is fundamentally about caring for the people in the organization and
offering services that allow people to do their best work, which has
supported our mission to help our communities thrive and curate knowledge.
While we will miss her wisdom and warmth, we thank her for her leadership
and celebrate her future adventures. HR will report directly to Terry at
this time.

Our purpose is to help Wikimedians around the world make the sum of all
knowledge available to everyone. We believe these changes, effective
immediately, will help us focus on our continued service to our community
and readers, and progress toward this mission.

Please join me in welcoming Terry as the newest member of our leadership
team and wishing Gayle well.  We have much exciting work in 2015, and I’m
looking forward to all the great things we will accomplish as we work
together to support our vision.

Lila
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] 2015 Strategy/Community consultation on the "Wikipedia for children" idea

[Mathias Damour]

Le 18/03/2015 15:02, Amir E. Aharoni a écrit :

Both were printed in Russian in the Soviet Union, so they also had, um,
ideological adaptations, which I was smart enough to spot (yay for me), but
the reason I loved it is that it had large illustrations, clear and large
font and engaging language. It doesn't mean that the articles were short,
for example - some of them were several pages long. It just means that it
was well-adapted.

I don't know how to create a new thing that would do his well. Maybe some
consultation from education experts would be good. And these would have to
come from different cultures - again, not fot censorship, but for better
adaptation. Children in Arab countries won't necessarily be engaged by the
same things as children in France, and children in Russia won't necessarily
love the illustration style enjoyed by children in Argentina.


Thanks for backing up the idea, yet it's not like nothing would have 
been done to that day.
The method was nearly simply to pick up the method of Wikipedia, and 
gather contributors of all ages just as Wikipedia gather contributors of 
all educational backgrounds/levels. They is also some "progressive 
education" ideas behind this functioning. Actually they didn't give a 
method, but rather just made us think or know that it was feasible with 
and for children.
The result you can get an idea by this Google Trends on Wikibooks, 
Commons, Wikiversity, Wikisource and Vikidia in France or Wikibooks, 
Commons, Wikiversity, Wikisource und Wikikids in the Netherlands:

http://www.google.com/trends/explore?q=wikibooks%2C%20commons%2C%20wiktionary%2C%20wikisource%2C%20vikidia&geo=FR
http://www.google.com/trends/explore?q=wikibooks%2C%20commons%2C%20wiktionary%2C%20wikisource%2C%20wikikids&geo=NL
But it took more than 8 years.

More on 
http://blog.wikimedia.fr/vikidia-in-english-opens-today-lets-build-a-children-wiki-encyclopedia-6400


--
Mathias Damour
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Astirmays
https://fr.vikidia.org/wiki/Utilisateur:Astirmays

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] 2015 Strategy/Community consultation on the "Wikipedia for children" idea

[Mathias Damour]

Le 18/03/2015 16:23, David Gerard a écrit :
http://schools-wikipedia.org does most of the job. And teachers LOVE 
it. We should give this project more love and assistance, it's 
basically the refutation of all attempts to, er, filter the base product.


Teachers love it, what about children?

Le 18/03/2015 16:51, Marc A. Pelletier a écrit :

On 15-03-18 11:23 AM, David Gerard wrote:

We should give this project more love and assistance, it's
basically the refutation of all attempts to, er, filter the base
product.

I agree.  Whenever a group of people decide to curate some subset of our
projects with an eye towards their needs, then I count it as a win (even
in the cases where I would object to the curation choices myself).


The fact is it is "just" a set of curated (and choosen) Wikipedia 
articles. What if they are still mostly too complicated ?


Le 18/03/2015 17:33, David Gerard a écrit :

On 18 March 2015 at 15:51, Marc A. Pelletier  wrote:


What irks me is the idea of giving imprimatur to something "we" curate,
or to do any sort of curation "ourselves" (that is, the movement or the
Foundation).  "All the knowledge" means "All", not "some subset thereof".

In the case of Schools Wikipedia, it's worked quite well - the
editorial review heavy lifting was substantially done by en:wp
volunteers. They specifically approached it as "what would we expect
in an English school situation?" though it was intended for use
outside the UK (they just used the English National Curriculum as
their guide).


Should children be only allowed to be interested to their school 
curriculum? There is so much subjects to be interested in and to learn 
about.


Le 18/03/2015 17:38, David Gerard a écrit :

On 18 March 2015 at 16:07, Richard Symonds
 wrote:


Indeed. http://schools-wikipedia.org is already used around the world -
it's a great example of what can be done if Wikimedians work with (even
passively with) other orgs.

Everyone likes it, not many are coming forward to lead the ongoing
update cycle since User:Bozmo left SOS Children (the charity who put
it together). (And I'm not volunteering.) Not sure what to do about
that.


Well I suggest to do it on a full new open wiki, to use the Simple 
English Wikipedia content when it fits, to promote the translation of 
already made good work on other languages equivalent of such a wiki, and 
to allow fully new articles to be written and bettered.


Yet even the Simple English Wikipedia article are not always the best 
content to have. You may compare:

https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_United_States
https://en.vikidia.org/wiki/History_of_the_USA , written in the last few 
month by a eleven years old "vikidian" (however a quite experienced user)
and... I can't find it on schools-wikipedia.org, there is just 
http://schools-wikipedia.org/wp/u/United_States.htm
I wonder how would someone curate the 168,391 bytes 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_United_States to make it 
fit to school children.
And here is how we can "curate", that's to say rewrite a few parts and 
add some images, an article from Simple English Wikipedia : 
https://en.vikidia.org/w/index.php?title=Roman_house&diff=76306&oldid=28149


--
Mathias Damour
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Astirmays
https://fr.vikidia.org/wiki/Utilisateur:Astirmays

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] 2015 Strategy/Community consultation on the "Wikipedia for children" idea

[Mathias Damour]

Le 18/03/2015 13:59, Marc A. Pelletier a écrit :

On 15-03-18 03:09 AM, Mathias Damour wrote:

[from the Convention on the Rights of the Child]
"[...] this right shall include freedom to seek, receive and impart
information and ideas of all kinds"

Interestingly enough, to me this reads /against/ the idea of a
"Wikipedia for Kids" insofar as the intent is to curate, limit, or
restrict the encyclopedia to material or language "apropriate" for children.


I really don't see your point. Children and older contributors can 
perfectly understand and comprehend that the the content must be 
appropriate for children, just as (and additionaly) it as to be 
encyclopedic content and respect the NPOV. They can go somewhere else 
for another kind of content. When they are on such a wiki for some time, 
they often are the most active defenders of its principles and rules.



For instance, would a Russian Kids' Wikipedia carefully avoid "promotion
of homosexuality" as their law now demands (to pick one salient example
amongst thousands).


There is not thousands examples, this kind af question is definitely not 
a day-to-day issue on Vikidia in French. There is so much to write on 
other subjects.


Le 18/03/2015 14:22, Fæ a écrit :

On 18 March 2015 at 12:59, Marc A. Pelletier  wrote:

For instance, would a Russian Kids' Wikipedia carefully avoid "promotion
of homosexuality" as their law now demands (to pick one salient example
amongst thousands).

Yes it would.

Though this has been bounced about as a project for many years, with a
few reasonable examples being implemented (invariably having issues
for long term maintenance), it is a difficult and debatable business.
The topic of LGBT is a good test, as making educational materials
available to children addressing sexuality and gender is always
controversial, and at the same time there is no doubt that it is
needed.


Where did you hear about such project "having issues for long term 
maintenance" ?
The main issue some (not all) of these projects have is just a very 
common one : to gather a significant community.
I must say we don't have enough content on sexuality on fr.vikidia (in 
my opinion) yet the controversies on those subjects are not no frequent. 
I remember one about the content on the article "Masturbation", some 
wanting it to remain vague and allusive, some other ones wanting it more 
informative. That's not such a big deal.


By the way, there is a frequent asked questions/Questions and answers on:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikikids/Questions_and_answers

--
Mathias Damour
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Astirmays
https://fr.vikidia.org/wiki/Utilisateur:Astirmays

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] 2015 Strategy/Community consultation on the "Wikipedia for children" idea

[David Gerard]

On 18 March 2015 at 16:07, Richard Symonds
 wrote:

> Indeed. http://schools-wikipedia.org is already used around the world -
> it's a great example of what can be done if Wikimedians work with (even
> passively with) other orgs.


Everyone likes it, not many are coming forward to lead the ongoing
update cycle since User:Bozmo left SOS Children (the charity who put
it together). (And I'm not volunteering.) Not sure what to do about
that.


- d.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Announcement: WMF to file suit against the NSA

[Andreas Kolbe]

On Wed, Mar 18, 2015 at 1:17 PM, Thyge  wrote:

> I do not think that WMF's filing a suit against NSA should be a starting
> point for demanding the WMF to cure all the evils of the World, political
> or otherwise.
>


Well, not all the evils of the world, obviously. :) But there is certainly
precedent for the Foundation tackling problems in Wikipedia itself. Recall
past board resolutions on BLP matters, for example.



> Even handling the recognized problems of some minor Wikipedias fall
> outside the scope of the WMF.
>


Isn't it in the Foundation's long-term interest though? I can't imagine
donors being overly happy if a part of their money ends up supporting
projects whose function is in any way similar to that of Pravda in the
Soviet era.



> Wikipedia is the Encyclopedia anyone can edit - except the WMF!
> (if they want to uphold their status as service provider).
>


I don't recall suggesting that WMF edit those Wikipedias. I suggested that
they collaborate with human rights organizations to monitor status, and
report on it as part of their stewardship of the Wikipedia project. Is
there anything wrong with that idea?
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] SUL finalization update (no, for real this time)

[Fæ]

Correction. This link lists backwards from "Fae" but misses out "Fae":
https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:UsersWhoWillBeRenamed&dir=prev&offset=Fae

This link lists forwards from "Fae" but again misses out "Fae"!:
https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:UsersWhoWillBeRenamed&offset=Fae

So yes, you can guess which name might be just before the name you are
actually searching for, or wait until this special page is debugged. I
suspect there was not much testing of it before the notices went out.

Fae

On 18 March 2015 at 15:27, Fæ  wrote:
> If anyone wishes to check a name, they can use "offset". For example
> this url checks to see if the account "Fae" is going to be affected:
> https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:UsersWhoWillBeRenamed&dir=prev&offset=Fae
>
> Just change the name at the end of the link.
>
> However I note some issues. If you miss out the "dir" parameter, then
> the list seems to start *after* your index point, missing out the name
> searched for:
> https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:UsersWhoWillBeRenamed&offset=Wikilover
> does not start at "Wikilover" as you might expect, but it is shown by
> https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:UsersWhoWillBeRenamed&offset=Wikilove
>
> P.S. the parameter "limit" does not seem to make any difference as it
> does not change the list from a default of 25 accounts.
>
> Fae
>
> On 18 March 2015 at 15:11, Dennis During  wrote:
>> Thanks for moving this close to completion.  I hope finalization goes well.
>>
>> However, It found Special:UsersWhoWillBeRenamed totally useless at
>> Wiktionary, as I'm sure it is at any mature project.  Only 25 names appear
>> at time. On Wiktionary the first page only includes names using exclusively
>> exclamation marks.  It takes several pageforwards to get to the first "A".
>> It is not searchable.  There is not even a count of how many there are in
>> total.
>>
>> I'm not sure why the list is provided.  What is a use case for it?
>>
>> It would be useful for those reviewing entries (articles) to have lists of
>> old and new names for contributors (with unreverted contributions) so as to
>> take advantage of hard-won knowledge about typical user contribution
>> quality, etc.  Are there plans for this?
> 
>
> --
> fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] 2015 Strategy/Community consultation on the "Wikipedia for children" idea

[David Gerard]

On 18 March 2015 at 14:02, Amir E. Aharoni  wrote:

> But TLDR - a Wikpedia *adapted* for children is a good idea.


http://schools-wikipedia.org does most of the job. And teachers LOVE
it. We should give this project more love and assistance, it's
basically the refutation of all attempts to, er, filter the base
product.


- d.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] SUL finalization update (no, for real this time)

[Dennis During]

Thanks for moving this close to completion.  I hope finalization goes well.

However, It found Special:UsersWhoWillBeRenamed totally useless at
Wiktionary, as I'm sure it is at any mature project.  Only 25 names appear
at time. On Wiktionary the first page only includes names using exclusively
exclamation marks.  It takes several pageforwards to get to the first "A".
It is not searchable.  There is not even a count of how many there are in
total.

I'm not sure why the list is provided.  What is a use case for it?

It would be useful for those reviewing entries (articles) to have lists of
old and new names for contributors (with unreverted contributions) so as to
take advantage of hard-won knowledge about typical user contribution
quality, etc.  Are there plans for this?



On Wed, Mar 18, 2015 at 2:05 AM, Keegan Peterzell 
wrote:

> On Wed, Mar 18, 2015 at 1:00 AM, Pine W  wrote:
>
> > Hi Keegan,
> >
> > Just a thought: you could invite WMFers to have SUL finalization parties
> > during a few lunch hours. Invite people out of their silos to work with
> you
> > and interact with the community to answer account-owner FAQs, translate
> the
> > Q&A, and interact with WMF's "customers". While this is a little
> different
> > from face-time, I still think that some of the 1:1 interaction would be
> > nice for everybody while helping move the SUL process along.
> >
> > Thanks for working on SUL.
> >
> > Pine
>
>
> Not a bad idea at all. I'll look into it, the prime time is this week and
> next, the expected response curve will likely drop sharply. Thanks, Pine :)
>
> --
> Keegan Peterzell
> Community Liaison, Product
> Wikimedia Foundation
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>



-- 
Dennis C. During
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] 2015 Strategy/Community consultation on the "Wikipedia for children" idea

[Amir E. Aharoni]

I'd be the most vocal opponent of an encyclopedia *censored* for children.

But I would be a very vocal proponent of an encyclopedia *adapted* for
children. Not by dumbing it down and not by removing information that some
cultures, religions or governments consider immoral or
mature-audiences-only, but by rewriting the information in a way that
children will find interesting and easy - indeed, possible - to learn.

When I grew up in Moscow, I had an encyclopedia for children at home. I
liked the pictures, but I didn't read a lot of the text - it was for older
children, 14 and more. But I had an aunt who had another encyclopedia for
younger children, and every time I visited that aunt, I spent most of time
at her home reading that encyclopedia. I learned a lot of what I know from
it, and I got my love for encyclopedias in general from it.

Both were printed in Russian in the Soviet Union, so they also had, um,
ideological adaptations, which I was smart enough to spot (yay for me), but
the reason I loved it is that it had large illustrations, clear and large
font and engaging language. It doesn't mean that the articles were short,
for example - some of them were several pages long. It just means that it
was well-adapted.

I don't know how to create a new thing that would do his well. Maybe some
consultation from education experts would be good. And these would have to
come from different cultures - again, not fot censorship, but for better
adaptation. Children in Arab countries won't necessarily be engaged by the
same things as children in France, and children in Russia won't necessarily
love the illustration style enjoyed by children in Argentina.

But TLDR - a Wikpedia *adapted* for children is a good idea.


--
Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
http://aharoni.wordpress.com
‪“We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬

2015-03-18 14:59 GMT+02:00 Marc A. Pelletier :

> On 15-03-18 03:09 AM, Mathias Damour wrote:
> > [from the Convention on the Rights of the Child]
> > "[...] this right shall include freedom to seek, receive and impart
> > information and ideas of all kinds"
>
> Interestingly enough, to me this reads /against/ the idea of a
> "Wikipedia for Kids" insofar as the intent is to curate, limit, or
> restrict the encyclopedia to material or language "apropriate" for
> children.
>
> For instance, would a Russian Kids' Wikipedia carefully avoid "promotion
> of homosexuality" as their law now demands (to pick one salient example
> amongst thousands).
>
> -- Marc
>
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] 2015 Strategy/Community consultation on the "Wikipedia for children" idea

[Fæ]

On 18 March 2015 at 12:59, Marc A. Pelletier  wrote:
> For instance, would a Russian Kids' Wikipedia carefully avoid "promotion
> of homosexuality" as their law now demands (to pick one salient example
> amongst thousands).

Yes it would.

Though this has been bounced about as a project for many years, with a
few reasonable examples being implemented (invariably having issues
for long term maintenance), it is a difficult and debatable business.
The topic of LGBT is a good test, as making educational materials
available to children addressing sexuality and gender is always
controversial, and at the same time there is no doubt that it is
needed.

P.S. The Wellcome Collection in London has a free, year long,
exhibition on sexology. Worth dropping in and pondering how this type
of educational material can or should be made available to children
and young adults via open knowledge.
http://wellcomecollection.org/events/stt-tour-institute-sexology

Fae
-- 
fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Announcement: WMF to file suit against the NSA

[Thyge]

I do not think that WMF's filing a suit against NSA should be a starting
point for demanding the WMF to cure all the evils of the World, political
or otherwise
.
Even handling the recognized problems of some minor Wikipedias fall outside
the scope of the WMF.

Wikipedia is the Encyclopedia anyone can edit - except the WMF!
(if they want to uphold their status as service provider).

Regards,
Thyge

2015-03-18 14:03 GMT+01:00 Andreas Kolbe :

> On Sun, Mar 15, 2015 at 11:55 PM, Andreas Kolbe 
> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Mar 15, 2015 at 10:14 PM, Andreas Kolbe 
> > wrote:
> >
> >> On Sun, Mar 15, 2015 at 5:53 PM, phoebe ayers 
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>> What other unfortunate laws are
> >>> happening elsewhere in the world and how do we track and maybe act on
> >>> those?
> >>
> >>
> >
> > Here is a concrete suggestion:
> >
> > Reach out to the most reputable human rights organisations.
> >
> > Starting with the countries at the bottom of the press freedom league
> > table, have the human rights organisations form working groups to assess
> > the relevant Wikipedia language versions for their coverage of the human
> > rights situation in the countries they serve.
> >
> > If a working group finds that a Wikipedia language version does not
> > accurately reflect the government's human rights record, issue a public
> > warning that – in the human rights organisations' opinion – the Wikipedia
> > in question appears to be subject to undue political manipulation.
> >
> > Provide funding for this work. Ensure high visibility for the resulting
> > reports. Ideally, place a superprotected link to the report in the
> > Wikipedia itself.
> >
> > This will increase the chances that the content will be accurate, while
> > relieving pressure on activists in the countries concerned.
> >
> > Think of it as a "Wikipedia freedom index."
> >
>
>
>
> One more case to illustrate the need.
>
> Human Rights Watch summarizes the situation in Uzbekistan[1] as follows:
>
> ---o0o---
>
> Uzbekistan’s human rights record is atrocious. Torture is endemic in the
> criminal justice system. Authorities intensified their crackdown on civil
> society activists, opposition members, and journalists. Muslims and
> Christians who practice their religion outside strict state controls are
> persecuted, and freedom of expression is severely limited. The government
> forces more than one million adults and children to harvest cotton under
> abusive conditions. Authorities still deny justice for the 2005 Andijan
> massacre, in which government forces shot and killed hundreds of
> protesters, most of them unarmed. Despite this, the United States and
> European Union continue to advance closer relations with Uzbekistan,
> seeking cooperation with the war in Afghanistan.
>
> ---o0o---
>
> Here is the biography of Uzbekistan's president in the Uzbek Wikipedia, as
> translated by Google:
>
>
> https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=https%3A%2F%2Fuz.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FIslom_Karimov&edit-text=
>
> Even from this broken translation, it is quite evident that this is another
> hagiography, devoid of any hint of criticism. Here are some samples:
>
> ---o0o---
>
> ... a well-thought-out program to build the country's economic foundation
> ...
>
> Karimov initiative promoting global policy is always the best ideas in the
> world, regardless of their point of view, it is known as a person who can
> achieve the desired goal. He has been committed to peace and unity policy.
>
> Karimov new residential construction, including a great step-by Jolanda
> prosperity of our ancestors, plays an important role in the implementation
> of the economic capacity to build large enterprises, cities, towns, and
> above all, a radical transformation of the capital, Tashkent,
> <
> https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&ie=UTF8&prev=_t&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&tl=en&u=https://uz.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toshkent&usg=ALkJrhguDlungYjoz2D8dUf12x2v7u6qjA
> >
> supervises
> the work.
>
> Karimov to establish an independent state and a democratic civil society
> based on the construction of the new century, the main directions of
> development of the country has developed into a bright future in the way of
> the people, it is the great goals.
>
> ---o0o---
>
> The English Wikipedia biography of the president[2] mentions dissidents
> being boiled alive.
>
> Peter Hitchens wrote about this some years ago, in an article titled "Our
> new best friends boil dissidents alive".[3]
>
> Kazakhstan, Azerbaijan and Uzbekistan were among the countries represented
> at the "Turkic Wikimedia Conference 2012", which according to the
> documentation on Meta[4] was coordinated by "Wikipedian of the Year"
> winners Wikibilim, and financially supported by the Wikimedia Foundation.
>
>
>
> [1] http://www.hrw.org/europecentral-asia/uzbekistan
> [2]
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_Karimov#Human_rights_and_press_freedom
> [3

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Announcement: WMF to file suit against the NSA

[Andreas Kolbe]

On Sun, Mar 15, 2015 at 11:55 PM, Andreas Kolbe  wrote:

>
>
> On Sun, Mar 15, 2015 at 10:14 PM, Andreas Kolbe 
> wrote:
>
>> On Sun, Mar 15, 2015 at 5:53 PM, phoebe ayers 
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> What other unfortunate laws are
>>> happening elsewhere in the world and how do we track and maybe act on
>>> those?
>>
>>
>
> Here is a concrete suggestion:
>
> Reach out to the most reputable human rights organisations.
>
> Starting with the countries at the bottom of the press freedom league
> table, have the human rights organisations form working groups to assess
> the relevant Wikipedia language versions for their coverage of the human
> rights situation in the countries they serve.
>
> If a working group finds that a Wikipedia language version does not
> accurately reflect the government's human rights record, issue a public
> warning that – in the human rights organisations' opinion – the Wikipedia
> in question appears to be subject to undue political manipulation.
>
> Provide funding for this work. Ensure high visibility for the resulting
> reports. Ideally, place a superprotected link to the report in the
> Wikipedia itself.
>
> This will increase the chances that the content will be accurate, while
> relieving pressure on activists in the countries concerned.
>
> Think of it as a "Wikipedia freedom index."
>



One more case to illustrate the need.

Human Rights Watch summarizes the situation in Uzbekistan[1] as follows:

---o0o---

Uzbekistan’s human rights record is atrocious. Torture is endemic in the
criminal justice system. Authorities intensified their crackdown on civil
society activists, opposition members, and journalists. Muslims and
Christians who practice their religion outside strict state controls are
persecuted, and freedom of expression is severely limited. The government
forces more than one million adults and children to harvest cotton under
abusive conditions. Authorities still deny justice for the 2005 Andijan
massacre, in which government forces shot and killed hundreds of
protesters, most of them unarmed. Despite this, the United States and
European Union continue to advance closer relations with Uzbekistan,
seeking cooperation with the war in Afghanistan.

---o0o---

Here is the biography of Uzbekistan's president in the Uzbek Wikipedia, as
translated by Google:

https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=https%3A%2F%2Fuz.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FIslom_Karimov&edit-text=

Even from this broken translation, it is quite evident that this is another
hagiography, devoid of any hint of criticism. Here are some samples:

---o0o---

... a well-thought-out program to build the country's economic foundation
...

Karimov initiative promoting global policy is always the best ideas in the
world, regardless of their point of view, it is known as a person who can
achieve the desired goal. He has been committed to peace and unity policy.

Karimov new residential construction, including a great step-by Jolanda
prosperity of our ancestors, plays an important role in the implementation
of the economic capacity to build large enterprises, cities, towns, and
above all, a radical transformation of the capital, Tashkent,

supervises
the work.

Karimov to establish an independent state and a democratic civil society
based on the construction of the new century, the main directions of
development of the country has developed into a bright future in the way of
the people, it is the great goals.

---o0o---

The English Wikipedia biography of the president[2] mentions dissidents
being boiled alive.

Peter Hitchens wrote about this some years ago, in an article titled "Our
new best friends boil dissidents alive".[3]

Kazakhstan, Azerbaijan and Uzbekistan were among the countries represented
at the "Turkic Wikimedia Conference 2012", which according to the
documentation on Meta[4] was coordinated by "Wikipedian of the Year"
winners Wikibilim, and financially supported by the Wikimedia Foundation.



[1] http://www.hrw.org/europecentral-asia/uzbekistan
[2]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_Karimov#Human_rights_and_press_freedom
[3]
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/columnists/article-228241/Our-new-best-friends-boil-dissidents-alive.html
[4] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Turkic_Wikimedia_Conference_2012
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] 2015 Strategy/Community consultation on the "Wikipedia for children" idea

[Marc A. Pelletier]

On 15-03-18 03:09 AM, Mathias Damour wrote:
> [from the Convention on the Rights of the Child]
> "[...] this right shall include freedom to seek, receive and impart
> information and ideas of all kinds"

Interestingly enough, to me this reads /against/ the idea of a
"Wikipedia for Kids" insofar as the intent is to curate, limit, or
restrict the encyclopedia to material or language "apropriate" for children.

For instance, would a Russian Kids' Wikipedia carefully avoid "promotion
of homosexuality" as their law now demands (to pick one salient example
amongst thousands).

-- Marc


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] 2015 Strategy/Community consultation on the "Wikipedia for children" idea

[Mathias Damour]

Le 18/03/2015 02:32, Samuel Klein a écrit :

Thanks for summarizing this, Mathias.  I love the work that has been done
so far on Wikikids, and think WMF should think about creative ways to make
such projects successful.  Gathering knowledge for all audiences requires
simpler language than most wikipedias have; and building a culture of
contribution works best when there are ways for young people to contribute
and collaborate.


Sure, I noted that the an article of the 1989 "Convention on the Rights 
of the Child" looks very closed to the Wikimedia vision and mission 
statements:
"Article 13 - 1. The child shall have the right to freedom of 
expression; this right shall include freedom to seek, receive and impart 
information and ideas of all kinds, regardless of frontiers, either 
orally, in writing or in print, in the form of art, or through any other 
media of the child's choice."



I don't know if it will work as a WM-hosted project, under the current
system. This depends on whether we become more flexible in creating new and
independent communities.  But we should consider all of the ways to realize
our mission, including through partners whose tools & policies &
contributor networks look very different.


The policy on Wikikids/Vikidia is very closed to the one of Wikipedia, 
the novelty being just to acknowledge it could be implemented to 
children content and contributions.


On tools I fully agree with you : for example I think that with some 
data mining in existing "simple" content (Simple English Wikipedia, 
Vikidia and Wikikids and others) to point out the best quality/fitting, 
most usefull, most needed contents and articles, and then 
translation/adaptation from one another of those pointed out content, 
with the help of other tools and communities (such as Duolingo), we 
could greatly develop the content of those existing or to come wikis.

That's only my ideas on the subject by the way.


On Tue, Mar 17, 2015 at 8:56 PM, Mathias Damour 
wrote:


Hi,

They were quite a few expressed thoughts on the 2015 Strategy - Community
consultation that raised in a way or another the idea of a "Wikipedia for
children". I've made some excerpt of them on the following page :
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikikids/Excerpt_from_
the_2015_Strategy/Community_consultation

It actually does exist and are thriving in some languages (especially in
Dutch and French, and we actually worked for a while on [[m:Wikikids]]),
however they seem to be also some rampant objections. The WMF may not be
the most suited organization to host and promote such wikis, is it?



--
Mathias Damour
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Astirmays
https://fr.vikidia.org/wiki/Utilisateur:Astirmays

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