Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] Wiki Loves Monuments 2013
Hi Lodewijk, As far as I can tell, no one is currently working on it but I can take it up plus anyone else that’s interested. Last year, we were to get an extra camera [or was it two?] but we never received them. We only have one camera that we used last year. I think this year we can aggressively market the project in colleges and universities [buy putting up posters] and also the social media. Sent from Windows Mail From: Lodewijk Sent: Monday, May 27, 2013 10:01 PM To: The discussion list for the upcoming Wikimedia Kenya chapter. Hi all, Is anyone currently working on organizing Wiki Loves Monuments 2013 in Kenya? Will Kenya join the contest again? Please let me know asap if there is any way how we can help. Lodewijk___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] visit to Kenya
Hi,i'm currently trying to work on having a meetup, possibly on 13th. You are welcome to join us. dennis. From: raidar...@gmail.com Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2013 11:00:55 +0300 To: wikimediake@lists.wikimedia.org CC: johanna.havem...@gmail.com; wikimediake@lists.wikimedia.org Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] visit to Kenya Hi, Would also love to meet and chat. David. Sent from my iPad On Apr 3, 2013, at 9:51 AM, Limoke Oscar oslim...@gmail.com wrote: Hello Johanna, I would be glad to meet up and chat. Perhaps at iHub? Look forward to seeing you too. Anything special you would like to know/see to allow us to prepare? Regards, On Sat, Mar 30, 2013 at 9:41 PM, Johanna Havemann johanna.havem...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Kenyan Wikimedians, my name is Johanna, I've been working in the German Wikimedia office for a couple of months and will be in Kenya from 10 April to 4 May. It would be great if some of you would find time to meet. Anything else you'd like to know - just ask :) Looking forward to meeting you /jo. Johanna Havemann, Dr. Editor at African Perspectives Facilitator to the UN Indigenous Youth Caucus E: johanna.havem...@gmail.com M: +49 176 22 88 24 37 W: http://africanperspectivesblog.wordpress.com/ LinkedIn: http://de.linkedin.com/in/johavemann Skype: jo79hanna ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake -- Limoke Oscar GIS, Google Apps Business Development Certfied Google Apps EDU Specialist Pawa IT Solutions Limitedwww.pawait.co.ke http://www.packtpub.com/google-map-maker-starter/book ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
[Wikimedia Kenya] meetup
Hi all,I was thinking that we could have our first meetup on Saturday, 13th April. How many of you will be able to make it? dennis___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] Meetup
Hi Oliver,We are meant to have a meetup this month, probably on 30th.. i'm currently working on it. I'll be sure to get back to you all as soon as i have everything ready. dennis. From: i...@oliverstegen.net To: wikimediake@lists.wikimedia.org Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2013 09:23:22 +0300 Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] Fwd: [Wikimania-l] Wikimania 2014: Officialbid list +1 Any meetings of our group on the horizon? Either RL or virtual/online? With continued hope and best wishes for Wikimedia in East Africa, BT -Original Message- From: Samuel Klein [mailto:meta...@gmail.com] Sent: 18 March 2013 20:57 To: The discussion list for the Wikimedia Kenya chapter. Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] Fwd: [Wikimania-l] Wikimania 2014: Officialbid list On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 1:49 PM, Asaf Bartov abar...@wikimedia.org wrote: On Sun, Mar 17, 2013 at 11:37 PM, Limoke Oscar oslim...@gmail.com wrote: I don't think it's a shame, and shouldn't be a pain: organizing a bid is a lot of work, but is almost purely on-wiki, and can be done by one or two Anyhow, we should all be happy for our Tanzanian colleagues for having found the initiative and energy to do this. It's not a competition. :) Yes. You might even try working with them to organize a shared regional event, if their bid for Wikimania itself doesn't work out. They clearly have a lot of energy for bringing people and speakers together around Wikimedia topics. Like I said in my more formal letter, you must not look upon the expiration of the provisional recognition as a blow or as a failure -- it was merely a deadline expiring, for a formal process that doesn't actually matter as much as it used to, because we now have these new affiliation models, which would have been more suitable in the first place, had they existed at the time. Yes. And once you have some projects underway, if they start to grow, you may always reapply to become a Chapter. SJ ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] From chapter to user group
I cannot think of a better name than Wikimedians in Kenya. Dennis. Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 09:18:36 +0300 From: wanjaus...@gmail.com To: wikimediake@lists.wikimedia.org Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] From chapter to user group Salute! To align the Wikimedians in Kenya to it is current state, the social media accounts should as well be renamed to the new name. What has been settled on as the new name? .S On 03/12/2013 02:51 PM, Oliver Stegen wrote: Thanks for this cautious and tentative initiative. I continue to be active as a Wikimedian (cf. http://toolserver.org/~purodha/sample/dbswithuser.php?usr=Baba_Tabitago=Go!uselang=en) and I am based in Kenya, so that presumably makes me a … Wikimedian in Kenya J Yours for making the sum of human knowledge available to everyone on this planet (and in my case, especially to everyone in the Swahili-speaking communities), BT (aka Oliver) From: dennis munene [mailto:deontemun...@hotmail.com] Sent: 12 March 2013 12:13 To: Wikimedia Kenya Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] From chapter to user group hi, I agree with Oscar, we were our own let down. Being a User Group should not in any way dwindle our commitment. You can count me in as part of the User Group [Wikimedians in Kenya?] :) dennis. From: oslim...@gmail.com Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 11:38:04 +0300 To: wikimediake@lists.wikimedia.org Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] From chapter to user group Hi All, I know all of us have been absorbing and digesting this news over the past couple of weeks. I think its time we now discussed and forged a way forward. True we were our own let down in many ways. We failed in many ways to steer ourselves to full registration 12 months after being granted charter. We failed to get legal registration locally and we failed to manage the 1st Start up grant for our Chapter. We failed to resolve issues surrounding the embezzlement and we refused to take responsibility I think Sue and Asaf are justified to deny us further recognition. So I guess its a User group we are. As such, we need to start to chat a way forward along this line. Could we start taking a new call for this user group? Remember, Officially Wikimedia Kenya Chapter is no more If you would want to join and be apart of this user group, please let us start a conversation Only if you are interested
Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] From chapter to user group
hi,I agree with Oscar, we were our own let down. Being a User Group should not in any way dwindle our commitment. You can count me in as part of the User Group [Wikimedians in Kenya?] :) dennis. From: oslim...@gmail.com Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 11:38:04 +0300 To: wikimediake@lists.wikimedia.org Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] From chapter to user group Hi All, I know all of us have been absorbing and digesting this news over the past couple of weeks. I think its time we now discussed and forged a way forward. True we were our own let down in many ways. We failed in many ways to steer ourselves to full registration 12 months after being granted charter. We failed to get legal registration locally and we failed to manage the 1st Start up grant for our Chapter. We failed to resolve issues surrounding the embezzlement and we refused to take responsibility I think Sue and Asaf are justified to deny us further recognition. So I guess its a User group we are. As such, we need to start to chat a way forward along this line. Could we start taking a new call for this user group? Remember, Officially Wikimedia Kenya Chapter is no more If you would want to join and be apart of this user group, please let us start a conversation Only if you are interested. Look forward to this new course. Best, On Fri, Mar 1, 2013 at 2:37 AM, Asaf Bartov abar...@wikimedia.org wrote: Dear colleagues in Kenya, I would like to let you know that (after consultation with the Affiliations Committee) the Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director, Sue Gardner, is not extending the Board of Trustees' provisional recognition of your group as Wikimedia Kenya. We recommend you pursue recognition as Wikimedia User Group instead. The recognition was conditional upon incorporation within a year, and that has not happened. In addition, the provisional board disintegrated (with some people leaving the chapter entirely) and no replacement announced, almost no activity took place this past year, casting doubt on the group's sustainability as a chapter, and certain personal issues added much confusion and demoralization, which no doubt contributed to the inactivity. In parallel, the Wikimedia movement has created new models of affiliation, not available at the time your group was seeking recognition, that we are confident would better serve your group at this stage, and would be more appropriate, than the traditional incorporated chapter model. Specifically, we encourage you to seek Wikimedia User Group recognition (via AffCom -- e-mail aff...@lists.wikimedia.org) right now, which will give you almost all the benefits of chapter recognition, with almost none of the bureaucracy: trademark permission will be available to you, and as you know, grants are always available, even to unincorporated groups (and we will take steps to improve group oversight and governance to minimize risk). Everything I know about this group and about AffCom suggests this should be a smooth process. Note that this does mean that the name Wikimedia Kenya should no longer be used by you or others to refer to your group, and specifically, that you are not to incorporate under that name. (It is best if incorporation under any name is postponed until there's a better idea of the group's interest, capacity, and plans. Creating a formal entity prematurely could saddle you with inconvenient responsibilities without any of the benefits.) Wikimedians in Kenya, Friends of Wikipedia in Kenya, and any number of other names you may feel comfortable with, are good possibilities for the name of your group, and can be recognized by the WMF if you do choose to pursue User Group recognition. We'd like to stress this is neither a punishment nor a demotion of your group; it is actually an adjustment of what we call the group to match reality and to adhere to the original terms of the provisional recognition. We recognize your dedicated and valuable contributions in the past, and look forward to renewed energy and accomplishments on this new path, as a user group, and will be happy to support you in this in every way we can. On behalf of Sue Gardner and the Wikimedia Foundation, Asaf Bartov-- Asaf Bartov Wikimedia Foundation Imagine a world in which every single human being can freely share in the sum of all knowledge. Help us make it a reality!https://donate.wikimedia.org ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake -- Limoke Oscar GIS, Google Apps Business Development Pawa IT Solutions Limited ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake ___ WikimediaKE
Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] Themed Monthly Meetups
hi alex,15th february, a friday? Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2013 06:46:35 +0300 From: xelaw...@gmail.com To: wikimediake@lists.wikimedia.org Subject: [Wikimedia Kenya] Themed Monthly Meetups Hi all, I think we really had a good thing going with the monthly meetups. I'd suggest we resume with this and have every meetup geared towards aching a particular task eg: edits on specific topics, focus on commons etc We can have it ran by someone different every month, to make it participatory and exciting. Building from that, we haven't met this year so I'm usggesting a meetup for the 15th of Feb. Any takers...? Alex ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] Offline wikipedia - Kenyan syllabus
Asaf, hi, on the offline syllabus, we were to start a fresh using a list of topics for the various subjects that we were to get from the Kenya Institute of Education. It is on sale though for Ksh. 1,900 [roughly $22]. I personally have the time to work on the project. It could also be great to have an edit-a-thon. Plus we would get it done much faster that way. yours, Dennis. From: abar...@wikimedia.org Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2013 18:28:35 -0800 To: wikimediake@lists.wikimedia.org Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] Response to Bence Hi, everyone. To my mind, the way forward is to find a project at least some of you are excited about, rather than make progress on the formalities. That project can be anything at all -- organizing a regular meetup or edit-a-thon, a photowalk, finishing the school curriculum update project so we can produce a new offline Wikipedia file relevant for Kenya, etc. It seems to me that there is no substitute for a core of _active editors_, on either English[1] or Swahili Wikipedia[1]. That core would be the basis for most of the other activities. For example, it's difficult to have effective mass outreach if we can't connect newbies to _local_ editors with at least some experience and interest in tutoring and supporting them on their first steps, especially on the English Wikipedia which has very high standards that are challenging and confusing to newbies. So of the activities above, I would recommend thinking about ways to get _you_, the core volunteers, more motivated about, or more _comfortable_ with, actual editing. A first step would be to identify what is the main obstacle -- know-how, interesting topics to contribute on, access to source material, etc., and then we can all think about how to remove that obstacle. Another fun thing to try, if you can have meetups somewhere with reasonable bandwidth (on campus? at the iHub?), you can schedule a Skype/Hangout with different communities/chapters around to world to exchange experience and learn about exciting ideas from other groups. In my experience, it's a fun and interesting way to get [re-]motivated, and I'm sure a number of our international colleagues would be happy to be the teleconferenced guests at those meetings. Just my two cents. :) Asaf [1] English Wikipedia has about 35 active editors (5 edits a month or more) in Kenya. That's a good number to work with, but it seems to me (do correct me if I'm wrong) that most of those regular editors are outside this mailing list. If we could actually be reasonable certain we have some of those active editors interested in supporting additional editor recruitment, we'd be in good shape. Source: http://global-dev.wmflabs.org/graphs/enwp_ke_active (very slow load, sorry) [2] Swahil Wikipedia has about 3-4 active editors (5 edits a month or more) in Kenya, and about the same number in Tanzania. Source: http://global-dev.wmflabs.org/graphs/swwp_active (again, very slow) On Mon, Feb 4, 2013 at 5:48 AM, Limoke Oscar oslim...@gmail.com wrote: Hello Bence, Thanks for your efforts and conecrns about the Chapter. Indeed we have heard some concerted efforts to resuscitate the chapter and although not much has come out of the meetings, we all are commited to saving the face and rescuing of the once vibrant Chapter. We are still trying to figure out the best way . Perhaps restarting the whole membership thing has been mooted but nothing has come out yet. Would be best if we reassign new roles and ownershipsamongs ourselves to restart it. On Mon, Feb 4, 2013 at 2:15 PM, Bence Damokos bdamo...@gmail.com wrote: Hi guys, Sorry to bring up again, but it would be useful to know what others (e.g. Alex, Limoke, etc) think about the future of the chapter? Best regards, Bence On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 4:35 PM, Bence Damokos bdamo...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Abbas, Thanks for responding. For the record, Limoke also responded quite quickly (apparently my letter ended up in the spam folder of many). I was just about to reply Limoke that we would not want the efforts extended so far to go to waste, but we could only recommend the extension of recognition to Sue if there was some effort or plan in place to get the chapter together and back on track both in terms of the bureaucratic process of founding and as far as possible in having a strong, active community again. Best regards,Bence On Mon, Jan 28, 2013 at 8:54 PM, Abbas Mahmood abbas...@hotmail.com wrote: Dear Bence, (Sorry for the very delayed response: I had hoped that a more appropriate person would have made an ''official'' response.) WRT the Chapter founding, I recently (last week, I think) connected Alex with the lawyer, to resume the legal process, which was halted after the misappropriation saga. I don't expect Alex (and Alex can correct me if I'm wrong) to have made any progress thus far, as things are still
Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] Meetup
When is the meetup? -- Sent from my Nokia Phone -Original Message- From: Alex Wafula Sent: 10/8/2012 6:13:55 PM To: The discussion list for the Wikimedia Kenya chapter. Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] Meetup It's between the 13th and the 20th. I already updatrd the Doodle. Alex On Oct 8, 2012 3:30 PM, dennis munene deontemun...@hotmail.commailto:deontemun...@hotmail.com wrote: hi, there seems to be a bit of a mix up, are we voting between the 6th 13th or the 13th 20th? Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2012 13:31:01 +0300 From: xelaw...@gmail.commailto:xelaw...@gmail.com To: wikimediake@lists.wikimedia.orgmailto:wikimediake@lists.wikimedia.org Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] WMKE Financial Status Hi all, Thanks for sharing your views. I would like for us to have a physical meetup to deliberate on the next steps to follow regarding this matter. Please also do add to the agenda here: http://etherpad.wikimedia.org/wmke-meeting-10-2012 I've started a Doodle to get the best date for the meeting between the 6th and 13th of October, please go to the link and vote for a date(s): http://www.doodle.com/ufw3r64uaympbcke Don't forget to indicate your name. best, Alex On Sat, Oct 6, 2012 at 6:26 PM, Branton Obwari bruceobw...@gmail.commailto:bruceobw...@gmail.com wrote: Been following this issue for a while and i must say i have restrained myself from being judgmental , Steve, there is no justification for your actions whatsoever ,BUT your admission is a step in the right direction , We have learned our lesson albeit with a painful experience ,its a learning process WMKE will emerge stronger . I want to believe that if we had the structures in place ,the unfortunate incident will not have occurred ,i call upon WMKE members to rededicate themselves to the activities of this young chapter , to the board,registration of WMKE is long overdue ,an audit of the expenditure is required finally the issue of joint account . My regards! Bruce. ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.orgmailto:WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.orgmailto:WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.orgmailto:WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] Meetup
hi, there seems to be a bit of a mix up, are we voting between the 6th 13th or the 13th 20th?Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2012 13:31:01 +0300 From: xelaw...@gmail.com To: wikimediake@lists.wikimedia.org Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] WMKE Financial Status Hi all, Thanks for sharing your views. I would like for us to have a physical meetup to deliberate on the next steps to follow regarding this matter. Please also do add to the agenda here: http://etherpad.wikimedia.org/wmke-meeting-10-2012 I've started a Doodle to get the best date for the meeting between the 6th and 13th of October, please go to the link and vote for a date(s): http://www.doodle.com/ufw3r64uaympbcke Don't forget to indicate your name. best, Alex On Sat, Oct 6, 2012 at 6:26 PM, Branton Obwari bruceobw...@gmail.com wrote: Been following this issue for a while and i must say i have restrained myself from being judgmental , Steve, there is no justification for your actions whatsoever ,BUT your admission is a step in the right direction , We have learned our lesson albeit with a painful experience ,its a learning process WMKE will emerge stronger . I want to believe that if we had the structures in place ,the unfortunate incident will not have occurred ,i call upon WMKE members to rededicate themselves to the activities of this young chapter , to the board,registration of WMKE is long overdue ,an audit of the expenditure is required finally the issue of joint account . My regards! Bruce. ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] Offline wikipedia
thank you all for your help. From: oslim...@gmail.com Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2012 15:16:52 +0300 To: wikimediake@lists.wikimedia.org Subject: Re: [Wikimedia Kenya] Offline wikipedia Good work Dennis, 50DVDs? wow, congratulations and way to go... Hope the User Manual helps. Its what we used in the Schools Training and it worked perfectly ad it assumes no pro-skilss in Computers. On Tue, Sep 11, 2012 at 11:32 AM, Stephen wanjaus...@gmail.com wrote: I have gone through the video in the link provided and I did not get what was being said. To complement that, there is a pdf manual that has screenshots explaining the step by step process of installing Kiwix. You can find it at [1]. Hope that helps. ./Stephen 1. http://wikimedia.or.ke/File:Wikipedia_for_Schools-User_Manual_110227.pdf On 09/11/2012 11:09 AM, Alex Wafula wrote: There's a manual that Sam did last year, it should be om the offline page on meta, i'll dig up a link for you Alex On Sep 11, 2012 10:07 AM, dennis munene deontemun...@hotmail.com wrote: Hi, i hope this finds you all well, last week i got a call from Dr Martin Njoroge, [our contact person at Kenyatta University] requesting for the offline wikipedia that he intended to give to his students taking a masters degree most of who are teachers at high schools. I was able to make 50 copies on dvd with both the kiwix application and the offline wikipedia. On the day i was to give the students an illustration of how to install and use the kiwix application, something came up and i wasn't able to do it then. Sadly, they were going back home that evening. I was planning to come up with a text document illustrating how to install and use the kiwix app but i needed to first know if there's any available.. [preferably a video.. i've tried searching for on on youtube but the closest i got was this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnvm7uxDhMs yours, dennis munene. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnvm7uxDhMs ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake -- ./Stephen ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake -- Regards, Limoke Oscar,Dream.Believe.Becomea world of endless oportunities ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
[Wikimedia Kenya] Offline wikipedia
Hi, i hope this finds you all well, last week i got a call from Dr Martin Njoroge, [our contact person at Kenyatta University] requesting for the offline wikipedia that he intended to give to his students taking a masters degree most of who are teachers at high schools. I was able to make 50 copies on dvd with both the kiwix application and the offline wikipedia. On the day i was to give the students an illustration of how to install and use the kiwix application, something came up and i wasn't able to do it then. Sadly, they were going back home that evening. I was planning to come up with a text document illustrating how to install and use the kiwix app but i needed to first know if there's any available.. [preferably a video.. i've tried searching for on on youtube but the closest i got was this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnvm7uxDhMs yours, dennis munene. ___ WikimediaKE mailing list WikimediaKE@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediake
