Re: [WISPA] [AFMUG] RE: FCC broadband deployment report

[Brian Webster]

Rick,

Andrew is no longer with the NTIA. I took some time to
review this FCC report and can shed some light on what problems people are
seeing. First this data is compiled from round 4 which was current as of
June 2011. If anyone updated or provided data to their states this last
round, your data will not show in this report. Second, the data shown does
include fixed wireless service but not satellite or cellular. What they
appear to have done is create a merge of data. In the report they tried to
replicate the 4 meg down 1 meg up national broadband plan set as the
national goal. The national broadband map was created before the wonderful
people who wrote that report had the brilliant idea of defining something
that is not part of the map standards. Give that problem the FCC decided to
use the category of 3 meg or greater as the download speed and 768 or
greater as the upload speed. If any WISP has reported data in round 4 or
earlier that does not meet those speed tiers, it was not used in this
report.

As with any mapping and report it is very important to read
their methodology before throwing stones. I had to answer to some of our
research people in Illinois today because the FCC report says 6% unserved in
Illinois and my mapping data says 1%. Most of the difference is that we
calculated using just the download speed tier information and the FCC
further restricted areas they deemed served by adding in the 768 or greater
upload requirement. Some WISP's get bumped off the map because of the upload
requirements they used in their study.

 

Thank You,

Brian Webster

www.wirelessmapping.com

www.Broadband-Mapping.com

 

From: a...@afmug.com [mailto:a...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Rick Harnish
Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2012 6:19 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'; a...@afmug.com; us...@wug.cc; color...@wispa.org
Subject: [AFMUG] RE: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report

 

Andrew,  (Andrew MacRae from the NTIA is BCC'd)

 

There seems to be some discrepancy in the Colorado and Michigan Data.  Can
you assist as to why Wisp coverage is not represented?  Please read the
email below my signature line.  Also, here are some other comments from
other providers.

 

. Merrill, MI: Our coverage area is not displayed on that map. Is it
only including wireline providers?

 

. Jackson, MI:  My coverage update for the 2nd to last round is not
there, but the rest is. The map is for 3Meg svc. and up also.

 

. Steamboat Springs: If you hover over a county a popup chart on the
right shows up and displays the demographics for that county and % of
broadband that is Fiber, Cable, DSL, or fixed wireless.  both the counties
we serve show 0% fixed wireless.

 

. Yuma: wow, they have my area as covered as NON-Rural DSL and Cable
no wireless links at all..

I think someone "fixed" the books on this info. As its completely BS..

 

1. everything out here in our area is Rural..

2. No wireless listed at ALL ( there are 2 providers ourselves and the telco
to the south of us) 

3. The local cable company has only a handful of customers 

4. says that over 3500 folks in my county have NO internet.. Complete and
total BS.. This is farm country and I'd PAY to find more than 50 homes that
don't have internet.

 

Again.. the books have been cooked, thanks to either bad info or
competition.

 

 

Where there is a Wisp, there is a way!

 

Respectfully,

 

Rick Harnish

Executive Director

WISPA

260-307-4000 cell

866-317-2851 Option 2 WISPA Office

Skype: rick.harnish.

rharn...@wispa.org

adm...@wispa.org (Trina and Rick)

 

 

 

 

 

> -Original Message-

> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On

> Behalf Of Sean Heskett

> Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2012 5:29 PM

> To: wireless@wispa.org; a...@afmug.com; us...@wug.cc; color...@wispa.org

> Subject: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report

> 

> Hi all,

> 

> Sorry for all the cross posts on multiple lists but this seems troubling
to me.  We

> submitted our coverage data to the state of Colorado and they submitted
our

> data for the national map.  However, this FCC broadband deployment report

> includes this map which doesn't show our coverage.

> 

> Report:  
http://www.fcc.gov/reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report

> Map:  
http://www.fcc.gov/maps/section-706-fixed-broadband-deployment-map

> 

> What gives???  WISPA???

> 

> Is anyone else noticing their coverage area is not included?

> 

> Best regards,

> 

> 

> Sean Heskett

> ZIRKEL Wireless

> High-speed Internet

> 

>   www.zirkelwireless.com

> 970-871-8500

> ___

> Wireless mailing list

>   Wireless@wispa.org

>  
http://lists.w

Re: [WISPA] [AFMUG] FCC broadband deployment report

[Brian Webster]

The FCC report is based on round 4 data which would have been current as of
June 2011. If you just submitted the last round they did not use that data
for this report. This is the first report on broadband the FCC has done that
does not use the 477 data.

Thank You,
Brian Webster
www.wirelessmapping.com
www.Broadband-Mapping.com


-Original Message-
From: a...@afmug.com [mailto:a...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Sean Heskett
Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2012 5:29 PM
To: wireless@wispa.org; a...@afmug.com; us...@wug.cc; color...@wispa.org
Subject: [AFMUG] FCC broadband deployment report

Hi all,

Sorry for all the cross posts on multiple lists but this seems troubling to
me.  We submitted our coverage data to the state of Colorado and they
submitted our data for the national map.  However, this FCC broadband
deployment report includes this map which doesn't show our coverage.

Report: http://www.fcc.gov/reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report
Map: http://www.fcc.gov/maps/section-706-fixed-broadband-deployment-map

What gives???  WISPA???

Is anyone else noticing their coverage area is not included?

Best regards,


Sean Heskett
ZIRKEL Wireless
High-speed Internet

www.zirkelwireless.com
970-871-8500

-
Animal Farm Microwave Users Group - www.afmug.com



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Re: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report

[Jason Bailey]

Thanks Rick!

--- On Thu, 8/23/12, Rick Harnish  wrote:

From: Rick Harnish 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report
To: "'WISPA General List'" , a...@afmug.com, us...@wug.cc, 
color...@wispa.org
Date: Thursday, August 23, 2012, 6:18 PM

Andrew,  (Andrew MacRae from the NTIA is BCC’d)  There seems to be some 
discrepancy in the Colorado and Michigan Data.  Can you assist as to why Wisp 
coverage is not represented?  Please read the email below my signature line.  
Also, here are some other comments from other providers.  · Merrill, 
MI: Our coverage area is not displayed on that map. Is it only including 
wireline providers?  · Jackson, MI:  My coverage update for the 2nd to 
last round is not there, but the rest is. The map is for 3Meg svc. and up also. 
 · Steamboat Springs: If you hover over a county a popup chart on the 
right shows up and displays the demographics for that county and % of broadband 
that is Fiber, Cable, DSL, or fixed wireless.  both the counties we serve show 
0% fixed wireless.  · Yuma: wow, they have my area as covered as 
NON-Rural DSL and Cable no wireless links at all..I think someone
 "fixed" the books on this info. As its completely BS..  1. everything out here 
in our area is Rural..2. No wireless listed at ALL ( there are 2 providers 
ourselves and the telco to the south of us) 3. The local cable company has only 
a handful of customers 4. says that over 3500 folks in my county have NO 
internet.. Complete and total BS.. This is farm country and I'd PAY to find 
more than 50 homes that don't have internet.  Again.. the books have been 
cooked, thanks to either bad info or competition.    Where there is a Wisp, 
there is a way!  Respectfully,  Rick HarnishExecutive DirectorWISPA260-307-4000 
cell866-317-2851 Option 2 WISPA OfficeSkype: 
rick.harnish.rharnish@wispa.orgadm...@wispa.org (Trina and Rick)          > 
-Original Message-> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org 
[mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On> Behalf Of Sean Heskett> Sent: Thursday, 
August 23, 2012 5:29 PM> To: wireless@wispa.org; a...@afmug.com; us...@wug.cc;
 color...@wispa.org> Subject: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report> > Hi 
all,> > Sorry for all the cross posts on multiple lists but this seems 
troubling to me.  We> submitted our coverage data to the state of Colorado and 
they submitted our> data for the national map.  However, this FCC broadband 
deployment report> includes this map which doesn't show our coverage.> > 
Report: http://www.fcc.gov/reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report> Map: 
http://www.fcc.gov/maps/section-706-fixed-broadband-deployment-map> > What 
gives???  WISPA???> > Is anyone else noticing their coverage area is not 
included?> > Best regards,> > > Sean Heskett> ZIRKEL Wireless> High-speed 
Internet> > www.zirkelwireless.com> 970-871-8500> 
___> Wireless mailing list> 
Wireless@wispa.org> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
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Re: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report

[Sean Heskett]

ditto.  we have worked with the colorado agency and i have contacted
him today about this issue.

-sean



On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 4:17 PM, Ryan Ghering  wrote:
> We did submit, and have worked with the mapping agency in colorado a
> number of times.. :(
>
> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 4:15 PM, Jack Unger  wrote:
>> 1. WISPs need to submit their information.
>>
>> 2. WISPs need to be diligent about working with their State mapping agency
>> to correct wrong information.
>>
>> No one else is going to do it for us.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 8/23/2012 2:59 PM, Ryan Ghering wrote:
>>
>> wow, they have my area as covered as NON-Rural DSL and Cable no
>> wireless links at all..
>>
>> I think someone "fixed" the books on this info. As its completely BS..
>>
>> 1. everything out here in our area is Rural..
>> 2. No wireless listed at ALL ( there are 2 providers ourselves and the
>> telco to the south of us)
>> 3. The local cable company has only a handful of customers
>> 4. says that over 3500 folks in my county have NO internet.. Complete
>> and total BS.. This is farm country and I'd PAY to find more than 50
>> homes that don't have internet.
>>
>> Again.. the books have been cooked, thanks to either bad info or
>> competition.
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:51 PM, Sean Heskett  wrote:
>>
>> if you hover over a county a popup chart on the right shows up and
>> displays the demographics for that county and % of broadband that is
>> Fiber, Cable, DSL, or fixed wireless.  both the counties we serve show
>> 0% fixed wireless.
>>
>> -sean
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:48 PM, Chris Fabien  wrote:
>>
>> Our coverage area is not displayed on that map.
>> Is it only including wireline providers?
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 5:28 PM, Sean Heskett  wrote:
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Sorry for all the cross posts on multiple lists but this seems
>> troubling to me.  We submitted our coverage data to the state of
>> Colorado and they submitted our data for the national map.  However,
>> this FCC broadband deployment report includes this map which doesn't
>> show our coverage.
>>
>> Report: http://www.fcc.gov/reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report
>> Map: http://www.fcc.gov/maps/section-706-fixed-broadband-deployment-map
>>
>> What gives???  WISPA???
>>
>> Is anyone else noticing their coverage area is not included?
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>>
>> Sean Heskett
>> ZIRKEL Wireless
>> High-speed Internet
>>
>> www.zirkelwireless.com
>> 970-871-8500
>> ___
>> Wireless mailing list
>> Wireless@wispa.org
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> ___
>> Wireless mailing list
>> Wireless@wispa.org
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> ___
>> Wireless mailing list
>> Wireless@wispa.org
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
>> Author (2003) - "Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks"
>> Serving the WISP Community since 1993
>> www.ask-wi.com  760-678-5033  jun...@ask-wi.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Wireless mailing list
>> Wireless@wispa.org
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Ryan Ghering
> Network Operations - Plains.Net
> Office: 970-848-0475 - Cell: 970-630-1879
> ___
> Wireless mailing list
> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
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Re: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report

[Jack Unger]

  
  
Great! Keep working with the
mapping agency until they get it right.

  
On 8/23/2012 3:17 PM, Ryan Ghering
  wrote:


  We did submit, and have worked with the mapping agency in colorado a
number of times.. :(

On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 4:15 PM, Jack Unger  wrote:

  
1. WISPs need to submit their information.

2. WISPs need to be diligent about working with their State mapping agency
to correct wrong information.

No one else is going to do it for us.



On 8/23/2012 2:59 PM, Ryan Ghering wrote:

wow, they have my area as covered as NON-Rural DSL and Cable no
wireless links at all..

I think someone "fixed" the books on this info. As its completely BS..

1. everything out here in our area is Rural..
2. No wireless listed at ALL ( there are 2 providers ourselves and the
telco to the south of us)
3. The local cable company has only a handful of customers
4. says that over 3500 folks in my county have NO internet.. Complete
and total BS.. This is farm country and I'd PAY to find more than 50
homes that don't have internet.

Again.. the books have been cooked, thanks to either bad info or
competition.

On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:51 PM, Sean Heskett  wrote:

if you hover over a county a popup chart on the right shows up and
displays the demographics for that county and % of broadband that is
Fiber, Cable, DSL, or fixed wireless.  both the counties we serve show
0% fixed wireless.

-sean


On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:48 PM, Chris Fabien  wrote:

Our coverage area is not displayed on that map.
Is it only including wireline providers?

On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 5:28 PM, Sean Heskett  wrote:

Hi all,

Sorry for all the cross posts on multiple lists but this seems
troubling to me.  We submitted our coverage data to the state of
Colorado and they submitted our data for the national map.  However,
this FCC broadband deployment report includes this map which doesn't
show our coverage.

Report: http://www.fcc.gov/reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report
Map: http://www.fcc.gov/maps/section-706-fixed-broadband-deployment-map

What gives???  WISPA???

Is anyone else noticing their coverage area is not included?

Best regards,


Sean Heskett
ZIRKEL Wireless
High-speed Internet

www.zirkelwireless.com
970-871-8500
___
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--
Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
Author (2003) - "Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks"
Serving the WISP Community since 1993
www.ask-wi.com  760-678-5033  jun...@ask-wi.com




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-- 
Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
Author (2003) - "Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks"
Serving the WISP Community since 1993
www.ask-wi.com  760-678-5033  jun...@ask-wi.com




  

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Re: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report

[Rick Harnish]

Andrew,  (Andrew MacRae from the NTIA is BCC'd)

 

There seems to be some discrepancy in the Colorado and Michigan Data.  Can
you assist as to why Wisp coverage is not represented?  Please read the
email below my signature line.  Also, here are some other comments from
other providers.

 

. Merrill, MI: Our coverage area is not displayed on that map. Is it
only including wireline providers?

 

. Jackson, MI:  My coverage update for the 2nd to last round is not
there, but the rest is. The map is for 3Meg svc. and up also.

 

. Steamboat Springs: If you hover over a county a popup chart on the
right shows up and displays the demographics for that county and % of
broadband that is Fiber, Cable, DSL, or fixed wireless.  both the counties
we serve show 0% fixed wireless.

 

. Yuma: wow, they have my area as covered as NON-Rural DSL and Cable
no wireless links at all..

I think someone "fixed" the books on this info. As its completely BS..

 

1. everything out here in our area is Rural..

2. No wireless listed at ALL ( there are 2 providers ourselves and the telco
to the south of us) 

3. The local cable company has only a handful of customers 

4. says that over 3500 folks in my county have NO internet.. Complete and
total BS.. This is farm country and I'd PAY to find more than 50 homes that
don't have internet.

 

Again.. the books have been cooked, thanks to either bad info or
competition.

 

 

Where there is a Wisp, there is a way!

 

Respectfully,

 

Rick Harnish

Executive Director

WISPA

260-307-4000 cell

866-317-2851 Option 2 WISPA Office

Skype: rick.harnish.

rharn...@wispa.org

adm...@wispa.org (Trina and Rick)

 

 

 

 

 

> -Original Message-

> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On

> Behalf Of Sean Heskett

> Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2012 5:29 PM

> To: wireless@wispa.org; a...@afmug.com; us...@wug.cc; color...@wispa.org

> Subject: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report

> 

> Hi all,

> 

> Sorry for all the cross posts on multiple lists but this seems troubling
to me.  We

> submitted our coverage data to the state of Colorado and they submitted
our

> data for the national map.  However, this FCC broadband deployment report

> includes this map which doesn't show our coverage.

> 

> Report:  
http://www.fcc.gov/reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report

> Map:  
http://www.fcc.gov/maps/section-706-fixed-broadband-deployment-map

> 

> What gives???  WISPA???

> 

> Is anyone else noticing their coverage area is not included?

> 

> Best regards,

> 

> 

> Sean Heskett

> ZIRKEL Wireless

> High-speed Internet

> 

>   www.zirkelwireless.com

> 970-871-8500

> ___

> Wireless mailing list

>   Wireless@wispa.org

>  
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

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Re: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report

[Ryan Ghering]

We did submit, and have worked with the mapping agency in colorado a
number of times.. :(

On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 4:15 PM, Jack Unger  wrote:
> 1. WISPs need to submit their information.
>
> 2. WISPs need to be diligent about working with their State mapping agency
> to correct wrong information.
>
> No one else is going to do it for us.
>
>
>
> On 8/23/2012 2:59 PM, Ryan Ghering wrote:
>
> wow, they have my area as covered as NON-Rural DSL and Cable no
> wireless links at all..
>
> I think someone "fixed" the books on this info. As its completely BS..
>
> 1. everything out here in our area is Rural..
> 2. No wireless listed at ALL ( there are 2 providers ourselves and the
> telco to the south of us)
> 3. The local cable company has only a handful of customers
> 4. says that over 3500 folks in my county have NO internet.. Complete
> and total BS.. This is farm country and I'd PAY to find more than 50
> homes that don't have internet.
>
> Again.. the books have been cooked, thanks to either bad info or
> competition.
>
> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:51 PM, Sean Heskett  wrote:
>
> if you hover over a county a popup chart on the right shows up and
> displays the demographics for that county and % of broadband that is
> Fiber, Cable, DSL, or fixed wireless.  both the counties we serve show
> 0% fixed wireless.
>
> -sean
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:48 PM, Chris Fabien  wrote:
>
> Our coverage area is not displayed on that map.
> Is it only including wireline providers?
>
> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 5:28 PM, Sean Heskett  wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> Sorry for all the cross posts on multiple lists but this seems
> troubling to me.  We submitted our coverage data to the state of
> Colorado and they submitted our data for the national map.  However,
> this FCC broadband deployment report includes this map which doesn't
> show our coverage.
>
> Report: http://www.fcc.gov/reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report
> Map: http://www.fcc.gov/maps/section-706-fixed-broadband-deployment-map
>
> What gives???  WISPA???
>
> Is anyone else noticing their coverage area is not included?
>
> Best regards,
>
>
> Sean Heskett
> ZIRKEL Wireless
> High-speed Internet
>
> www.zirkelwireless.com
> 970-871-8500
> ___
> Wireless mailing list
> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> ___
> Wireless mailing list
> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> ___
> Wireless mailing list
> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
>
>
> --
> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
> Author (2003) - "Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks"
> Serving the WISP Community since 1993
> www.ask-wi.com  760-678-5033  jun...@ask-wi.com
>
>
>
>
> ___
> Wireless mailing list
> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>



-- 
Ryan Ghering
Network Operations - Plains.Net
Office: 970-848-0475 - Cell: 970-630-1879
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Re: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report

[Jack Unger]

  
  
1. WISPs need to submit their
information. 

2. WISPs need to be diligent about working with their State
mapping agency to correct wrong information. 

No one else is going to do it for us. 



  
On 8/23/2012 2:59 PM, Ryan Ghering
  wrote:


  wow, they have my area as covered as NON-Rural DSL and Cable no
wireless links at all..

I think someone "fixed" the books on this info. As its completely BS..

1. everything out here in our area is Rural..
2. No wireless listed at ALL ( there are 2 providers ourselves and the
telco to the south of us)
3. The local cable company has only a handful of customers
4. says that over 3500 folks in my county have NO internet.. Complete
and total BS.. This is farm country and I'd PAY to find more than 50
homes that don't have internet.

Again.. the books have been cooked, thanks to either bad info or competition.

On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:51 PM, Sean Heskett  wrote:

  
if you hover over a county a popup chart on the right shows up and
displays the demographics for that county and % of broadband that is
Fiber, Cable, DSL, or fixed wireless.  both the counties we serve show
0% fixed wireless.

-sean


On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:48 PM, Chris Fabien  wrote:


  Our coverage area is not displayed on that map.
Is it only including wireline providers?

On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 5:28 PM, Sean Heskett  wrote:

  
Hi all,

Sorry for all the cross posts on multiple lists but this seems
troubling to me.  We submitted our coverage data to the state of
Colorado and they submitted our data for the national map.  However,
this FCC broadband deployment report includes this map which doesn't
show our coverage.

Report: http://www.fcc.gov/reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report
Map: http://www.fcc.gov/maps/section-706-fixed-broadband-deployment-map

What gives???  WISPA???

Is anyone else noticing their coverage area is not included?

Best regards,


Sean Heskett
ZIRKEL Wireless
High-speed Internet

www.zirkelwireless.com
970-871-8500
___
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-- 
Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
Author (2003) - "Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks"
Serving the WISP Community since 1993
www.ask-wi.com  760-678-5033  jun...@ask-wi.com




  

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Re: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report

[Josh Luthman]

Where?

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373


On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 5:59 PM, Ryan Ghering  wrote:

> wow, they have my area as covered as NON-Rural DSL and Cable no
> wireless links at all..
>
> I think someone "fixed" the books on this info. As its completely BS..
>
> 1. everything out here in our area is Rural..
> 2. No wireless listed at ALL ( there are 2 providers ourselves and the
> telco to the south of us)
> 3. The local cable company has only a handful of customers
> 4. says that over 3500 folks in my county have NO internet.. Complete
> and total BS.. This is farm country and I'd PAY to find more than 50
> homes that don't have internet.
>
> Again.. the books have been cooked, thanks to either bad info or
> competition.
>
> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:51 PM, Sean Heskett  wrote:
> > if you hover over a county a popup chart on the right shows up and
> > displays the demographics for that county and % of broadband that is
> > Fiber, Cable, DSL, or fixed wireless.  both the counties we serve show
> > 0% fixed wireless.
> >
> > -sean
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:48 PM, Chris Fabien 
> wrote:
> >> Our coverage area is not displayed on that map.
> >> Is it only including wireline providers?
> >>
> >> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 5:28 PM, Sean Heskett  wrote:
> >>> Hi all,
> >>>
> >>> Sorry for all the cross posts on multiple lists but this seems
> >>> troubling to me.  We submitted our coverage data to the state of
> >>> Colorado and they submitted our data for the national map.  However,
> >>> this FCC broadband deployment report includes this map which doesn't
> >>> show our coverage.
> >>>
> >>> Report: http://www.fcc.gov/reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report
> >>> Map:
> http://www.fcc.gov/maps/section-706-fixed-broadband-deployment-map
> >>>
> >>> What gives???  WISPA???
> >>>
> >>> Is anyone else noticing their coverage area is not included?
> >>>
> >>> Best regards,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Sean Heskett
> >>> ZIRKEL Wireless
> >>> High-speed Internet
> >>>
> >>> www.zirkelwireless.com
> >>> 970-871-8500
> >>> ___
> >>> Wireless mailing list
> >>> Wireless@wispa.org
> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >> ___
> >> Wireless mailing list
> >> Wireless@wispa.org
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> > ___
> > Wireless mailing list
> > Wireless@wispa.org
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
>
>
> --
> Ryan Ghering
> Network Operations - Plains.Net
> Office: 970-848-0475 - Cell: 970-630-1879
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Re: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report

[Ryan Ghering]

wow, they have my area as covered as NON-Rural DSL and Cable no
wireless links at all..

I think someone "fixed" the books on this info. As its completely BS..

1. everything out here in our area is Rural..
2. No wireless listed at ALL ( there are 2 providers ourselves and the
telco to the south of us)
3. The local cable company has only a handful of customers
4. says that over 3500 folks in my county have NO internet.. Complete
and total BS.. This is farm country and I'd PAY to find more than 50
homes that don't have internet.

Again.. the books have been cooked, thanks to either bad info or competition.

On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:51 PM, Sean Heskett  wrote:
> if you hover over a county a popup chart on the right shows up and
> displays the demographics for that county and % of broadband that is
> Fiber, Cable, DSL, or fixed wireless.  both the counties we serve show
> 0% fixed wireless.
>
> -sean
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:48 PM, Chris Fabien  wrote:
>> Our coverage area is not displayed on that map.
>> Is it only including wireline providers?
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 5:28 PM, Sean Heskett  wrote:
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> Sorry for all the cross posts on multiple lists but this seems
>>> troubling to me.  We submitted our coverage data to the state of
>>> Colorado and they submitted our data for the national map.  However,
>>> this FCC broadband deployment report includes this map which doesn't
>>> show our coverage.
>>>
>>> Report: http://www.fcc.gov/reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report
>>> Map: http://www.fcc.gov/maps/section-706-fixed-broadband-deployment-map
>>>
>>> What gives???  WISPA???
>>>
>>> Is anyone else noticing their coverage area is not included?
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>>
>>>
>>> Sean Heskett
>>> ZIRKEL Wireless
>>> High-speed Internet
>>>
>>> www.zirkelwireless.com
>>> 970-871-8500
>>> ___
>>> Wireless mailing list
>>> Wireless@wispa.org
>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>> ___
>> Wireless mailing list
>> Wireless@wispa.org
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> ___
> Wireless mailing list
> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless



-- 
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Network Operations - Plains.Net
Office: 970-848-0475 - Cell: 970-630-1879
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Re: [WISPA] Internet Speed test..are they inaccurate with wireless?

[Matt Jenkins]

  
  

http://usage.sbbnet.com/customer.php?customer=173.195.176.6&curDate=1345758487

That page shows the usage by hour/day/month/year of our speedtest
server. It takes a while to load, its on an old server. 

I get a lot of tests from Apple, Inc (we are their nearest speedtest
site). These shows up to and over 100mbps sometimes. But they are
only for a few seconds each. It averages out to about 7mbps of
upload data needed. We have lots of spare upload.


On 08/22/2012 05:26 PM, Blake
  Covarrubias wrote:


  Matt,

How much bandwidth on average are you seeing to your speed test servers?

We're considering becoming a speedtest.net host, but are concerned about the amount of bandwidth generated by users outside our network.

--
Blake Covarrubias

On Aug 22, 2012, at 9:54 AM, Matt Jenkins  wrote:


  
We setup a speedtest server. So when customers connect to speedtest.net they reach our local server. The test data never leaves our network.


On 08/21/2012 12:27 PM, Joey Craig wrote:


  We only guarantee from the customers radio to our servers and we make sure the customer is aware of that. We use Jperf/Iperf also…works very well.
How can you guarantee ANYTHING beyond your network? You are absolutely in the right.
 
Joey Craig
Network/RF Engineer
Firenet1.Com
Phone:  (662) 510-0764
Mobile: (662) 404-1118
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Bret Clark
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 2:22 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] Internet Speed test..are they inaccurate with wireless?
 
We mostly deal with business customer and guarantee bandwidth to customers. We validate the bandwidth using IPERF from a Linux server off of our BGP edge routers down to the customer and IPERF always shows the customer getting the bandwidth they signed up for.  We use QoS to control bandwidth and make sure to not oversubscribe any one linksmall ratios of 3:1. 

Of course eventually at some point the customer runs one of those stupid bandwidth test on the Internet and the results are woefully inaccurate (not in our favor)...but  of course customers take the results as gospel. AAA!

It's not our internet connections, we have three 100Mbps BGP links and none of them run at more then 50% during peak loads.

Has anyone else found those Internet speed test to be woefully inaccurate? Or is something else going on that I'm missing?  

Thanks,
Bret


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Re: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report

[Sean Heskett]

if you hover over a county a popup chart on the right shows up and
displays the demographics for that county and % of broadband that is
Fiber, Cable, DSL, or fixed wireless.  both the counties we serve show
0% fixed wireless.

-sean


On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:48 PM, Chris Fabien  wrote:
> Our coverage area is not displayed on that map.
> Is it only including wireline providers?
>
> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 5:28 PM, Sean Heskett  wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Sorry for all the cross posts on multiple lists but this seems
>> troubling to me.  We submitted our coverage data to the state of
>> Colorado and they submitted our data for the national map.  However,
>> this FCC broadband deployment report includes this map which doesn't
>> show our coverage.
>>
>> Report: http://www.fcc.gov/reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report
>> Map: http://www.fcc.gov/maps/section-706-fixed-broadband-deployment-map
>>
>> What gives???  WISPA???
>>
>> Is anyone else noticing their coverage area is not included?
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>>
>> Sean Heskett
>> ZIRKEL Wireless
>> High-speed Internet
>>
>> www.zirkelwireless.com
>> 970-871-8500
>> ___
>> Wireless mailing list
>> Wireless@wispa.org
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> ___
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Re: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report

[Jason Bailey]

My coverage update for the 2nd to last round is not there,but the rest is. The 
map is for 3Meg svc. and up also.

--- On Thu, 8/23/12, Sean Heskett  wrote:

From: Sean Heskett 
Subject: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report
To: wireless@wispa.org, a...@afmug.com, us...@wug.cc, color...@wispa.org
Date: Thursday, August 23, 2012, 5:28 PM

Hi all,

Sorry for all the cross posts on multiple lists but this seems
troubling to me.  We submitted our coverage data to the state of
Colorado and they submitted our data for the national map.  However,
this FCC broadband deployment report includes this map which doesn't
show our coverage.

Report: http://www.fcc.gov/reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report
Map: http://www.fcc.gov/maps/section-706-fixed-broadband-deployment-map

What gives???  WISPA???

Is anyone else noticing their coverage area is not included?

Best regards,


Sean Heskett
ZIRKEL Wireless
High-speed Internet

www.zirkelwireless.com
970-871-8500
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Re: [WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report

[Chris Fabien]

Our coverage area is not displayed on that map.
Is it only including wireline providers?

On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 5:28 PM, Sean Heskett  wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Sorry for all the cross posts on multiple lists but this seems
> troubling to me.  We submitted our coverage data to the state of
> Colorado and they submitted our data for the national map.  However,
> this FCC broadband deployment report includes this map which doesn't
> show our coverage.
>
> Report: http://www.fcc.gov/reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report
> Map: http://www.fcc.gov/maps/section-706-fixed-broadband-deployment-map
>
> What gives???  WISPA???
>
> Is anyone else noticing their coverage area is not included?
>
> Best regards,
>
>
> Sean Heskett
> ZIRKEL Wireless
> High-speed Internet
>
> www.zirkelwireless.com
> 970-871-8500
> ___
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> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
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[WISPA] FCC broadband deployment report

[Sean Heskett]

Hi all,

Sorry for all the cross posts on multiple lists but this seems
troubling to me.  We submitted our coverage data to the state of
Colorado and they submitted our data for the national map.  However,
this FCC broadband deployment report includes this map which doesn't
show our coverage.

Report: http://www.fcc.gov/reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report
Map: http://www.fcc.gov/maps/section-706-fixed-broadband-deployment-map

What gives???  WISPA???

Is anyone else noticing their coverage area is not included?

Best regards,


Sean Heskett
ZIRKEL Wireless
High-speed Internet

www.zirkelwireless.com
970-871-8500
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Re: [WISPA] Internet Speed test..are they inaccurate with wireless?

[Faisal Imtiaz]

A very common occurring reason for what you are describing would be a 
'Ethernet Connection / Speed / Duplex Mismatch', in the customer's 
connection path.


Regards

Faisal Imtiaz
Snappy Internet & Telecom

On 8/23/2012 9:52 AM, Bret Clark wrote:
I initially brought up the question because I have Verizon FiOS at 
home and not matter what time of the day can run a speed test to the 
same server and see my 30Mbps DN/15 Mbps up.


If I run and Iperf test between my FiOS connection and one of our 
wireless business customers with 10Mbps circuit...it nails the speed 
every time... iperf show 10Mbps up & 10Mbps down (we have a Linux 
server at the customers site).


Yet when that same customer runs the same speed.net test to the same 
speed.net server the results suck pretty much every single time!


I know the majority of test speed test are really based on algorithms 
that try to figure out what the potential speed of a circuit is and 
because our network is all wireless it just screws up the algorithms?


Bret

On 08/22/2012 01:00 PM, Matt Jenkins wrote:

http://www.speedtest.net/mini.php


On 08/21/2012 12:22 PM, Bret Clark wrote:
We mostly deal with business customer and guarantee bandwidth to 
customers. We validate the bandwidth using IPERF from a Linux server 
off of our BGP edge routers down to the customer and IPERF always 
shows the customer getting the bandwidth they signed up for.  We use 
QoS to control bandwidth and make sure to not oversubscribe any one 
linksmall ratios of 3:1.


Of course eventually at some point the customer runs one of those 
stupid bandwidth test on the Internet and the results are woefully 
inaccurate (not in our favor)...but  of course customers take the 
results as gospel. AAA!


It's not our internet connections, we have three 100Mbps BGP links 
and none of them run at more then 50% during peak loads.


Has anyone else found those Internet speed test to be woefully 
inaccurate? Or is something else going on that I'm missing?


Thanks,
Bret


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Re: [WISPA] Internet Speed test..are they inaccurate with wireless?

[Bret Clark]

I initially brought up the question because I have Verizon FiOS at home 
and not matter what time of the day can run a speed test to the same 
server and see my 30Mbps DN/15 Mbps up.


If I run and Iperf test between my FiOS connection and one of our 
wireless business customers with 10Mbps circuit...it nails the speed 
every time... iperf show 10Mbps up & 10Mbps down (we have a Linux server 
at the customers site).


Yet when that same customer runs the same speed.net test to the same 
speed.net server the results suck pretty much every single time!


I know the majority of test speed test are really based on algorithms 
that try to figure out what the potential speed of a circuit is and 
because our network is all wireless it just screws up the algorithms?


Bret

On 08/22/2012 01:00 PM, Matt Jenkins wrote:

http://www.speedtest.net/mini.php


On 08/21/2012 12:22 PM, Bret Clark wrote:
We mostly deal with business customer and guarantee bandwidth to 
customers. We validate the bandwidth using IPERF from a Linux server 
off of our BGP edge routers down to the customer and IPERF always 
shows the customer getting the bandwidth they signed up for.  We use 
QoS to control bandwidth and make sure to not oversubscribe any one 
linksmall ratios of 3:1.


Of course eventually at some point the customer runs one of those 
stupid bandwidth test on the Internet and the results are woefully 
inaccurate (not in our favor)...but  of course customers take the 
results as gospel. AAA!


It's not our internet connections, we have three 100Mbps BGP links 
and none of them run at more then 50% during peak loads.


Has anyone else found those Internet speed test to be woefully 
inaccurate? Or is something else going on that I'm missing?


Thanks,
Bret


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Re: [WISPA] Internet Speed test..are they inaccurate with wireless?

[Paolo Di Francesco]

that is a common situation, but another one is:
"Sir, you had to have some virus or p2p application..."
"no, you changed something now it's working well, so you are not telling 
me all the truth, it's working good now only because I called to 
complain..."

We did nothing but they keep not believe us. Sometimes I feel that the 
more you tell the truth the more they will not believe you

Maybe I could have better success with "yes, you are right we catch all 
the packets coming from complaining users and we give them higher 
priority by hand, so the more you call us the faster you go..."
hum... unfortunately they do not pay us to spend time at the phone or 
that could be a good approach :)

> For us this is the biggest one.
> I will have customer call, speedtest says 384K.  Look at the radio and
> we are pushing 2.04M in on a 2M connection.  "Ask your kids to turn off
> all their devices and try again."  "Oh, wow, I am getting the full 2M
> now. What did you change?"  Then the long explanation about shared
> bandwidth on their connection.
> Has to be the same for businesses, though it is kind of hard to have all
> the other kids turn off their computers.
>
> On 8/21/2012 3:33 PM, Larry Weidig wrote:
>>
>> Bret:
>>
>> We have found that the tests are “fairly” accurate (well speedtest.net
>> anyhow), *_BUT_* only in controlled environments.  Your end user is
>> probably running these tests when their Internet is “slow”.  Viola
>> look I am right it is slow, xyz speed test says so!  What he does not
>> realize is that Johnny intern in the warehouse has set his computer up
>> to grab torrents for him while he picks stock and then just dumps the
>> off to flash before heading out.  Ok, that is just one example, but
>> all sorts of other traffic can come into play.
>>
>> We tell our customers that we are not at all interested in speed tests
>> unless we have a support person on the line watching their link for
>> other types of traffic as well during the test.  We also host their
>> speedtest.net mini (free) on own of our own servers so that we can
>> eliminate any Internet oddness causing problems with the results.  The
>> mini however only seems accurate up to about 25-30 Mbps in our
>> experience at which point the results are only ballpark at best. Ookla
>> claims mini is good until about 50 Mbps, but that has not been our
>> experience.
>>
>> Just what we have experienced with speedtest results.
>>
>> Larry A. Weidig (lwei...@excel.net )
>>
>> Excel.Net, Inc. – http://www.excel.net/
>>
>> (920) 452-0455 – Sheboygan/Plymouth area
>>
>> (888) 489-9995 – Other areas, toll-free
>>
>> *From:*wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
>> *On Behalf Of *Bret Clark
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, August 21, 2012 2:22 PM
>> *To:* WISPA General List
>> *Subject:* [WISPA] Internet Speed test..are they inaccurate with wireless?
>>
>> We mostly deal with business customer and guarantee bandwidth to
>> customers. We validate the bandwidth using IPERF from a Linux server
>> off of our BGP edge routers down to the customer and IPERF always
>> shows the customer getting the bandwidth they signed up for.  We use
>> QoS to control bandwidth and make sure to not oversubscribe any one
>> linksmall ratios of 3:1.
>>
>> Of course eventually at some point the customer runs one of those
>> stupid bandwidth test on the Internet and the results are woefully
>> inaccurate (not in our favor)...but  of course customers take the
>> results as gospel. AAA!
>>
>> It's not our internet connections, we have three 100Mbps BGP links and
>> none of them run at more then 50% during peak loads.
>>
>> Has anyone else found those Internet speed test to be woefully
>> inaccurate? Or is something else going on that I'm missing?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Bret
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>>
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
>> Version: 2012.0.2197 / Virus Database: 2437/5212 - Release Date: 08/20/12
>>
>
> --
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> Owner
> NewWays Networking, LLC
> Wireless Networking
> Network Design, Installation and Administration
>
>
>
> Mikrotik Advanced Certified
>
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Re: [WISPA] Internet Speed test..are they inaccurate with wireless?

[Paolo Di Francesco]

Hi Jack

you are right about the two points, but also it's not a problem of 
education but sometimes "honesty" and trustness

I will do an example: I turned on some graphs for a customer who was 
complaining all the time about speed. The issue was that his upload was 
always full and therefore that was limiting the "user experience"
So I explained that and he did not want to believe. So I turned on some 
graphs to show that the bandwidth was there, and the issue was him not 
using it in the right way.
After some time, he was looking at the graphs all the time and 
complaining everytime the graph (average on 5mins) were under the 
"maximum" value (i.e. if the offer was 6Mbit the graph had to be always 
6mbit, whatever server he was using).
So after all the calls for the "my internet is not going at full speed" 
I said "ok you know what, I am turning off that feature unless you pay 
us an extra fee". I was tired of spending my time for no money at the 
phone with a customer who does not understand "5 min AVERAGE". Moreoever 
he was saying "it's not full speed, I will not pay the bills"
So after turning the graphs off  he was complaining that I was hiding 
some nasty thing because he had no more graphs.

So the lessons that I lernt were:

1) trustness: users tend to NOT believe us, even if you give them an 
accurate, bullet proof explanation. They are not engineers and they 
simpply say "I did not understand but if I pay for 6Mega I want 6Mega, 
because with the other WISP I am sure it will go ALWAYS at full speed" 
(that is the big lie of telecommunication, but who cares...)
2) education: you can spend as much time as you want explaining numbers 
to them but they will keep only the part they like most of those 
explanations and use those parts against you (to pay less, to complain, 
to waste your time, etc.).

I am not saying we will stop trying to be polite and explicative with 
our users, I am just saying that it's an hard path even if you explain 
with full honesty "why or what"

Just my 2 Euro cents
 > Two points -
>
> 1. Customer education. I think it's the job of each WISP to educate
> their customers that the Internet is a huge network with multiple hops
> needed to get anywhere. Yes; I know it seems stupid to us to have to do
> this but much of the public is just not aware so we need to help them
> understand.
>
> 2. Local and "Beyond Local" Testing - As part of our customer education,
> we need to set up a local (at our NOC) speed test and a "beyond our NOC"
> speed test link. That way, we can train the customer to a) check approx.
> throughput to our NOC, and b) check approx. throughput beyond our NOC.
>
> jack
>
>
>
> On 8/21/2012 12:22 PM, Bret Clark wrote:
>> We mostly deal with business customer and guarantee bandwidth to
>> customers. We validate the bandwidth using IPERF from a Linux server
>> off of our BGP edge routers down to the customer and IPERF always
>> shows the customer getting the bandwidth they signed up for.  We use
>> QoS to control bandwidth and make sure to not oversubscribe any one
>> linksmall ratios of 3:1.
>>
>> Of course eventually at some point the customer runs one of those
>> stupid bandwidth test on the Internet and the results are woefully
>> inaccurate (not in our favor)...but  of course customers take the
>> results as gospel. AAA!
>>
>> It's not our internet connections, we have three 100Mbps BGP links and
>> none of them run at more then 50% during peak loads.
>>
>> Has anyone else found those Internet speed test to be woefully
>> inaccurate? Or is something else going on that I'm missing?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Bret
>>
>>
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>
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> Author (2003) - "Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks"
> Serving the WISP Community since 1993
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>
>
>
>
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Level7 s.r.l. unipersonale

Sede operativa: Largo Montalto, 5 - 90144 Palermo

C.F. e P.IVA  05940050825
Fax : +39-091-8772072
assistenza: (+39) 091-8776432
web: http://www.level7.it



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