Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
I agree, this is a behavior issue that shouldn't be fixed with technology.The only real options require authentication and user control (FTE to maintain), or having an the right number of APs in strategic positions and shutting them off during class time (costs added equipment, infrastructure, and an FTE). On 11/18/2010 1:47 PM, Parker, Ron wrote: Yes, if you look at the archives for this list on the EDUCAUSE web site, you'll see that this has come up before. It also comes up on the CIO list and probably others that are archived there. There doesn't seem to be a technology solution for this that would work in a typical academic environment. -- Ron Parker, Director of Information Technology, Brazosport College Voice: (979) 230-3480 FAX: (979) 230-3111 http://www.brazosport.edu -Original Message- From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Julian Y. Koh Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2010 1:43 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 At 1:30 PM -0600 11/18/10, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: Can somebody tell me which is the best and cheaper solution (something so easy as turn a switch on/off)? The best solution that is always presented here is that this is a classroom control issue, not a technology issue. :) -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: 9.9.1.287 wj8DBQFM5YHRDlQHnMkeAWMRArbJAKDzn1VaaoeLsmHDfhxU8qO9jocqEQCg68RG g3Aw5+zLk260yf5TxQ+3CmE= =p2U0 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- Julian Y. Kohmailto:kohs...@northwestern.edu Manager, Network Transportphone:847-467-5780 Telecommunications and Network Services Northwestern University PGP Public Key:http://bt.ittns.northwestern.edu/julian/pgppubkey.html ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. -- Heath Barnhart, CCNA Network Administrator Information Systems and Services Washburn University Topeka, KS 66621 ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
Yes, we do.The idea is to block any source of wireless connection to the WiFi network. lf From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Hanset, Philippe C Sent: Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 07:42 p.m. To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms And do you plan to block air-cards on cellular as well with that jammer? Philippe Univ. of TN On Nov 18, 2010, at 4:06 PM, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: I understand your points of view and I agree with some of your comments. However, we use our classrooms for multiple academic activities (MBA programs, seminar and in-company events), and we need to find a simple device to block the signal in a 10-20 meters radius / classroom. So, the adjacent classrooms can work with the signal of their own access points (some professors require Internet signal to teach their sessions - internet dynamics, simulations over the internet, cloud computing services, etc.). I have heard that this is implemented in some universities in the USA, Europe and Asia (for instance, I was told that in the Indian School of Bussiness' classrooms there are switches to enable/disable wireless signals. I emailed them, but I haven't received answer yet). Luis Fernando From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Greg Schaffer Sent: Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 03:00 p.m. To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms They also use cloud document management such as Google docs and would need the connectivity if storing notes out there. Instructors need to manage the classroom, not take tools away, IMO. Greg On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 2:52 PM, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.uk wrote: If you have some lead laying around, you could line the rooms and turn the APs off during lecture times... But as other respondents have said it's not really a technology issue, you design your WIFI for full coverage for a reason. Students use laptops to take notes like we all used to use notepads. Similar to using notepads to draw on when bored in a lecture or write notes, our current students use their laptops to use facebook etc. The issue lecturers should look at is why their students are so bored in their lectures that they are losing interest! Many Thanks Peter Peter Methven Network Specialist Heriot-Watt University Edinburgh Scotland EH14 4AS (+44)0 131 4513516 This email has been sent from a mobile phone, please excuse any creative spelling or grammar that may have occured! On 18 Nov 2010, at 20:35, Russ Leathe russ.lea...@gordon.edu wrote: We can push out different SSID's with ACL's that limit what an authenticated user can access. However, our AP heatmap shows leakage from AP's above and below the floors where the classroom are. So, in a nutshell, it wasn't worth it (blocking that is). Especially true once you incorporate emergency notification via 802.11x. I would agree with other colleagues comments, it's an academic/classroom/Professor issue. Northeastern, I believe, did not roll out 802.11x in the classrooms, because the Professors did not want it. The idea behind this decision was you don't need wifi to take notes. I hope this is helpful, Russ From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Luis Fernando Valverde Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2010 2:31 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms Hello, Has anybody used jammer WiFi blockers to block to block wireless network access in classrooms in order to help students to concentrate on course instruction?I would like to know which blockers are being used with success to do this? Can somebody tell me which is the best and cheaper solution (something so easy as turn a switch on/off)? Thanks, Luis Fernando --- Luis Fernando Valverde Director de Tecnología de Información INCAE Business School Tel: +506 24 37 2338 Fax: +506 24 33 9101 fernando.valve...@incae.edu mailto:fernando.valve...@incae.edu www.incae.edu http://www.incae.edu/ --- Error! Filename not specified. El medio ambiente es del interés de todos. Evitemos imprimir correos innecesarios. ** Participation and subscription information
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
Thanks Rick. We are in Costa Rica and regulations are different here. Most of professors want to keep students away from facebook, youtube, blogs, etc during teaching sessions / exams.We need a device to block wireless access to the network in the circumference of the classrooms. Thanks everybody for your opinions and comments Luis Fernando From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Rick Brown Sent: Viernes, 19 de Noviembre de 2010 09:00 a.m. To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms Folks, Rules regarding blocking RF may be different in other countries. He is simply asking if it is possible and how. It is up to him to obey whatever regulations apply in his situation. Rick On 11/19/2010 9:55 AM, Holland, Stephen wrote: Russ, Did you mean Northeastern University?. If so we have had wireless in our classrooms for a few years now and the service is expanding to support future wireless initiatives in the classroom. Like others have stated blocking wireless in the classroom is not the solution. The FCC does not look kindly on jamming devices and even if you did students would figure out other ways to use their mobile devices. Sure you can come up with different ways to shut off access in the classrooms by using different SSID's, authentication approaches, etc. But you create more work for the help desk because wireless is not seamless across the campus and it confuses the students and faculty. What you cannot change is students who have grown up using wireless and their expectation that it will be available for them where ever they go. You are not going to get very far with students in the classroom by disabling wireless! Stephen Holland Network Engineer Northeastern University From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Russ Leathe Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2010 3:34 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms We can push out different SSID's with ACL's that limit what an authenticated user can access. However, our AP heatmap shows leakage from AP's above and below the floors where the classroom are. So, in a nutshell, it wasn't worth it (blocking that is). Especially true once you incorporate emergency notification via 802.11x. I would agree with other colleagues comments, it's an academic/classroom/Professor issue. Northeastern, I believe, did not roll out 802.11x in the classrooms, because the Professors did not want it. The idea behind this decision was you don't need wifi to take notes. I hope this is helpful, Russ From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Luis Fernando Valverde Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2010 2:31 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms Hello, Has anybody used jammer WiFi blockers to block to block wireless network access in classrooms in order to help students to concentrate on course instruction? I would like to know which blockers are being used with success to do this? Can somebody tell me which is the best and cheaper solution (something so easy as turn a switch on/off)? Thanks, Luis Fernando --- Luis Fernando Valverde Director de Tecnología de Información INCAE Business School Tel: +506 24 37 2338 Fax: +506 24 33 9101 fernando.valve...@incae.edu mailto:fernando.valve...@incae.edu www.incae.edu http://www.incae.edu/ --- El medio ambiente es del interés de todos. Evitemos imprimir correos innecesarios. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. -- ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. image001.jpgimage002.gif
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
Luis, Cellular networks (usually licensed spectrum) are not under the same regulations as Wi-Fi (usually unlicensed spectrum). In the US, for instance, one cannot interfere with the licensed spectrum (jammers etc...), and when it comes to the unlicensed spectrum (e.g. Wi-Fi), you have to comply with Part15 of the FCC. Can you interfere with cellular networks in Nicaragua or Costa Rica? (I would double check...otherwise students will remind you!) The point I want to make with Cellular access (Macro towers, DAS, etc..), is that students that cannot join the Wi-Fi network in classrooms will find other wireless technologies to get access (Smartphones, tethering laptops, air-cards or just a book, but not the textbook!). So, students that can afford cellular-data access can still be distracted. This could be an interesting research. The hypothesis would be Is it about who you know or what you know or TextBook VS FaceBook ;-) Philippe Univ. of TN On Nov 19, 2010, at 9:45 AM, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: Yes, we do.The idea is to block any source of wireless connection to the WiFi network. lf From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Hanset, Philippe C Sent: Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 07:42 p.m. To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUmailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms And do you plan to block air-cards on cellular as well with that jammer? Philippe Univ. of TN On Nov 18, 2010, at 4:06 PM, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: I understand your points of view and I agree with some of your comments. However, we use our classrooms for multiple academic activities (MBA programs, seminar and in-company events), and we need to find a simple device to block the signal in a 10-20 meters radius / classroom. So, the adjacent classrooms can work with the signal of their own access points (some professors require Internet signal to teach their sessions – internet dynamics, simulations over the internet, cloud computing services, etc.). I have heard that this is implemented in some universities in the USA, Europe and Asia (for instance, I was told that in the Indian School of Bussiness’ classrooms there are switches to enable/disable wireless signals. I emailed them, but I haven’t received answer yet). Luis Fernando From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Greg Schaffer Sent: Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 03:00 p.m. To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUmailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms They also use cloud document management such as Google docs and would need the connectivity if storing notes out there. Instructors need to manage the classroom, not take tools away, IMO. Greg On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 2:52 PM, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.ukmailto:p.j.meth...@hw.ac.uk wrote: If you have some lead laying around, you could line the rooms and turn the APs off during lecture times... But as other respondents have said it's not really a technology issue, you design your WIFI for full coverage for a reason. Students use laptops to take notes like we all used to use notepads. Similar to using notepads to draw on when bored in a lecture or write notes, our current students use their laptops to use facebook etc. The issue lecturers should look at is why their students are so bored in their lectures that they are losing interest! Many Thanks Peter Peter Methven Network Specialist Heriot-Watt University Edinburgh Scotland EH14 4AS (+44)0 131 4513516 This email has been sent from a mobile phone, please excuse any creative spelling or grammar that may have occured! On 18 Nov 2010, at 20:35, Russ Leathe russ.lea...@gordon.edumailto:russ.lea...@gordon.edu wrote: We can push out different SSID’s with ACL’s that limit what an authenticated user can access. However, our AP heatmap shows leakage from AP’s above and below the floors where the classroom are. So, in a nutshell, it wasn’t worth it (blocking that is). Especially true once you incorporate emergency notification via 802.11x. I would agree with other colleagues comments, it’s an academic/classroom/Professor issue. Northeastern, I believe, did not roll out 802.11x in the classrooms, because the Professors did not want it. The idea behind this decision was “you don’t need wifi to take notes”. I hope this is helpful, Russ From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUmailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Luis Fernando Valverde Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2010 2:31 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUmailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms Hello, Has anybody used jammer WiFi blockers to block
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
Thanks Philippe.I understand you and share your opinion.However, I have to complete my research in order to give a conclusion to the authorities of the Institution. Kind regards, Luis Fernando From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Hanset, Philippe C Sent: Viernes, 19 de Noviembre de 2010 09:31 a.m. To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms Luis, Cellular networks (usually licensed spectrum) are not under the same regulations as Wi-Fi (usually unlicensed spectrum). In the US, for instance, one cannot interfere with the licensed spectrum (jammers etc...), and when it comes to the unlicensed spectrum (e.g. Wi-Fi), you have to comply with Part15 of the FCC. Can you interfere with cellular networks in Nicaragua or Costa Rica? (I would double check...otherwise students will remind you!) The point I want to make with Cellular access (Macro towers, DAS, etc..), is that students that cannot join the Wi-Fi network in classrooms will find other wireless technologies to get access (Smartphones, tethering laptops, air-cards or just a book, but not the textbook!). So, students that can afford cellular-data access can still be distracted. This could be an interesting research. The hypothesis would be Is it about who you know or what you know or TextBook VS FaceBook ;-) Philippe Univ. of TN On Nov 19, 2010, at 9:45 AM, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: Yes, we do.The idea is to block any source of wireless connection to the WiFi network. lf From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Hanset, Philippe C Sent: Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 07:42 p.m. To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms And do you plan to block air-cards on cellular as well with that jammer? Philippe Univ. of TN On Nov 18, 2010, at 4:06 PM, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: I understand your points of view and I agree with some of your comments. However, we use our classrooms for multiple academic activities (MBA programs, seminar and in-company events), and we need to find a simple device to block the signal in a 10-20 meters radius / classroom. So, the adjacent classrooms can work with the signal of their own access points (some professors require Internet signal to teach their sessions - internet dynamics, simulations over the internet, cloud computing services, etc.). I have heard that this is implemented in some universities in the USA, Europe and Asia (for instance, I was told that in the Indian School of Bussiness' classrooms there are switches to enable/disable wireless signals. I emailed them, but I haven't received answer yet). Luis Fernando From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Greg Schaffer Sent: Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 03:00 p.m. To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms They also use cloud document management such as Google docs and would need the connectivity if storing notes out there. Instructors need to manage the classroom, not take tools away, IMO. Greg On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 2:52 PM, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.uk wrote: If you have some lead laying around, you could line the rooms and turn the APs off during lecture times... But as other respondents have said it's not really a technology issue, you design your WIFI for full coverage for a reason. Students use laptops to take notes like we all used to use notepads. Similar to using notepads to draw on when bored in a lecture or write notes, our current students use their laptops to use facebook etc. The issue lecturers should look at is why their students are so bored in their lectures that they are losing interest! Many Thanks Peter Peter Methven Network Specialist Heriot-Watt University Edinburgh Scotland EH14 4AS (+44)0 131 4513516 This email has been sent from a mobile phone, please excuse any creative spelling or grammar that may have occured! On 18 Nov 2010, at 20:35, Russ Leathe russ.lea...@gordon.edu wrote: We can push out different SSID's with ACL's that limit what an authenticated user can access. However, our AP heatmap shows leakage from AP's above and below the floors where the classroom are. So, in a nutshell, it wasn't worth it (blocking that is). Especially true once you incorporate emergency notification via 802.11x. I would agree with other colleagues comments, it's an academic/classroom/Professor issue. Northeastern, I believe, did not roll out 802.11x in the classrooms, because the Professors did
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
As a faculty member who also closely follows developments in the wireless industry, I thought I would share my perspective. I teach an intro networking course to 120 students per semester. I try to edutain whenever possible but it is impossible for me to compete with the Internet for the attention of most students. Network guys/gals need to understand this. If you think you can command the attention of 120 students staring at laptops and smartphones in class, give me a call and I will hire you. I also know enough about wireless to know that dealing with this problem at the physical layer is probably not practical, for many reasons -- financial, technical, and behavioral. If there is any hope for a technical solution, I could envision a system that ties together class rosters, authentication, and location services. But even with that, you don't have any control over commercial wireless services. My current policy is no laptops or smartphones in class. I give students a 10-minute grace period at the start of class for urgent communication. Some students complain about this policy but the majority understand why I do this and feel it helps them focus on course content. The most valid complaint comes from students who take notes in class on their computer. I'm somewhat sympathetic to that, but if you've ever sat next to someone in a meeting who is taking notes on a laptop, you know that the keyboard clatter is distracting, sometimes infuriating. I encourage students to take notes by hand or record the lectures for later transcription, which helps with retention of course content. In my wireless course, which only has about 25-30 students, I have been more hesitant to implement a no-tolerance policy, but even there, I think the only way I could get away with that is to change my presentation style so that I spend more time in the back of the room checking screens and scolding abusers. Alas, one wonders whether there is a solution that will be acceptable to all. Last semester, our Dean implemented a no-laptop policy for faculty meetings, offering to reduce the meeting time by 30 minutes as an incentive. Before this policy, it was a very strange experience, with over half of the faculty attendees working away at their computers while we were supposed to be deliberating about important issues. The policy seemed to be working pretty well until the iPad was released. Now we have faculty coming to the meeting with iPads. It's not a laptop, right? dm Dave Molta Associate Professor Director, BS in Information Management and Technology Assistant Dean for Technology Syracuse University School of Information Studies 212 Hinds Hall Syracuse, NY 13244 315-443-4549 djmo...@syr.edu On 11/19/10 10:30 AM, Hanset, Philippe C phan...@utk.edu wrote: Luis, Cellular networks (usually licensed spectrum) are not under the same regulations as Wi-Fi (usually unlicensed spectrum). In the US, for instance, one cannot interfere with the licensed spectrum (jammers etc...), and when it comes to the unlicensed spectrum (e.g. Wi-Fi), you have to comply with Part15 of the FCC. Can you interfere with cellular networks in Nicaragua or Costa Rica? (I would double check...otherwise students will remind you!) The point I want to make with Cellular access (Macro towers, DAS, etc..), is that students that cannot join the Wi-Fi network in classrooms will find other wireless technologies to get access (Smartphones, tethering laptops, air-cards or just a book, but not the textbook!). So, students that can afford cellular-data access can still be distracted. This could be an interesting research. The hypothesis would be Is it about who you know or what you know or TextBook VS FaceBook ;-) Philippe Univ. of TN On Nov 19, 2010, at 9:45 AM, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: Yes, we do.The idea is to block any source of wireless connection to the WiFi network. lf From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Hanset, Philippe C Sent: Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 07:42 p.m. To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms And do you plan to block air-cards on cellular as well with that jammer? Philippe Univ. of TN On Nov 18, 2010, at 4:06 PM, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: I understand your points of view and I agree with some of your comments. However, we use our classrooms for multiple academic activities (MBA programs, seminar and in-company events), and we need to find a simple device to block the signal in a 10-20 meters radius / classroom. So, the adjacent classrooms can work with the signal of their own access points (some professors require Internet signal to teach their sessions – internet dynamics, simulations over the internet, cloud computing services, etc.). I have heard that this is implemented in some universities in the USA, Europe and Asia (for instance, I was told
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
(Macro towers, DAS, etc..), is that students that cannot join the Wi-Fi network in classrooms will find other wireless technologies to get access (Smartphones, tethering laptops, air-cards or just a book, but not the textbook!). So, students that can afford cellular-data access can still be distracted. This could be an interesting research. The hypothesis would be Is it about who you know or what you know or TextBook VS FaceBook ;-) Philippe Univ. of TN On Nov 19, 2010, at 9:45 AM, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: Yes, we do.The idea is to block any source of wireless connection to the WiFi network. lf *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [ mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUWIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] *On Behalf Of *Hanset, Philippe C *Sent:* Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 07:42 p.m. *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU *Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms And do you plan to block air-cards on cellular as well with that jammer? Philippe Univ. of TN On Nov 18, 2010, at 4:06 PM, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: I understand your points of view and I agree with some of your comments. However, we use our classrooms for multiple academic activities (MBA programs, seminar and in-company events), and we need to find a simple device to block the signal in a 10-20 meters radius / classroom. So, the adjacent classrooms can work with the signal of their own access points (some professors require Internet signal to teach their sessions – internet dynamics, simulations over the internet, cloud computing services, etc.). I have heard that this is implemented in some universities in the USA, Europe and Asia (for instance, I was told that in the Indian School of Bussiness’ classrooms there are switches to enable/disable wireless signals. I emailed them, but I haven’t received answer yet). Luis Fernando *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [ mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUWIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] *On Behalf Of *Greg Schaffer *Sent:* Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 03:00 p.m. *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU *Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms They also use cloud document management such as Google docs and would need the connectivity if storing notes out there. Instructors need to manage the classroom, not take tools away, IMO. Greg On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 2:52 PM, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.uk wrote: If you have some lead laying around, you could line the rooms and turn the APs off during lecture times... But as other respondents have said it's not really a technology issue, you design your WIFI for full coverage for a reason. Students use laptops to take notes like we all used to use notepads. Similar to using notepads to draw on when bored in a lecture or write notes, our current students use their laptops to use facebook etc. The issue lecturers should look at is why their students are so bored in their lectures that they are losing interest! Many Thanks Peter Peter Methven Network Specialist Heriot-Watt University Edinburgh Scotland EH14 4AS (+44)0 131 4513516 This email has been sent from a mobile phone, please excuse any creative spelling or grammar that may have occured! On 18 Nov 2010, at 20:35, Russ Leathe russ.lea...@gordon.edu wrote: We can push out different SSID’s with ACL’s that limit what an authenticated user can access. However, our AP heatmap shows leakage from AP’s above and below the floors where the classroom are. So, in a nutshell, it wasn’t worth it (blocking that is). Especially true once you incorporate emergency notification via 802.11x. I would agree with other colleagues comments, it’s an academic/classroom/Professor issue. Northeastern, I believe, did not roll out 802.11x in the classrooms, because the Professors did not want it. The idea behind this decision was “you don’t need wifi to take notes”. I hope this is helpful, Russ *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto: wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] *On Behalf Of *Luis Fernando Valverde *Sent:* Thursday, November 18, 2010 2:31 PM *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU *Subject:* [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms Hello, Has anybody used jammer WiFi blockers to block to block wireless network access in classrooms in order to help students to concentrate on course instruction?I would like to know which blockers are being used with success to do this? Can somebody tell me which is the best and cheaper solution (something so easy as turn a switch on/off)? Thanks, Luis Fernando --- Luis Fernando Valverde Director de Tecnología de Información INCAE Business School Tel: +506 24 37 2338 Fax: +506 24 33 9101 fernando.valve...@incae.edu mailto:fernando.valve
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
Greg, your suggestion makes sense in many ways especially as those students should be in the class! If they are not in class their punishment is no internet on campus... I would have a concern about what happens when a class location is moved (room or time), or a student changes class/module/course midterm whether this information is fed back correctly and in a timely manner. However this would be easy to implement as long as the student records systems had accurate information. (Which of course they always do ;-) ) Many Thanks Peter Mr Peter Methven, Network Specialist Information Technology (IT) Allen McTernan Building, Edinburgh Campus Tel: 0131 451 3516 For IT support queries or requests, please email ith...@hw.ac.uk mailto:ith...@hw.ac.uk or phone ext 4045, with full details of your query or request and your contact details. http://www.hw.ac.uk/it From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Greg Schaffer Sent: 19 November 2010 16:35 To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms David, that's an interesting perspective. I have had the opposite experience when I have taught. Now, I should say that I am in IT and taught as an adjunct one intro networking class to 25-35 students. At the beginning of the first class I told them that I am not going to regulate use of electronic devices in class; if they wanted to watch videos all during the class that was their decision *so long as it did not interfere with the class or other students*. I also made it clear that they were responsible for all work in class and not paying attention in class was not a valid reason for extra attention during office hours. It worked well, but it might have been a function of the smaller class size. Tinkering on a device did not relieve you from being called on, and class participation was part of he grade. Having said that, I never had anyone complain of another's laptop use bothering them; if I had I would have adjusted. Actually, I only had a few using laptops, and often they would use it to research class topics as I was talking. Bottom line, in my experience (limited), letting students decide worked the best. But I can certainly see the other side. Finally, with regards to WiFi blocking, I don't think the simplest solution has been offered yet. If the wireless is accessed via credentials, create an LDAP/AD/Radius interface that can disable those accounts during a specified class time, or on command from the instructor. Can it be done? I don't see why not, but I may be missing something(s)... Greg As a side note, authentication On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 10:02 AM, David J Molta djmo...@syr.edu wrote: As a faculty member who also closely follows developments in the wireless industry, I thought I would share my perspective. I teach an intro networking course to 120 students per semester. I try to edutain whenever possible but it is impossible for me to compete with the Internet for the attention of most students. Network guys/gals need to understand this. If you think you can command the attention of 120 students staring at laptops and smartphones in class, give me a call and I will hire you. I also know enough about wireless to know that dealing with this problem at the physical layer is probably not practical, for many reasons -- financial, technical, and behavioral. If there is any hope for a technical solution, I could envision a system that ties together class rosters, authentication, and location services. But even with that, you don't have any control over commercial wireless services. My current policy is no laptops or smartphones in class. I give students a 10-minute grace period at the start of class for urgent communication. Some students complain about this policy but the majority understand why I do this and feel it helps them focus on course content. The most valid complaint comes from students who take notes in class on their computer. I'm somewhat sympathetic to that, but if you've ever sat next to someone in a meeting who is taking notes on a laptop, you know that the keyboard clatter is distracting, sometimes infuriating. I encourage students to take notes by hand or record the lectures for later transcription, which helps with retention of course content. In my wireless course, which only has about 25-30 students, I have been more hesitant to implement a no-tolerance policy, but even there, I think the only way I could get away with that is to change my presentation style so that I spend more time in the back of the room checking screens and scolding abusers. Alas, one wonders whether there is a solution that will be acceptable to all. Last semester, our Dean implemented a no-laptop policy for faculty meetings, offering to reduce the meeting time by 30 minutes as an incentive. Before this policy
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
that will be acceptable to all. Last semester, our Dean implemented a no-laptop policy for faculty meetings, offering to reduce the meeting time by 30 minutes as an incentive. Before this policy, it was a very strange experience, with over half of the faculty attendees working away at their computers while we were supposed to be deliberating about important issues. The policy seemed to be working pretty well until the iPad was released. Now we have faculty coming to the meeting with iPads. It's not a laptop, right? dm Dave Molta Associate Professor Director, BS in Information Management and Technology Assistant Dean for Technology Syracuse University School of Information Studies 212 Hinds Hall Syracuse, NY 13244 315-443-4549 djmo...@syr.edu http://djmo...@syr.edu On 11/19/10 10:30 AM, Hanset, Philippe C phan...@utk.edu http://phan...@utk.edu wrote: Luis, Cellular networks (usually licensed spectrum) are not under the same regulations as Wi-Fi (usually unlicensed spectrum). In the US, for instance, one cannot interfere with the licensed spectrum (jammers etc...), and when it comes to the unlicensed spectrum (e.g. Wi-Fi), you have to comply with Part15 of the FCC. Can you interfere with cellular networks in Nicaragua or Costa Rica? (I would double check...otherwise students will remind you!) The point I want to make with Cellular access (Macro towers, DAS, etc..), is that students that cannot join the Wi-Fi network in classrooms will find other wireless technologies to get access (Smartphones, tethering laptops, air-cards or just a book, but not the textbook!). So, students that can afford cellular-data access can still be distracted. This could be an interesting research. The hypothesis would be Is it about who you know or what you know or TextBook VS FaceBook ;-) Philippe Univ. of TN On Nov 19, 2010, at 9:45 AM, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: Yes, we do.The idea is to block any source of wireless connection to the WiFi network. lf *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] *On Behalf Of *Hanset, Philippe C *Sent:* Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 07:42 p.m. *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU http://WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU *Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms And do you plan to block air-cards on cellular as well with that jammer? Philippe Univ. of TN On Nov 18, 2010, at 4:06 PM, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: I understand your points of view and I agree with some of your comments. However, we use our classrooms for multiple academic activities (MBA programs, seminar and in-company events), and we need to find a simple device to block the signal in a 10-20 meters radius / classroom. So, the adjacent classrooms can work with the signal of their own access points (some professors require Internet signal to teach their sessions – internet dynamics, simulations over the internet, cloud computing services, etc.). I have heard that this is implemented in some universities in the USA, Europe and Asia (for instance, I was told that in the Indian School of Bussiness’ classrooms there are switches to enable/disable wireless signals. I emailed them, but I haven’t received answer yet). Luis Fernando *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] *On Behalf Of *Greg Schaffer *Sent:* Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 03:00 p.m. *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU http://WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU *Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms They also use cloud document management such as Google docs and would need the connectivity if storing notes out there. Instructors need to manage the classroom, not take tools away, IMO. Greg On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 2:52 PM, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.uk http://p.j.meth...@hw.ac.uk wrote: If you have some lead laying around, you could line the rooms and turn the APs off during lecture times... But as other respondents have said it's not really a technology issue, you design your WIFI for full coverage for a reason
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 At 10:56 AM -0600 11/19/10, heath.barnhart wrote: Shouldn't be too hard, just throwing out some what-ifs. The first one that pops into my mind is what if the student is not in class and expecting to get wireless access elsewhere? Perhaps even in the room next door that's serviced by the same AP? -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: 9.9.1.287 wj8DBQFM5qy1DlQHnMkeAWMRAucLAKCedwKGlT3pVMtGHDPgW/+MncxWvgCfSeAk zv1oAXbX0as/rTCRMPTp+dA= =mZnI -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- Julian Y. Koh mailto:kohs...@northwestern.edu Manager, Network Transport phone:847-467-5780 Telecommunications and Network Services Northwestern University PGP Public Key:http://bt.ittns.northwestern.edu/julian/pgppubkey.html ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
Syracuse University School of Information Studies 212 Hinds Hall Syracuse, NY 13244 315-443-4549 djmo...@syr.edu http://djmo...@syr.edu On 11/19/10 10:30 AM, Hanset, Philippe C phan...@utk.edu http://phan...@utk.edu wrote: Luis, Cellular networks (usually licensed spectrum) are not under the same regulations as Wi-Fi (usually unlicensed spectrum). In the US, for instance, one cannot interfere with the licensed spectrum (jammers etc...), and when it comes to the unlicensed spectrum (e.g. Wi-Fi), you have to comply with Part15 of the FCC. Can you interfere with cellular networks in Nicaragua or Costa Rica? (I would double check...otherwise students will remind you!) The point I want to make with Cellular access (Macro towers, DAS, etc..), is that students that cannot join the Wi-Fi network in classrooms will find other wireless technologies to get access (Smartphones, tethering laptops, air-cards or just a book, but not the textbook!). So, students that can afford cellular-data access can still be distracted. This could be an interesting research. The hypothesis would be Is it about who you know or what you know or TextBook VS FaceBook ;-) Philippe Univ. of TN On Nov 19, 2010, at 9:45 AM, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: Yes, we do.The idea is to block any source of wireless connection to the WiFi network. lf *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] *On Behalf Of *Hanset, Philippe C *Sent:* Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 07:42 p.m. *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU http://WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU *Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms And do you plan to block air-cards on cellular as well with that jammer? Philippe Univ. of TN On Nov 18, 2010, at 4:06 PM, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: I understand your points of view and I agree with some of your comments. However, we use our classrooms for multiple academic activities (MBA programs, seminar and in-company events), and we need to find a simple device to block the signal in a 10-20 meters radius / classroom. So, the adjacent classrooms can work with the signal of their own access points (some professors require Internet signal to teach their sessions – internet dynamics, simulations over the internet, cloud computing services, etc.). I have heard that this is implemented in some universities in the USA, Europe and Asia (for instance, I was told that in the Indian School of Bussiness’ classrooms there are switches to enable/disable wireless signals. I emailed them, but I haven’t received answer yet). Luis Fernando *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] *On Behalf Of *Greg Schaffer *Sent:* Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 03:00 p.m. *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU http://WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU *Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms They also use cloud document management such as Google docs and would need the connectivity if storing notes out there. Instructors need to manage the classroom, not take tools away, IMO. Greg On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 2:52 PM, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.uk http://p.j.meth...@hw.ac.uk wrote: If you have some lead laying around, you could line the rooms and turn the APs off during lecture times... But as other respondents have said it's not really a technology issue, you design your WIFI for full coverage for a reason. Students use laptops to take notes like we all used to use notepads. Similar to using notepads to draw on when bored in a lecture or write notes, our current students use their laptops to use facebook etc. The issue lecturers should look at is why their students are so bored in their lectures that they are losing interest! Many Thanks Peter Peter Methven Network Specialist Heriot-Watt University Edinburgh Scotland EH14 4AS (+44)0 131 4513516 This email has been sent from a mobile phone, please excuse any creative
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
On Nov 19, 2010, at 10:35 AM, Greg Schaffer wrote: Finally, with regards to WiFi blocking, I don't think the simplest solution has been offered yet. If the wireless is accessed via credentials, create an LDAP/AD/Radius interface that can disable those accounts during a specified class time, or on command from the instructor. Can it be done? I don't see why not, but I may be missing something(s)... Greg You would have to tune the wireless system to require re-authentication quite often, otherwise students could just connect to the network 5 minutes be fore class and still be connected during class. Also this would create a situation where students are highly motivated to share their access credentials with others. Is the administrative overhead to enter all of the data for class times worth it when the future will only bring higher and higher percentages of students with smart phones or netbooks that access the Internet through 3G and 4g celluar?
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
Something to keep in mind with WiFi location services is that the level of accuracy ranges from 3-10 meters, depending on AP placement, AP density, and environmental factors. If your deployment isn't built with location accuracy in mind, then regulating access based on location may not be a viable solution. -- Tamarack Birch-wheeles Network Engineer Portland State University - Networking and Telecommunications Phone: (503)725-3201 On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 10:31 AM, Michael Horne michael.ho...@olin.eduwrote: I am surprised no one has seen this before. http://www.trapezenetworks.com/products/rf_firewall/ Location based solution with Trapeze location engine. Not cheap but it does the job of being able to control access by location as requested. We looked at it last year but was cost prohibitive given our schools limited population. Michael Horne Network Engineer FW Olin college of Engineering 781-292-2438 -Original Message- From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto: wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Curtis, Bruce Sent: Friday, November 19, 2010 1:14 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms On Nov 19, 2010, at 10:35 AM, Greg Schaffer wrote: Finally, with regards to WiFi blocking, I don't think the simplest solution has been offered yet. If the wireless is accessed via credentials, create an LDAP/AD/Radius interface that can disable those accounts during a specified class time, or on command from the instructor. Can it be done? I don't see why not, but I may be missing something(s)... Greg You would have to tune the wireless system to require re-authentication quite often, otherwise students could just connect to the network 5 minutes be fore class and still be connected during class. Also this would create a situation where students are highly motivated to share their access credentials with others. Is the administrative overhead to enter all of the data for class times worth it when the future will only bring higher and higher percentages of students with smart phones or netbooks that access the Internet through 3G and 4g celluar? ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
Oh, I don't think it's worth it; I believe this to be an instruction issue, but there are good points on both sides. Wouldn't need re-authentication; just some method of kicking off those authenticated users at specified times. I'm not a programmer, nor do I know if this is done in any product, but I'd think it would be possible to do. The sharing of access creds is a good point. BUT, if the authentication was by machine and not user, that would go far in solving that issue. For example, Enterasys NAC authenticates on MAC address that has been registered by a user. SO the algorithm would be look at class list, look at student user id, look at MAC(s) registered, perform individual block action. And I will say again, yes, a lot of work to solve what I think is an instructor issue, and yes it does nothing to address 3/4G. But it's an interesting academic exercise...if you'll pardon the pun :) Greg On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 12:13 PM, Curtis, Bruce bruce.cur...@ndsu.eduwrote: On Nov 19, 2010, at 10:35 AM, Greg Schaffer wrote: Finally, with regards to WiFi blocking, I don't think the simplest solution has been offered yet. If the wireless is accessed via credentials, create an LDAP/AD/Radius interface that can disable those accounts during a specified class time, or on command from the instructor. Can it be done? I don't see why not, but I may be missing something(s)... Greg You would have to tune the wireless system to require re-authentication quite often, otherwise students could just connect to the network 5 minutes be fore class and still be connected during class. Also this would create a situation where students are highly motivated to share their access credentials with others. Is the administrative overhead to enter all of the data for class times worth it when the future will only bring higher and higher percentages of students with smart phones or netbooks that access the Internet through 3G and 4g celluar? ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
On Nov 19, 2010, at 1:08 PM, Greg Schaffer wrote: Oh, I don't think it's worth it; I believe this to be an instruction issue, but there are good points on both sides. Wouldn't need re-authentication; just some method of kicking off those authenticated users at specified times. I'm not a programmer, nor do I know if this is done in any product, but I'd think it would be possible to do. The sharing of access creds is a good point. BUT, if the authentication was by machine and not user, that would go far in solving that issue. For example, Enterasys NAC authenticates on MAC address that has been registered by a user. SO the algorithm would be look at class list, look at student user id, look at MAC(s) registered, perform individual block action. MAC addresses are easily changed/spoofed on modern laptops, probably not as easily spoofed on smartphones though yet (or is there already and app for that?) Two factor identification would be more robust than machine identification. Students might be less likely to share smartcards or other physical devices than simple passwords. And I will say again, yes, a lot of work to solve what I think is an instructor issue, and yes it does nothing to address 3/4G. But it's an interesting academic exercise...if you'll pardon the pun :) Greg On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 12:13 PM, Curtis, Bruce bruce.cur...@ndsu.edu wrote: On Nov 19, 2010, at 10:35 AM, Greg Schaffer wrote: Finally, with regards to WiFi blocking, I don't think the simplest solution has been offered yet. If the wireless is accessed via credentials, create an LDAP/AD/Radius interface that can disable those accounts during a specified class time, or on command from the instructor. Can it be done? I don't see why not, but I may be missing something(s)... Greg You would have to tune the wireless system to require re-authentication quite often, otherwise students could just connect to the network 5 minutes be fore class and still be connected during class. Also this would create a situation where students are highly motivated to share their access credentials with others. Is the administrative overhead to enter all of the data for class times worth it when the future will only bring higher and higher percentages of students with smart phones or netbooks that access the Internet through 3G and 4g celluar? ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. --- Bruce Curtis bruce.cur...@ndsu.edu Certified NetAnalyst II701-231-8527 North Dakota State University
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
We have been wrestling with this idea of blocking students on our wireless for some time. I think the solution is to provide technology that increases student participation in classroom so they won't be as distracted by social media. Some technologies that I have come across: Hotseat by Perdue. http://www.itap.purdue.edu/studio/hotseat/ Google Moderator and Forms come to mind. The clickers seem to help. If anybody has ideas on technologies that work in the classroom I'm all ears. -- Nicholas Urrea Information Technology UC Hastings College of the Law urr...@uchastings.edu x4718 -Original Message- From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Curtis, Bruce Sent: Friday, November 19, 2010 11:20 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms On Nov 19, 2010, at 1:08 PM, Greg Schaffer wrote: Oh, I don't think it's worth it; I believe this to be an instruction issue, but there are good points on both sides. Wouldn't need re-authentication; just some method of kicking off those authenticated users at specified times. I'm not a programmer, nor do I know if this is done in any product, but I'd think it would be possible to do. The sharing of access creds is a good point. BUT, if the authentication was by machine and not user, that would go far in solving that issue. For example, Enterasys NAC authenticates on MAC address that has been registered by a user. SO the algorithm would be look at class list, look at student user id, look at MAC(s) registered, perform individual block action. MAC addresses are easily changed/spoofed on modern laptops, probably not as easily spoofed on smartphones though yet (or is there already and app for that?) Two factor identification would be more robust than machine identification. Students might be less likely to share smartcards or other physical devices than simple passwords. And I will say again, yes, a lot of work to solve what I think is an instructor issue, and yes it does nothing to address 3/4G. But it's an interesting academic exercise...if you'll pardon the pun :) Greg On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 12:13 PM, Curtis, Bruce bruce.cur...@ndsu.edu wrote: On Nov 19, 2010, at 10:35 AM, Greg Schaffer wrote: Finally, with regards to WiFi blocking, I don't think the simplest solution has been offered yet. If the wireless is accessed via credentials, create an LDAP/AD/Radius interface that can disable those accounts during a specified class time, or on command from the instructor. Can it be done? I don't see why not, but I may be missing something(s)... Greg You would have to tune the wireless system to require re-authentication quite often, otherwise students could just connect to the network 5 minutes be fore class and still be connected during class. Also this would create a situation where students are highly motivated to share their access credentials with others. Is the administrative overhead to enter all of the data for class times worth it when the future will only bring higher and higher percentages of students with smart phones or netbooks that access the Internet through 3G and 4g celluar? ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. --- Bruce Curtis bruce.cur...@ndsu.edu Certified NetAnalyst II701-231-8527 North Dakota State University ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
We've looked at it before, the location accuracy is very good, but as I mentioned before you will need to adjust radius reauth timers for it to work at its best from my understanding for what is being talked about here. (plus we didn't really need that level of location tracking, the Trapeze management software already gets you to room level pretty reliably). I think the location box was initially intended to track high value equipment and alert when it left an area working with RFID tags etc. and also to allow it to be located etc. I know our reseller has mentioned their main market for it has been the UK NHS for tracking trolley mounted scanners, monitors etc. Many Thanks Peter This email has been sent from a mobile phone, please excuse any creative spelling or grammar that may have occured! On 19 Nov 2010, at 18:31, Michael Horne michael.ho...@olin.edu wrote: I am surprised no one has seen this before. http://www.trapezenetworks.com/products/rf_firewall/ Location based solution with Trapeze location engine. Not cheap but it does the job of being able to control access by location as requested. We looked at it last year but was cost prohibitive given our schools limited population. Michael Horne Network Engineer FW Olin college of Engineering 781-292-2438 -Original Message- From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Curtis, Bruce Sent: Friday, November 19, 2010 1:14 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms On Nov 19, 2010, at 10:35 AM, Greg Schaffer wrote: Finally, with regards to WiFi blocking, I don't think the simplest solution has been offered yet. If the wireless is accessed via credentials, create an LDAP/AD/Radius interface that can disable those accounts during a specified class time, or on command from the instructor. Can it be done? I don't see why not, but I may be missing something(s)... Greg You would have to tune the wireless system to require re-authentication quite often, otherwise students could just connect to the network 5 minutes be fore class and still be connected during class. Also this would create a situation where students are highly motivated to share their access credentials with others. Is the administrative overhead to enter all of the data for class times worth it when the future will only bring higher and higher percentages of students with smart phones or netbooks that access the Internet through 3G and 4g celluar? ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. -- Heriot-Watt University is a Scottish charity registered under charity number SC000278. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
And the law of unintended consequences strikes again: Students figure this out and exchange credentials with those who aren't supposed to be in class at the time. End result: not only do you have student using the network, but you've now compromised the passwords of any number of students. On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 8:50 AM, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.ukwrote: Greg, your suggestion makes sense in many ways especially as those students should be in the class! If they are not in class their “punishment” is no internet on campus... I would have a concern about what happens when a class location is moved (room or time), or a student changes class/module/course midterm whether this information is fed back correctly and in a timely manner. However this would be easy to implement as long as the student records systems had accurate information. (Which of course they always do ;-) ) Many Thanks Peter Mr Peter Methven, Network Specialist Information Technology (IT) Allen McTernan Building, Edinburgh Campus Tel: 0131 451 3516 For IT support queries or requests, please email ith...@hw.ac.uk or phone ext 4045, with full details of your query or request and your contact details. http://www.hw.ac.uk/it *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto: wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] *On Behalf Of *Greg Schaffer *Sent:* 19 November 2010 16:35 *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU *Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms David, that's an interesting perspective. I have had the opposite experience when I have taught. Now, I should say that I am in IT and taught as an adjunct one intro networking class to 25-35 students. At the beginning of the first class I told them that I am not going to regulate use of electronic devices in class; if they wanted to watch videos all during the class that was their decision *so long as it did not interfere with the class or other students*. I also made it clear that they were responsible for all work in class and not paying attention in class was not a valid reason for extra attention during office hours. It worked well, but it might have been a function of the smaller class size. Tinkering on a device did not relieve you from being called on, and class participation was part of he grade. Having said that, I never had anyone complain of another's laptop use bothering them; if I had I would have adjusted. Actually, I only had a few using laptops, and often they would use it to research class topics as I was talking. Bottom line, in my experience (limited), letting students decide worked the best. But I can certainly see the other side. Finally, with regards to WiFi blocking, I don't think the simplest solution has been offered yet. If the wireless is accessed via credentials, create an LDAP/AD/Radius interface that can disable those accounts during a specified class time, or on command from the instructor. Can it be done? I don't see why not, but I may be missing something(s)... Greg As a side note, authentication On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 10:02 AM, David J Molta djmo...@syr.edu wrote: As a faculty member who also closely follows developments in the wireless industry, I thought I would share my perspective. I teach an intro networking course to 120 students per semester. I try to edutain whenever possible but it is impossible for me to compete with the Internet for the attention of most students. Network guys/gals need to understand this. If you think you can command the attention of 120 students staring at laptops and smartphones in class, give me a call and I will hire you. I also know enough about wireless to know that dealing with this problem at the physical layer is probably not practical, for many reasons -- financial, technical, and behavioral. If there is any hope for a technical solution, I could envision a system that ties together class rosters, authentication, and location services. But even with that, you don't have any control over commercial wireless services. My current policy is no laptops or smartphones in class. I give students a 10-minute grace period at the start of class for urgent communication. Some students complain about this policy but the majority understand why I do this and feel it helps them focus on course content. The most valid complaint comes from students who take notes in class on their computer. I'm somewhat sympathetic to that, but if you've ever sat next to someone in a meeting who is taking notes on a laptop, you know that the keyboard clatter is distracting, sometimes infuriating. I encourage students to take notes by hand or record the lectures for later transcription, which helps with retention of course content. In my wireless course, which only has about 25-30 students, I have been more hesitant to implement a no-tolerance policy, but even there, I think the only
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
Block wi-fi and people would likely go cellular. Block cellular and people would likely go to public safety. Significant liability in event of endangerment or personal injury. -Original Message- From: John Rodkey rod...@westmont.edu Sender: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2010 13:20:52 To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Reply-To: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms And the law of unintended consequences strikes again: Students figure this out and exchange credentials with those who aren't supposed to be in class at the time. End result: not only do you have student using the network, but you've now compromised the passwords of any number of students. On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 8:50 AM, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.ukwrote: Greg, your suggestion makes sense in many ways especially as those students should be in the class! If they are not in class their “punishment” is no internet on campus... I would have a concern about what happens when a class location is moved (room or time), or a student changes class/module/course midterm whether this information is fed back correctly and in a timely manner. However this would be easy to implement as long as the student records systems had accurate information. (Which of course they always do ;-) ) Many Thanks Peter Mr Peter Methven, Network Specialist Information Technology (IT) Allen McTernan Building, Edinburgh Campus Tel: 0131 451 3516 For IT support queries or requests, please email ith...@hw.ac.uk or phone ext 4045, with full details of your query or request and your contact details. http://www.hw.ac.uk/it *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto: wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] *On Behalf Of *Greg Schaffer *Sent:* 19 November 2010 16:35 *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU *Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms David, that's an interesting perspective. I have had the opposite experience when I have taught. Now, I should say that I am in IT and taught as an adjunct one intro networking class to 25-35 students. At the beginning of the first class I told them that I am not going to regulate use of electronic devices in class; if they wanted to watch videos all during the class that was their decision *so long as it did not interfere with the class or other students*. I also made it clear that they were responsible for all work in class and not paying attention in class was not a valid reason for extra attention during office hours. It worked well, but it might have been a function of the smaller class size. Tinkering on a device did not relieve you from being called on, and class participation was part of he grade. Having said that, I never had anyone complain of another's laptop use bothering them; if I had I would have adjusted. Actually, I only had a few using laptops, and often they would use it to research class topics as I was talking. Bottom line, in my experience (limited), letting students decide worked the best. But I can certainly see the other side. Finally, with regards to WiFi blocking, I don't think the simplest solution has been offered yet. If the wireless is accessed via credentials, create an LDAP/AD/Radius interface that can disable those accounts during a specified class time, or on command from the instructor. Can it be done? I don't see why not, but I may be missing something(s)... Greg As a side note, authentication On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 10:02 AM, David J Molta djmo...@syr.edu wrote: As a faculty member who also closely follows developments in the wireless industry, I thought I would share my perspective. I teach an intro networking course to 120 students per semester. I try to edutain whenever possible but it is impossible for me to compete with the Internet for the attention of most students. Network guys/gals need to understand this. If you think you can command the attention of 120 students staring at laptops and smartphones in class, give me a call and I will hire you. I also know enough about wireless to know that dealing with this problem at the physical layer is probably not practical, for many reasons -- financial, technical, and behavioral. If there is any hope for a technical solution, I could envision a system that ties together class rosters, authentication, and location services. But even with that, you don't have any control over commercial wireless services. My current policy is no laptops or smartphones in class. I give students a 10-minute grace period at the start of class for urgent communication. Some students complain about this policy but the majority understand why I do this and feel it helps
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
And if you offer guest access, that is another end run that students will find and use. We prefer to keep the students authenticated and using an encrypted connection as a matter of general security - anyone heard of Firesheep? Addressing this issue with technology really is a losing proposition. Students will find ways around any method we use to limit there access. In my day, it was the comic or other book inside the textbook, passing notes, or skipping class. Today it's the Internet, Facebook, IM, and texting. It really needs to be addressed in the classroom by the instructors and the students. On a lighter note, I have this Doonesbury cartoon on my cube wall to remind me of what the students are really doing with Wi-Fi (or 3/4G) access. http://www.gocomics.com/doonesbury/2008/04/27 There was an HP laptop TV ad from about the same time that highlighted this issue as well (motocross bikes and rock bands in the lecture hall), but I've not been able to find it online. If anyone remembers it and has a link, please share! - Stan Brooks - CWNA/CWSP Emory University University Technology Services 404.727.0226 AIM/Y!/Twitter: WLANstan MSN: wlans...@hotmail.commailto:wlans...@hotmail.com GoogleTalk: wlans...@gmail.commailto:wlans...@gmail.com From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] on behalf of John Rodkey [rod...@westmont.edu] Sent: Friday, November 19, 2010 4:20 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms And the law of unintended consequences strikes again: Students figure this out and exchange credentials with those who aren't supposed to be in class at the time. End result: not only do you have student using the network, but you've now compromised the passwords of any number of students. On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 8:50 AM, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.ukmailto:p.j.meth...@hw.ac.uk wrote: Greg, your suggestion makes sense in many ways especially as those students should be in the class! If they are not in class their “punishment” is no internet on campus... I would have a concern about what happens when a class location is moved (room or time), or a student changes class/module/course midterm whether this information is fed back correctly and in a timely manner. However this would be easy to implement as long as the student records systems had accurate information. (Which of course they always do ;-) ) Many Thanks Peter Mr Peter Methven, Network Specialist Information Technology (IT) Allen McTernan Building, Edinburgh Campus Tel: 0131 451 3516 For IT support queries or requests, please email ith...@hw.ac.ukmailto:ith...@hw.ac.uk or phone ext 4045, with full details of your query or request and your contact details. http://www.hw.ac.uk/it From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUmailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Greg Schaffer Sent: 19 November 2010 16:35 To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUmailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms David, that's an interesting perspective. I have had the opposite experience when I have taught. Now, I should say that I am in IT and taught as an adjunct one intro networking class to 25-35 students. At the beginning of the first class I told them that I am not going to regulate use of electronic devices in class; if they wanted to watch videos all during the class that was their decision *so long as it did not interfere with the class or other students*. I also made it clear that they were responsible for all work in class and not paying attention in class was not a valid reason for extra attention during office hours. It worked well, but it might have been a function of the smaller class size. Tinkering on a device did not relieve you from being called on, and class participation was part of he grade. Having said that, I never had anyone complain of another's laptop use bothering them; if I had I would have adjusted. Actually, I only had a few using laptops, and often they would use it to research class topics as I was talking. Bottom line, in my experience (limited), letting students decide worked the best. But I can certainly see the other side. Finally, with regards to WiFi blocking, I don't think the simplest solution has been offered yet. If the wireless is accessed via credentials, create an LDAP/AD/Radius interface that can disable those accounts during a specified class time, or on command from the instructor. Can it be done? I don't see why not, but I may be missing something(s)... Greg As a side note, authentication On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 10:02 AM, David J Molta djmo...@syr.edumailto:djmo...@syr.edu wrote: As a faculty member who also closely follows developments
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
I don't think it's an instructor issue or a technical issue. It's a student issue. Some students will use wifi to goof off in class. Some will use it to help them take better notes or in other ways to help them do better. Others won't use it all. The point here is that it's a tool; perhaps a tool in immature hands, but a tool nonetheless. I remember my last year of school I managed to acquire a Windows 3.1 laptop for free that the prior owner had written off as broken. I used it to take notes some, but used in class a lot more to play solitaire. I'm unapologetic for this, because playing solitaire in class helped me to do better. No instructor can engage 100% of students 100% of the time, and having the ready distraction available to keep my mind active helped prevent me from zoning out entirely. I'm sure that at times it distracted more than it helped, but my feeling was that overall it ended in a big net positive and probably bought me almost a full letter grade in every class where I was able to use it. Joel Coehoorn IT Director, York College 402.363.5603 On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 5:50 PM, Brooks, Stan stan.bro...@emory.edu wrote: And if you offer guest access, that is another end run that students will find and use. We prefer to keep the students authenticated and using an encrypted connection as a matter of general security - anyone heard of Firesheep? Addressing this issue with technology really is a losing proposition. Students will find ways around any method we use to limit there access. In my day, it was the comic or other book inside the textbook, passing notes, or skipping class. Today it's the Internet, Facebook, IM, and texting. It really needs to be addressed in the classroom by the instructors and the students. On a lighter note, I have this Doonesbury cartoon on my cube wall to remind me of what the students are really doing with Wi-Fi (or 3/4G) access. http://www.gocomics.com/doonesbury/2008/04/27 There was an HP laptop TV ad from about the same time that highlighted this issue as well (motocross bikes and rock bands in the lecture hall), but I've not been able to find it online. If anyone remembers it and has a link, please share! - Stan Brooks - CWNA/CWSP Emory University University Technology Services 404.727.0226 AIM/Y!/Twitter: WLANstan MSN: wlans...@hotmail.com GoogleTalk: wlans...@gmail.com -- *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [ wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] on behalf of John Rodkey [ rod...@westmont.edu] *Sent:* Friday, November 19, 2010 4:20 PM *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU *Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms And the law of unintended consequences strikes again: Students figure this out and exchange credentials with those who aren't supposed to be in class at the time. End result: not only do you have student using the network, but you've now compromised the passwords of any number of students. On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 8:50 AM, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.ukwrote: Greg, your suggestion makes sense in many ways especially as those students should be in the class! If they are not in class their “punishment” is no internet on campus... I would have a concern about what happens when a class location is moved (room or time), or a student changes class/module/course midterm whether this information is fed back correctly and in a timely manner. However this would be easy to implement as long as the student records systems had accurate information. (Which of course they always do ;-) ) Many Thanks Peter Mr Peter Methven, Network Specialist Information Technology (IT) Allen McTernan Building, Edinburgh Campus Tel: 0131 451 3516 For IT support queries or requests, please email ith...@hw.ac.uk or phone ext 4045, with full details of your query or request and your contact details. http://www.hw.ac.uk/it *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto: wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] *On Behalf Of *Greg Schaffer *Sent:* 19 November 2010 16:35 *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU *Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms David, that's an interesting perspective. I have had the opposite experience when I have taught. Now, I should say that I am in IT and taught as an adjunct one intro networking class to 25-35 students. At the beginning of the first class I told them that I am not going to regulate use of electronic devices in class; if they wanted to watch videos all during the class that was their decision *so long as it did not interfere with the class or other students*. I also made it clear that they were responsible for all work in class and not paying attention in class was not a valid reason for extra attention during office hours. It worked well, but it might have been
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
You make an excellent point. I also teach part time, but would be my own worst student. Unless the material is absolutely riveting and the instructor totally engaging, I easily get bored to the point of daydreaming. Connectivity helps me either productively screw off or to get closer to the material, depending on the situation, but to me either is better than slamming my head into the desk when I fall asleep. It's easy to command students to stay focused, and also easy to forget what it's like to be a student and how hard staying equally engaged in all subject matter and instructor types can be. I've had some damn boring instructors, and some who's English is so poor that I couldn't follow the lecture if you put a gun to my head. Thankfully I also usually had either connectivity or a book or something to fill my time while getting points for attendance. Ultimately, students are responsible for their own grades, and behaviors. K-12 is behind them, now they're at the big table and if they bomb a course from too much in-class Facebook, perhaps a lesson will be learned. I know that from my perspective as a WLAN administrator, system designer, writer and enforcer of policy, and one who deals with every demographic on campus, I could not imagine trying to manipulate the WLAN to control in-class behavior. I'd rather spend time on something that has a chance of succeeding. -Lee Badman From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Coehoorn, Joel [jcoeho...@york.edu] Sent: Friday, November 19, 2010 7:47 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms I don't think it's an instructor issue or a technical issue. It's a student issue. Some students will use wifi to goof off in class. Some will use it to help them take better notes or in other ways to help them do better. Others won't use it all. The point here is that it's a tool; perhaps a tool in immature hands, but a tool nonetheless. I remember my last year of school I managed to acquire a Windows 3.1 laptop for free that the prior owner had written off as broken. I used it to take notes some, but used in class a lot more to play solitaire. I'm unapologetic for this, because playing solitaire in class helped me to do better. No instructor can engage 100% of students 100% of the time, and having the ready distraction available to keep my mind active helped prevent me from zoning out entirely. I'm sure that at times it distracted more than it helped, but my feeling was that overall it ended in a big net positive and probably bought me almost a full letter grade in every class where I was able to use it. Joel Coehoorn IT Director, York College 402.363.5603 On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 5:50 PM, Brooks, Stan stan.bro...@emory.edumailto:stan.bro...@emory.edu wrote: And if you offer guest access, that is another end run that students will find and use. We prefer to keep the students authenticated and using an encrypted connection as a matter of general security - anyone heard of Firesheep? Addressing this issue with technology really is a losing proposition. Students will find ways around any method we use to limit there access. In my day, it was the comic or other book inside the textbook, passing notes, or skipping class. Today it's the Internet, Facebook, IM, and texting. It really needs to be addressed in the classroom by the instructors and the students. On a lighter note, I have this Doonesbury cartoon on my cube wall to remind me of what the students are really doing with Wi-Fi (or 3/4G) access. http://www.gocomics.com/doonesbury/2008/04/27 There was an HP laptop TV ad from about the same time that highlighted this issue as well (motocross bikes and rock bands in the lecture hall), but I've not been able to find it online. If anyone remembers it and has a link, please share! - Stan Brooks - CWNA/CWSP Emory University University Technology Services 404.727.0226 AIM/Y!/Twitter: WLANstan MSN: wlans...@hotmail.commailto:wlans...@hotmail.com GoogleTalk: wlans...@gmail.commailto:wlans...@gmail.com From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [wireless-...@listserv.educause.edumailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] on behalf of John Rodkey [rod...@westmont.edumailto:rod...@westmont.edu] Sent: Friday, November 19, 2010 4:20 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUmailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms And the law of unintended consequences strikes again: Students figure this out and exchange credentials with those who aren't supposed to be in class at the time. End result: not only do you have student using the network, but you've now compromised the passwords of any number of students. On Fri, Nov
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 At 1:30 PM -0600 11/18/10, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: Can somebody tell me which is the best and cheaper solution (something so easy as turn a switch on/off)? The best solution that is always presented here is that this is a classroom control issue, not a technology issue. :) -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: 9.9.1.287 wj8DBQFM5YHRDlQHnMkeAWMRArbJAKDzn1VaaoeLsmHDfhxU8qO9jocqEQCg68RG g3Aw5+zLk260yf5TxQ+3CmE= =p2U0 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- Julian Y. Koh mailto:kohs...@northwestern.edu Manager, Network Transport phone:847-467-5780 Telecommunications and Network Services Northwestern University PGP Public Key:http://bt.ittns.northwestern.edu/julian/pgppubkey.html ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
Yes, if you look at the archives for this list on the EDUCAUSE web site, you'll see that this has come up before. It also comes up on the CIO list and probably others that are archived there. There doesn't seem to be a technology solution for this that would work in a typical academic environment. -- Ron Parker, Director of Information Technology, Brazosport College Voice: (979) 230-3480 FAX: (979) 230-3111 http://www.brazosport.edu -Original Message- From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Julian Y. Koh Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2010 1:43 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 At 1:30 PM -0600 11/18/10, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: Can somebody tell me which is the best and cheaper solution (something so easy as turn a switch on/off)? The best solution that is always presented here is that this is a classroom control issue, not a technology issue. :) -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: 9.9.1.287 wj8DBQFM5YHRDlQHnMkeAWMRArbJAKDzn1VaaoeLsmHDfhxU8qO9jocqEQCg68RG g3Aw5+zLk260yf5TxQ+3CmE= =p2U0 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- Julian Y. Koh mailto:kohs...@northwestern.edu Manager, Network Transport phone:847-467-5780 Telecommunications and Network Services Northwestern University PGP Public Key:http://bt.ittns.northwestern.edu/julian/pgppubkey.html ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
Julian is exactly right. If you were to attempt to block/jam wireless in a classroom, how do you contain that jamming to the classroom so that it does not interfere with wireless outside the classroom? Attempting to correct behavior with technology typically causes much larger technical headaches. Rick On 11/18/2010 2:43 PM, Julian Y. Koh wrote: At 1:30 PM -0600 11/18/10, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: Can somebody tell me which is the best and cheaper solution (something so easy as turn a switch on/off)? The best solution that is always presented here is that this is a classroom control issue, not a technology issue. :) -- ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
You may have a hard time locating a solution that sits well with the FCC and other regulatory agencies, even if you can find something that promises to meet the goal. -Lee From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Parker, Ron Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2010 2:47 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms Yes, if you look at the archives for this list on the EDUCAUSE web site, you'll see that this has come up before. It also comes up on the CIO list and probably others that are archived there. There doesn't seem to be a technology solution for this that would work in a typical academic environment. -- Ron Parker, Director of Information Technology, Brazosport College Voice: (979) 230-3480 FAX: (979) 230-3111 http://www.brazosport.edu -Original Message- From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Julian Y. Koh Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2010 1:43 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 At 1:30 PM -0600 11/18/10, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: Can somebody tell me which is the best and cheaper solution (something so easy as turn a switch on/off)? The best solution that is always presented here is that this is a classroom control issue, not a technology issue. :) -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: 9.9.1.287 wj8DBQFM5YHRDlQHnMkeAWMRArbJAKDzn1VaaoeLsmHDfhxU8qO9jocqEQCg68RG g3Aw5+zLk260yf5TxQ+3CmE= =p2U0 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- Julian Y. Koh mailto:kohs...@northwestern.edu Manager, Network Transport phone:847-467-5780 Telecommunications and Network Services Northwestern University PGP Public Key:http://bt.ittns.northwestern.edu/julian/pgppubkey.html ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.comhttp://www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1153 / Virus Database: 424/3264 - Release Date: 11/18/10 ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
If you have some lead laying around, you could line the rooms and turn the APs off during lecture times... But as other respondents have said it's not really a technology issue, you design your WIFI for full coverage for a reason. Students use laptops to take notes like we all used to use notepads. Similar to using notepads to draw on when bored in a lecture or write notes, our current students use their laptops to use facebook etc. The issue lecturers should look at is why their students are so bored in their lectures that they are losing interest! Many Thanks Peter Peter Methven Network Specialist Heriot-Watt University Edinburgh Scotland EH14 4AS (+44)0 131 4513516 This email has been sent from a mobile phone, please excuse any creative spelling or grammar that may have occured! On 18 Nov 2010, at 20:35, Russ Leathe russ.lea...@gordon.edu wrote: We can push out different SSID’s with ACL’s that limit what an authenticated user can access. However, our AP heatmap shows leakage from AP’s above and below the floors where the classroom are. So, in a nutshell, it wasn’t worth it (blocking that is). Especially true once you incorporate emergency notification via 802.11x. I would agree with other colleagues comments, it’s an academic/classroom/Professor issue. Northeastern, I believe, did not roll out 802.11x in the classrooms, because the Professors did not want it. The idea behind this decision was “you don’t need wifi to take notes”. I hope this is helpful, Russ From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Luis Fernando Valverde Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2010 2:31 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms Hello, Has anybody used jammer WiFi blockers to block to block wireless network access in classrooms in order to help students to concentrate on course instruction?I would like to know which blockers are being used with success to do this? Can somebody tell me which is the best and cheaper solution (something so easy as turn a switch on/off)? Thanks, Luis Fernando --- Luis Fernando Valverde Director de Tecnología de Información INCAE Business School Tel: +506 24 37 2338 Fax: +506 24 33 9101 fernando.valve...@incae.edu www.incae.edu --- El medio ambiente es del interés de todos. Evitemos imprimir correos innecesarios. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. -- Heriot-Watt University is a Scottish charity registered under charity number SC000278.
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
They also use cloud document management such as Google docs and would need the connectivity if storing notes out there. Instructors need to manage the classroom, not take tools away, IMO. Greg On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 2:52 PM, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.ukwrote: If you have some lead laying around, you could line the rooms and turn the APs off during lecture times... But as other respondents have said it's not really a technology issue, you design your WIFI for full coverage for a reason. Students use laptops to take notes like we all used to use notepads. Similar to using notepads to draw on when bored in a lecture or write notes, our current students use their laptops to use facebook etc. The issue lecturers should look at is why their students are so bored in their lectures that they are losing interest! Many Thanks Peter Peter Methven Network Specialist Heriot-Watt University Edinburgh Scotland EH14 4AS (+44)0 131 4513516 This email has been sent from a mobile phone, please excuse any creative spelling or grammar that may have occured! On 18 Nov 2010, at 20:35, Russ Leathe russ.lea...@gordon.edu wrote: We can push out different SSID’s with ACL’s that limit what an authenticated user can access. However, our AP heatmap shows leakage from AP’s above and below the floors where the classroom are. So, in a nutshell, it wasn’t worth it (blocking that is). Especially true once you incorporate emergency notification via 802.11x. I would agree with other colleagues comments, it’s an academic/classroom/Professor issue. Northeastern, I believe, did not roll out 802.11x in the classrooms, because the Professors did not want it. The idea behind this decision was “you don’t need wifi to take notes”. I hope this is helpful, Russ *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto: wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] *On Behalf Of *Luis Fernando Valverde *Sent:* Thursday, November 18, 2010 2:31 PM *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU *Subject:* [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms Hello, Has anybody used jammer WiFi blockers to block to block wireless network access in classrooms in order to help students to concentrate on course instruction?I would like to know which blockers are being used with success to do this? Can somebody tell me which is the best and cheaper solution (something so easy as turn a switch on/off)? Thanks, Luis Fernando --- Luis Fernando Valverde Director de Tecnología de Información INCAE Business School Tel: +506 24 37 2338 Fax: +506 24 33 9101 fernando.valve...@incae.edu www.incae.edu --- *[image: cid:972451819@20052008-09B2]** *El medio ambiente es del interés de todos. Evitemos imprimir correos innecesarios. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. -- Heriot-Watt University is a Scottish charity registered under charity number SC000278. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
I understand your points of view and I agree with some of your comments. However, we use our classrooms for multiple academic activities (MBA programs, seminar and in-company events), and we need to find a simple device to block the signal in a 10-20 meters radius / classroom. So, the adjacent classrooms can work with the signal of their own access points (some professors require Internet signal to teach their sessions - internet dynamics, simulations over the internet, cloud computing services, etc.). I have heard that this is implemented in some universities in the USA, Europe and Asia (for instance, I was told that in the Indian School of Bussiness' classrooms there are switches to enable/disable wireless signals. I emailed them, but I haven't received answer yet). Luis Fernando From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Greg Schaffer Sent: Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 03:00 p.m. To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms They also use cloud document management such as Google docs and would need the connectivity if storing notes out there. Instructors need to manage the classroom, not take tools away, IMO. Greg On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 2:52 PM, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.uk wrote: If you have some lead laying around, you could line the rooms and turn the APs off during lecture times... But as other respondents have said it's not really a technology issue, you design your WIFI for full coverage for a reason. Students use laptops to take notes like we all used to use notepads. Similar to using notepads to draw on when bored in a lecture or write notes, our current students use their laptops to use facebook etc. The issue lecturers should look at is why their students are so bored in their lectures that they are losing interest! Many Thanks Peter Peter Methven Network Specialist Heriot-Watt University Edinburgh Scotland EH14 4AS (+44)0 131 4513516 This email has been sent from a mobile phone, please excuse any creative spelling or grammar that may have occured! On 18 Nov 2010, at 20:35, Russ Leathe russ.lea...@gordon.edu wrote: We can push out different SSID's with ACL's that limit what an authenticated user can access. However, our AP heatmap shows leakage from AP's above and below the floors where the classroom are. So, in a nutshell, it wasn't worth it (blocking that is). Especially true once you incorporate emergency notification via 802.11x. I would agree with other colleagues comments, it's an academic/classroom/Professor issue. Northeastern, I believe, did not roll out 802.11x in the classrooms, because the Professors did not want it. The idea behind this decision was you don't need wifi to take notes. I hope this is helpful, Russ From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Luis Fernando Valverde Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2010 2:31 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms Hello, Has anybody used jammer WiFi blockers to block to block wireless network access in classrooms in order to help students to concentrate on course instruction?I would like to know which blockers are being used with success to do this? Can somebody tell me which is the best and cheaper solution (something so easy as turn a switch on/off)? Thanks, Luis Fernando --- Luis Fernando Valverde Director de Tecnología de Información INCAE Business School Tel: +506 24 37 2338 Fax: +506 24 33 9101 fernando.valve...@incae.edu mailto:fernando.valve...@incae.edu www.incae.edu http://www.incae.edu/ --- Error! Filename not specified. El medio ambiente es del interés de todos. Evitemos imprimir correos innecesarios. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. Heriot-Watt University is a Scottish charity registered under charity number SC000278. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
On Thu, 18 Nov 2010 20:52:58 +, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.uk said: If you have some lead laying around, you could line the rooms and turn the APs off during lecture times... But as other respondents have said it's not really a technology issue, you design your WIFI for full coverage for a reason. Not lead, but a grounded conductive mesh: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faraday_cage Use something with a fine enough mesh to block 5GHz (.5 spacing is smaller than 1/4wavelength at 5GHz), line all surfaces of the room (floor, ceiling, walls). Turn off the APs in that room when they aren't needed. Side benefit: Cellular telephone signals are also blocked! Of course, installing said mesh is not going to be a quick or easy task. Hmm...I wonder if wireless location services would provide a mechanism to allow or deny access based on a client's location? -- Nick Kartsioukas Cuesta College Computer Services 805-546-3248 ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
You may want to check with your public safety folks before you go Faraday cage your rooms. They may have something to say about blocking RF in a classroom. Cell phones not working is a life safety concern, and first responder radio systems not working even more so. -Toivo -Original Message- From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Nick Kartsioukas Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2010 16:53 To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms On Thu, 18 Nov 2010 20:52:58 +, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.uk said: If you have some lead laying around, you could line the rooms and turn the APs off during lecture times... But as other respondents have said it's not really a technology issue, you design your WIFI for full coverage for a reason. Not lead, but a grounded conductive mesh: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faraday_cage Use something with a fine enough mesh to block 5GHz (.5 spacing is smaller than 1/4wavelength at 5GHz), line all surfaces of the room (floor, ceiling, walls). Turn off the APs in that room when they aren't needed. Side benefit: Cellular telephone signals are also blocked! Of course, installing said mesh is not going to be a quick or easy task. Hmm...I wonder if wireless location services would provide a mechanism to allow or deny access based on a client's location? -- Nick Kartsioukas Cuesta College Computer Services 805-546-3248 ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
I didn't say this... use a dummy AP at higher power with same SSID in the room. I don't know who said that. - The Lone Stranger From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Luis Fernando Valverde [fernando.valve...@incae.edu] Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2010 4:06 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms I understand your points of view and I agree with some of your comments. However, we use our classrooms for multiple academic activities (MBA programs, seminar and in-company events), and we need to find a simple device to block the signal in a 10-20 meters radius / classroom. So, the adjacent classrooms can work with the signal of their own access points (some professors require Internet signal to teach their sessions – internet dynamics, simulations over the internet, cloud computing services, etc.). I have heard that this is implemented in some universities in the USA, Europe and Asia (for instance, I was told that in the Indian School of Bussiness’ classrooms there are switches to enable/disable wireless signals. I emailed them, but I haven’t received answer yet). Luis Fernando From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Greg Schaffer Sent: Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 03:00 p.m. To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms They also use cloud document management such as Google docs and would need the connectivity if storing notes out there. Instructors need to manage the classroom, not take tools away, IMO. Greg On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 2:52 PM, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.ukmailto:p.j.meth...@hw.ac.uk wrote: If you have some lead laying around, you could line the rooms and turn the APs off during lecture times... But as other respondents have said it's not really a technology issue, you design your WIFI for full coverage for a reason. Students use laptops to take notes like we all used to use notepads. Similar to using notepads to draw on when bored in a lecture or write notes, our current students use their laptops to use facebook etc. The issue lecturers should look at is why their students are so bored in their lectures that they are losing interest! Many Thanks Peter Peter Methven Network Specialist Heriot-Watt University Edinburgh Scotland EH14 4AS (+44)0 131 4513516 This email has been sent from a mobile phone, please excuse any creative spelling or grammar that may have occured! On 18 Nov 2010, at 20:35, Russ Leathe russ.lea...@gordon.edumailto:russ.lea...@gordon.edu wrote: We can push out different SSID’s with ACL’s that limit what an authenticated user can access. However, our AP heatmap shows leakage from AP’s above and below the floors where the classroom are. So, in a nutshell, it wasn’t worth it (blocking that is). Especially true once you incorporate emergency notification via 802.11x. I would agree with other colleagues comments, it’s an academic/classroom/Professor issue. Northeastern, I believe, did not roll out 802.11x in the classrooms, because the Professors did not want it. The idea behind this decision was “you don’t need wifi to take notes”. I hope this is helpful, Russ From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUmailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Luis Fernando Valverde Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2010 2:31 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUmailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms Hello, Has anybody used jammer WiFi blockers to block to block wireless network access in classrooms in order to help students to concentrate on course instruction? I would like to know which blockers are being used with success to do this? Can somebody tell me which is the best and cheaper solution (something so easy as turn a switch on/off)? Thanks, Luis Fernando --- Luis Fernando Valverde Director de Tecnología de Información INCAE Business School Tel: +506 24 37 2338 Fax: +506 24 33 9101 fernando.valve...@incae.edumailto:fernando.valve...@incae.edu www.incae.eduhttp://www.incae.edu/ --- Error! Filename not specified. El medio ambiente es del interés de todos. Evitemos imprimir correos innecesarios. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. Heriot-Watt University is a Scottish charity
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
The dummy AP is a simple and interesting ideaI wonder how many users would complain about not having internet access, or any access...depending on how the ap is configured. Ken Connell Intermediate Network Engineer Computer Communication Services Ryerson University 350 Victoria St RM AB50 Toronto, Ont M5B 2K3 416-979-5000 x6709 -Original Message- From: Lee H Badman lhbad...@syr.edu Sender: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2010 17:50:26 To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Reply-to: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms I didn't say this... use a dummy AP at higher power with same SSID in the room. I don't know who said that. - The Lone Stranger From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Luis Fernando Valverde [fernando.valve...@incae.edu] Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2010 4:06 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms I understand your points of view and I agree with some of your comments. However, we use our classrooms for multiple academic activities (MBA programs, seminar and in-company events), and we need to find a simple device to block the signal in a 10-20 meters radius / classroom. So, the adjacent classrooms can work with the signal of their own access points (some professors require Internet signal to teach their sessions – internet dynamics, simulations over the internet, cloud computing services, etc.). I have heard that this is implemented in some universities in the USA, Europe and Asia (for instance, I was told that in the Indian School of Bussiness’ classrooms there are switches to enable/disable wireless signals. I emailed them, but I haven’t received answer yet). Luis Fernando From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Greg Schaffer Sent: Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 03:00 p.m. To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms They also use cloud document management such as Google docs and would need the connectivity if storing notes out there. Instructors need to manage the classroom, not take tools away, IMO. Greg On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 2:52 PM, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.ukmailto:p.j.meth...@hw.ac.uk wrote: If you have some lead laying around, you could line the rooms and turn the APs off during lecture times... But as other respondents have said it's not really a technology issue, you design your WIFI for full coverage for a reason. Students use laptops to take notes like we all used to use notepads. Similar to using notepads to draw on when bored in a lecture or write notes, our current students use their laptops to use facebook etc. The issue lecturers should look at is why their students are so bored in their lectures that they are losing interest! Many Thanks Peter Peter Methven Network Specialist Heriot-Watt University Edinburgh Scotland EH14 4AS (+44)0 131 4513516 This email has been sent from a mobile phone, please excuse any creative spelling or grammar that may have occured! On 18 Nov 2010, at 20:35, Russ Leathe russ.lea...@gordon.edumailto:russ.lea...@gordon.edu wrote: We can push out different SSID’s with ACL’s that limit what an authenticated user can access. However, our AP heatmap shows leakage from AP’s above and below the floors where the classroom are. So, in a nutshell, it wasn’t worth it (blocking that is). Especially true once you incorporate emergency notification via 802.11x. I would agree with other colleagues comments, it’s an academic/classroom/Professor issue. Northeastern, I believe, did not roll out 802.11x in the classrooms, because the Professors did not want it. The idea behind this decision was “you don’t need wifi to take notes”. I hope this is helpful, Russ From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUmailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Luis Fernando Valverde Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2010 2:31 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUmailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms Hello, Has anybody used jammer WiFi blockers to block to block wireless network access in classrooms in order to help students to concentrate on course instruction? I would like to know which blockers are being used with success to do this? Can somebody tell me which is the best and cheaper solution (something so easy as turn a switch on/off)? Thanks, Luis Fernando --- Luis Fernando Valverde Director de Tecnología de
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
And do you plan to block air-cards on cellular as well with that jammer? Philippe Univ. of TN On Nov 18, 2010, at 4:06 PM, Luis Fernando Valverde wrote: I understand your points of view and I agree with some of your comments. However, we use our classrooms for multiple academic activities (MBA programs, seminar and in-company events), and we need to find a simple device to block the signal in a 10-20 meters radius / classroom. So, the adjacent classrooms can work with the signal of their own access points (some professors require Internet signal to teach their sessions – internet dynamics, simulations over the internet, cloud computing services, etc.). I have heard that this is implemented in some universities in the USA, Europe and Asia (for instance, I was told that in the Indian School of Bussiness’ classrooms there are switches to enable/disable wireless signals. I emailed them, but I haven’t received answer yet). Luis Fernando From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:wireless-...@listserv.educause.edu] On Behalf Of Greg Schaffer Sent: Jueves, 18 de Noviembre de 2010 03:00 p.m. To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUmailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms They also use cloud document management such as Google docs and would need the connectivity if storing notes out there. Instructors need to manage the classroom, not take tools away, IMO. Greg On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 2:52 PM, Methven, Peter J p.j.meth...@hw.ac.ukmailto:p.j.meth...@hw.ac.uk wrote: If you have some lead laying around, you could line the rooms and turn the APs off during lecture times... But as other respondents have said it's not really a technology issue, you design your WIFI for full coverage for a reason. Students use laptops to take notes like we all used to use notepads. Similar to using notepads to draw on when bored in a lecture or write notes, our current students use their laptops to use facebook etc. The issue lecturers should look at is why their students are so bored in their lectures that they are losing interest! Many Thanks Peter Peter Methven Network Specialist Heriot-Watt University Edinburgh Scotland EH14 4AS (+44)0 131 4513516 This email has been sent from a mobile phone, please excuse any creative spelling or grammar that may have occured! On 18 Nov 2010, at 20:35, Russ Leathe russ.lea...@gordon.edumailto:russ.lea...@gordon.edu wrote: We can push out different SSID’s with ACL’s that limit what an authenticated user can access. However, our AP heatmap shows leakage from AP’s above and below the floors where the classroom are. So, in a nutshell, it wasn’t worth it (blocking that is). Especially true once you incorporate emergency notification via 802.11x. I would agree with other colleagues comments, it’s an academic/classroom/Professor issue. Northeastern, I believe, did not roll out 802.11x in the classrooms, because the Professors did not want it. The idea behind this decision was “you don’t need wifi to take notes”. I hope this is helpful, Russ From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUmailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Luis Fernando Valverde Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2010 2:31 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUmailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms Hello, Has anybody used jammer WiFi blockers to block to block wireless network access in classrooms in order to help students to concentrate on course instruction? I would like to know which blockers are being used with success to do this? Can somebody tell me which is the best and cheaper solution (something so easy as turn a switch on/off)? Thanks, Luis Fernando --- Luis Fernando Valverde Director de Tecnología de Información INCAE Business School Tel: +506 24 37 2338 Fax: +506 24 33 9101 fernando.valve...@incae.edumailto:fernando.valve...@incae.edu www.incae.eduhttp://www.incae.edu/ --- Error! Filename not specified. El medio ambiente es del interés de todos. Evitemos imprimir correos innecesarios. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. Heriot-Watt University is a Scottish charity registered under charity number SC000278. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] WiFi blockers in classrooms
Hey, the Coachcomm system I mentioned is pretty effective at killing WiFi! :) Hector Rios Louisiana State University ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
