RE: [WISPA] Fw: [TowerTalk] Tower accident - link
http://www.arrl.org/?artid=7795 -Original Message- --- David Fuller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Greg Molyneaux, N5CLM, died last Saturday after falling 90 feet from a ham radio tower. Anyone have details on this accident? -Dave NN5K ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Fw: [TowerTalk] Tower accident
- Original Message - From: Pat Barthelow [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: David Fuller [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 1:33 PM Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Tower accident Sad News, sorry to hear of it. Here is a local paper's story : see: http://www.roswell-record.com/main.asp?Search=1ArticleID=17238SectionID=49SubSectionID=112S=1 All the Best, 73, Pat Barthelow [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.jamesburgdish.org Subscribe: http://bambi.net/jamesburg.html Jamesburg Earth Station Moon Bounce Team Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 14:09:32 -0600 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [TowerTalk] Tower accident Greg Molyneaux, N5CLM, died last Saturday after falling 90 feet from a ham radio tower. Anyone have details on this accident? -Dave NN5K ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Fw: [TowerTalk] Tower accident
- Original Message - From: Jeffrey Okamitsu [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: David Fuller [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 1:36 PM Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Tower accident There's a posting on ARRL: http://www.arrl.org/ --- David Fuller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Greg Molyneaux, N5CLM, died last Saturday after falling 90 feet from a ham radio tower. Anyone have details on this accident? -Dave NN5K ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Fw: [TowerTalk] Tower accident
Don't do stupid things people. It'll get you dead. Sooner or late, no one knows, but in the end, dead is dead. marlon - Original Message - From: AA6DX [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: David Fuller [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 2:42 PM Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Tower accident MOLYNEAUX, GREGORY DEAN - Private family services will be held at a later date for Gregory Dean Molyneaux. Greg passed away October 20, 2007 in Roswell.. Gregory was born February 17, 1954 in Lubbock, Texas to Gordon Molyneaux and Betty Compton. His father preceded him in death. Gregory married Trish Graves on June 3, 2006 in Chimmey Springs, New Mexico. She survives him at the family home. Gregory had a degree in Ag. Science. He was a member of the Pecos Valley Amateur Radio Club, F.I.S.T., ARRL Amateur Radio Club, Straight Key Century Club, Roadrunner Amateur Radio Club, Public Service Net, Southwest Traffic Net and also a Mason and attended N.M.M.I. He is survived by his wife Trish, his mother Betty Compton, daughters DeAnne Molyneaux and Cassie Molyneaux of Roswell. As well as four grandchildren: Brooke Daubert, Brandon Russell, Journey McCaskey and Lila McCaskey. Arrangements are under the direction of LaGrone Funeral Chapel. - Original Message - From: David Fuller [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 1:09 PM Subject: [TowerTalk] Tower accident Greg Molyneaux, N5CLM, died last Saturday after falling 90 feet from a ham radio tower. Anyone have details on this accident? -Dave NN5K ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.15.8/1088 - Release Date: 10/23/2007 1:26 PM ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk ** Join us at the WISPA Reception at 6:30 PM on October the 16th 2007 at ISPCON ** ** ISPCON Fall 2007 - October 16-18 - San Jose, CA www.ispcon.com ** ** THE INTERNET INDUSTRY EVENT ** ** FREE Exhibits and Events Pass available until August 31 ** ** Use Customer Code WSEMF7 when you register online at http://www.ispcon.com/register.php ** WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Fw: [TowerTalk] Tower ACCIDENT
Before drilling ANY hole in a tower leg, I would check with the manufacturer. Maybe a better option is to remove a bolt if possible, but will probably not be unless it is your lucky day. Ralph -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 5:43 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Fw: [TowerTalk] Tower ACCIDENT fyi marlon - Original Message - From: jeremy-ca [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Blake M [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Bill Winkis [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 7:22 AM Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Tower ACCIDENT First of all, ANY tower that is installed by burying a section should be suspect UNLESS you are absolutely sure that the legs have plenty of drainage. Drilling a small hole in the legs a few inches above ground can give you an idea if there is standing water. If the water is clear then it is probably safe; if rusty then walk away. If its a dry hole at that level then snake some cotton string down the hole. If it comes back wet and rusty then Id also suggest not climbing. New tower construction should always use a base plate and pier pin if the only support is guy wires. If house bracketed then a minimum of 2 brackets is required. The base should be a standard base plate but with one hole at each corner and secured to the concrete with 3/4 J bolts. An existing tower that was installed without drainage MAY have its life extended by drilling those small holes I mentioned. Then with ~ 3/16 tubing inserted down to the bottom regularly pump out any water. There are ways to derust the legs and seal against further rust but its an iffy proposition when you cant tell the extent of the damage. Carl KM1H - Original Message - From: Bill Winkis [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Blake M [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 7:39 AM Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Tower ACCIDENT This information is all well and good ... it rings with a bell of caution ... BUT , how do you know .. In this case the climber felt all was well until the tower came down with him on it .. but now how in the world do you test and determine all is OK before you climb.?? Or what steps do you use to protect your self ... Certainly the professional tower people who partake in this forum will have a degree of in site for us .. but it needs to be discussed.!!! We've got guys here with 5-10-20 plus years old towers What is the answer?? -Bill At 10:05 PM 6/26/2007, Blake M wrote: If I had a nickel for every time somebody has told me this line!! In my experience, what this really means is: This is a hack-job install, but I really need to make you believe it's OK or else you're going to bolt on me and I'm going to have to fork out major coin for a crane. Simple psych 101 If you have a pretty girlfriend, you wouldn't have to walk around telling people how pretty she is, now, would you? ;-) Be safe 73, Blake N4GI -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Richard J. Fiero II W5TFW The owner told me that he and his Brother Both men about 230 pounds each had been on the tower recently at the same time and that it was strong as an ox. ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Fw: [TowerTalk] Tower ACCIDENT
fyi marlon - Original Message - From: Richard J. Fiero II W5TFW [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 6:23 PM Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Tower ACCIDENT I havent seen the legs of the tower to be honest, since I got out of the hospital, my lawyer has it he sent it to a metal expert who told him that the legs were rusted on the inside and therefore collapsed, I have put up and taken down many towers over the yrs, this one ( rohn 25 ) just buckled, and down she came, I dont remember falling, just waking up sucking air, the tower on top of me, and the pain, Let me tell you the pain,.. I have been Combat wounded, But the pain I felt from a broken body, That hurt ! for 25 days I was hospitalized, 14 days in intensive care, I had a blood clot in my left lung, I am lucky to be alive, Joey - Original Message - From: kd4e [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Dan Cisson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Richard Joey Fiero II W5TFW [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 7:59 PM Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Tower ACCIDENT Dan Joey, We do not have enough information yet. Joey is on the 6M list and many of the guys prayed and encouraged him through the early days following his accident. Joey didn't post the insurance report, perhaps the missing variables are in there. I am guessing that the tower may have suffered some sort of internal rusting or some other damage prior to his work on it. The stress of the work at 100 feet and then removing the top sections may have stressed those weaknesses until they finally gave. There may also have been a change in weather, e.g. wind gusts, temperature, etc. Metal fatigue sometimes results in failures at odd moments and I am sure Joey is happy that tower failed when he was at 40 feet vs 100! I found a couple of things you said that did not add up correctly, obviously it happened,, but seems it should not have. You said you had the tower down to the 40 ft. level...By the way, is the tower Rohn 25?? When the tower was fully up with the antennas and all the guy cables, that tower was at maximum load. Then you added your body weight, your gear to take the tower down, and all the movement that comes with getting a tri-bander down from 100 ft. That is theoretically when the tower shoud have collapsed. The only way I could see any different, is the bottom set of wires created some pivot at the failure point. But if that tower was up with proper guy cables, with a minimum of 3/16 EHS, 3990 lb break strength, the guy should have never broke. I am sure sorry of your accident, I hope what I am describing, and what happened to you can foil another tower tragedy...I sure feel it should not have happenedBest Wishes,, Good Luck to you,, Dan Cisson N4GNR -- Thanks! 73, doc, KD4E Personal: http://bibleseven.com/kd4e.html Ham QTH: http://bibleseven.com/steel/cjb-steelhouse-index.html ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Fw: [TowerTalk] Tower ACCIDENT
fyi marlon - Original Message - From: jeremy-ca [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Blake M [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Bill Winkis [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 7:22 AM Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Tower ACCIDENT First of all, ANY tower that is installed by burying a section should be suspect UNLESS you are absolutely sure that the legs have plenty of drainage. Drilling a small hole in the legs a few inches above ground can give you an idea if there is standing water. If the water is clear then it is probably safe; if rusty then walk away. If its a dry hole at that level then snake some cotton string down the hole. If it comes back wet and rusty then Id also suggest not climbing. New tower construction should always use a base plate and pier pin if the only support is guy wires. If house bracketed then a minimum of 2 brackets is required. The base should be a standard base plate but with one hole at each corner and secured to the concrete with 3/4 J bolts. An existing tower that was installed without drainage MAY have its life extended by drilling those small holes I mentioned. Then with ~ 3/16 tubing inserted down to the bottom regularly pump out any water. There are ways to derust the legs and seal against further rust but its an iffy proposition when you cant tell the extent of the damage. Carl KM1H - Original Message - From: Bill Winkis [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Blake M [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 7:39 AM Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Tower ACCIDENT This information is all well and good ... it rings with a bell of caution ... BUT , how do you know .. In this case the climber felt all was well until the tower came down with him on it .. but now how in the world do you test and determine all is OK before you climb.?? Or what steps do you use to protect your self ... Certainly the professional tower people who partake in this forum will have a degree of in site for us .. but it needs to be discussed.!!! We've got guys here with 5-10-20 plus years old towers What is the answer?? -Bill At 10:05 PM 6/26/2007, Blake M wrote: If I had a nickel for every time somebody has told me this line!! In my experience, what this really means is: This is a hack-job install, but I really need to make you believe it's OK or else you're going to bolt on me and I'm going to have to fork out major coin for a crane. Simple psych 101 If you have a pretty girlfriend, you wouldn't have to walk around telling people how pretty she is, now, would you? ;-) Be safe 73, Blake N4GI -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Richard J. Fiero II W5TFW The owner told me that he and his Brother Both men about 230 pounds each had been on the tower recently at the same time and that it was strong as an ox. ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Fw: [TowerTalk] Tower ACCIDENT
fyi marlon - Original Message - From: Roger (K8RI) [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Bill Winkis [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Blake M [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 11:41 AM Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Tower ACCIDENT I can only tell you what I've done in the past. I'm not a professional, but I've been climbing for many years and had to do so at work as well. This information is all well and good ... it rings with a bell of caution ... BUT , how do you know .. First you do a thourough visual inspection of the tower, tower bolts, guys, and guy anchors looking for any damage, irregularities (is it straight, bent, twisted, or dented. How about cross braces no longer attached.), and *signs* of rust. Rusty bolts, or signs of rust around the bolt holes. I'd even go so far as to remove at least one bolt from the bottom of each tower leg. Is the bolt rusty or is the bolt good but has signs of rust being deposited on it, particularly as a stain. (pull the top bolt of the pair and use a light to inspect the lower bolt in place if possible) Guy wires may or may not rust from the inside. I've taken down towers where the guy wires were completly coated with rust, but proved to be plenty strong. Be wary of small guy wires. Wire rope showing rust is likely to be bad or at least seriously compromised and particularly the smaller diameter stuff. It can be tensioned to near it's working strength as a test using a Loos gage. If it passes back off to the normal 10% of the rated strength. I *always* use temporary guys on any older tower. Even use extra temporary guys if there is any doubt. I shold note that the tensioning of the guy wires doesn't necessiarily prove the tower is good. It's only a test of the guys and the atach points. Remember a tower can have some serious damage and still have sufficient strength in the vertical plane while having very little in the horizontal at spots. Internal rust may be completely invisible from the outside, hence the reason for checking the bolts for signs of rust. It may be stains which are a warning sign, but not necessiarily and indication the tower is ready to fail. OTOH if there is loose, granular rust laying on the bolts or visible at the base of the tower it's time to call a crane in. I'd definately not climb in that case. At one time I had an electronic thickness gage that worked on steel and aluminum. It only needed to be calibrated for the material to be tested. We used it on pressure vessels. How well that would have worked on tower legs, I don't know. BUT even after a thourough inspection there is still a fair amount of intuition involved because as I said above, some serious damage may be completely invisible and with no outward signs elsewhere. I've put up and taken down a lot of towers, but when it comes to older towers I become very picky. As I said earlier, I also use temporary guys so even if a guy broke or a secion buckled it'd not fall far unless it broke off completely. In this case the climber felt all was well until the tower came down with him on it .. but now how in the world do you test and determine all is OK before you climb.?? Or what steps do you use to protect your self ... Certainly the professional tower people who partake in this forum will have a degree of in site for us .. but it needs to be discussed.!!! We've got guys here with 5-10-20 plus years old towers http://www.rogerhalstead.com/ham_files/tower9.htm The tower shown is well over 30 years old and had been up at 3 different locations. It showed no signs of rust and was climbed regularly. However it was reaching the point where there were many small irregularities in it. IE it was no longer straight. Not bad, but not straight either and that was when I decided it was time to replace it. After it was taken down there were no signs of rust damage inside. What is the answer?? As a personal opinion, climbing is risky even with the proper equipment. Climbing old towers can be down right dangerous and I'd not recomend it for a casual climber unless they can get some one in the know to do a good apraisal of the tower. Even then there are no gurantees. Roger (K8RI) ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Fw: [TowerTalk] Tower ACCIDENT
fyi for you tower owners or soon to be tower owners. marlon - Original Message - From: Pete Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 7:27 AM Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Tower ACCIDENT There is an excellent presentation by W3LPL from the 2006 Dayton antenna forum at (http://www.kkn.net/dayton2006/w3lpl_dayton_2006.pdf), titled Design, Construction and Maintenance of Antennas and Towers for Storm Survival and Long Term Reliability - Practical Checklists of Best Practices It would be a conservative solution, but if people only climbed towers that had been designed and maintained according to Frank's checklists, there'd probably be a few more still living. 73, Pete N4ZR At 10:18 AM 6/27/2007, David Jordan wrote: What would be really good for the list members is a set of questions one should ask before beginning work on a tower that they do not own or do not have knowledge of the structural health. In the instance provided the writer was told the tower is in good shape, by the owner. That is a pretty subjective statement. What is good shape to an inexperienced ham radio operator who has no experience with towers might be a red flag for a professional tower installer. Some obvious questions that come to my mind are: - How long has the tower been installed? - Have the guy wires been replaced regularly? - Has the tower been inspected regularly? - Has the tower been hit by lightning? - Who did the installation? - Has the tension on the guy lines been measured? I'm sure there are better questions to ask but having a check-list for our list members might prevent future accidents. Maybe, such a list, already exist on a web site but I'm not aware of such a list and I'd like to have access to such a list for myself and my friends in the hobby. I'd post such a list on our club web page. Thanks, Dave Wa3gin -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jim Lux Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 9:58 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] Tower ACCIDENT At 04:39 AM 6/27/2007, Bill Winkis wrote: This information is all well and good ... it rings with a bell of caution ... BUT , how do you know .. ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk ___ ___ TowerTalk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/towertalk -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
