[WSG] There may be a delay before I get back to you. Re: WSG Digest

2011-05-04 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Thanks for emailing me.

I'm working in the United States from Wednesday 27 April through to
Friday 6 May, as part of SilverStripe's involvement at the CMS Expo in
Chicago (cmsexpo.net). I will be checking email and available on my
cellphone over this period, however my availability will be more
limited than usual.

My New Zealand mobile is switched off currently. You can reach me on
this number:
+1 (415) 691 5967.

Also note that I'll be taking annual leave from 9 May through 31 May,
returning to work in Wellington on 1 June 2011.

If you have an urgent matter and can't reach me, please contact either;
1. Lee Middleton, Head of Sales and Marketing, on l...@silverstripe.com
on +64 27 288 9909
2. Sam Minnee, Acting CEO, on s...@silverstripe.com or +64 21 411 311

Cheers,
Sigurd Magnusson

-- 
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Business Relationship Manager
SilverStripe

DDI: +64 4 978 7332
Mobile (US): 415 691 5967
Mobile: (NZ): +64 21 42 12 08 (Off until 1 June 2011)
Skype: sigurdmagnusson
twitter.com/SigurdMagnusson
www.silverstripe.com

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[WSG] There may be a delay before I get back to you. Re: WSG Digest

2011-04-29 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Thanks for emailing me.

I'm working in the United States from Wednesday 27 April through to
Friday 6 May, as part of SilverStripe's involvement at the CMS Expo in
Chicago (cmsexpo.net). I will be checking email and available on my
cellphone over this period, however my availability will be more
limited than usual.

My New Zealand mobile is switched off currently. You can reach me on
this number:
+1 (415) 691 5967.

Also note that I'll be taking annual leave from 9 May through 31 May,
returning to work in Wellington on 1 June 2011.

If you have an urgent matter and can't reach me, please contact either;
1. Lee Middleton, Head of Sales and Marketing, on l...@silverstripe.com
on +64 27 288 9909
2. Sam Minnee, Acting CEO, on s...@silverstripe.com or +64 21 411 311

Cheers,
Sigurd Magnusson

-- 
Sigurd Magnusson
Business Relationship Manager
SilverStripe

DDI: +64 4 978 7332
Mobile (US): 415 691 5967
Mobile: (NZ): +64 21 42 12 08 (Off until 1 June 2011)
Skype: sigurdmagnusson
twitter.com/SigurdMagnusson
www.silverstripe.com

--
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Keep an eye on silverstripe.org/blog for news and video recordings of our
sessions!
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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2011-01-05 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Thanks for emailing me. I'm out of the office on annual leave over
Christmas, returning to work on Monday 10 January 2011.

Cheers,
Sigurd.

-- 
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Business Relationship Manager
SilverStripe

DDI: +64 4 978 7332
Mobile: +64 21 42 12 08
Skype: sigurdmagnusson
twitter.com/SigurdMagnusson
www.silverstripe.com

--
Did you know we just won 'Best Open Source
Projecthttp://silverstripe.org/silverstripe-cms-wins-an-nz-open-source-award/'
and were just named the first Microsoft-Certified open source
CMShttp://silverstripe.org/silverstripe-cms-the-first-ever-open-source-web-app-to-become-microsoft-certified/
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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2010-12-31 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Thanks for emailing me. I'm out of the office on annual leave over
Christmas, returning to work on Monday 10 January 2011.

Cheers,
Sigurd.

-- 
Sigurd Magnusson
Business Relationship Manager
SilverStripe

DDI: +64 4 978 7332
Mobile: +64 21 42 12 08
Skype: sigurdmagnusson
twitter.com/SigurdMagnusson
www.silverstripe.com

--
Did you know we just won 'Best Open Source
Projecthttp://silverstripe.org/silverstripe-cms-wins-an-nz-open-source-award/'
and were just named the first Microsoft-Certified open source
CMShttp://silverstripe.org/silverstripe-cms-the-first-ever-open-source-web-app-to-become-microsoft-certified/
?
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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2010-12-27 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Thanks for emailing me. I'm out of the office on annual leave over
Christmas, returning to work on Monday 10 January 2011.

Cheers,
Sigurd.

-- 
Sigurd Magnusson
Business Relationship Manager
SilverStripe

DDI: +64 4 978 7332
Mobile: +64 21 42 12 08
Skype: sigurdmagnusson
twitter.com/SigurdMagnusson
www.silverstripe.com

--
Did you know we just won 'Best Open Source
Projecthttp://silverstripe.org/silverstripe-cms-wins-an-nz-open-source-award/'
and were just named the first Microsoft-Certified open source
CMShttp://silverstripe.org/silverstripe-cms-the-first-ever-open-source-web-app-to-become-microsoft-certified/
?
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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2010-12-23 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Thanks for emailing me. I'm out of the office on annual leave over
Christmas, returning to work on Monday 10 January 2011.

Cheers,
Sigurd.

-- 
Sigurd Magnusson
Business Relationship Manager
SilverStripe

DDI: +64 4 978 7332
Mobile: +64 21 42 12 08
Skype: sigurdmagnusson
twitter.com/SigurdMagnusson
www.silverstripe.com

--
Did you know we just won 'Best Open Source
Projecthttp://silverstripe.org/silverstripe-cms-wins-an-nz-open-source-award/'
and were just named the first Microsoft-Certified open source
CMShttp://silverstripe.org/silverstripe-cms-the-first-ever-open-source-web-app-to-become-microsoft-certified/
?
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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2010-09-30 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Thanks for emailing me. I'm out the office on annual leave, returning
to work Monday morning.

You may contact Lee Middleton on l...@silverstripe.com in my absence.

Cheers,
Sigurd.

-- 
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Business Relationship Manager
SilverStripe

DDI: +64 4 978 7332
Mobile: +64 21 42 12 08
Skype: sigurdmagnusson
twitter.com/SigurdMagnusson
www.silverstripe.com

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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2010-09-20 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Thanks for emailing me. I'm out the office today due to sick leave.

You may contact Lee Middleton on l...@silverstripe.com in my absence.

Cheers,
Sigurd

-- 
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Business Relationship Manager
SilverStripe

DDI: +64 4 978 7332
Mobile: +64 21 42 12 08
Skype: sigurdmagnusson
twitter.com/SigurdMagnusson
www.silverstripe.com

--
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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2010-09-07 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Thanks for emailing me.

I'm out the office Wednesday, Thursday, and Friday. Please phone me on
+64 21 42 12 08 if urgent, otherwise your patience is appreciated
while my access to email is limited.

You may also contact l...@silverstripe.com in my absence.

Cheers,
Sigurd

-- 
Sigurd Magnusson
Business Relationship Manager
SilverStripe

DDI: +64 4 978 7332
Mobile: +64 21 42 12 08
Skype: sigurdmagnusson
twitter.com/SigurdMagnusson
www.silverstripe.com

--
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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2010-08-27 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Thanks for emailing me.

I'm largely out the office Friday, Monday, and Tuesday (27-31 August).
Please phone me on +64 21 42 12 08 if urgent, otherwise your patience
is appreciated while my access to email is limited.

Cheers,
Sigurd

-- 
Sigurd Magnusson
Business Relationship Manager
SilverStripe

DDI: +64 4 978 7332
Mobile: +64 21 42 12 08
Skype: sigurdmagnusson
twitter.com/SigurdMagnusson
www.silverstripe.com

--
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www.nzosa.org.nz and
www.packtpub.com/open-source-awards-home/nominate-best-open-source-cms
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[WSG] Re: Browser Backwards Compatibility -- How far back?

2009-03-15 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Most websites we build at SilverStripe have IE 6.0 as a minimum, and  
even then, we're unpatiently anticipating the time when we can drop IE  
6.


FireFox (2), Safari (3), Chrome (latest) users are more encouraged to  
keep up to the latest versions, and have more aggressive update  
mechanisms, so we just use the bracketed versions as minimum.


We have not given thought to Netscape for years.

The same applies to when we're working on the administration interface  
of our open source SilverStripe CMS (www.silverstripe.org.)


Cheers,
Sig.


On 15/03/2009, at 8:32 PM, wsg@webstandardsgroup.org wrote:


*
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*


From: Brett Patterson inspiron.patters...@gmail.com
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 15:19:00 -0400
Subject: Browser Backwards Compatibility -- How far back?

Hi all,

I was just reading from a book that talked about some code that  
would not
work in Internet Explorer 3.0, but would in Internet Explorer 4.0  
and later,
and Netscape Navigator 3.0 and later. This brought up a question  
that I

could not find direct and consistent answers while searching the
Internet...so, how far back would it be acceptable to design for,  
when it
comes to backwards browser compatibility? I have been told from some  
sites,
that Internet Explorer 5.0/later and Netscape Navigator 4.0/later,  
as well

as Firefox 1.5/later and Opera 6.0/later. Is this correct?

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[WSG] Examples of great high-school websites?

2009-01-15 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Can people offer examples of school websites that lead the way, for  
instance in terms of;


- interaction between student/parent/school/community
- allows students to show off work
- allows students/teachers/parents/community to engage (e.g. see  
sports results, look up when next school theatre production is on, etc).
- less important, but strong information architecture / usability /  
visual design.


In otherwords, all the usual sort of stuff that leading private/public  
sector websites have, and that seems all too rare on school websites..


Sigurd

PS: I'm not really looking for examples of Moodle / learning  
management systems; more the public-facing side.



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[WSG] Re: Text-only version

2008-11-22 Thread Sigurd Magnusson

Rob,

Without knowing if you place extreme important to accessibility, I  
would suggest shifting the budget from Betsie to furthering the  
usability and accessibility of your main templates; e.g. good semantic  
layout, separate CSS/unobtrusive JS, printable CSS, checking that a  
blind person with screen reader can make sense of the site, SEO, etc  
(not to mention compliance with which ever (X)HTML doctrine you're  
into!).


The spirit behind what the CMS vendor is trying to do sounds  
completely reasonable. What little info you provide makes it easy to  
assume a more modern approach is possible, though.


---
Sigurd Magnusson
SilverStripe
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[WSG] Best password strength indicator?

2008-03-27 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Am looking for an intuitive and elegant example of a password field  
with an strength indicator that updates as you type each character.


I've seen plenty around, and off the top of my head I quite like  
Google's* (although I'd say it should show small amount of red graph  
to begin with, portraying instantly that the line is a strength  
indicator).

* https://www.google.com/accounts/NewAccount

Can anyone let me know if there's one they feel is significantly  
better than that? I'm keen for one that is compact. Some are over the  
top and make the user have to think an unnecessarily extra amount.


For instance, this MSN one contains intuitive elements but is  
cluttered with too much instruction.

https://accountservices.passport.net/reg.srf?roid=2sl=1vv=400lc=1033


Sigurd Magnusson,
SilverStripe






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[WSG] A Google contest for highschoolers that is very relevant to this list

2007-11-29 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
We've been collaborating with Google on an extension to their successful 
Google Summer of Code program, producing the Google Highly Open 
Participation Contest. Aimed to illustrate to our next generation in the 
industry on the virtues of collaboration, open standards, and freedom of 
information,  the contest has the lure of money, Google T-Shirts and 
grand prizes (paid trips to the Googleplex from anywhere in the world.).


To get involved, students work on predetermined tasks for open source 
projects from now until early February, and a number of these tasks are 
intentionally web based, such as building widgets and skins/themes, 
testing a web application, or even demonstrating a project to a group of 
people.


As an example, see the task list at;
http://code.google.com/p/google-highly-open-participation-silverstripe/issues/list

So far, building-a-theme tasks are slow to being taken up, despite them 
being very visible contributions to the project (i.e. their name will be 
forever attributed on their theme!). Since since these require a sound 
knowledge of HTML, CSS and design... hence my post on this list. So if 
people could let highschoolers in their midst know about the contest, 
that'd be awesome :)


Overall info at;
http://www.silverstripe.com/highschoolers-add-google-to-your-cv/
http://code.google.com/opensource/ghop/2007-8/

Siggy,
SilverStripe open source web development platform


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[WSG] A Google contest for highschoolers that is very relevant to this list

2007-11-29 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
We've been collaborating with Google on an extension to their successful 
Google Summer of Code program, producing the Google Highly Open 
Participation Contest. Aimed to illustrate to our next generation in the 
industry on the virtues of collaboration, open standards, and freedom of 
information,  the contest has the lure of money, Google T-Shirts and 
grand prizes (paid trips to the Googleplex from anywhere in the world.).


To get involved, students work on predetermined tasks for open source 
projects from now until early February, and a number of these tasks are 
intentionally web based, such as building widgets and skins/themes, 
testing a web application, or even demonstrating a project to a group of 
people.


As an example, see the task list at;
http://code.google.com/p/google-highly-open-participation-silverstripe/issues/list

So far, building-a-theme tasks are slow to being taken up, despite them 
being very visible contributions to the project (i.e. their name will be 
forever attributed on their theme!). Since since these require a sound 
knowledge of HTML, CSS and design... hence my post on this list. So if 
people could let highschoolers in their midst know about the contest, 
that'd be awesome :)


Overall info at;
http://www.silverstripe.com/highschoolers-add-google-to-your-cv/
http://code.google.com/opensource/ghop/2007-8/

Siggy,
SilverStripe open source web development platform


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Re: [WSG] FF1.5 and Web Dev. T/B

2005-11-30 Thread Sigurd Magnusson











  

  



  Stephen Stagg wrote:

> Is it just me or does the ‘Disable Images’ option on the Web 
> Developers Toolbar not work with FF1.5?
>
> Stephen
>
Yes. When I choose this option, it refreshes the page but all the images 
still seem to appear.
In addition, the "view style information" (under CSS) is greyed out, 
very annoying.

   
  

  
  

        
  
Sigurd Magnusson | Technical Director 

  


  
  


  
  

  
SilverStripe
Level 4, 25a Marion Street
Wellington, New Zealand

  
Phone
+64 4 381 4482
  

  
Fax
+64 4  803 3347
  

  
Mobile
+64 21 421 208
  


  

   

SilverStripe Website Management
 SilverStripe gives you full control of your website. From adding and modifying
pages on your website, to sending personalised email newsletters to thousands of
people, everything can be done quickly and easily by people without technical
knowledge of the Internet.
Find out more

  
  

  
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Re: [WSG] web standards training course/events in Sydney next year?

2005-11-22 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Webstock in May 2006 is hosted at a capital city--Wellington--and you 
guys probably treat NZ as a state :P


Its going to be absolutely amazing --  Check out http://www.Webstock.org.nz

Siggy

--

Cade Whitbourn wrote:


I know it's early but...

Anybody know of any good training courses or events that are being held
in Sydney (or the other capital cities) next year on web standards/best
practice web design/usability etc (other than WE06 and the regular wsg
meetings?)

Cheers,

C a d e  W h i t b o u r n
Web Designer - Web Projects and Business Development
Australian Stock Exchange
www.asx.com.au
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[WSG] Awards / Endorsements for quality websites?

2005-04-17 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
I was wondering if anyone knew of a popular sites to promote semanitc or 
compliant (or good in general) websites?
Furthermore, if there was a site or an award that would be considered 
quite an achievement or endorsement for your work?

I have submitted several items to www.w3cSites.com, however despite the 
fact that one of our submissions (our creativehq website) has been 
hand-picked to be featured on its homepage and therefore giving us alot 
of traffic, it seems that in general that sites submitted to w3csites 
are uninspiring--too much focus seems to go on design, rather than the 
coding, and very few items seem to be a truely commercial nature; I 
would suggest that the wirelessdataforum.org.nz website I mentioned a 
few weeks back is much more worthy that the creative-hq site which won, 
for example.

(BTW, thanks to every one who commented on the wirelessforum site, much 
of your feedback is either now done, or before queued up to done over 
the forthcoming week.).

Siggy
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Re: [WSG] validation errors

2005-04-17 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
This needs to be rewritten as:
http://www.choice.com.au/defaultView.aspx?id=102314amp;catId=100165

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hi
I have a page in the site I am working on
(http://learnline.cdu.edu.au/wip/sbi240/module3/agriculture.html) that
won't validate because of an external link I have to the Australian
Consumers' Association -
http://www.choice.com.au/defaultView.aspx?id=102314catId=100165
I'm getting these sorts of errors
Line 298, column 70: cannot generate system identifier for general entity
catId
Line 298, column 70: general entity catId not defined and no default
entity
Line 298, column 75: reference not terminated by REFC delimiter
Line 298, column 75: reference to external entity in attribute value
Is there any way to get the page to validate?
Any help is much appreciated.
Thank you
Helen
***
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Charles Darwin University, Northern Territory 0909
Tel: 8946 7779 Mobile: 0403 290 842
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Re: [WSG] A form within a form

2005-04-07 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
I always thought a form was not able to be placed in a form. Can you 
explain what you're attempting to do? Are you sure you're not just 
wanting to have two submit buttons within the one form?

Charla wrote:
Hi
Does anybody know how to sumbit the inner form, if you have a form
within a form on the same page and you only want to submit the inner
one..how do you do this?
Any ideas
Charla Nicol
Web Developer
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[WSG] Comments on new wirelessforum.org.nz site?

2005-04-07 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
We just 'soft launched' a new website, http://www.wirelessforum.org.nz, 
so that we can gather a final set of feedback and changes for a Monday 
meeting to see the project finished next week.

The entire site is XHTML 1.1, CSS2, WCAG-AAA compliant, and makes good 
use of semantic markup, e.g. no tables for layout, lists for menus, 
H1/H2/H3 in appopriate places, as well as lists of news items, events, 
etc on pages. Am wanting this to be a good portfolio item for our web 
standards compliance, so if anyone can point out things in our markup or 
CSS to make it even more bullet proof, or find any holes, that would be 
fantastic :P I've submitted it to http://w3csites.com/sites.asp, so I 
want to ensure it has a valid home there!

It is designed to look fine in pcIE6/MacIE5.2, and the latest Safari, 
FireFox, Opera and Netscape. A few things happen in pcIE5.5, and 5, but 
are mainly to do with the size of paddings and margins and we don't deem 
this as any concern. NB: The two lines of *homepage event titles* 
currently don't fit, but we're going to get some new taller backgroung 
images here by Monday, but other than that, there shouldn't be surprises.

The whole site is content managed (with content and new pages being 
added/edited as I speak by a few  different people, so please excuse any 
gaps in the content!)--its a good test of the xhtml compliance feature 
of our CMS that we've been working dilegently on!

As you can see, its quite an improvement over its previous state 
(http://www.wirelessdataforum.org.nz).

Siggy
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Re: [WSG] Comments on new wirelessforum.org.nz site?

2005-04-07 Thread Sigurd Magnusson




Charla, Rick, Cheers for the nice feedback ;)

Yeah what you mention with the dates overlapping the border was what I
perhaps ambigiously descriped in my email as:
"NB: The two lines of *homepage
event titles* currently don't fit,
but we're going to get some new taller backgroung images here by
Monday, but other than that, there shouldn't be surprises.
"

I'm hoping for some more issues! :P

---

Offtopic, but probably of interest to all is that one of the major
reasons we did a soft launch is website compression. This has worked
since neither of you complained about that. All HTML, CSS and JS is
compressed when delivered to your browser. See this:

http://www.pipeboost.com/getreport.asp?URL="">

This shows that the front page HTML goes from an already compact 7.5k
to a almost ridiculous 2k (The CSS I am sure follows suit). This ought
to make for a very responsive site, given we've been very particular
about the use of images. (Turn images off, its almost as good! :P).

Siggy



Charla wrote:

  
  
This site looks awesome...jus noticed dnt kno if you have but on the
home page in FF mozilla.. in the "coming up" boxes the text doe not
fix...the date in particular
  
Rick Faaberg wrote:
  
On 4/7/05 12:53 AM "Sigurd Magnusson" [EMAIL PROTECTED] sent this
out:

  

  We just 'soft launched' a new website, http://www.wirelessforum.org.nz,
so that we can gather a final set of feedback and changes for a Monday
meeting to see the project finished next week.

The entire site is XHTML 1.1, CSS2, WCAG-AAA compliant, and makes good
use of semantic markup, e.g. no tables for layout, lists for menus,
H1/H2/H3 in appopriate places, as well as lists of news items, events,
etc on pages. Am wanting this to be a good portfolio item for our web
standards compliance, so if anyone can point out things in our markup or
CSS to make it even more bullet proof, or find any holes, that would be
fantastic :P I've submitted it to http://w3csites.com/sites.asp, so I
want to ensure it has a valid home there!



Very nice looking site, if that helps.

The two Comimg Up boxes have the dates overlapping the bottom border in
Safari (latest) fwiw.

Haven't surfed much beyond the main page. I'll report anything that I see
down below the main page if I get to it.

Rick

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[WSG] wirelessforum.org.nz --- on a mobile device?

2005-04-07 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Oops--something I forgot to ask, is what does this website look like on 
a mobile device that supports HTML? I browsed around it with an Ericsson 
P900 and it was quite acceptable (for a similar effect, use FireFox with 
images and styles disabled and about 300px window width).

However, I am not sure what sort of 'standards' I should use to test 
against to have a website that operates well with a mobile device; are 
their good emulators or techniques to improve the site beyond what it 
currently is like?

Sig
Sigurd Magnusson wrote:
We just 'soft launched' a new website, 
http://www.wirelessforum.org.nz, so that we can gather a final set of 
feedback and changes for a Monday meeting to see the project finished 
next week.

The entire site is XHTML 1.1, CSS2, WCAG-AAA compliant, and makes good 
use of semantic markup, e.g. no tables for layout, lists for menus, 
H1/H2/H3 in appopriate places, as well as lists of news items, events, 
etc on pages. Am wanting this to be a good portfolio item for our web 
standards compliance, so if anyone can point out things in our markup 
or CSS to make it even more bullet proof, or find any holes, that 
would be fantastic :P I've submitted it to 
http://w3csites.com/sites.asp, so I want to ensure it has a valid home 
there!

It is designed to look fine in pcIE6/MacIE5.2, and the latest Safari, 
FireFox, Opera and Netscape. A few things happen in pcIE5.5, and 5, 
but are mainly to do with the size of paddings and margins and we 
don't deem this as any concern. NB: The two lines of *homepage event 
titles* currently don't fit, but we're going to get some new taller 
backgroung images here by Monday, but other than that, there shouldn't 
be surprises.

The whole site is content managed (with content and new pages being 
added/edited as I speak by a few  different people, so please excuse 
any gaps in the content!)--its a good test of the xhtml compliance 
feature of our CMS that we've been working dilegently on!

As you can see, its quite an improvement over its previous state 
(http://www.wirelessdataforum.org.nz).

Siggy
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Re: [WSG] textarea rows cols - presentation in xhtml?

2005-04-04 Thread Sigurd Magnusson



It could be argued that it is more than 
presentation. It indicates to the user about the quantity or usage of the 
textarea; the size of text fields is a usability topic. If you were told to 
write a "Summary of your proposal", and given 8 lines instead of 2 lines, you 
would probably write a completely different passage of text. 

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Alan 
  Trick 
  To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org 
  Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2005 8:15 
  AM
  Subject: Re: [WSG] textarea rows  
  cols - presentation in xhtml?
  I've wondered about this one as well, my guess is that
  1. they figured the attributes were to important to drop in the 
event of non-css user agents,or more likely
  2. they didn't change it because xhtml1.x was really not much 
more than a reformulation of html into xml. To get real xhtml we will 
have to wait for xhtml2, xforms and all that good stuff. (there are no cols or rows in xforms). This was done in 
order to maintain backwards compatibility, something xhtml2 will 
  break.Not a great answer, but that's all I can come up 
  with.AlanPaul Novitski wrote: 
  Why is it 
that rows and cols are required attributes for the textarea element, even in 
xhtml? They strike me as being purely presentational, and not really 
needed: in the absense of styling, browsers could apply arbitrary defaults 
as they do with text input field width. I can't find any reference to 
this oddity on the w3c site or elsewhere. Any suggestions? 
Paul 


Re: [WSG] textarea rows cols - presentation in xhtml?

2005-04-04 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
The number of rows and columns of a textarea in no way constrains the 
amount of text that can be entered, it only affect the appearance of the 
input area on the screen.
I agree it doesn't technically constrain the user, but it does instruct a 
user how much they are expected to write. As power users, we would both know 
we could type in any quantity of text, however casual users will expect the 
amount of text they write in has a relationship with the size of the text 
area. A blind reader, a search engine, a lynx browser, and so on, can more 
easily interpret the intended use of a text area with cols/rows.


but the apparent size of the input field is wholly determined by CSS 
width.
Not wholly--XHTML 1.1 continues to have the size attribute for the input 
element, and this is akin to cols for the textarea.
http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml-modularization/abstract_modules.html#s_extformsmodule

We can only surmise that W3C had people touting both opinions, and this 
shows a comprimise?

This matter might be better dealt with in XForms or other forthcoming form 
standards.

Siggy

- Original Message - 
From: Paul Novitski [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2005 10:45 AM
Subject: Re: [WSG] textarea rows  cols - presentation in xhtml?


At 03:00 PM 4/4/2005, Sigurd Magnusson wrote:
It could be argued that it is more than presentation. It indicates to the 
user about the quantity or usage of the textarea; the size of text fields 
is a usability topic. If you were told to write a Summary of your 
proposal, and given 8 lines instead of 2 lines, you would probably write 
a completely different passage of text.

Perhaps, but that seems very obviously a presentational aspect to me.  The 
number of rows and columns of a textarea in no way constrains the amount 
of text that can be entered, it only affect the appearance of the input 
area on the screen.

 input type=text / fields have the optional maxlength attribute to 
constrain the length of input, but the apparent size of the input field is 
wholly determined by CSS width.  The W3C leaves it completely up to you if 
you style an input field with {width: 1px;} but maxlength=64000 and it 
surprises me that they make an exception with textarea.

Presumably, when they deprecated the width attribute for input but kept 
maxlength, they fervently wished they could do the same for textarea but 
couldn't, since textarea wasn't born with a maxlength and they probably 
didn't deem it wise to tack one on.  I wouldn't be surprised if this 
detail generated considerable debate, although I can't find any reference 
to the decision-making process on their site.

Regards,
Paul
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Re: [WSG] Captioning images - to DL or not to DL

2005-04-04 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Sure
I've never heard myself of using DL/DT/DD for this sort of thing, although 
instinctively it seems quite an appropriate use.

My question relates to what sort of problems you have encountered with 
widths; I would have thought the following would pose no problems:

dl class=captionedimage
dtimg src=xyz.jpg width=100 height=150 alt=Australian Landmark 
//dt
ddHere is wonderful example of a Australian Landmark/dd
/dl

You would simply be meddling with padding, margins and borders on the 
elements; the width remains attached to the image itself, as this is 
appropriate even with XHTML 1.1.

I presume you know you can easily float the dl left or right, rather than 
use align=right on the img / element.

Siggy
I was wondering what the best solution was for captioning images where
you
have a number of differently sized images on a page.
Is using a definition list the best way to do this and the most
semantically correct?  Are there better ways?
The biggest problem I have found is having to set the width of the dl
when
all the images are of a different size.
Thanks
Helen 
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Re: [WSG] Extra padding mysteriously exists in IE6

2005-03-30 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Cheers; will investigate the footer menu tomorrow ;)
If only we could earn 5c for every discrepency between browser renderings of 
valid xhtml/css, I'd only have to build one website a year :)

Siggy
- Original Message - 
From: David Laakso [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 8:41 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] Extra padding mysteriously exists in IE6


On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 19:45:20 +1200, Sigurd Magnusson 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Gah - we're well underway on a an XHTML 1.1 compliant site, and we've 
eventually found that we need to do an IE hack--a real shame since 
everything else was going so well. Can anyone see if there's a simple 
mistake we've done, or if it is indeed a bug with IE which necessitates 
a hack.
[...]
 http://test.totallydigital.co.nz/wdf/
http://test.totallydigital.co.nz/wdf/mainsite/css/main.css for the CSS
Someone will probably come along with way to do it without a hack, in the 
meantime this at the bottom of your style sheet will address  IE, and 
Opera7.54u2 where you have the same problem:

* html #FeaturedMembers {margin: 0 0 0 0;}/*tweak margin-top for ie as 
necessary*/
@media screen and (min-width: 0px){
   #FeaturedMembers {margin: 0 0 0 0;} /*tweak margin-top for Opera as 
necessary*/
}

BTW, in the h-menu at the bottom of the page, the // things are below the 
text links in Opera.
Siggy
Best,
David
--
de gustibus non est disputandum
http://www.dlaakso.com/
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[WSG] Extra padding mysteriously exists in IE6

2005-03-29 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Gah - we're well underway on a an XHTML 1.1 compliant site, and we've 
eventually found that we need to do an IE hack--a real shame since 
everything else was going so well. Can anyone see if there's a simple 
mistake we've done, or if it is indeed a bug with IE which necessitates a 
hack.

The problem simply relates to the vertical gap between the Related Links 
and Featured Members boxes at the right. We want the gap to be 9px.

This should be possible simply with:
#FeaturedMembers{
 margin:9px 0 0 0;
}
... and this works with Mac IE, FireFox, Safari, etc. If padding-top is 0, 
then the blue borders of boxes touch.

But IE6 has a much larger gap, and even a gap when the padding-top is set to 
0. (You need to set the padding-top to 3px to provide an equivilent gap...). 
Our hack was to do;

#FeaturedMembers{
margin:3px 0 0 0; /* margin-top used by IE6 */
}
htmlbody #FeaturedMembers{
margin-top:9px; /* margin-top used by others */
}
It's not the end of the world if we are forced to do the hack, although 
wouldn't it be cool if we could have site without hacks ;) Its more out of 
curiosity about what the heck is going on!

See the site (which is currently missing the hack as shown above to 
illustrate the problem) at http://test.totallydigital.co.nz/wdf/

See lines ~270-280 of 
http://test.totallydigital.co.nz/wdf/mainsite/css/main.css for the CSS in 
question.

(Yes, the homepage is currently xhtml1.1/css2 compliant, other pages have a 
few issues that will be checked and fixed as we go on ;) )

Siggy

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Re: [WSG] Style part of form field

2005-03-28 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
http://www.sql-und-xml.de/unicode-database/miscellaneous-symbols.html
All symbols of version 2.1 are shown in standard-browsers.
Actually, while when I loaded this up (in FireFox), I was happily surprised 
that all symbols showed, I noticed that IE6 showed WAY   less than half of 
them... perhaps there is a work-around or other factors involved here (e.g. 
the character set, font used to display the items, etc).

Siggy 

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Fw: [WSG] Style part of form field

2005-03-28 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
In fact, IE5 (on another computer) renders even less than the few that IE6 
displayed; Opera and Netscape 7.2 also performed very poorly... And when I 
tried this on another machine here with FireFox, it performed very poorly in 
comparison with my machine... so must be affected by what fonts or setup you 
have in the operating system???

Siggy
- Original Message - 
From: Sigurd Magnusson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 7:25 AM
Subject: Re: [WSG] Style part of form field



http://www.sql-und-xml.de/unicode-database/miscellaneous-symbols.html
All symbols of version 2.1 are shown in standard-browsers.
Actually, while when I loaded this up (in FireFox), I was happily 
surprised that all symbols showed, I noticed that IE6 showed WAY   less 
than half of them... perhaps there is a work-around or other factors 
involved here (e.g. the character set, font used to display the items, 
etc).

Siggy 

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[WSG] Page views per month, peak rates in an hour

2005-03-28 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Untitled DocumentHi all,
A little off-topic, but after a look around the internet I've come up blank:
I'm trying to lump the popularity of websites into groups based on the total 
number of page views per month, and also learn the peak rate of page views 
per hour.

E.g. a standard banking website in New Zealand might recieve 15 million page 
views per month, which is around 27,000 page views an hour (if you decided 6 
hours a night were idle), but in lunch times, that rate might be more like 
50,000, etc.

I imagine in New Zealand it would be groups such as 10M+, 1-10M, 50k-1M that 
would be--it would be interesting to learn the quantity and general examples 
of websites in those categories. Finally, it would be useful to learn how 
much higher than average the 'peak hour' is.

Does anyone have resources or information on this; Australiasian would be 
most useful but other areas would atleast give me ideas!

Siggy 

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Re: [WSG] Rounded corner and IE Win help needed

2005-03-28 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Well if you put a border on the span you see that the image is in the wrong 
place within the span;

Doing background-position: bottom right; within the ul#subnav li.last 
span { certainly gets you most the way there; had you done that?

Siggy
- Original Message - 
From: Mike Brown [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 3:12 PM
Subject: [WSG] Rounded corner and IE Win help needed


Ok, so this is driving me crazy!
http://cpanz.signify.co.nz/test/national-pod-template.html
I have an unordered list being used for navigation. The bottom item on the 
list needs to have a rounded corner. I figure:

- make the last li position: relative
- add a span inside the last li the exact size of the corner image
- position it absolute to bottom and right of the last li
- have the corner image set as a background for the span
- give the last li height: 1%; as if I don't IE Win positions the 
span further down the page cf: 
http://www.positioniseverything.net/abs_relbugs.html

It all looks fine in Mozilla, Safari and Opera, but the span is being 
positioned wrongly in IE Win - ie, not at right and bottom of the last 
li.

Any ideas? I've spent way too long trying to figure this out, so no doubt 
have missed something basic!

Thanks.
Mike
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Re: [WSG] Rounded corner and IE Win help needed

2005-03-28 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Alternatively, fast forward to the the future, and use 
border-bottom-right-radius :P

http://www.w3.org/TR/2005/WD-css3-background-20050216/#the-border-radius
Someone here mentioned that this is already implemented in FireFox with a 
different  name.

Siggy
- Original Message - 
From: Mike Brown [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 4:09 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] Rounded corner and IE Win help needed


Sigurd Magnusson wrote:
 Well if you put a border on the span you see that the image is in the
 wrong place within the span;

 Doing background-position: bottom right; within the ul#subnav li.last
 span { certainly gets you most the way there; had you done that?
No! I hadn't thought it necessay because the span was given a width and 
height the same size as the background image. Your suggestion does help. 
It's still not quite right, but getting closer :)

Thanks!
Bert Doorn wrote:
http://cpanz.signify.co.nz/test/national-pod-template.html
I have an unordered list being used for navigation. The bottom item on 
the list needs to have a rounded corner. I figure:
Any ideas? I've spent way too long trying to figure this out, so no 
doubt have missed something basic!

Why not just make a background image for the last li instead of fiddling 
with spans, absolute and relative positioning etc?

ul#subnav li.last {
  background: #url(subnav-corner.gif) no-repeat right bottom;
}
If that (as I suspect) interferes with the links (corner disappears, 
particularly on hover), put a background image on

li.last a
...and...
li.last a:hover
I had thought of that, but the li.last a:hover does interfere with the 
corner:
http://cpanz.signify.co.nz/test/national-pod-template2.html

I can't put the corner as a background image on the a as you suggest as 
it already has the little box with the arrow as a background image. And I 
can't combime that with the bottom right corner as I don't know how high 
the link will be - eg whether it's 1 or 2 lines.

Incidentally, you might ass more contrast - there's not enough of it, 
especially on hover, making the (tiny) link text very hard to read.

Agreed, but I didn't design it, am just building it!
Thanks.
Mike
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Re: [WSG] XML Declaration

2005-03-24 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Is there any situation where IE6 renders in standard compliance mode with 
the ?xml ...  preamble?

E.g. if a certain HTTP Header is used? And/or with a .xml suffix (Microsoft 
is big on looking at file extensions you know... )

I've seen plenty of comments that application/xhtml+xml isn't embraced by 
IE, but what about text/xml ?

Siggy
- Original Message - 
From: Patrick Lauke [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Friday, March 25, 2005 4:34 AM
Subject: RE: [WSG] XML Declaration


Collin Davis

Per the W3C
specs, XHTML should be served as application/xhtml+xml or
application/xml or
text/xml and should not be served as text/html.
Actually, it doesn't say should not! As per section 5.1, it
actually states that documents may be sent as text/html:
XHTML Documents which follow the guidelines set forth in Appendix C,
HTML Compatibility Guidelines may be labeled with the Internet
Media Type text/html [RFC2854], as they are compatible with most
HTML browsers. 
http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/#media
I've never really understood this
- it's very
easy to use content negotiation to serve up HTML 4.01 as text/html to
browsers that can't handle the proper MIME type, and XHTML 1.0/1.1 as
application/xhtml+xml to those that can.
So your server actually sends clean HTML 4.01 to those browsers that can't
handle XHTML? Does it strip out the self-closing slashes? Or are you
sending XHTML with a text/html mime type (which you previously said should 
not
be done)?

Patrick

Patrick H. Lauke
Webmaster / University of Salford
http://www.salford.ac.uk
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[WSG] FireFox 1.0.2 out :)

2005-03-23 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Untitled DocumentUpgrade your browsers ;)
The new version simply resolves a couple of security vulnerabilities:
http://www.mozilla.org/projects/security/known-vulnerabilities.html
Siggy
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Re: [WSG] nesting in list

2005-03-21 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Looking at the W3C for XHTML 1.1;
http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml-modularization/abstract_modules.html#s_listmodule
It says that LI and DDs both are part of the Flow content model, which is 
the same as DIV, so this looks to confirm what my feeling was... they can 
contain any nested element, including further DLs, ULs and OLs. DTs are like 
H1s; and can only contain inline elements.

Siggy
- Original Message - 
From: Jonathan T. Sage [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 5:52 AM
Subject: Re: [WSG] nesting in list


at the very least, I believe any inline element can be nested.  Some
block-level elements may be as well I think.
~j

On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 12:32:33 -0500, Alan Trick [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 Does anyone know what is allowed to be nested under a list (ul,ol,dl) in
XHTML?  I read one resource, but all it said is that ul and ol require 1 
li,
and dl requires at least one dt, and one dl.
 Alan Trick


--
Jonathan T. Sage
Theatrical Lighting / Set Designer
Professional Web Design
[HTTP://www.JTSage.com]
[HTTP://design.JTSage.com]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: [WSG] Dilemma: Useful, additional attributes in elements, invalidating HTML

2005-03-20 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Thanks for all your feedback;
Steve Bryant: Cheers. The second approach is pretty code-heavy, so I would 
probably make the verbose style 
onblur=checkvalidation('required=true,validation=numeric') and possibly run 
the onblur event on all forms at the submission, or something like that.

Gez; So you're under the opinion, if you're setting attributes, only for 
later retrieval (i.e. that the user agent is specifically being asked to 
ignore the attributes), that this is poor design?
(I'd not come across this idea before). Additionally, would you be of the 
opinion, even if we used a custom DTD, that we were not operating in the 
spirits of webstandards? (i.e. we were tricking the validator for 
approval?). This angle interests me.

Kornel: The alistapart article, we have seen--it however causes a raft of 
problems in the interim. One is that I do want to be able to produce xhtml 
1.1 sites because some people need this (and one thing that I was asking, 
was if the fact it longer was the XHTML 1.1 doctype, would I run into 
people's apprehension-- see Bert Doorn's comment, for example)

. I use validation both as a means for marketing the quality of a website, 
and expect to have it so I can quickly check websites for mistakes (the 
htmlhelp one that can spider whole websites is great - i.e. 
www.htmlhelp.com/cgi-bin/validate.cgi?url=http://webstandardsgroup.org/index.cfmwarnings=yesspider=yes).

I didn't get any feedback on extending XML via more namespaces? I have seen 
this on other sides, and my understanding was that this is an alternative 
way of adding attributes to elements?

html xmlns:niftyform=http://somewhere/niftyform
...
form ... 
...
input niftyform:required=1 /
...
/form 
...
/html
It seems one Vignette website I know (http://tvnz.co.nz/) uses this. 
(Beware, that site is horrid in FireFox for some reason. I'm sure the 
missing doctype and the hundreds of errors probably don't help?)

If I validate that document as XHTML 1.1, it tells me that there are 
additional namespaces, however it seems the manner in which they are 
included is not permitted, as you see from the top few errors:

http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Ftvnz.co.nz%2Fview%2Ftvnz_index_skin%2Ftvnz_index_groupcharset=%28detect+automatically%29doctype=XHTML+1.1verbose=1
Or am I supposed to do something like this? Has anyone played with this sort 
of thing, or should I devote an afternoon to playing around and letting you 
all know how I get on?

html  xmlns=http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml 
...
form xmlns=http://some.custom/one/thatsomehow/adds/niftyform/namespace 
...
input niftyform:required=required /
...
/form 
...
/html

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Re: [WSG] Website Review

2005-03-20 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Hi,
Just a comment on layout;
When I went to the website, I immediately took an interest in the package 
and wanted to go to a download page, but I actually had difficulty locating 
it, which then raised my suspicions that it was still under development, 
especially when I went to 'Status' menu item, which has Uniform Server 
Development Status as the main heading in the content area.

I would suggest bumping in a new heading like Current version x.x available 
for download, with a sentance or two, including its release date (always 
promote your release date!) and the link over to sourceforge. Put this both 
on the homepage, and in the status page. Using some more graphics like 
Download version x.x now would also aid this.

Perhaps it was due to the fact there are three menus, and on the homepage 
they're all shouting I am the most important menu.

Anyway, now that I did find the download link, I am keen on trialing it :P
Siggy
- Original Message - 
From: Olajide Olaolorun [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WSG wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 7:07 AM
Subject: [WSG] Website Review


Can you please review http://www.uniformserver.com and tell me what you 
think?

I would love to hear from you all...
Thanks
--
Best Regards,
Olajide Olaolorun @ www.olajideolaolorun.com
...ain't nothing impossible unless you make it...
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Re: [WSG] CSS validator says [xX][mM][lL] is not allowed.

2005-03-19 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
I get the same response, so would seem to be a bug; perhaps submit a bug 
report to w3c? (Our company has sent in a bug report for the w3c xhtml 1.1 
validator the other week, so don't treat it as absolutely perfect!!)

Siggy
- Original Message - 
From: Andrey Stefanenko [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Saturday, March 19, 2005 8:42 PM
Subject: [WSG] CSS validator says  [xX][mM][lL] is not allowed.


Hi,
I have valid XHTML
http://idealcouple.com/
http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fidealcouple.com%2F
And valid CSS
http://idealcouple.com/styling/idealism.css
http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fidealcouple.com%2Fstyling%2Fidealism.cssusermedium=all
But when my client click CSS link in the footer,
CSS validator says :
Please, validate your XML document first!
Line 2
Column 6
The processing instruction target matching [xX][mM][lL] is not allowed.
I have both XHTML and CSS valid, but CSS Validator dont think so :(  Whats 
my
problem?  The same trouble i have in my other site in development (line 
and
column number are different)
http://it.net.ua/weblog/

We use PHP to render XML prolog and DOCTYPE, and we use PHP sessions.
Any help are welcome, as well as screenshots from Mac people.
Thanx,
Andrey.
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Re: [WSG] Making accessible a one-text field form with an image submit button?

2005-03-19 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Cheers - had wondered about using display:none, but always feel a little 
annoyed there aren't better ways; it surprises me that an alt tag on the 
input type=text / is insufficient.

One other note--does having an initial value in the text field aid blind 
readers? Is it advocated by WAI or aid WCAG rules? (I would express a view 
that it helps visual users).

Sig
- Original Message - 
From: Patrick H. Lauke [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Saturday, March 19, 2005 11:55 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] Making accessible a one-text field form with an image 
submit button?


Sigurd Magnusson wrote:
Rule: 12.4.1 - Identify all non-hidden INPUT elements that do not have an 
explicit LABEL association.
Failure - INPUT Element, of Type TEXT, at Line: 109, Column: 30 in FORM 
Element at Line: 108, Column: 2

I could put the label around the image button, or have a blank one, but 
this sort of defeats the purpose in my opinion... ideas?
Firstly: submit buttons and image button do not need an additional label: 
for submit buttons, the value itself acts as a label; for images, the ALT 
attribute takes that role.

So your only real problem here is the text input (as the above error 
message suggests).

label for=searchtermSearch/label
input type=text name=searchterm id=searchterm /
input type=submit value=search /
You can then use CSS to hide the label, if you want...and this is one of 
those rare cases where even if you use display:none, screenreaders will 
still see the label (due to its explicit tie to the input field).

--
Patrick H. Lauke
_
re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively
[latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.]
www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk
http://redux.deviantart.com
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Re: [WSG] Making accessible a one-text field form with an image submit button?

2005-03-19 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Cheers - had wondered about using display:none, but always feel a little 
annoyed there aren't better ways; it surprises me that an alt tag on the 
input type=text / is insufficient.

One other note--does having an initial value in the text field aid blind 
readers? Is it advocated by WAI or aid WCAG rules? (I would express a view 
that it helps visual users).

Sig
- Original Message - 
From: Patrick H. Lauke [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Saturday, March 19, 2005 11:55 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] Making accessible a one-text field form with an image 
submit button?


Sigurd Magnusson wrote:
Rule: 12.4.1 - Identify all non-hidden INPUT elements that do not have an 
explicit LABEL association.
Failure - INPUT Element, of Type TEXT, at Line: 109, Column: 30 in FORM 
Element at Line: 108, Column: 2

I could put the label around the image button, or have a blank one, but 
this sort of defeats the purpose in my opinion... ideas?
Firstly: submit buttons and image button do not need an additional label: 
for submit buttons, the value itself acts as a label; for images, the ALT 
attribute takes that role.

So your only real problem here is the text input (as the above error 
message suggests).

label for=searchtermSearch/label
input type=text name=searchterm id=searchterm /
input type=submit value=search /
You can then use CSS to hide the label, if you want...and this is one of 
those rare cases where even if you use display:none, screenreaders will 
still see the label (due to its explicit tie to the input field).

--
Patrick H. Lauke
_
re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively
[latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.]
www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk
http://redux.deviantart.com
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[WSG] Dilemma: Useful, additional attributes in elements, invalidating HTML

2005-03-19 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
This is a split technical/marketing dilemma for people to ponder...
Over the past few years, we have built up a library of rather useful 
Javascript libraries that we thought were a very elegant solution for adding 
behaviour to menu systems and forms. These have been used on dozens of 
websites, and are going to be offered to webdesigners' use.

For example, we built some javascript which could be used by including a 
single external javascript file, and when the page loaded, it would 
efficiently look through the the DOM (document object model) for fields like 
this:

input type=text name=EmailAddress required=true validation=email 
/

It would then automatically add javascript events to ensure when the form 
was clicked, that this text field contained a value, and that this value 
followed the [EMAIL PROTECTED] format.

We had a number of different types of validation; for example; numeric, 
which contained other options such as minimum/maximum numeric values.

Clever, we thought -- very easy to implement, reliable, cross-platform 
tested, et al. We looked to the XForms' spec in coming up with conventions, 
so they could become a standard in time. Supposedly, somewhere it was once 
mentioned that any unknown attribute it left ignored by a browser, so we 
utilised that feature, knowing that many scripts around the net use the DOM 
in this way.

Of course, we strike a major problem when we attempt to validate such HTML; 
these attributes are not known, and show as failures. Doh!

So, as I see it, there are two problems;
1. Technical -- there will be times when the validator shows errors. This 
may lead to us letting in other errors--its much easier to go through pages 
and check they are 100% correct instead of checking they are nearly correct, 
bar some permissble exceptions.

2. Marketing -- people consider a document validates or doesn't. If you say 
Well, it validates, except for some things where we've ... people will 
stop listening and just summarise it as It doesn't validate. This dilutes 
our ability to promote that sites we create validate, and also diluates our 
crusade to encourage others to build valid sites.

I'm interested to know what your views on how important these concerns seem 
to you (especially in terms of marketing? Would you, as a webdesigner, use 
scripts like this, knowing they would invalidate your code, but make certain 
areas of development way easier?)

Possible solutions:
1. Create a custom DTD that takes the DOCTYPE of XHTML1.1 and adds the extra 
attributes such as 'required' to the 'input' element. Alistapart has a 
recent article on this. Basically, browser's ignore them, but will be in 
standards mode, and frustratingly, the W3C Validator doesn't interpret them, 
so we'd have to promote that such sites don't validate with that validator 
(but you can use an alternative validator, sigh). This is a possible 
solution with XHTML 1.1, especially in time to come, but a solution to apply 
to XHTML 1.0 or even old HTML 4.01 sites would be useful. I find this to be 
a good 'technical' solution, but means we have a battle every time we 
explain the do you validate? topic.

2. Use a different style for attributes. I was reading that you could 
include them as XML attributes, e.g. input type=text xml::required=1 
 / But I haven't seen much information. Doesn't anyone know if this 
approach would be suitable (i.e. that browsers support it, the DOM can be 
used to retrieve values, the W3C validator would silently pass over them, 
etc). I presume you could only put these in with XHTML 1.0/1.1 documents, 
and that there is no way to put in extra attributes into HTML 4.01. Has 
anyone got some resources on the purpose or usage of XML attributes?

3. Leave it as it, and just have pages with forms fail on these items ...
4. Some jewel that is only thought up by mailing the WSG :)
Cheers for taking your time to mull over this one :)
Siggy 

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[WSG] Making accessible a one-text field form with an image submit button?

2005-03-18 Thread Sigurd Magnusson


I noticed that 
WCAG-AA needs a label "for" any text fields in a form. Makes sense, but 
...In the case where you have a text field like (where the button is an 
image):[] [Sign Up To Newsletter] or 
[] [Search]These are common as a global form on all 
pages. There is no label, even for visual users; the button image is the only 
item, and if this is an image, then it can have an alt tag.However, it 
seems that even if I put an ALT on the text field, the automated WCAG-AA test 
still fails the form; why??Rule: 12.4.1 - Identify all non-hidden INPUT 
elements that do not have an explicit LABEL association.Failure - INPUT 
Element, of Type TEXT, at Line: 109, Column: 30 in FORM Element at Line: 108, 
Column: 2 I could put the label around the image button, or have a blank 
one, but this sort of defeats the purpose in my opinion... 
ideas?Siggy


[WSG] Browser support for javascript CDATA regions

2005-03-17 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Untitled DocumentI am wanting to get some inline javascript to validate to 
xhtml1.1, which can be done via cdata regions. What's browser support for 
these like? Is this another area of brainnumbing hacks and problems?

Siggy
script type=text/javascript ![CDATA[Lots of juicy
symbols.]]/script 

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Re: [WSG] Asterisks in W3C spec

2005-03-15 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Wow. Some serious bedtime reading. Cheers.
Siggy
- Original Message - 
From: russ - maxdesign [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Web Standards Group wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2005 8:35 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] Asterisks in W3C spec


Here are some:
Joe Clark's serialised book (covers all three - title, alt and longdesc)
http://joeclark.org/book/sashay/serialization/Chapter06.html
Writing good ALT text (covers all three - title, alt and longdesc)
http://www.gawds.org/show.php?contentid=28
The alt and title attributes (covers alt and title but not longdesc, from
memory)
http://www.456bereastreet.com/archive/200412/the_alt_and_title_attributes/
Then there is always Laura's mega resource:
http://www.d.umn.edu/itss/support/Training/Online/webdesign/accessibility.ht
ml#alt
HTH
Russ

Finally, is there a commentary somewhere about the use of longdesc vs alt 
vs
title (e.g. on images, on images where they are the sole content of 
links,
etc). There seems to be a bit of information here and there, and 
obviously I
can use common sense, but was wondering if there was some high-calibre
writing out there, spelling out the different browser support and an 
overall
conclusion?
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Re: [WSG] Redundant Code

2005-03-14 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Don't know the maximum number of pixels a page can have; it very likely 
depends on the user agent. I would have thought the most robust way is to 
have a fluid design; which led me to an idea--having a fluid design only in 
the print media type :P I wonder if anyone's done that??

Or you could print it out in landscape view, given that a piece of paper is 
normally portait whereas a screen often landscape.

FireFox has some rather nice print options, btw.
Siggy
- Original Message - 
From: Mary Ann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2005 12:05 PM
Subject: RE: [WSG] Redundant Code


Hi, Sarah-
I printed out your test site because I thought it was so very clean and
attractive and I wanted to study your use of styles in creating it.
However, the page is wider than my printer's page size so some text is 
lost
along the left side.  For instance, Checkout in the navigation bar is cut
off as is Contact.
I see you have set the container width at 760px.  Does anyone know what is
the maximum number of pixels for page width in order to avoid truncating 
the
text along the left side of a print job?  Even Microsoft's support pages
suffer from this same problem . . . really maddening when trying to solve 
a
technical problem.
Thanks for your help.
Mary Ann

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Sarah Peeke (XERT)
Sent: Sunday, March 13, 2005 7:35 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] Redundant Code
Hi Siggy
Thanks for your reply.
ul liSub Heading 1
  ul
lia href=/Category 1/a/li
lia href=/Category 2/a/li
lia href=/Category 3/a/li
lia href=/Category 4/a/li
lia href=/Category 5/a/li
lia href=/Category 6/a/li
   /ul /li
 liSub Heading 2/li  liSub Heading 1/li
/ul
The change to the heirarchy above is great, but it doesn't help the 
#header,
#mainnav
and #subnav lists because there isn't a heading for these. If you look at
the page with styles
disabled you'll see what I mean.

I have changed the list style as per your suggestion #2 - thanks, an 
obvious
improvement.

Sarah
Test site http://www.bureke.com.au/test/index.html which is valid
XHTML/CSS. The style
sheet is here: http://www.bureke.com.au/test/styles/global.css
--
XERT Communications
email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
office: +61 2 4782 3104
mobile: 0438 017 416
http://www.xert.com.au/   web development : digital imaging : dvd 
production
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[WSG] Asterisks in W3C spec

2005-03-14 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
I keep seeing asterisks in the W3C spec but cannot see a glossary anywhere. 
As an example, with the img element in xhtml 1.1, the attributes 'src' and 
'alt' are both marked with an asterisk. Why?

http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml-modularization/abstract_modules.html#s_imagemodule
(I realise img is marked to be deprecated in xhtml2, but I feel adoption for 
that will require new browsers to come out and gain market share, as the 
object tag has a huge set of problems)

Finally, is there a commentary somewhere about the use of longdesc vs alt vs 
title (e.g. on images, on images where they are the sole content of links, 
etc). There seems to be a bit of information here and there, and obviously I 
can use common sense, but was wondering if there was some high-calibre 
writing out there, spelling out the different browser support and an overall 
conclusion?

Siggy 

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Re: [WSG] Redundant Code

2005-03-13 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
#1 - not sure
#2 If you want to apply something to every li within #header, use  #header 
li { ... }

Regarding #3, nesting your menus will create a clearer heirachy;
e.g. change
ul
 lih2Sub Heading 3/h2/li
 lia href=/Category 1/a/li
 lia href=/Category 2/a/li
lia href=/Category 3/a/li
 lia href=/Category 4/a/li
 lia href=/Category 5/a/li
 lia href=/Category 6/a/li
/ul
to
ul liSub Heading 1
 ul
   lia href=/Category 1/a/li
   lia href=/Category 2/a/li
   lia href=/Category 3/a/li
   lia href=/Category 4/a/li
   lia href=/Category 5/a/li
   lia href=/Category 6/a/li
  /ul /li
liSub Heading 2/li  liSub Heading 1/li
/ul
(Sorry, indentation in emails doesn't seem to work very well!)
Siggy
- Original Message - 
From: Sarah Peeke (XERT) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WSG wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 10:00 AM
Subject: [WSG] Redundant Code

Hello all
I have a test site http://www.bureke.com.au/test/index.html which is valid 
XHTML/CSS. The style
sheet is here: http://www.bureke.com.au/test/styles/global.css

In order for it to work cross-platform (I have tested on Firefox, IE5, 
IE5.5, and IE6 on the PC, and
Firefox, Safari and IE5.2 on the Mac) I have added all sorts of float and 
clear tags.

My questions are these:
1. What is the best way to test for redundant code (other than removing code 
and testing on all
browsers, line by line)? Can any of you 'float gurus' see any glaringly 
obvious redundancies?

2. I have used a modification of one of Russ' tutorials for the #header and 
#subnav - to float the
menu elements left and right. Is there a cleaner way to achieve this other 
than to apply a class to
*every* li tag?

3. Disabling styles in the browser provides three (3) separate lists 
comprising #header, #mainnav
and #subnav *without* any explanation or visual hierarchy (obviously). Is 
there a better way of
making it easier for someone without css (eg Netscape 4 users) or text 
readers etc to differentiate
between these navigational elements?

Thanks for any suggestions.
Sarah
--
XERT Communications
email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
office: +61 2 4782 3104
mobile: 0438 017 416
http://www.xert.com.au/   web development : digital imaging : dvd production
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[WSG] More links, their titles, and accessibility

2005-03-13 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Untitled DocumentA list of items containing titles, summaries and more links 
is fairly common; both for news articles, and products ('buy now '.).

In my opinion, a 'more' link is good accessibility for most users... You 
read a snippet of an interesting news article, and therefore your eye is at 
the end of a sentance, possible with an elipses (...) and therefore having a 
read more link right there is attractive and easy to use.

I understand completely about the adverse effects of this, and therefore the 
news headlines, or product titles, *must* be linked, and therefore a blind 
reader might say when descibing links;

Company offers new product..., more, Company staff win prizes, 
more

For this reason, I see linking the titles as a necessity, and having 'more' 
links an option to consider if they are worthwhile. (I also believe that 
designers who want to *not* have links on the titles can simply choose to 
remove the visual apperance of links, and ensure that they are infact 
links--not that I really want to endorse that practice, but its better than 
not having the titles as links at all)

What I wanting to ask is this:
How useful is it to place an title attribute on a / tags?
Supposedly these can be used to differentiate links where the linked text is 
duplicated, or possibly not very clear, and supposedly this conforms to 
XHTML 1.1. I'm wondering (especially in the case of products' buy now 
links, if these provide very real benfits--i.e. do any major user agents 
support them?)

Cheers,
Siggy 

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[WSG] DLs and multiple DDs, as more semantic means to produce general lists containing titles and summaries

2005-03-13 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
Untitled DocumentIn an effort to make our company's code XHTML 1.1 compliant
and more semantic (we were loosely following XHTML 1.0 Trans but now want to
more ridigly follow it), I was brainstorming for conventions and best
practices. I came up with an idea pertaining to general lists that I'd like
your input on.
Looking back at our sites, we would generally produce lists (such as news
articles with dates, summaries, leading into full pages), or products,
upcoming events, articles (.e.g
http://www.wigley.co.nz/mainsite/LatestArticles.html)  etc, in two general
ways;
1. Divs with nested headers/paragraphs. E.g.
div id=LatestNews
h1Latest News/h2
h2a href=FullArticle.htmlNews Item One/a/h2
pspan class=Date20/10/05/span Introduction goes here.../p
h2a href=FullArticle2.htmlNews Item Two/a/h2
pspan class=Date20/10/05/span Introduction goes here.../p
/div
Or, a wee bit nicer, use an unordered list, almost identically:
div id=LatestNews
h1Latest News/h2
ul
lia href=FullArticle.html class=HeadingNews Item One/a/h2
span class=Date20/10/05/span Introduction goes here.../li
h2a href=FullArticle2.html  class=HeadingNews Item Two/a/h2
span class=Date20/10/05/span Introduction goes here.../li
/ul
/div
However, it occured to when reading the XHTML 1.1 doctype's list module,
that it would be appropriate to use the definition list (dl, dt, dd) for
lists where you had a clear heiracy of titles and associated information
about them. The first example shows the proper heirachy between h1,h2 (news
article) and introduction, but doesn't give any semantic idea that the h2's
are all related in a list.
So, you could do this:
div id=LatestNews
h1Latest News/h2
dl
dta href=FullArticle.htmlNews Item One/a/dt
ddspan class=Date20/10/05/span Introduction goes here.../dd
dta href=FullArticle2.html  class=HeadingNews Item Two/a/dt
ddspan class=Date20/10/05/span Introduction goes here.../dd
/dl
/div
This gives both the idea of list of items and that the list has 'titles'
and 'descriptions'... I also went back to the W3C and determined that it is
a requirement of the html401 spec to allow multiple DDs for a DT. (e.g. if
your DT was for a word that had several meanings. Even Netscape 4 supports
it!), so you could even do the following, which I feel most comfortable
about:
div id=LatestNews
h1Latest News/h2
dl
dta href=FullArticle.htmlNews Item One/a/dt
dd class=date20/10/05/dd
dd class=intro Introduction goes here.../dd
dta href=FullArticle2.html  class=HeadingNews Item Two/a/dt
dd class=date20/10/05/dd
dd class=intro Introduction goes here.../dd
/dl
/div
While I do understand the DL is for a definition list, the W3C provide
another acceptable use of it as a transcript of people talking. To me, this
seems like another appropriate use that was simply not dreamed of years ago
when the spec was built--I can't see any places where this is used, not that
I looked around much ...
Ideas? Opinions?
Siggy 

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Re: [WSG] Redundant Code

2005-03-13 Thread Sigurd Magnusson
The change to the heirarchy above is great, but it doesn't help the 
#header, #mainnav
and #subnav lists because there isn't a heading for these. If you look at 
the page with styles
disabled you'll see what I mean.
I think what you and I are both really waiting for is XHTML2; except we need 
to wait for browsers and W3C to adopt it :P

http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml2/mod-list.html#edef_list_nl
nl
  labelContents /label
  li href=#introductionIntroduction/li
  li
 nl
 labelTerms/label
 li href=#mayMay/li
 li href=#mustMust/li
 li href=#shouldShould/li
 /nl
  /li
  li href=#conformanceConformance/li
  li href=#referencesReferences/li
  ...
/nl
Siggy

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