From: Danny Angus Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2004 13:42:14 +0000
I'd *guess* that PHOENIX_HOME is C:\APACHE2\HTDOCS\JAMES
I'm not clear why you have it "inside" APACHE2, you do know that James is a stand alone Mail server don't you? (Please don't be offended by questions which insult your intelligence I'm just trying to establish a base level of understanding)
PHOENIX_HOME is now "C:\JAMES", and no I'm not offended what-so-ever. I'm fully aware there are plenty of ignorances by anybody who breathes air and certainly for me trying to do crazy things that I don't know about and take on in an unstructured way of learning... -so I'm always willing to realize my ignorance and even let it be know to others. I certainly appreciate you picking-up on that path I was using, and in fact I was fully willing to write the whole path like that because indeed there has been somewhat of a question in my mind about something like this. I thank you for calling it out and clarifying the situation.
Within the past few months I have delved into alot of things that I had no clue about and I've learned with it all. The first thing I took on was installing Apache and getting into that. And then of course to get some of the extras involved you have to install other things(Perl, MySQL, php, etc.) and it was a big question to me at that point having never dealt with "rights" and the whole "multi user" schemes. So, in that situation I did the same thing and installed all this stuff under "Apache\htdocs" because I didn't know any better but I was thinking maybe it would be easier for all these rights to happen. I've found that there's plenty of information available for everything but I didn't find any to help me with things like this. So within the past couple weeks I decided to see what James was all about and upon downloading it and unzipping it I only had the vaguest idea of what it was and that was simple "a mail server". It matched the criteria for something I wanted to learn about... -it serves mail in and out, has the SMTP and POP3 workings.
Interestingly I guess I've been under a big disillusion about the whole "server" thing over the years. I've been under the assumption that a "server" was something that could provide you with the whole website thing and email and you can use ftp for your website and there was all this stuff that you could do with a "server"... hehe.. but I clearly see now that this is not the case at all and that a "server" would likely only deal with one thing.. -be it http, ftp, pop3, smtp among the many possibilities. So, anyway, I no longer think a "server" provides you will all these things, and too, I see now how James is just an email server(well only with the smtp and pop3 part cause it could be more with the NMTP and future additions) but that it has nothing to do with Apache or http or right involved with THAT "server"... hehe.. so thanks for bringing that up. ;)
Your problem is Windows 98 related and pretty much not anything else :-( Win98 has poor support for batch file scripting when conpared with NT derivatives and linux/unix. To overcome this you should indeed be specifying JAVA_HOME, and PHONENIX_HOME
Here's some installation comments:
Okay, first I undid those relevant variables from my autoexec.bat file for the system. Then I worked out a shortcut to dos in the local folder for the "run.bat" file(ie. C:\James\bin). Next I increased the initial memory for the shortcut and set it to crank up a "setenvvar.bat" on startup(which sets the 3 variables and then calls the infamous "run.bat").
After initiating, It worked okay and I guess on this first time that is where the whole unpacking happens. I successfully see the message that Phoenix is up and James is up and running and it showed the services and their ports...
Okay, so I shut down James with [Ctrl] + [C] and I get some message that JVM is being abnormal and then the Phoenix shuts down. I don't know whether that was the Java Virtual Machine being abnormal from my method of shutting down or maybe that's like James Virtual Machine or some other acronym. Either way it shutdown so I go look for my newly deflated files. I see that within C:\James\Apps\ there is now a folder called James and it's got the various subfolders for mail and such. ALSO I see a folder that comes up under the James root there and it is called Work. I'm assuming this is probably the work files and such that are getting used when James is up and runnin live.
Now, I go to do my config situation but there is no config.xml on the machine. I look here I look there etc. etc.. it's not there.. I dig through the docs that seem to replicate this installation/setup process in various conficting forms, but either way, I eventually go for a "search and find" from Windows and definately the file was not there.
So, I think.. ahh. no biggie.. I've got all the documentation of what should be in the config.xml and obviously the rest of the files got unpacked like the installation talks about.. -I'll just write one up real quick.. :) hey, it's just like HTML right?.. hehe.. not sure why I would think that and I actually got pretty far into it before I realized that I really don't know XML enough to even dream that I'm gonna get that many elements and variables and specifications and all that characteristics and such right(matter of fact the first XML document I've really studied extensively was this kernal.xml in C:\James\conf).
Next I just cry for a while... hey, it was a good cleansing experience.
Okay, next, delete these folders that got expanded during the first round and give it a try again... maybe... perhaps... hopefully... -there was just some random glitch in the positioning of the Earth in space or something... yea, should be fine the next go around, I dream.
Now, this time I decide to dig around while I still have the Phoenix/James server up for the first time(well I'm faking the "first time" part:).
So, when I dig under the C:\James\Apps\ tree I end up seeing the unpacked James folder and its subfolders but also there is a couple more folders that have come up this time and I've got the elusive config.xml within there as well. I don't why I would think to do it but I decided to copy those files and the whole stuff that wasn't there successfully from that first try I did. The folders and all that was like this:
AFTER my very first initiation of the "startup then shutdown-to-configure" process:
under C:\James\Apps\James appears:
logs
vars
..and that's it(but of course there are subfolders there -all blank.
I try it all again and DURING the "startup then shutdown-to-configure" BEFORE I shutdown I see this:
under C:\James\Apps\James appears:
logs
vars
conf
SAR-INF
So, anyway those other 2 folders are the ones I copied... then I shut down the server and get the abnormal message(which may or may not be abnormal but I haven't yet found any other way to shutdown). Of course again, those 2 particular folders disappear from existence, so I just copy my harvested folders back into that location hoping that maybe now I can do my config and everything will be okay. So, in the end of it I end up back with:
under C:\James\Apps\James appears: logs vars conf SAR-INF
Now, I run the scenerio again(actually didn't even change the config file at all), and I'm able to telnet in and get a hello message and such.. I use HELP and see the basic commands. I continue following the docs and go for making some users so I call 'adduser boogieman password' but it returns telling me 'this command not recognized'. Okay, fine, I don't care because I HAVE THE CONFIGS NOW!! HAHA!!! :p So there!.. Anyway I'll get back on track and say that I used quite a few of the commands in the list and found plenty to be "this command not recognized". I just figure maybe at this point those aren't implemented... -OR something's wrong of course. But I was able to shutdown the telnet anyhow. I decide to try to do some mail to see if I can at least lock the machine up or something, and I can just try to use the root root account if there may be some authentication issue from the mail software(I don't know maybe that's only for the remote administration part and the mailing thing isn't about account authenication)..
I had to start MySQL and the Apache/php installation here so I could pop into either my phpBB2 installation or the PHP-Nuke installation and enable the mail functionality and go for it(otherwise I have no clue how to send or receive mail with James because I'm not seeing any GUI for mailing functionality from James himself). I do that and try various things and of course it wont work. I'm not suprised at all though because I didn't fill-in the proper things into the James config.xml file. A sidenote of ignorance here is that perhaps after I DO get the config right there would be some way to use telnet or even what's that cheesy program that is known to spread virus'... ummm.. oh Outlook Express.. Yea, I do have outlook on the machine here although I don't use it. So, anyway perhaps it would be easy for me to check whether I can send/receive mails locally without getting the Apache server involved.
Now, so here I am I suspect I have the Phoenix/James system installed properly and at least configured somewhat properly considering my situation. There's 2 things I'd like to overcome though for this to have the functionality I would like. 1. I need to either get some DNS happening locally(or change the config to get to legitimate DNS). and 2. Change the config to enable the mail to go/come beyond "local". I guess while I'm at it I really have no clue what NNTP is so I could get that out of there and apparently the "Remote Manager" isn't very relevant for me either(being that is doesn't seem to work but mainly because I'm not remote and I can just use the config.xml).
I have no clue about a DNS server and I'm sure there's not one on my machine unless it's inherently build into winsock or the underlying Win multi-user networking system or whatever. This is one thing that has always eluded me. I've had a friend who has a hosting business and he would tolerate alot of my questioning but never would go anywhere with the "whats all this stuff about DNS" question. I don't know perhaps he really didn't know because after all he did have a handful of guys that really ran things I guess. Is it possible to understand without being a system administrator?
Can I just make some file on my computer to accomplish DNS? Like maybe: localhost=127.0.0.1 NOTlocalhost="MAGICDNS"
Or can I run a DNS server locally? It doesn't sound too appealing to be honest but if it's not too hard to accomplish then I wouldn't be scared to give it a whirl.
Can I use somebody elses DNS server in this situation? I'm sure my ISP is providing for some kind of name resolution right?.. -otherwise I probably couldn't type http://jakarta.apache.org/ into my browser right? But, I don't have a commercial account or anything so I guess I have no legitimate reason to deal with a DNS server and I don't want to do anything illegal or anything that would make my ISP climb on my back. I just want to be able to play around and learn things without having to go pay people for some server space and domain name that I'm just goobering around on.
any ideas, like do you think that James probably WAS running okay and maybe that whole installation craziness I did was right.. And anything about DNS? I don't even know how this works other than it being the resolution between humanly readable names and cryptic IP addresses. I suppose I'm getting ready to learn that there is yet another term for "server"..
Alright, thanks for reading.. hope you are willing to give me a little nudge here..
good day, sincerely, Scott
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