What part did you think was insulting to the USNO? Here it is from the same USNO link I posted earlier: <http://www.usno.navy.mil/USNO/astrometry/optical-IR-prod/ucac>
"The catalog is free of charge, although our resources are limited" Just for fun, I used archive.org to check what happened when USNO-A2.0 was released. From <http://web.archive.org/web/20001025181730/www.nofs.navy.mil/projects/pmm/a2.html> "We could afford to print only 500 of these sets, so we must request that individuals at the same institution share them. Requests should be sent to [email protected], and should include a postal address and a brief scientific justification." Note they specifically asked you to justify your need for that catalog. In the past, they have run out of copies, and not been able to get funding to produce more, before the demand ran out. You're right that we then had to "count on the generosity of the astro community to distribute the data in other ways". For the USNO-A2.0 catalog, Bill Gray (the guy I mentioned who made the source code available to access UCAC3) started a "pass it along" program where he made a few copies of his own set of USNO-A2.0 CDs (this was pre-DVD, and it took several CDs to contain the whole catalog) and sent these to the first people who asked, as long as they promised to pass it along to the next person who needed one, after copying it to their hard drive. That's what we had to do due to funding restrictions. I'm simply trying to avoid a repeat of that problem. It's not USNO's fault, and I never implied it was. As for the "geek" comment, I was referring to the attitude of whoever higher up in the chain of command makes the funding decisions- his attitude towards both the USNO and its "customers". That guy is probably more concerned with building fighter jets and has little idea of what actually happens at the USNO. -John ----- Original Message ---- > From: Sander Pool <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 5:46:15 PM > Subject: Re: [skychart-discussion] UCAC3 > > > You're welcome to discourage everyone from asking for the disk, of > course. Sure the UCAC project is from the 'olden days' but who cares? > There are still people working on it, collecting a pay check and writing > papers etc. You can decide to ignore the project and not ask for a disk > or show your interest and send an email explaining why you want one. > USNO and the UCAC project will not crumble because it got more requests > than it could handle. The reverse *could* happen. Why do UCAC4 when no > one wanted UCAC3? > > Use your own judgment and only ask for the disk if it has meaning to > you. But don't worry about poor ol' USNO. If I worked at USNO and read > sentiment like that below I'd be insulted. I wouldn't need protection > from the evil hordes of astro geeks who send emails asking for my > product. I'd welcome the interest and be proud of how relevant my > project is. If I ran out of resources to send out disks I'd stop sending > them out and reply with a simple 'sorry, no more disks to be had'. I'd > then count on the generosity of the astro community to distribute the > data in other ways. This is what happened with UCAC2. We're still here, > as is USNO. > > But, that's just my opinion. Mr Zacharias may well curse me and agree > with you :) > > Sander > > John Mahony wrote: > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: Sander Pool > > > > > > > > > I trust the USNO is a mature organization that can throttle the number > > > of discs it sends out or put usage restrictions on what people can ask > > > them for. > > > > (Well I misread that as "put restrictions on which people can ask for > > them", so my first paragraph isn't directly applicable, but I'll leave > > it in since it helps explain the situation) > > > > The problem with restrictions is that many amateurs use catalogs from > > the USNO for many various "real science" uses, but they often have no > > formal affiliation with established science/educational organizations, > > so there's no practical way to "regulate" distribution of discs from > > the USNO that would still allow these amateurs to get them. > > > > But the USNO also has limited resources for this. Much USNO > > activities, especially producing astrometric catalogs like this, is a > > throwback to the days when accurate navigation was much more directly > > related to star positions. These days, for an admiral in the Navy's > > budget office in the pentagon (or wherever it is), it probably looks > > like a low priority- interesting to geeks but of limited practical > > value to the military. There are perhaps a few hundred users who have > > a legitimate scientific need for these catalogs, and the impression I > > get is that there are only a few people at the USNO involved in > > produing them. In other words, it's a very low budget operation. > > > > So they're forced to rely on individuals to be reasonable in making > > requests for discs. For earlier catalogs, it has been common for them > > to run out of discs and have no funding for further distribution. But > > by then it's usually available online through CDS/Vizier, although > > downloads of the full catalog would require a very fast connection. > > > > If you're planning to convert the catalog for use by CdC users, that > > sounds like a reasonable reason to request a disc. But it would be bad > > if every CdC user requested his own disc from the USNO. > > > > -John > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > >
