Let them drill the well for general service and install a small heated tank for fire service. Use the wells to maintain the tank level. The problem with wells is that if the weather changes they can become unreliable. A storage tank big enough to handle fire service with a bit of reserve for domestic use would give them some level of reliability.
Is the existing tower filled by wells or some municipal service? Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection Group Mechanical Department CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 Direct - 864.599.4102 Fax - 864.599.8439 [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.lg.com -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Autry Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 11:54 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Fire Pump What the owner is proposing is that the tower be abandoned and new water supply from a well. David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Steve Leyton Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 10:51 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Fire Pump It sounds like the reserve is more of a problem. Another option is to construct a new (heated) tank that is filled from the tower, of a capacity that includes a minimum of 30 minutes of sprinkler water. There would be two taps on the tank, one at the bottom for fire and the other high enough on the tank so that it is above the 30-minute reserve level. Provide separate general service and listed fire pumps. The issue appears to be that the freezing weather conditions don't even allow adequate fire flow, no matter what configuration of pump(s) you use. Steve Leyton Protection Design & Consulting -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chris Cahill Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 8:34 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Fire Pump Well I posted my response before I saw Dave's clarification of the problem. I don't retract what I said but clearly a nursing home is very near the top of what Ray said about reliability. And I did speak to the reliability issue and the consideration of the needs. And Ray, I was going to note in rural America I have become more concerned with the assumption of "there is seldom a question as to the reliability of the pumps". Granted you did caveat with large municipal systems. Dave's situation couldn't possibly more illustrate the problem in rural places. I was born, raised and practiced until recently in "the big city". Out here in God's country there is definitely a lot of things I take for granted that are just not true. For example those that manage things like water systems never heard of the AWWA. Chris Cahill, P.E. Fire Protection Engineer Sentry Fire Protection, Inc. 763-658-4483 763-658-4921 fax Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mail: P.O. Box 69 Waverly, MN 55390 Location: 4439 Hwy 12 SW Waverly, MN 55390 -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Autry Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 10:20 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Fire Pump The occupancy is a nursing home outside of town with no municipal water supply. This building is currently supplied by a water tower. We have come to find out that the water tower is not heated and freezes in the winter time (this is Nebraska), apparently the domestic demand from the tower maintains about a 6" column of unfrozen water in the winter. While this "column" of water is sufficient for domestic demand, we know it won't be for the fire protection demand. David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 10:04 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Fire Pump What is the application, commercial, industrial or residential? Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection Group Mechanical Department CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 Direct - 864.599.4102 Fax - 864.599.8439 [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.lg.com -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Autry Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 10:47 AM To: [email protected] Cc: Doug Hohbein Subject: Fire Pump Dear Forum, NFPA 13 (2002) 15.2.2* Pumps. A single automatically controlled fire pump installed in accordance with NFPA 20, Standard for the Installation of Stationary Pumps for Fire Protection, shall be an acceptable water supply source. A15.2.2 An automatically controlled vertical turbine pump taking suction from a reservoir, pond, river, or well complies with 15.2.2. I have an owner that wants to supply domestic water and fire protection water with a vertical turbine pump on a well. Does this pump need to be installed per NFPA 20? Does this pump need to be a listed fire pump? I've always ASSUMED that if a pump supplied fire protection it needed to be a listed fire pump installed per NFPA 20. Now I'm not so sure. David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
