Rod, you have to use standard response heads on dry and pre-action, even in light hazard, because quick response is limited to wet systems. I think the intent was to say 'QR Reduction' is limited to wet, but that is not what it says.
-----Original Message----- From: Rod DiBona [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2010 3:45 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: USACE Velocity Thank you for the perspective on the velocity. A good judge of where a guy really stands is to ask "would I spend the money if it was mine?". The answer for me is no. I do see where George and Rahe are coming from and each situation is unique but I don't believe it is a good buy in the majority of situations. In this case I have heartburn because it is already guided by the UFC 3-600 so my area is already doubled and this specific project at our Air Force Base was under a MATOC with specifications from "SpecsIntact" incorporated by reference that limited the velocity. Another thing to be aware of in the 2009 UFC 3-600 is that ALL dry and preaction systems are to be schedule 40 galvanized piping and IF you groove the piping it HAS to be cut grooved. This was pointed out to me at a class at the convention in Rhode Island and I see it being enforced. Just a heads up to anyone bidding government work. -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Art Tiroly Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2010 2:29 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: USACE Velocity By increasing pipe sizes with velocity you are in effect increasing the density since the required pressure is likely far below the available water pressure. The industry rules for hydraulic calculations are pretty conservative if the correct density has been established for the occupancy. Increase the density or the area of application and use the NFPA rules everyone else uses. IMHO Arthur Tiroly ATCO Fire Protection Design Tiroly and Associates 216-621-8899 216-570-7030 Cell WWW.ATCOfirepro.com -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2010 4:11 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: USACE Velocity Rod, We at GSA still adhere to this velocity limit. However, we don't do it because of equation breakdown or some other esoteric reason. We do it simply to insure that we get larger piping. Since we do not really maintain our system very well and numerous changes and additions are made to our systems by everybody and their dog, we need all of the help we can get. This is just one of the ways. Since our buildings are supposed to last 100 years, we also start with a C-factor of 100 and reassess it in the future to see if it needs to be lowered again. We only use fire pumps where absolutely necessary to overcome elevation loss. Our fire pumps are not sized to reduce pipe sizes nor for providing the NFPA 14 pressures and flows at the top of standpipes. The fire pump is sized for the sprinkler system only. We are not that old fashioned, just that conservative. Rahe Loftin PE GSA Region 7 _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
