Galen, I am rather ashamed to admit I cannot remember having read A.5.1, and even if I had it might not have sunk in without your breaking it down. I am mostly focused on required water application rates for LH, OHI & OHII because I think it is the 'soggy middle ground' between the firmer Residential (life safety) & Storage (property protection). It is also by far the bulk of the work I have done, am doing, and likely will do. I will stay out of the "susceptibility for changes' debate because instead of the simplicity of Restaurant Seating being unquestionably .1 I would have to ask "what if they arrange the chairs in a circle and relocate the grill from the kitchen to the middle of the circle? Does 5.1.2 mean .15 is now required? A.5.1 says 'should', but as you say, it explains 5.1.2, which says 'shall not'. But I am not the least bit discouraged by the vagueness of "...abnormal fuel loadings or combustible characteristics...", since 'normal' is not defined, in fact it sets a range of sorts for the concepts and numbers I have been interested in defining for myself.
Thanks again, Brad > On Mar 7, 2014, at 8:51 PM, Brad Casterline <[email protected]> wrote: > > Thank you so much Galen. I was stuck, and I had a feeling it was due to > subtlety. Now I can proceed, slowly, but thanks to you I'm moving! > Brad > >> On Mar 7, 2014, at 7:57 PM, "Taylor, Galen" <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> Brad, >> >> I agree that the language of 5.1.2 is unfortunate. However, I think the >> explanation found in Annex A provides a reasonable answer to your question. >> Consider A.5.1 as two parts of a whole. >> The first sentence states: "Occupancy examples in the listings as shown in >> the various hazard classifications are intended to represent the norm for >> those occupancy types". I believe this sentence explains 5.1.1. >> However, the second sentence provides some variables to the norm that >> should be considered before determining the occupancy classification. It >> states: "Unusual or abnormal fuel loadings or combustible characteristics >> and susceptibility for changes in these characteristics, for a particular >> occupancy, are considerations that should be weighed in the selection and >> classification". I believe this sentence explains 5.1.2. >> >> So, in other words, don't get tunnel vision. Take off the blinders and >> consider all the factors before selecting a particular classification. I'm >> sure more than one AHJ has disagreed with your selection at any given time; >> and the two of you had to reach an agreement one way or another. >> >> I also think Classification of Occupancies in NFPA 13 is an unfortunate use >> of terms, because the Building Code uses the same term to describe building >> use such as Group A, for assembly use, Group E, for educational use, and >> etc. I've had to explain the difference on more than one occasion. >> >> Regards, >> Galen Taylor >> County of Los Angeles Fire Department >> Fire Prevention Engineering >> 323-890-4339 >> [email protected] >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [email protected] >> [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Brad >> Casterline >> Sent: Friday, March 07, 2014 4:25 PM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: occupancy classification vs occupancy hazard >> >> >> >>> On Mar 7, 2014, at 6:08 PM, Brad Casterline <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> NFPA 13, 5.1.2 (i'm looking at 2007): >>> "Occupancy classifications shall not be intended to be a general >>> classification of occupancy hazards". >>> >>> I have finally said "well, uh, ok" to 5.1.1, but am still saying "huh?" to >>> 5.1.2. >>> >>> This is not a pressing issue, I am not trying to cause a stir, and I wish I >>> had a real world hands on type something to share. >>> >>> Happy Friday, >>> Brad >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
