I'll agree with you on that, but who will answer my first question? Any bold takers?
Mark at Aero 602 820-7894 Sent from my iPhone > On May 6, 2015, at 5:14 PM, "Steve Leyton" <[email protected]> wrote: > > I'm very forward thinking ... > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Sprinklerforum > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of > [email protected] > Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2015 5:06 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: RE: Light & OH1 Hazard From Same Riser > > This response,(not yours Steve) requires me to ask another question, > which likely should be on a separate thread, but here goes. Is it the > charter of the NFPA 13 committee to write or amend the language of the > standard for what the AHJ will approve? Or rather is it the > responsibility of the NFPA 13 committee to write or amend the language > of the standard for the AHJ to ENFORCE. I think I may be really > confused! > > But for your response Steve, I'm not sure what you mean by "I told you > so", because what you told me was " but I'm pretty sure that utility > and/or mechanical rooms, service areas, etc. are classified in Chap 5 > (annex) as OH1.", which is not true, at least until next year. :-) > > Mark at Aero > 602 820-7894 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Sprinklerforum > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of > Steve Leyton > Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2015 2:15 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: RE: Light & OH1 Hazard From Same Riser > > Good info Tom - thanks. > > Mark Phelps - I TOLD YOU SO. > > (winkie face) > > SML > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Sprinklerforum > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Tom > Wellen > Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2015 11:25 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: Light & OH1 Hazard From Same Riser > > The next edition, 2016 will address mechanical rooms in the annex. > > I submitted PI No. 514 to address mechanical rooms: > > Public Input No. 514-NFPA 13-2013 [ Section No. A.5.3.1 ] > A.5.3.1 > Ordinary hazard (Group 1) occupancies include occupancies having uses > and conditions similar to the following: > (1) Automobile parking and showrooms > (2) Bakeries > (3) Beverage manufacturing > (4) Canneries > (5) Dairy products manufacturing and processing > (6) Electronic plants > (7) Glass and glass products manufacturing > (8) Laundries > (9) Restaurant service areas > (10) Mechanical rooms with stockpiles up to 8 ft > > Statement of Problem and Substantiation for Public Input A new > mechanical room by definition is a light hazard occupancy. The room is > empty and the equipment is generally noncombustible. The AHJ likely will > not buy off that the room will not be used for storage. > > I also submitted Public Input No. 515-NFPA 13-2013 [ Section No. A.5.3.2 > ] that was rejected: > A.5.3.2 > Ordinary hazard (Group 2) occupancies include occupancies having uses > and conditions similar to the following: > ...... > (31) Mechanical rooms with stockpiles up to 12 ft > > Committee Statement > Resolution: The definition of OH2 will drive the user to this occupancy > hazard classification. This language is superfluous. > > > Tom Wellen > > >> On May 6, 2015, at 12:39 PM, Tim Stone <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> John, >> Answers to >> #1 YES. >> #2 NFPA 13 Chapter 5, current edition. >> #3 Of course you can, there is no restriction. >> >> Regards, >> G. Tim Stone >> >> G. Tim Stone Consulting, LLC >> NICET Level III Engineering Technician Fire Protection Sprinkler >> Design and Consulting Services >> >> 117 Old Stage Rd. - Essex Jct., VT. 05452 >> CELL: (802) 373-0638 TEL: (802) 434-2968 Fax: (802) 434-4343 >> [email protected] >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Sprinklerforum >> [mailto:[email protected]] >> On Behalf Of John Allen, CET, CFPS >> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2015 1:27 PM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: RE: Light & OH1 Hazard From Same Riser >> >> Okay, I'm really confused. In NFPA 13HB - 2013, I found the > following: >> >> FAQ: Can nonmetallic pipe be used in an ordinary hazard occupancy? >> Nonmetallic pipe is not permitted in ordinary hazard occupancies and >> is only permitted in specific small ordinary hazard rooms within light > >> hazard occupancies. The limitation to rooms that do not exceed 400 ft2 > >> (37 m2) recognizes that almost all buildings have typically small >> storage rooms or mechanical rooms that would be categorized as >> ordinary hazard. Requiring a change in pipe type for those rooms or >> requiring the entire system to use metallic pipe would be > overburdensome. >> >> Supplement 3: >> (8)* Sprinklers shall not be required to be installed within >> electrical equipment, mechanical equipment, or air handling units not >> intended for occupancy. >> A.8.1.1(8) Equipment having access for routine maintenance should not >> be considered as intended for occupancy. >> Clarifies that some electrical equipment is large enough to be >> accessed by man doors. In these instances, where this equipment is not > >> occupied but rather accessed for maintenance, sprinklers are not > required. >> >> So, my three questions now are: >> 1. do I need sprinklers in the mechanical room that is 750 sqf? >> 2. what code identifies the mechanical room as OH1? >> 3. if I do need sprinklers, can I design the OH1 area off the cross >> main that feeds the light hazard areas (using only one riser feed)? >> >> >> Best Regards, >> >> John Allen, CET, CFPS >> President >> >> >> AFS: Allen Fire & Security >> Your Safety is Our Success >> Direct: 770.715.7261 | Office: 770.723.7280 Ext 2 | Fax: 678.894.4180 >> >> >> Please consider the environment before printing this email This >> email contains proprietary and confidential material for the sole use >> of the intended recipient and is the sole property of AFS. Any >> review, use, distribution or disclosure by others without the >> permission of the sender is strictly prohibited. If you are not the >> intended recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), >> please contact the sender by reply email and delete all copies of the > message. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Sprinklerforum >> [mailto:[email protected]] >> On Behalf Of [email protected] >> Sent: Wednesday, May 6, 2015 8:56 AM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: RE: Light & OH1 Hazard From Same Riser >> >> You are looking for permission? How long could the possible > scenarios in >> that list be? >> >> There is no restriction or prohibition of designing systems of >> different densities off one riser. It's common practice. Calculate >> and prove it works and you're done. >> >> Mechanical rooms contain rotating electrical equipment, some may >> contain natural gas or propane piping, or fuel oil, typically there's >> at least one or more boxes of filters since they go with the AC >> equipment, we will at some time probably have to consider the >> refrigerant being used on HVAC equipment as some of the "greener" >> gases have flammability properties. So HVAC mechanical rooms are not >> without hazards. OH 1 is typical for anything bigger than an > apartment closet mechanical room. >> >> Craig L. Prahl >> Fire Protection Group Lead >> CH2MHILL >> Lockwood Greene >> 1500 International Drive >> Spartanburg, SC 29303 >> Direct - 864.599.4102 >> Fax - 864.599.8439 >> CH2MHILL Extension 74102 >> [email protected] >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Sprinklerforum >> [mailto:[email protected]] >> On Behalf Of Brad Casterline >> Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2015 6:14 PM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: RE: Light & OH1 Hazard From Same Riser >> >> Apology accepted ;) >> >> a real head-scratcher--- i thought of a few things, looked them up, >> and by golly they were not codes that allows you to design that way >> (the way we all do all systems that is) >> >> i'm going home and let this bother me all night... thanks (i cant wait > >> til tomorrow morning when i check my mail) >> >> brad >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Sprinklerforum >> [mailto:[email protected]] >> On Behalf Of Jack Carlson >> Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2015 4:51 PM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: RE: Light & OH1 Hazard From Same Riser >> >> John, >> >> You should not have an issue with the design as described. Light and >> ordinary are commonly mixed, no separate supply main is necessary. >> >> >> Jack W. Carlson, SET >> Triple "A" Fire Protection >> Office - 251.649.2034 >> Fax - 251.649.2037 >> Cell - 706.247.5050 >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Sprinklerforum >> [mailto:[email protected]] >> On Behalf Of John Allen, CET, CFPS >> Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2015 5:38 PM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Light & OH1 Hazard From Same Riser >> >> I apologize for such a simple question, but I would greatly appreciate > >> some >> guidance: >> >> I have a 22,000 sqf light hazard office space with a 750 sqf >> mechanical room that I've identified as ordinary hazard 1. The entire > >> ceiling space is an open 14' concrete beams and roof deck, and the >> mechanical room is separated by sheetrock and self-closing doors. The > >> riser is in the mechanical room and I have 7 upright sprinkler heads >> fed off the cross main pipe feeding the light hazard office space. >> What code allows me to design this way or must I create a separate > riser feed for each hazard? >> >> >> Best Regards, >> >> John Allen, CET, CFPS >> President >> >> >> AFS: Allen Fire & Security >> Your Safety is Our Success >> Direct: 770.715.7261 | Office: 770.723.7280 Ext 2 | Fax: 678.894.4180 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl >> er.org _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl >> er.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl >> er.org _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl >> er.org _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl >> er.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl >> er.org > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler > .org > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler > .org > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler > .org > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
