It also depends on what edition of NFPA 13 has been adopted by your
jurisdiction.
Forest Wilson
Fire Sprinkler Contractor
PH: 937-736-0425
forest_wil...@aol.com
-----Original Message-----
From: rongreenman . <rongreen...@gmail.com>
To: sprinklerforum <sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org>
Sent: Wed, Jun 3, 2015 2:27 pm
Subject: Re: Antifreeze systems
The reason I have no hair is local jurisdictions thinking they have a
better
insight into these problems than the committee because they have a
"special"
problem. I think they want the attic system because they're
afraid of
firefighters falling through the roof. My solution has always
been, if this is
a concern don't go on the roof. The shoe purpose of a 13R
is to afford
residents more tenable escape time. If everyone is standing on
the sidewalk,
surround and drown. Only my opinion though.
On Wed, Jun 3, 2015 at 11:15 AM,
Parsley Consulting <
parsleyconsult...@cox.net> wrote:
Travis,
I
believe you have this correct, however, there's also a hook in the
applicable
sections for 13R systems.
That link (if you scroll down), shows you the
page, you see the
revised section 5.4.2 for 13R, and it notes that ares
needing freeze
protection can use anti-freeze if it is a listed solution per
NFPA 13, and
the installation of that sort of system is to be per NFPA 13.
Sounds like the AHJ for you Jay is stepping way out on a limb. I
don't know
if I'd do this sort of work with this sort of problem hanging
over the
project, even if I did get the AHJ's instructions in writing with
their
signature. For me, one of the early seminars I attended included an
advisory
that "How are you going to defend installing a system with
anti-freeze when
you know it has this issue?"
Or maybe ask the AHJ if they're going to
defend you in court, and
definitely get that in writing, since they're asking
you to install
something outside of the adopted standard.
*Ken Wagoner,
SET
*Parsley Consulting***
*350 West 9th Avenue, Suite 206
*Escondido,
California 92025
*****Phone 760-745-6181*
Visit our website
<http://www.parsleyconsulting.com/>
***
On 06/03/2015 10:52 AM,
Travis Mack, SET wrote:
Jay:
The way I read that link is that you
can use AF listed for ESFR systems,
or you can use premix solutions in
"specific areas" of a new 13D
installation. It doesn't say anywhere that it
is permitted in a 13R or 13
system based on that link.
So, if you
are 13R, I don't see how it would comply with the
requirements. But, maybe
I am reading something wrong.
Travis Mack, SET
MFP Design, LLC
2508 E Lodgepole Drive
Gilbert, AZ 85298
480-505-9271
fax:
866-430-6107
email:tm...@mfpdesign.com
http://www.mfpdesign.com
https://www.facebook.com/pages/MFP-Design-LLC/92218417692
Send large files
to us via: https://www.hightail.com/u/MFPDesign
On 6/3/2015 10:48 AM,
Jay Stough wrote:
I have an AHJ that is telling me to install an
antifreeze system in a 13R
attic. They have an ordinance requiring attics
to be protected in 13R
and
13D systems if deemed appropriate by the
fire marshal. I was under the
impression that after September of 2012 you
could not install new
antifreeze systems without listed solution, which at
the present time is
not available. He is telling me that it just has to be
premixed.
When I go to the NFPA website, at
http://www.nfpa.org/safety-information/for-consumers/fire-and-safety-equipment/home-fire-sprinklers/current-requirements-for-sprinkler-systems-containing-antifreeze,
it appears that you can use premixed, even at the higher concentrations.
Am I reading this correctly?
*Jay Stough*
NICET IV LAYOUT
NICET III ITM
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--
Ron Greenman
Instructor
Fire Protection Engineering Technology
Bates
Technical College
1101 So. Yakima Ave.
Tacoma, WA
98405
rgreen...@bates.ctc.edu
http://www.bates.ctc.edu/fireprotection/
253.680.7346
253.576.9700
(cell)
Member:
ASEE, SFPE, ASCET, NFPA, AFSA, NFSA, AFAA, NIBS, WSAFM, WFC,
WFSC
They are happy men whose natures sort with their vocations. -Francis
Bacon,
essayist, philosopher, and statesman (1561-1626)
A problem well
stated is a problem half solved. -Charles F. Kettering,
inventor and engineer
(1876-1958)
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