On 01/27/2015 11:49 PM, Gonzalo Peña-Castellanos wrote:
First of all, thanks for sharing your views on the issues I raised,
I really appreciate all your comments and input and Spyder greatly
benefits from them.
*I know all this are personal opinions but I would like for you to always *
*look at Spyder through the eyes of a new user, not a developer,*
*not a hacker, not an old time user.*
Now on the issues raised
*Template*
Sorry I needed to elaborate more on this, that was the "old time user"
talking!
I really like the suggestion from André, we could have some "standard"
templates,
and we could even allow for easy creation of more templates.
This way you could tailor your default templates.
* Blank
* Scientific Stack template
I am aware of the weirdness of the boilerplate, I was unaware of it
for a long time, but when I started making my own modules it all
made sense. I also know it is hard to teach what it does and why
it look so weird BUT is something worth getting straight from the
beginning, no?
Dumping import in the namespace is relative... templates are meant for
the editor and erasing lines is easier than writing
*PEP*
I am well aware of the optional quality of PEP in the python world.
I was also unaware of PEP for a while and my scripts looked pretty
bad (hell maybe they still do!) but once I learned about my code
really looks clean to the point, that I type it like that and the
"annoyance"
is minimal. Would not this be something to foster in new generations?
If you "annoy" them at the beginning you might actually make clean
python programmers as a side effect, is that something bad to wish for ;) ?
As André, I also have a small background in teaching Python (with Spyder)
and this is something needed
The removing of trailing and empty lines is what gets triggered often in
PEP8,
mostly because autoindent should remove and empty space if you hit enter
twice, so that this indented empty lines would not get generated.
This really would benefit the new comers and people teaching them
*Online help*
André raises a good point, but it looks so ugly!!! any alternative to this?
maybe styling the output with a custom css to make it look consistent
and pretty with Spyder then??
*Object inspector*
Yes I see the point, I still miss it how it was before :(
*Language*
I agree with André, you should be able to ste the language to whatever
you want and not get any "unexpected" stuff by using LANG defaults.
*Anaconda*
I would argue anaconda is the present. The thing is that is Windows
for better or worse will still remain the OS of choice of institutions
worldwide and most new people will come from a windows background
so we should strive to make this the default.
For a linux user that only uses Linux, and learn linux 5 years ago,
fine, you know how to hack away in linux, and will use apt to do
everything
For the new and recent linux user (ubuntu, mint... etc..) with a pretty
interface and no command line needed (in general).. anaconda is also
great.
For the cross platform user, anaconda IS A MUST!
If people have not work on science with numpy scipy, mpi etc on windows
then the argument of "pip and virtual env is enough" will never be
backwards.
Pip is a great tool and still needed, virtual_env is pretty useless if
you go
outside of Python only libraries, I know is quick and easy.
Even on Linux and trying to share your work with only pip and virtual env
wont do. The new projects features could immensely benefit if we used conda
environments as a core of it.
Here is an idea. We also have Minconda
<http://conda.pydata.org/miniconda.html> available.
Should we create a custom installer with minconda + Spyder + numpy + scipy +
optional but very usefull dependencies on Spyder? We could even ask for the
help at conitnuum.
It would not be so heavy as anaconda and it could carry everything
needed and
it could already leverage conda for projects and the installation of
packages.
Whats more, conda allows for installing R packages now (in beta testing)
so we
could potentially add an R console to Spyder for people still needing
R!!!!!!!
Bottom line, you have an opinion of how and where you want to work on
Python. That is fine, but in the end it is your opinion, not necessarily
shared by others. Hard coding that into the design of Spyder is a no-go
from where I stand. The tools exist now for the end user to customize
the look, feel and operation of Spyder. These could be made easier and
more readily apparent and I think this is where work could be done. Also
at last look there were 487 open issues here:
https://code.google.com/p/spyderlib/issues/list
Seems to me that fixing these is bigger priority then starting on a
campaign that will only add to that list. If you want to help Spyder,
then I would suggest working on the Project manager. A fully functional
Project Manager would do more to 'sell' Spyder then anything else I can
think of.
Thanks for sharing, cheers
--
Adrian Klaver
[email protected]
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