Tim wrote, "I'd like to suggest we be careful about where this topic is going." In my opinion the two realities: white privilege and imbalanced (racially and class) civic participation are inextricably entwined. In addition, discussing either or the combination of the both violates none of the forum's rules, unless new rules get created so as to assidiously avoid issues of white privilege, racism or the potential affects of those realities on how we do our democracy, online or otherwise. When I questioned the fairness and openness of the CIB process I certainly meant more than the fact that they were handpicked by the Mayor. My analysis, worked through over fifteen years of active community organizing in St. Paul, includes the issues of race and class (notice my post included tenants as those outside the present "open" processes not just African Americans. Tim you chose to center your critique soley on the issue of race). So my suggestions are: a) the moderator be very careful about how and why he or she tries to control or limit any discussion and that we can and should be able to talk about both issues (or multiple issues) if they are in any way related and relevant to a given topic and its relation to how we do our democracy. I find it fascinating that the first time since I've been reading/particpating in this dialogue, when race is mentioned, there is an attempt to squash/limit/control the discussion. Finally, we should probably allow Bob to define what he meant by privilege don't you agree.
Tim Erickson wrote:
that if the CIB committee members are being chosen by the Mayor from a pool of folks that come mainly from the district council system, then it is flawed, inequitable and so unfair system and will choose to spend tax dollars on projects that they and their peers perceive as important. And as far as accepting or admitting your own privilege thats between you and your conscience.
Caty (and all):
I'd like to suggest that we be careful about where this topic is going. The original accusation was that the CIB process is "hand picked" by the mayor. Now, the criticism is that the CIB process is greatly influenced by the effects of "white privilage".
These are entirely different points and need to be separated. I don't think that anyone in this forum has said that the CIB process is the best possible system for citizen input or even claimed that minority groups are adequately represented.
The only claims that I have heard are:
#1) That the body is not "hand picked" by the mayor. In fact, it appears that neighborhoods have a great deal of influence on who is on it. #2) That the body is more inclusive than just about any other political body in the city.
Its completely possible for both of these statements to be true AND to still claim that the process if far from "open and inclusive."
Just to summarize. For the sake of clarity, I would suggest that if we proceed with this topic we be clear about which issue we are talking about.
Are we concerned about the Mayor "hand picking" the CIB committee?
OR
Are we talking about racism and the effects of "white privilege" on citizen participation?
If we are to have a productive discussion, its essential that we all be talking about the same thing! I suspect that when Bob said he was "not privileged," he was speaking in terms of "having an 'in' with the mayor," which is far different from saying that he does not have "privilege" in comparison with some of the very poor and disadvantaged communities in our city.
In short, I'm not sure I see disagreement on this issue as much as I see different people talking about completely different things. That's not to say that real disagreement will not emerge as we proceed.
Thanks,
Tim Erickson Hamline Midway
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