Hmmm,
I read everyone's posts, and they are somewhat inspiring. I'd like to see examples of using Xalan to get my struts message bundle, or other messag bundles. I'm sure I could spend an hour and figure this out, but if anyone has ready examples, links, send them my way! XForms - I'm excited about these, but I think it'll be awhile before the browser's support them. #3 is probably from my own experience. I spent a week trying to develop a XML/XSL framework using JSPs to emit XML, XSL and the JSTL to do the transformation. My JSPs became very small and nice, but it seemed I was spending a lot of time writing the XSL and trying to get it to work properly. I've had a lot of experience with writing HTML and JSPs, and so I bagged the whole idea and recommended we just use JSP/HTML with Tiles and CSS. I know that my client will get more value from my time with this approach. The reason my client wanted to use XML/XSL was to easily adapt the UI for other devices. I think this is a great reason, but it almost seems simpler to me to separate my HTML client from my WAP client and develop entirely new JSPs for the WAP client. Of course, working with a limited budget and a small development team (1) - there's not much time for learning curve. Matt --- Taylor Cowan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Matt, > > Those are very good points. Here is how I deal with each one: > > 1. You can internationalize using resource bundles with Xalan, because it > allows Java extensions. Another thing on i18n, I've noted that when UI's > are described in XML, you are combining question text, labels, instructions > all in one document. In that case it's more direct to just translate the > XML docs, and not use resource bundles. It's rare that you just need to > translate a word here or there for web apps. They are full of text, and > resource bundles are suited well to managing documents of translated text. > The framework just needs to choose the correct XML doc based on the > language. > > 2. XForms is introducing a generic form descriptor language, once that's > available we can choose a generic style sheet and modify...I have defined my > own XML strucure, and that article gave an example as well. It's not that > big of a deal. Once the first style sheet is done, it's easy to modify to > account for little changes here and there. > > 3. Using a tool like excelon makes XSL easy to debug. It is not difficult > to debug. You're not really 100% correct on that one. J2EE is difficult to > debug, but we still use it. > > I just saw the post from J. Gibbons, and it is NOT TOO EARLY. Nope. That's > wrong. It's time has come, at least for us to consider as developers. > > Taylor > > -----Original Message----- > From: Matt Raible [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Monday, February 04, 2002 11:01 AM > To: Struts Users Mailing List > Subject: Re: Boost Struts with XSLT and XML - JavaWorld.com > > > I read this article and think that it is good - but there's a couple of > things > that I think need to happen before this architecture is "embraced." > > 1. There needs to be mechanisms for getting internationalization into your > XML > or XSL. It seems difficult to use messages from a properties files for > messages and form labels. By "difficult", I mean harder than it is to use > <bean:message> in JSPs. I could see putting them into the XML document, but > then it seems that HTML developer type stuff is getting handed off to the > Java > developer. > > 2. XSL Templates and examples are difficult to find. I think this > technology > and concept would rapidly catch-on if there were XSL stylesheets that you > could > download that would format all your form-elements and other details. If the > struts-example where adapted to use this approach, people would jump all > over > it I'll bet. > > 3. XSL is difficult to debug, and if we're truly separating view from > everything else - good luck finding a "view" developer that knows XSL. > > I know some of these are irrelevant since we HTML developers are often Java > coders and XSL experts... but just my 2 cents. > > Matt > > > > > > --- Ted Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > See also the Velocity/Struts toolset. > > > > http://husted.com/struts/resources/velstruts.zip > > > > and > > > > http://cvs.apache.org/viewcvs/jakarta-velocity-tools/ > > > > Same basic idea: expose the Struts API as an object that anybody can > > easily use, without having to know that Struts even exists. All the > > hooks are there, they just aren't as easy to get to as they might be. > > > > I started a ContextHelper object that did this as part of the core > > framework. We pulled it out temporarily while the new multiapps stuff is > > going on. But I plan to put it back in so that the default controller > > does what the X2 Servlet and Velocity Servlets are doing, in a uniform > > way. > > > > It's my personal opinion that, while JSPs are flexible, these other > > technologies work are ever bit as effictive when used as the V in MVC. > > > > -- Ted Husted, Husted dot Com, Fairport NY USA. > > -- Java Web Development with Struts. > > -- Tel +1 585 737-3463. > > -- Web http://www.husted.com/struts/ > > > > > > > > "Knoll, Zach" wrote: > > > > > > This is really cool. I've been struggling with this for a while trying > to > > > convince myself that everything that comes from SUN must be good and > > > beautiful and that those that were ragging on JSP were just fringe > loonies. > > > I thought the whole struts tag library and tag libraries in general > would > > > shut up the non-believers by removing spaghetti code from JSP. But from > > > experience I am seeing that people will always go the easiest route and > > when > > > offered a choice between learning how to handle a new tag library API or > > > just slopping some java code into your JSP, its the rare coder who wont > > take > > > the sloppy, easier, impossibly harder to debug 2 months later approach. > I > > > think I can finally admit now that JSP is just not a clean good > technology > > > and although I have a lot to learn I'd like to move away from JSP's > > > altogether. Simultaneous to my JSP=bad voyage of discovery I was also > > > starting to learn Struts and saw and continue to see in Struts stuff > that I > > > have been doing on my own for a while now, done in a more polished > cleaner > > > fashion that attracts me to it. This article showing how to have the > best > > > servlet centric architecture (Struts) while cutting out the dead-weight > > > (JSP) really hits home. I just wish they would've provided more code so > > > people like myself who are new to xml can really get a sense of how to > > > implement this beast. > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Pete Carapetyan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > > Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2002 12:17 PM > > > To: Struts Users Mailing List > > > Subject: Re: Boost Struts with XSLT and XML - JavaWorld.com > > > > > > This is one of the most well written articles I have ever seen. > > > > > > At first blush, I am having a difficult time deciding wether this > > technology > > > is > > > totally cool, or it is just such a straightforward presentation that I > am > > > twitterpated. > > > > > > Thanks Todd > > > > > > "Todd G. Nist" wrote: > > > > > > > I have not seen this posted so, for those interested in using XSLT and > > XML > > > > with Struts, thought the following article maybe of value. > > > > > > > > Boost Struts with XSLT and XML > > > > An introduction to Model 2X > > > > > > > > Summary > > > > Struts is an innovative server-side Java framework designed to build > Web > > > > applications. Hosted by the Apache Software Foundation's Jakarta > Project, > > > > Struts has recently gained wide acceptance in the Java community. In > this > > > > article, Julien Mercay and Gilbert Bouzeid introduce the processing > model > > > > underlying Struts, describe the Struts framework itself, and present > > Model > > > > 2X, which enhances Struts by replacing JSP (JavaServer Pages) with XML > > and > > > > XSLT (Extensible Stylesheet Language Transformations) to better > separate > > > > logic and presentation. (2,600 words; February 1, 2002) > > > > > > > > By Julien Mercay and Gilbert Bouzeid > > > > > > > > URL: > > > http://www.javaworld.com/javaworld/jw-02-2002/jw-0201-strutsxslt.html? > > > > > > > > Todd G. Nist > > > > > > > > -- > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > -- > > > Pete Carapetyan > > > http://datafundamentals.com > > > Java Development Services > > > > > > Open standards technology for commercial profitability > > > > > > -- > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > ********************************************************************** > > > This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and > > > intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they > > > are addressed. 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