I agree with Jeff about the extension conflict. Easy solutions to possibly easy problems first. I know that under OS 9.1 I would get random Type 11 errors on startup that were caused by the PowerLogix G3 Profiler INIT.
-Robyn On Saturday, September 21, 2002, at 04:46 PM, Jeff Walther wrote: > At 12:58 -0700 09/21/2002, Bolton Peck wrote: > >> Upon bootup from cold I am getting a 'type 11' bomb error on my J700, >> it >> happens regularly at the end of the icon parade which is my extension >> loading :-) If I power down, take the lid off, unseat and reseat the >> CPU card and push down on the PCI cards, then reboot it will usually >> come back up. However running mem test software results in no >> indicated >> RAM problems. Although Gauge pro only tests the RAM that's free, in >> my >> case the remaining 90MB or so of 160 which is free when runningthe >> machine. >> >> So my question is, how is the memory mapped in Mac OS and within the >> machine? That is, does the Mac OS get put in the lowest available >> address, and does that correspond to motherboard RAM? > > I don't know whether the motherboard RAM is at the high addresses or > the low. However, it appears that the Mac OS mostly loads starting > at the lower addresses, but there's also some stuff that seems to go > at the highest addresses. So it's not as simple as we would like it > to be. Another nice list member sent me a memory utility several > months ago that made this apparent. Of course, my leaky wetware > memory doesn't remember the name of the kind list member nor the name > of the utility. > >> I would not be >> averse to unsoldering the slower 70ns mobo RAM chips, since I have >> plenty of other RAM in the box. Do I have to unsolder all of the pins >> or could I just disconnect the power pins? > > I don't think that you can just unsolder the power pins. The memory > is in an SOJ package which means it has pins like a PLCC chip. They > are thick and bend under the chip and curl. You'd be hard pressed > to desolder them and bend them out of contact with the underlying > pad. You'd pretty much need to desolder the whole chip. > > Technically, just desoldering the power pins might do the trick of > disabling the motherboard RAM. I'm just saying that I think it's > physically impossible to very difficult to do so. > > BTW, the RAM chips in our machines (or at least the one I examined) > are 1M X 16. Which is a little odd, because eight chips of that > sort gives a width of 128 bits unless they divided it into two banks > or something. The memory bus is 64 bits wide. Or, if it is > interleaved it makes sense. Kennedy? Didn't you write a few years > back that the motherboard RAM *is* interleaved. > > I've been hunting around for a 8M X 16 or 4M X 16 in a 42 pin SOJ > which would take the MB RAM to 128 MB or 64 MB respectively. > Doesn't make much economic sense, but if one wants to get the > S900/J700 over 1 GB this would do it... > > Anyway, if ultimately you do need to desolder the memory chips, and > if you need advice, Mad Dog or I can probably give you pretty easy to > follow instructions. They'll involve buying Chip Quik though... > But I think this is unlikely. > >> The above is based on the assumption that a type 11 error relates to >> memory, and that it could be hardware related since pushing and >> prodding >> the motherboard seems to temporarily cure it. > > I'm not sure about this. The first thing I would try is booting > with extensions disabled. If the problem goes away, try hunting for > a single extension that is causing the problem. I might also try > booting from a different volume or CDROM. > > In other words, check to make sure that your problem is not caused by > a conflict or corrupt software before modifying your hardware. The > fact that the problem goes away after you reseat the cards seems to > indicate hardware, but I've seen a number of problems that seemed to > be hardware that turned out to be coincidences. In my experience, > freezing right after the extension march is more often a corrupt OS > or extension conflict than a hardware problem. > > Another possibility is that your CPU may be overheating and that's > how long it takes to overheat. Do you have it overclocked? > >> Finally I should note that I soldered in one more PCI slot, and it >> works >> fine with firewire card installed into it. I desoldered the other >> slot, >> but then accidentally damaged the other PCI socket I had on hand to go >> in there, so the board is ready for the other PCI slot to be >> installed, >> that is, the pin holes are open. Could the open pin holes in PCI >> slot F >> cause this problem? > > I don't think that the work you did on the PCI slots would cause this > problem. These systems are so complex that almost anything is > possible in wierd cases. :-) But based on past experience I don't > think this is related to your PCI slots. The easy check here would > be to remove the cards in the lower slots and operate just top slots > for a while. The problem with this test is that removing the lower > cards would probably cause some extensions not to load, and those > extensions might be the root of the problem, rather than the physical > PCI cards or slots. > > Yet another complicating factor is that if you do indeed have a > memory problem, it could be just the last extension or two to load, > regardless of which extensions those are, that causes the problem. > That is, it may take X number of extensions to fill the memory up to > the problem spot. This is also unlikely, but a factor to consider > when you are designing your troubleshooting approach. > > Still, I think the place to start is a common boot with extensions > off and then extension hunt if indicated. Plus boot from another > volume or a CDROM and see what data you collect. > >> Finally, would it help to reinstall OS 8.6? (I don't have anything >> newer >> or I'd be using it..) > > To the extent that you may have a corrupt OS component or extension > conflict this may help. > > Jeff Walther > > P.S. I'm probably going to be doing a Digi-Key order in the next > couple of weeks, so if you'd like me to order you a PCI slot I could. > You'd need to pay the postage from me to you (probably about $1 with > the cost of the padded mailer included) but that should still be > cheaper than ordering it yourself if that's all you need from > Digi-Key. -- SuperMacs is sponsored by <http://lowendmac.com/> and... 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