Hi Mark Want to talk about processors? I've got a couple of questions.
This is what you first told me about your weldless processors, a while back: > > >the collective's new weldless 55-gallon processor. > > >This thing I built is really, really low-tech (and >ugly!). I'm going on the premise that it's easier for >people to grind or chisel or otherwise cut metal than >to use a torch for anything. I took a 55-gallon drum >and turned it upside down, cut what used to be the >bottom off, so now I have an open-topped drum with >bungs on the bottom. I then used a very common >adaptor to fit a water heater element into the 2" >bung, and screwed a ball valve into the smaller one. >Voila! lowest-common-denominator oil heating rig. Then >I bolted up something like the motor/pulley from the >fryertothefueltank kind of design (motor on a hinge >driving a pulley that's mounted on a crosspiece that >sits across the drum and drives a mixer paddle.. So we >can have about three of these in a row for almost no >money spent, limited only by the massive electric >usage of a water heater element - but two of them can >be settling, or wash tanks, while one is a reaction >being agitated. Yee haw. Below is a more recent message you sent to the list, mostly about seals. We need a bigger processor, rather soon. I have a closed head 55-gal drum, and I'll cut out the bottom and turn it upside down. I managed to find a lid (not easy) with steel strap and rubber (?) seal. So, motors. I have two washing machines and a fridge excess to need. You mentioned a washing machine motor, would these do? They're standard twin-tubs (no pumps). I think they go at about 2,000 rpm - too fast? Do you gear them down with the belt wheels? Do you have any info on which size wheels to use? You use a paint-stirrer as a mixer. I was thinking of a shaft with a propeller welded on, something like Simon's: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_processor1.html Overkill? Yeah, welding, and we don't have a welder, do have a plumbing torch though, and a helpful friend with a good workshop and a welder. Could also be two propellers with the blades set opposite to create a counterflow. Simon's shaft looks heavy though - too heavy for a washing-machine motor? What gauge would you recommend? Do you set a bearing into the lid for the shaft? Is it more or less airtight? Thinking of methanol recovery, as well as fumes. Do you brace the shaft somehow? Simon has a brace halfway down. Or it could fit a ferrule on the bottom. What size/power electric heating element do you use? I want to fit an electric element, but I plan to use hot water mostly, also like Simon's set-up, once I've figured the plumbing. Compost is providing plenty of heat at between 55 and 68 deg C (130-155 deg F), biogas will provide more eventually, but a vegoil burner will do in the meantime. Also, for pumping methoxide in and oil in and out and so on, would the compressor from the fridge work for this? Thanks Best Keith >I've been thinking about the weldless approach a lot lately as I >just made some new processors (I demo'ed one at the >huge anti-war rally in san fran today, I played around with a 12V >pump for an agitator (not a good enough one >though it did make some biodiesel while we ran our mouth about how >others should too), showed off the anti-war >machine, flew banners off of our cars and trucks, and otherwise >made fools of ourselves along with a contingent of >other biodieslers. > >Anyway I think there are times when a weldless approach is >preferable and times when brazing in fittings makes >more sense. > >I was fooling around trying to figure out some cheap variations on >processor design, pushing the bung-side-down >and weldless approach as far as I could take it. I have an excess of >closed head drums available which is an unusual >factor- I got to cut some of them up just for the bungs, and then >played with attaching the bungs to other drums... > >(After two or three months of processor experimenting, I have >developed some kind of obsessive disorder or >something- I visualize plumbing stuff and weldless processors in >different configurations all day and allnight in >my head- I dream about these things, I notice that no matter what I >am doing, in the backof my consciousness I seem >to have some kind of visual of fittings, drums, and pipe layout >configurations running through my head. I REALLY >need to get a life! really!) > >Having just gone through all of the options I could think of I'm >pretty convinced of the following: > >1. if you want to go weldless for a 'starter' processor, use the >bungsidedown approach (I don't believe plastics are a >good idea at all for processors, having watched my friend melt a >plastic tank processor, and watched a lot of others >leak) > >2. brazing is the easiest way for an amateur metalworker to attach >fittings to the thin metal of a drum with the >least risk of leaks > >3. various compression-fitted connectors spring leaks (and I've as I >said experienced this a lot) > >4. One problem with the male-female connector approach is that (in >the US at least) pipe thread is tapered. SO >there aren't a lot of ways to get a really tight fit with standard >plumbing parts- you can screw two plumbing >fittings together but they'll bottom out before there's enough >contact to make this a safe way (using commonly >available gaskets) to put a fitting on the bottom of a drum that >will contain 400 pounds of hot biodiesel. Bungs, by >the way, do not seem to be tapered. THis allows for a pipe thread to >be extended quite far through a bung, at which >point you can attach more plumbing to the protruding threads on the >inside of the drum- there's times when this is >useful, dip tubes and other intakes inside of drums, heat >exchangeers, and more. There ARE a couple of 'nuts' that >screw on to pipe thread, and can be run further than most other >fittings- one is just a pipe thread nut that can be >difficult to find in hardware stores and isn't used often in >plumbing, and the other is a lightweight lockring from >electrical conduit fittings- the lockring/nut (cant remember actual >name) that you tighten inside an electrical box >in EMT or rigid applications is threaded like pipe thread, and this >is useful for light-duty applications with a >gasket. > > If you spend money to send away to a catalog place for a gasketed >spigot adaptor (they do make a few things like >this- it;s a fitting that gets a lockring and an gasket -ring, I >haven't been albe to find a good one locally, though >MacMaster-Carr has them I believe) you might as well spend the same >money on getting some local shop to braze a >fitting on for you so that it will be permanently leakproof >5. However if you just need a place to stick a fitting above the >liquid level- ie the top of your sight tube, or a >return from a pump in a pump-agitated processor- screwing plumbing >fittings together on either side of the >drum's sheet metal with some gasketing material to take up the slack >is fine- just don't expect it to be totally >fumeproof without serious gasketing. This is the light duty >application I just referred to. > >6. We got some bungs brazed to the bottom of a 110-gallon tanks and >our welder saint used rivets in addition to the >brazing, for the added security (and epoxy coating to insure it was >all as liquidtight as could be. ) seems that it >could b e problematic unless the rivets are steel- pop rivets are >usually aluminum I believe. > >7. Silicone is a decent sealant that I think is biodiesel-proof. I >still wouldn't use it as a gasket for a fitting that has >all of that pressure/weight on top of it, but it's good for sealing >light-duty fittings up above the liquid level. I just >used it for stuff attached to the top of a closed 'barrel-based, >bungside down' processor- to help contain the fumes. >Mark ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ---------------------~--> Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM ---------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
