my opinion on this is its more to do with the quality and dryness of the wood you are using that causes the smoke i have been heating with wood for many years and when you put non seasoned wood into any wood stove be it indoor or out door you are going to get incomplete combustion people often put green (unseasoned) wood in a fire to make it last longer if they are going to be away an extended period of time my sisters outdoor furnace is one of the newer catalyctic ones and really doesnt smoke that much> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: sustainablelorgbiofuel@sustainablelists.org> Date: Sun, 18 May 2008 19:30:19 +0000> Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Company is buying WVO> > as i understand it , the wood boilers burn cooler because of the water jacket and this produces a more incomplete combustion> -------------- Original message ----------------------> From: "Thomas Kelly" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> > A friend of mine installs and services outdoor wood boilers for a > > dealer. He's been after me to buy one.> > >several towns around here are trying to ban them because they tend to > > >produce low >level smoke when the air is still.> > There's some opposition to them around here too. Is it just a problem in > > developed areas (towns) or is the smoke somehow different from the smoke > > from my woodstove?My nearest neighbor is a quarter of a mile away and he's > > thinking of getting one too.> > > > Tom> > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> > To: <sustainablelorgbiofuel@sustainablelists.org>> > Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2008 11:37 AM> > Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Company is buying WVO> > > > > > >a neighbor wanted me too install theirs. the problem was it was a non > > >pressurized system and vented. he had a 2 story house meaning the water > > >pressure from the second floor required him to have a heat exchanger to > > >operate with his heating system. Installation turned out to be a lot more > > >expensive than they had planned. several towns around here are trying to > > >ban them because they tend to produce low level smoke when the air is > > >still. personally , if a neighbor complains about what i'm doing then they > > >paid to much to live next to me> > > -------------- Original message ----------------------> > > From: "Thomas Kelly" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> > >> Hi Zeke,> > >> > What is it being used for? Mostly additives to animal food (dog food, > > >> > and> > >> > probably factory chickens and cows), and allegedly soap and detergent> > >> > (google yellow grease)> > >>> > >> I have read a bit about the fate of WVO from dumpsters ..... > > >> ingredient> > >> in animal food.> > >> I had the opportunity to talk to someone who worked in a lab that> > >> "evaluated" WVO.> > >> He said that WVO that "meets standards" can be used in food for human> > >> consumption here in the US. He said that WVO that was "below standard" > > >> might> > >> be exported, used to make a food product, and then exported back to the > > >> US> > >> for human consumption. He also said that the real bad stuff is used in > > >> pet> > >> food/animal feed. I don't know if the food for human consumption is fact > > >> or> > >> fiction, but I have avoided the products that he mentioned as containing> > >> WVO.> > >>> > >> I haven't noticed any dramatic increase in dog or cat food. Chicken> > >> feed and other grain-based animal food for livestock seems to reflect> > >> increases in grain prices.> > >> I don't think the switch from charging the restaurant for WVO pickup, to> > >> paying the restaurant for the WVO is due to its use in animal food.> > >> The increased cost of vegetable oil for cooking has caused some> > >> restaurants to change their oil less frequently. Others have switched to> > >> cheaper veg oil. Some fast food "restaurants" filter and re-use their > > >> oil. I> > >> was wondering if there is now a market for used veg. oil for cooking. > > >> Will> > >> it be used in more food for human consumption? Will restaurants resort to> > >> using veg oil that has been discarded from other restaurants?> > >> I have heard of a BD producer coming on line about a hundred or so> > >> miles from me. While BD is not available at the pump, home heating oil> > >> suppliers offer B20 now. Diesel fuel at $5/gal might be making BD > > >> production> > >> profitable even if the producer must pay for WVO collected from 100 or > > >> more> > >> miles away.> > >>> > >> I just came back from sunny Florida (US) where I picked up a nice > > >> 1985> > >> Mercedes 300CD for my wife. Maybe I'll just match the price for veg oil, > > >> do> > >> conversions on our two diesels and run them on veg oil rather than BD.> > >> Heating the house may be a problem. Anybody know about outdoor> > >> wood-fired boilers?> > >> Best to All,> > >> Tom> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > > >> From: "Zeke Yewdall" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> > >> To: <sustainablelorgbiofuel@sustainablelists.org>> > >> Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2008 9:28 PM> > >> Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Company is buying WVO> > >>> > >>> > >> > It means that the economy is starting to value stuff that used to be> > >> > regarded as a waste product (a concept that does not exist in nature).> > >> > It's> > >> > good that the economy is coming more in line with reality. Though > > >> > perhaps> > >> > not for you in this case.> > >> >> > >> > What is it being used for? Mostly additives to animal food (dogfood, > > >> > and> > >> > probably factory chickens and cows), and alledgedly soap and detergent> > >> > (google yellow grease)> > >> >> > >> > I know a few years ago, a few of us investigated buying filtered WVO > > >> > from> > >> > one of the companies that collects it commercially from restuarants. > > >> > At> > >> > that time, it was going to be $1/gal for filtered WVO, buying it 100> > >> > gallons> > >> > at a time, I think. Diesel was around $2.40 or so. I don't know what> > >> > else> > >> > that company sold the filtered WVO for, but they were willing to sell > > >> > it> > >> > for> > >> > use as fuel as well.> > >> >> > >> > Z> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> > On Sat, May 17, 2008 at 5:50 PM, Thomas Kelly <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> > >> > wrote:> > >> >> > >> >> Hello All,> > >> >> A restaurant that has been happily giving me their WVO for the past> > >> >> three years received a letter from the company that they used to pay > > >> >> used> > >> >> to> > >> >> pick up their WVO. The company is offering to pay them them > > >> >> $0.35/pound> > >> >> for> > >> >> their WVO .... 4.5 gal (17.7L) "cubies" of WVO going for more than > > >> >> $10!> > >> >> I found it hard to believe. I stopped at another restaurant and > > >> >> asked> > >> >> to> > >> >> have their WVO, hoping to maintain my steady oil flow, and was told > > >> >> that> > >> >> someone pays them $2/gal for their waste oil.> > >> >> Does anybody know what is happening here?> > >> >> Is the WVO being converted to BD? With diesel hovering around > > >> >> $5/gal> > >> >> and with subsidies (in US) for BD, is it profitable to pay $2/gal for > > >> >> WVO> > >> >> and then convert it into BD?> > >> >> Or> > >> >> Is it being filtered and re-sold as veg oil? I've been told that > > >> >> the> > >> >> veg oil restaurants bought last year at $15/cubie now cost $35 -> > >> >> $40/cubie.> > >> >>> > >> >> I have a bad feeling about this.> > >> >> Tom> > >> >> -------------- next part --------------> > >> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...> > >> >> URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080517/78ed9c2d/attachment.html> > >> >> _______________________________________________> > >> >> Biofuel mailing list> > >> >> Biofuel@sustainablelists.org> > >> >> http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel> > >> >>> > >> >> Biofuel at Journey to Forever:> > >> >> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html> > >> >>> > >> >> Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000> > >> >> messages):> > >> >> http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/> > >> >>> > >> > -------------- next part --------------> > >> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...> > >> > URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080517/0bcd255f/attachment.html> > >> > _______________________________________________> > >> > Biofuel mailing list> > >> > Biofuel@sustainablelists.org> > >> > http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel> > >> >> > >> > Biofuel at Journey to Forever:> > >> > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html> > >> >> > >> > Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000> > >> > messages):> > >> > http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/> > >> >> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >> _______________________________________________> > >> Biofuel mailing list> > >> Biofuel@sustainablelists.org> > >> http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel> > >>> > >> Biofuel at Journey to Forever:> > >> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html> > >>> > >> Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 > > >> messages):> > >> http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/> > >> > >> > > _______________________________________________> > > Biofuel mailing list> > > Biofuel@sustainablelists.org> > > http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel> > >> > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever:> > > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html> > >> > > Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 > > > messages):> > > http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/> > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________> > Biofuel mailing list> > Biofuel@sustainablelists.org> > http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel> > > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever:> > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html> > > > Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages):> > http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/> > > _______________________________________________> Biofuel mailing list> Biofuel@sustainablelists.org> http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel> > Biofuel at Journey to Forever:> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html> > Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages):> http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ _________________________________________________________________ E-mail for the greater good. 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