Ah Bah! You speak as one who enjoys it too much and you forget the most honorable choice.
Rebel. We canonized the men and women in our history for it, and we will in our future. It is not unproductive to turn ingenuity into tax avoidance. It saves money at least. Tax Avoidance is a right. Illegal Tax Avoidance is by definition illegal. But the wise examination of law is always a good idea. >From: Michael Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: biofuels-biz@yahoogroups.com >To: biofuels-biz@yahoogroups.com >Subject: Re: [biofuels-biz] Legal Obstacles for Biodiesel >Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 21:43:46 -0700 (PDT) >MIME-Version: 1.0 >Received: from [66.218.66.106] by hotmail.com (3.2) with ESMTP id >MHotMailBF10C5C500554004319042DA426AB1EB463; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 22:59:08 >-0700 >Received: from [66.218.67.195] by n38.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jul >2002 05:51:26 -0000 >Received: (qmail 83506 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 05:51:25 -0000 >Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; >31 Jul 2002 05:51:25 -0000 >Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by >mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 05:51:25 -0000 >Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jul >2002 05:51:25 -0000 >Received: (EGP: mail-8_0_7_4); 31 Jul 2002 04:44:11 -0000 >Received: (qmail 30133 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 04:44:10 -0000 >Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; >31 Jul 2002 04:44:10 -0000 >Received: from unknown (HELO web14506.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.224.69) by >mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 04:44:10 -0000 >Received: from [202.12.73.6] by web14506.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 30 >Jul 2002 21:43:46 PDT >From sentto-3381553-1382-1028094686-ericruttan Tue, 30 Jul 2002 22:59:46 >-0700 >X-eGroups-Return: >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >X-eGroups-Return: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >X-eGroups-Approved-By: doosjp <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> via web; 31 Jul >2002 05:51:22 -0000 >X-Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >X-Apparently-To: biofuels-biz@yahoogroups.com >Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >In-Reply-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >X-Yahoo-Profile: tamarind39 >Mailing-List: list biofuels-biz@yahoogroups.com; contact >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >Delivered-To: mailing list biofuels-biz@yahoogroups.com >Precedence: bulk >List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >Now come on guys! > >Let's hear it for the poor old tax collectors! > >Their political masters want the taxes extracted >without hurting those organizations who paid for them >to gain office (such as oil companies and soy-bean and >maize grower cartels). > >And let's remember that the tax-collectors have wives >/husbands and kids and a mortgage and aging parents >just like everyone else. > >Being in debt, (like most United States citizens), >they can't afford to lose their job; > >No one loves them, (why even their own mother >sometimes looks at them suspiciously). > >Their education is probably deficient in basic science >and technology (and maybe much else???) > >And now they are told by a bunch of smart-alecks that >wind-power, sun-light, waste cooking oil, abattoir >wastes, kitchen waste and even harmless plants can be >a source of energy used by ingenious people around the >world to make their vehicle go from A to B. > >All of which, by law, must be taxed if the route A-B >touches any US public road! > >They are not generally told how to do this but they do >know that their salary and job depend on making a >visible effort. So they resort to the tried and tested >techniques of obfuscation, form-filling and threats. >And you, of course, turn your undoubted ingenuity into >tax avoidance. > >All of which is pretty unproductive and time wasting >but is apparently the price you must pay for living in >an elected aristocracy rather than a true democracy. > >Need I move on to the public investment that has been >made in the EPA and the need it now has to continually >justify and support itself and its employees? > >In my opinion (which, as has often been pointed out, >means I could easily be wrong), your choices are >straight-forward enough: > >You get the rules changed: Lobbying, forming your own >co-operative, paying for a barrage of spin-doctors, >media-men and (horrors!) lawyers. > >You live by the rules: Pay your taxes, tithes and >levies, perhaps write to your Congress-man (unless, of >course, he is doing an 8 year stretch for corruption), >you can even get out of biodiesel production and buy >the regular stuff made by the companies and so >(indirectly) contribute to party funds. > >You can leave: Go to Europe, Canada, Australia, New >Zealand perhaps. Or (what is considered by some people >to be equivalent) you can just curl up and die. >(Besides, other countries, perhaps even the Hereafter, >have new laws which you have to learn about.) > >You can moan and groan: But this doesn't normally >achieve much unless you happen to like talk-back >radio. > >But don't get sore. Remember that the rules that you >object to have been carefully put in place to protect >society from any new ideas (such as yours) which >originate outside of Corporate America. > >Lots of luck! > >Michael Allen > >--- Steve Spence <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > better not charge your electric car with a wind or > > pv source ....... :-) > > > > in order to charge me road tax, one would have to > > determine how much svo I > > use ...... > > > > > > Steve Spence > > Subscribe to the Renewable Energy Newsletter > > & Discussion Boards: > > http://www.green-trust.org > > Renewable Energy Pages - > > http://www.webconx.dns2go.com/ > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: <biofuels-biz@yahoogroups.com> > > Sent: Saturday, July 27, 2002 1:25 PM > > Subject: Re: [biofuels-biz] Legal Obstacles for > > Biodiesel > > > > > > > Hi Thor- > > > > > > The federal definition of "fuel" includes any > > substance capable of > > releasing > > > energy or power by combustion or other chemical or > > physical reaction. That > > > about covers anything other than sneeze power. > > Looks like all of those SVO > > > conversions are liable for unpaid road tax. I > > believe the minimum fine for > > > using a vehicle on the road with untaxed fuel is > > $2000. (tax section 6714 > > > (a)(3)) > > > > > > Tom > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/27/02 1:00:39 PM, > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > > > > > > << Tom, > > > > > > Any idea if SVO counts as a personal use fuel? > > > > > > thor > > > > > > --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > > Hi Keith, > > > > > > > > I try to keep myself far from legal matters as > > > > possible, but here is my > > > > belief. Commerce is defined under federal codes > > as > > > > selling or bartering. I > > > > don't have a reference to that, but it should > > not be > > > > hard to confirm. As you > > > > imply, it is hard to document barter > > arrangements, > > > > but if something was to go > > > > big scale, it could be a vulnerability for > > federal > > > > prosecution. > > > > > > > > Road tax is supposed to be paid on all fuel used > > for > > > > road transportation. > > > > This is the basis of the multi-thousand dollar > > fines > > > > some truckers have paid > > > > when it was discovered that they were using > > un-taxed > > > > fuel in trucks. As you > > > > know, the standard test for that is to put a few > > > > drops of fuel from a suspect > > > > tank on a piece of blotter paper and look for > > the > > > > tell-tale red dye of > > > > untaxed fuel. But, surprise, no red dye in > > > > biodiesel, so the chances of > > > > getting caught are less. So far no one has > > reported > > > > this situation to my > > > > knowledge. And yes, tax is due on personal use > > fuel- > > > > quarterly on the Excise > > > > Tax forms for federal road tax, and ususally > > monthly > > > > on state tax forms. The > > > > postage alone will cost more than the tax > > payments > > > > for the personal user. I > > > > paid over $700 last year in federal and state > > tax > > > > payments, but the EPA says > > > > they will use that as evidence I'm violating > > 40CFR79 > > > > if I make more tax > > > > payments for other than personal use, so I've > > > > stopped for a while until this > > > > gets sorted out. > > > > > > > > Tom Leue > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/26/02 11:25:27 PM, > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > > > > > > > > << Hello again Tom > > > > > > > > >In a message dated 7/22/02 10:11:41 PM, > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > > > > > > > > > ><< Hello Tom > > > > > > > > <snip> > > > > > > > > >The EPA says they will > > > > > >fine small producers up to $25,000 a day if > > they > > > > find your are putting > > > > > >biodiesel fuel into "commerce", meaning > > selling > > > > it or bartering it. > > > > > > > > > >Bartering it? They actually specify that? > > > > > > > > > >---Yeah, its the legal definition of > > "commerce"--- > > > > > > > > Sorry, whose definition? The EPA's specifically, > > in > > > > this context? Or > > > > generally? Barter might be commerce, but it's > > > > virtually impossible to > > > > regulate it. Or even to prove it, if you're > > smart, > > > > seems to me. Two > > > > parties give each other gifts on a semi-regular > > > > basis. So? > > > > > > > > By the way, if you are selling it, who pays the > > road > > > > tax? Is there > > > > any road tax on fuel you make yourself for your > > own > > > > use in the US? > > > > > > > > Keith >> >> > > > > > > > > > > > > Biofuels at Journey to Forever > > > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > > > Biofuel at WebConX > > > > > >http://www.webconx.dns2go.com/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm > > > List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at > > NNYTech: > > > http://archive.nnytech.net/ > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better >http://health.yahoo.com > > > >Biofuels at Journey to Forever >http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html >Biofuel at WebConX >http://www.webconx.dns2go.com/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm >List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: >http://archive.nnytech.net/ >To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------ Yahoo! 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