Hi Lee, &all, comments inline
On Sat, Jun 27, 2009 at 2:04 PM, Lee Bolding <[email protected]> wrote: > > OK guys, time to be PRAGMATIC, and put your creative urges aside. > > A payment framework for Symfony would be incredibly useful - there's > plenty of SaaS applications that can (and will) be created with > Symfony. I'm even working on a few myself ;) > > Something that plays well with Amazon's DevPay would be awesome... you > could quickly create extremely flexible pricing models for your SaaS > applications. > > As for a larger scale project; what are the costs and benefits of > creating a fully-blown ecommerce solution with Symfony? > > Magento already exists (using the Zend framework). Magento is free, > open source and has commercial support available (if you want it). Not > just that, it's got a massive community (85K community members, 750K > downloads), it's PCI compliant, Magento have partnered with Zend and > Rackspace. > > What could possibly be the benefit (to you, and to the end user) of > developing a competitor? you're already the encumbent before you even > begin coding, you'd be competing with a free product - there's not > going to be much financial reward for your efforts, and not much to > add to your CV. having tried implementing magento, two times until i dropped it out completely, i can say for me it didn't work because whatever you do, it's too damn slow. You need a virtual machine 1GB+ RAM and up with all the possible tinkering under the hood still is java-like slow. To me it's not acceptable that fetching data from db, updating few rows here and there and populating some templates would take such amount of time and processing power. I really dig the EAV principles but at the bottom line is nothing NASA like, it's just plain "a lot of out" and "few ins" from a database. Sorry about spilling the frustration but i really had to :) There is no competition to me. It's just getting things done quickly (and having a revision graph :)) I really appreciate the comment below from Tom, especially " focus those efforts to create a 'standardised' platform ". To me this focus for start means no massive coding at all, just assemble documentation and code snippets for proposed plugins so everyone would benefit from something constructive. I think also that re-writing massive amounts of code just because it doesn't fit 100% would be also counter-productive. Everybody is rapid-developing in their own way. what should emerge should be a common way of rapid-developing. > > You'd receive far more benefit in terms of peer recognition and > financial gain by fixing the perceived problems with Magento. Add to > this that there's already a need to experienced and capable Magento > professionals. > > > Remember, although open source empowers you to create competing > products, it's this fractured and fragmented mentality that turns big > business off of open source. > > I'd be interested to hear some pragmatic responses to this thread from > Fabien, Jonathan and Nicholas... even if they disagree with me :) > > On 27 Jun 2009, at 09:20, Gandalf wrote: > > > > > Hello, > > > > Just my 2 cents, from my point of view, personal, we should write a > > new of store solution if: > > > > 1) we can make a better job than magento, magento got the rights > > features, but implementation is really slow, can we do better??? > > sure? see my post about sympal performance. > > > > As I said, my very own 2 cents. > > > > Pablo > > > > On 6/27/09, Marius Rugan <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Hi Antoine, > >> > >> there is http://code.google.com/p/sfshop/ > >> > >> i've signed up on the google group / took a peak into the code. > >> imho still > >> needs a lot of documentation and participation. > >> i've test drove it 4-5 months ago but i was too keen on getting > >> things done > >> for a small project so i used a small footprint solution. (opencart) > >> > >> for now i think it's a good candidate for not reinventing the > >> wheel. as of > >> functionalities, code quality and so on i'm not in the position to > >> asses > >> those since i didn't bump my head into whatever problems might > >> generate. > >> > >> > >> On Sat, Jun 27, 2009 at 10:22 AM, Antoine Leclercq > >> <[email protected]>wrote: > >> > >>> [This thread follows the discussion started on > >>> > http://groups.google.com/group/symfony-users/browse_thread/thread/9be2bdb7cff682bf(Status<http://groups.google.com/group/symfony-users/browse_thread/thread/9be2bdb7cff682bf%28Status> > >>> of paypal plugin(s)) about an ecommerce solution for symfony. It has > >>> been moved here as it was slightly off topic.] > >>> > >>> Agreed on the fact that we should not reinvent the wheel (@Lee), > >>> that's > >>> whole point of symfony itself. > >>> Agreed on the fact that many great ecommerce solutions already > >>> exist and > >>> can be interfaced with symfony. > >>> > >>> But, AFAIK symfony offers a real plus when it comes to building > >>> complex > >>> and > >>> maintainable applications. Plus, when you have a development team > >>> trained > >>> on > >>> the framework, you want as much as possible to avoid injecting major > >>> external piece of code that will bring its amount of specificity, > >>> its own > >>> frame of mind / framework, and will inevitably cause you to dig on > >>> some > >>> specific issues related to that very piece of code. > >>> > >>> In addition, what if one of these os ecommerce solutions was built > >>> with > >>> symfony? Don't you think it would provide more? It would highly > >>> benefit > >>> from > >>> the framework improvements (integrated tests, security, performance, > >>> customization...) and therefore its community could focus on the > >>> real > >>> work. > >>> > >>> If we take the CMF example, how many open source solutions can we > >>> list? > >>> 30, > >>> 40, a lot more? > >>> And great solutions like Joomla, XOOPS, Drupal, Plone… All of them > >>> are in > >>> a > >>> really mature state. > >>> Then why Sympal? > >>> IMHO the first answer would be that it's a real need for the > >>> community. > >>> Because developers want to feel safe with their developments, to > >>> know what > >>> they integrate, and finally to be able to dig in quickly whenever > >>> they > >>> need > >>> to fix a bug. > >>> > >>> This seems to be the same pattern with our symfony ecommerce > >>> solution > >>> discussion. > >>> > >>> I would be interested in knowing how many people have developed > >>> ecommerce > >>> applications with symfony. > >>> RT @Thomas: How many people are willing to help to create an > >>> "ecommerce-like" open source project? > >>> > >>> Regards, > >>> > >>> Antoine > >>> LetsCod > >>> > >>>> > >>> > >> > >>> > >> > > > > > > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "symfony users" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/symfony-users?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
